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How do we break people's unrealistic assumption that if a guy wears a dress, or dresses as a women, then he must be gay?
I am NOT gay. I love women, but I also love their clothes. For the most part, they are lighter, softer, and more comfortable then a lot of the heavy, darker "mens clothing" not to mention a better variety other then pants and shirts.
I am not gay, all I want is to wear what I feel comfortable wearing without having to explain myself.
Well Susan I know some transmasculine guys who would probably disagree with you about the guy clothes. The gay thing is only a matter of perspective though. Gay means happy and I'm very happy to be myself regardless of what others may think.:)
I just ask them that if a woman wears a mans shirt, is she a lesbian?
Just don't bother talking with people like that, if they're ignorant enough to think anything other than being attracted to men means you're gay. Also, though, you shouldn't care so much whether you're gay or not.
I don't care. At least in my corner of this world, there are many gays. All of whom are accepted. The point is, is the automatic assumption I am gay if I wear womens clothes. THAT is what I am posting about.Quote:
Originally Posted by VioletJourney
People are generally ignorant of the differences between gender identity and sexual identity. After doing this stuff for a long time, my advice is to get used to it and don't let it bother you, it's going to happen.
Carol
Be as you are no matter if you're gay or not.
That's my principle.
No one is only one thing forever.
That's what I call deep wisdom.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julogden
here is the irony; because I am not gay I am married to a woman, a woman who does not allow me to dress as a woman. If I was gay I would not be married and be able to dress...
I personally know hundreds of guys that are gay! only a very few dress as women! Most have no desire to be fem'! So go figure! I'm not bashing gays at all because I have many gay friends! I do NOT LIKE BEING CALLED SOMETHING THAT I'M NOT!
My philosophy is that it doesn't really matter in today's society. Those who know me are pretty sure that I'm not gay because I'm happily married and have children. The opinions of those who don't know me aren't of concern.
who cares what other people say or think.
if i did i would be mad or worried all my life.
Funny thing for me though, I never thought I was either.
But i love dressing and being feminine.
I love how the attached forms and corset make my body feel.
I don't want to get off subject but I feel we or at least i wonder what it would be like if i was a gg.
It has made me think about guys as a woman and treated as a womam.
don't worry hunny it's ok to be straight in this day and age :D
Believe me, many gay people get mad as hornets about it too. They don't like the assumption that just because they are gay, they are assumed to be overtly feminine...wear dresses...be drag queens...etc.
It's to the point that drag shows have been taken out of gay clubs in some communities.
So, yes, just as desperately as you don't want to be associated with anything gay, many gays don't want to be associated with anything CDing related. Imagine a very large, gay man stomping up and down saying, "I don't wear dresses or talk in a feminine voice, damnit!"
I think the fear that is there is, in many circles of work, gay is still not as acceptable. Sad but true. If you are a gay male, you are less than a man. But then again to most of the knuckle draggers that think that way, a guy wearing clothing that is associated with women is also less than a man. It is both stupid and drips of ignorance.
There are times I think my life would be easier if I were attracted to men, but I am not.
What I really don't like aside from being assumed to be gay, is having my mental capacity questioned due to those things I choose to wear. That is more ignorant.
There is no way to 'break' the assumption. It's going to happen regardless. As was said earlier it has to do with the level of education the average person has on the differences between gender identity and sexual identity. Every time someone sees you and pays attention to you in public places they assume things about you. They assume things based on how you walk,talk, dress, act. We all do it to a degree. It doesn't matter if you're a crossdresser or not. If someone you know thinks you are homosexual because you dress then you can just talk with them and tell them it isn't so. I guess what I'm trying to ramble is don't worry about it. After all...they're random strangers.
I am not gay either, and I exclusively wear womens' clothes for fit and feel, and my girl friends have all been ok with that
Clothes don't have anything to do with sexual preference. That's the base message to be conveyed regardless of a person's birth gender or gender expression. I gave up trying to convince closed-minded people a long time ago. There are probably people still believing the world is flat too. I'll save my breath for where it can be the most effective.
Babette
The problem is that homosexuality has become acceptable in modern society, but most people are still clueless that there is more to gender than straight or gay. I don't care if anyone thinks I'm gay, because there is nothing wrong with being gay. There is no reason to get upset over it. However, it is upsetting that people remain so ignorant that they can't accept gender diversity, even when you try to explain it to them. The best way to fight prejudice is education, so try to enlighten those that you can.
a conumdrum wrapped up in an enigma stuffed inside a Rubik`s Cube:daydreaming::doh::heehee:Quote:
Originally Posted by Kattie Philips
Oh! We are all a little gay! Any way, you have got to quit worrieing what other people think!
In the end, the most important thing is figuring out who you are... when you are this way inclined (CD) it opens up lots of questions and issues... my take is to explore them and see what they mean.
I am pretty sure who I am, but this has not always been so, and even now there are grey areas... It gets better as you get older!
A problem with identifying with being feminine is that...?
And if you answered the above, will we always have gender issues...?
CD does not mean you are gay. Gay guys are attracted to men, gay women.. women.. If I was gay, why would I want a guy dressed as a woman? This is not what I would be attracted to!
Now there are people out there who appear to be attracted to TG/CD orientation... I am not sure what this means, but some people on this site have met their soul mates.
We are who we are, and that to me is the bottom line...
yep im gay.... since ive begun transitioning and still wanna be with a woman, but guess what i dont give 2 $hits about stupid peoples dumb stupid ideas... so what life is short, move on.
I am Gay then when people assume it they are always right:)
WHO CARES !!!! Just because I wear pants doesn't mean I'm straight. Just because a woman wears a dress doesn't mean she isn't a lesbian. When I interact with another person I am not concerned about their gender identity. My response is, "Why would you be interested in that?" Add whatever statement/question you wish at this point,like: are you? it's none of your business! yes, I'm a lesbian; yes I am. WHO CARES!!!!
I guess sometimes it's just a question out of curiosity, sure some are ignorant but others just need to know, depends how open minded they are
Its been said for years that a crossdresser HAS to be gay, but its only by people who are narrow minded, judgemental and ignorant. But these days, its improved I think, particurely since I came out a few years ago.
There are CD's that experiment though, but even that does'nt necasarilly say they are gay. I, myself have had experience with men, and still do, but I do it as a woman. Its my woman within taking over and expressing my feminine interests...
Sounds like you might not be sure, are you sure your not gay. Does it really matter?
To a lot of these Low-Brow individuals,they will stick to their opinion,no matter what you try in order to educate them,Leave them to their bigoted views,and be who you are without giving them a second thought,Gay or str8 your better than they are
Sophie
How do we break that assumption? By telling them we're not gay, if that's the case. On occasion someone will think I'm gay (probably happens to many of us once in a while). To me, that's not a bad word or an insult.
I don't get wound up about it, and just nonchalantly say, "I'm straight, by the way," which seems to catch people off guard. I guess the standard response to being "accused" of being gay is to get all pissed off and belligerent.
I'm not gay but my boyfriend is. (now there will be 50 people who assume I am gay but who cares :) I quit worrying about that years ago)
I went to the ICRME Coronation here last night. 200 drag queens. All willing to be out in the open. Most were gay and made no bones about it. How many CDs have you seen recently? Did a group of TG's get press like on a television show? How many shows where crossdressers are the center of the show have you seen?
It is all perspective. You can thank the media. Name the last movie you saw with men in women's clothing. Tootsie? ha hah hah funny. Guy who pretends to be a woman but doesn't really want to dress but gets "forced" into it. Clown, comedy. Too Wong Foo? 3 "GAY" DQ's, Priscilla? Ditto. Some like it hot? Underlying gay theme with Jack Lemon's character. Angry Inch? Gay.
You ask why we are all considered gay? Look at who represents YOU in the real world? They are Drag Queens who usually are GAY. Congratulations you are lumped with them. Just like every other minority, the squeaky wheel gets the press.
So now a question? How may straight crossdressers are hiding in the closet? If 10% of them went out once in a while in public, maybe even at an event where they raised money for a cause (like most DQ's do with their shows). AND if we did that maybe even the extra perk of spouses accepting men in women's clothes would occur. Another question. How many have been hit on by a gay guy? Usually we are hit on by so called straights...why don't we ask them if THEY are gay?
"I'm not gay but my boyfriend is."
Wha?
Are you using "boyfriend" in the same manner women use "girlfriend"?
It is just one of the pitfalls of social norms.
Social norms are just rules that a particular group uses to define appropriate and inappropriate values, beliefs, attitudes and behaviors all members must uphold to continue being accepted within the group. They revolve around our basic needs for safety/security, acceptance/belonging and for some sense of order to life.
People that adhere to the group norms (rules) are predictable in their behavior, so they are viewed as “safe”. People who do not follow the “rules” are confirming to the group that their behaviors are unpredictable. Unpredictable behaviors imply unpredictable intentions. Unpredictable intentions initiate defense postures for a possible “threat”. It is just a remnant defense mechanism of basic human survival instinct that kept cavemen from getting eaten by things they were not familiar with.
Fortunately, most “critical” people have evolved to a point where they no longer hurl spears when they feel the threat induced by the lack of knowledge and understanding that overshadows their encounter with a crossdresser. They seem content to seek shelter behind unfounded stereotypes and other dysfunctional defenses employed by the socially illiterate. (Lucky for us, eh?) :heehee:
I do not feel any obligation to “prove or disprove” anything to anyone, other than to myself in life. Not every invitation or opportunity to get involved in a “battle” is worth my time. (A few are, most are not) I usually find a creative strategy to work around obstacles and ignorance instead of trying to knock them all down. Life is short. My goal is to get where I want to go, not waste my time trying to defeat opponents in a game others created.
That's my strategy. We all have one and no two are exactly alike. Hopefully we all have one that keeps us happy in life. That is all that really matters...for me anyway...
:love:
...now that was funny!Quote:
Originally Posted by joannemarie barker
You are what you ware.
I'm so pink inside it's unreal, Hell yes I'm gay! I'm a lesbian! trap in a man body, and if I really was a woman, I'd still be gay.now where'd I put my pink bra and matching thong! Damn I'm running late! Jenni
Wow, 34 responses so far and counting...methinks the ladies doth protest too much! :eek::doh::heehee:
FWIW - I'm not gay either, nor have I ever been attracted to men in any way, shape, or form. I don't even have any male friends.
Maybe that's due to my own particular life experiences (only child; weak, ineffective, and hen-pecked father i.e. poor role model; never into sports and more of a "nerd" when younger, therefore a prime target for bullying as a child etc., etc.)
As a result, I far prefer the company of women, so part of my love for crossdressing is probably rooted in a sub-conscious desire to emulate them and experience their world, where I feel more comfortable and at home.
I'm not gay and never will be, I'm just a guy who likes to dress 'eccentrically', but also feels like I'm in the wrong body, thats a different issue altogether.
In terms of my dress, if others have a problem then it's their problem, not mine. In short I do things how I do things, everyone else can please themselves
This could be the tip of the iceburg.
What you are really saying here is that society does not understand the concept of gender. It has stereotypes and misinformation which almost always adds up to a mis-diagnosis.
Until the more complex concepts of gender permeate the society, misconceptions will continue, and part of what we all need to do is educate those we encounter, one at a time, doing it with calmness and grace.
tina
[SIZE="2"]Well, Susan, I wish to confess that crossdressing has MADE me gay! Yup, I’ve been completely subverted by this inexplicable desire to dress, and I now embrace the consequences. It didn’t happen overnight, but gradually, imperceptibly, my feminine clothes drained away every drop of masculinity I once possessed, until I became the blessed being I KNEW was hiding inside me. I, as an effeminate male, only had to make a slight adjustment before I was able to completely embrace my latent homosexual nature – it was such a relief! In fact, I’m not sure why I still feel the need to dress as a woman! Maybe I do it just for old times sake – you know, when I was a confused, alienated heterosexual, fueled my masculine desires and trapped in limbo. I can breathe now, thanks to crossdressing! You have something to look forward to, my dear...Quote:
Originally Posted by susancheerleader
:)
As far as I’m concerned, if THEY (the uninformed public) wish to automatically assume that a MtF crossdresser is gay, I say BE gay and go about your business. What’s the alternative – being upset, in a masculine way, that you are unfairly being aligned with an alternative sexuality you don’t subscribe to? Be a man, and dismiss these distinctions before they destroy you! Believe me, crossdressing really does drain away masculinity, if you are brave enough to let it do so – you can be a hero to yourself, and ditch the male pretensions that keep you at arm’s length from a life more interesting, more fulfilling, and more... beautiful. I learned that it’s never too late to become gay, at least in your mind, undetected by those who may do you harm – crossdressing is a catalyst in this regard, and I’m so glad I found it. It has changed me in many positive ways, and, even though I’m poking fun at perceptions in this post, crossdressing really has changed my sexual outlook, for lack of a better explanation...
:battingeyelashes: [/SIZE]
It is what gays says when asked if they are gay. No it isn't the same as when women say "girlfriend" (or when we say that to a sister). The whole are you gay or straight question is first of all only important IF you want to have a sexual relationship with a person of the same sex and second a down right inane question. The point of the OP was to point out that only gays (men specifically) who dress as females MUST want to be female. Just as everyone who dresses as a cowboy has the desire to ride a bull for 8 seconds. Or those people who dress as chipmunks at football games have the desire to run in front of cars and get mushed. It is an inane ignorant question which needs to be addressed by sexual partners, not your best buddy at a bar or the woman who checks you out at Wal-mart. It doesn't matter unless it is between the two people who happen to be naked in the back of a 1957 Chevy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pythos
So if I wear a Brooks Brothers suit I can be a Wall Street broker? :) Does this hard hat make me look like a construction worker? (I am assuming that this remark was tongue in cheek)Quote:
Originally Posted by Valerie1973
Now let me address the "I am a lesbian trapped in a man's body." That is almost as wrong as asking if you are gay. You cannot be lesbian by definition unless you have female genitals and you prefer having sexual relations with a person who has female genitals. This may apply to a transsexual but it is really a slap to real lesbians when a crossdresser says it. You are a straight male who prefers to have sexual relations with females. You are not gay you are not a lesbian, you are straight no matter how much you fantasize that you are a female. No more than you are Tom Selleck when your SO imagines you to be when you are being intimate. So unless you really are a transsexual, you are not a lesbian.
When we finally get to the point where we don't think of ourselves as strange or perverted maybe we can address the idea that we all want sex with guy.
I loved this post :) I always wondered why some called themelves lesbian :) of course it's up to them how they see themselves I guess but it's not accurate :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorileah
You see, I used to be straight but, I once shook hands with a gay guy and I must have caught it. Now I'm bi.
If someone thinks I like men it really doesn't change my day. I can say no and beyond that they can believe whatever their little hearts want. Some people think because you dress like a woman you want men but there are those of us who know that not all women like men.
I won't try to defend myself here for having a sense of humor, which thats what I was alluding to, if I've offended any one buy my post my apologies, I didn't realize I had made such an error Jenni
Considering that the overwelming majority of crossdressers live in the closet and thier only ventures into the world are to gay bars it is reasonable to say that the general public has virtually NO reference point as to what a crossdresser is except.... drag queens.
Since they are all too often gay and since they are virtually the only trans people exposed to the world it is no wonder the world thinks CDs are gay.
Perhaps some day CDs will come out of the closet and walk into the real world with a sense of confidence and pride. Until that day they will be victims of thier own fears and judged by society with no one on the witness stand since they nearly all hide in the closet.
KAtie
I'm bi in the sense that when crossdress I am a male lesbian:battingeyelashes:. Billie Jean
One way I have tried to explain it is to say. "You like women so much you want to be one."
I love it when I read posts about people saying being gay would be so much easier and is soooo much more accepted. A few weeks ago I was literally slapped by one of my so-called "best friends" for being bisexual. She was the first close female friend that I came out to...and, I got slapped...not once...but twice.
So, yeah...basically, you all that have posted this have no idea what you are talking about. Be aware of foolish posts.
I don't really see acceptance for homosexuality as a problem. Also, gender really has little to do with being straight or gay. Maybe you mean gender has little to do with what sex you may be attracted to...?Quote:
Originally Posted by juno
Don't be ashamed. It's not your fault. You were probably born straight.:heehee:Quote:
Originally Posted by susancheerleader
Juno, I think you're on to something... the majority of the population relates to things as simply as 'you are or you aren't'. It's a 'black or white' outlook into a world composed of not only many shades of gray but colours! They miss a lot and it's a shame. It's their loss.