Walking off the cliff

I feel like I'm hovering over a huge chasm, waiting to fall...

My wife and I have been seeing a couples counsellor. Yesterday, I finally admitted to myself, to my wife and to the counsellor that my crossdressing feelings have changed and that I have full-on gender dysphoria. I was very shaky and couldn't speak for a few minutes after that and my heart is still pounding, wondering where this is going to take me and us.

Luckily my wife took this very calmly, even admitting that it explains a lot of things such as my moodiness and depression over the last few days. I'm going to arrange to see a gender counsellor to sort things out and see what these feelings really mean.

Sorry if this is somewhat of a downer post, but I had to get this out. Keeping it inside has filled my head to the point of bursting.

Hi

All I can say is thread carefully Dawn. Please don't be in a rush and make life-altering decisions lightly. There have been times when I also experience intense feelings of wanting to be a woman permanently, only to have these moments pass later on. Then I'm happy to be just a cd'ing man again.

At the moment I am in a happy place just doing the cd thing and I hope for all parties concerned that you could be in that place soon.

Dawn it is healthy to get things off your breast. :)

You should choose your words wisely and remember things that you say and do will not be an instant cure or be solved overnight.
You also have to realise that this may not be a practical path to go down but at least you have made a start.
Like coming out, tread slowly and carefully.
Try not to get too emotional.

Hi again

There's just one thing I'd like to add to what I said before:

Anything in our lives that we give free reign to, has a tendency to rope us in more and more. Maybe the time has come to just step back a bit and try focus on something else in your life for a while, like a hobby etc.

The way I know that I'm not a TS is that these feelings (wanting to be a woman) normally dissipate after I've been with my wife (you know :love:) so maybe try that (not just once).

Now I've gone and disproved my theory that dressing is not (just) a sexual thing for me! Expecting a backlash from the wife...

Dawn,

You're doing the right thing and taking the right steps - these things will surely take time to bottom out completely - work through the process with your counsellor and your wife - skirt the chasm! At least through this process... :hugs:

Keep Calm & Carry On!

Katey x

It was good to get it out. My hope is that your wife is open to helping you deal with the changes in your needs. I think you may find the meaning behind your feelings fairly easily. The challenge will be finding a way to integrate them into your life. Take your time.

WOW to admit that is huge step in understanding yourself good luck

Hi Dawn
(I hope as a gg that I am allowed in this section...)
May I agree with Jenny (my CD husband), that it may well just be a bend in the road, and not necessarily a fork in the path...
We also went for counselling at a stage, and what I clearly saw, is that with the 'open minded' counsellor's questions, he actually sort of brought my husband to a place where he was more convinced about his 'gender dysphoria'.. Most of the questions and discussions were almost leading my husband into 'believing' that is actually what he is and where he would like (or would have to) go with this.

He even made and appointment for my husband to go and see a dr in GID ...
We decided that it would not be a good and wise thing, and since then, it became better and those feelings subsided....

It is almost like if you have a bit of a flu coming, and someone else tells you about someone they know that had this terrible illness with fluelike symptoms.... and then they ask you... "don't you have this pain or that pain also sometimes,because this will be a definite sign of that terrible illness" and then all of a sudden, deep down, you start to wonder whether you didn't maybe have those pains also...

Hope I've managed to say what I meant to say...

Good luck and take a rethink.

The good news seems to be that your wife is being reasonable and considerate. You may be on to something, but only a skilled experienced gender therapist can help you figure out what you need. Gender dyshoria has many variations so see where this takes you. Be certain to see a specialist (I spent yrs and $$$$ going to untrained therapists). Good luck and take it a day at a time.

O, and Jenny, hun.... what is it about a backlash... not sure I understand it?

Dawn, I don't think your going to fall of the cliff. It seems like you found the information center and you have been given the correct advice on where to go next.

Hi Dawn,

I am sure that took a lot of courage to get out and I hope you have some cathartic release from that. I believe the right course of action is for you to go and see a gender identity therapist (there is a very good one in the city if you can get to see her). You may be having these feeling and they may be real (I had them myself) and the therapist helped me bring order to chaos. If and when you do go sweetie, be honest with your therapist and don't second guess what you think they want you to say. If they ask you a question go with your first thought (don't overthink) as this will allow them to work with you vice having to fight for clarity.

Feel free to PM me.

Hugs and good luck

Isha

Dawn
That took courage. Please don't feel alone. I too am struggling with those feelings with a supportive wife. However I do know that to go down the path much further would endanger my marriage. I am in therapy and am taking it slowly. I love my wife so much but am so afraid I will lose her because of this. Feel free to PM me any time. I hope the best for you!
Hugs
Suzanne

Self awareness is a good thing

Me again.

I feel like I am swimming up the current here a bit. Or I am just the sole voice of reason, you decide.

What I propose is a simple test:

Maybe, like me you also profess that dressing is not a sexual thing and you do not do it for release, I don't know. What I do know is that it does build sexual tension (in me) over time and this clouds your thought process, making you believe that you are TG, even though your not.

What you need to do is release that sexual tension. So grab the wife 2 or 3 times over 2 or 3 days and make some hay. If the TG feelings continue, you might be TG and I have no further advice for you. (Be honest with yourself though). If, like me, the TG feelings abate you know you are just a crossdresser. What you need to do now is work at keeping those TG feelings in check and there is only one way really...and the wife may come to enjoy that as well! Life is simple if you get back to basics.

I don't know your full situation (I am new to the forum) all I can do is (like I tried to do) speak frankly from my own experience. If it doesn’t apply please disregard.

All the best.

Thanks for all the replies, cautions and support.

It's not a matter of sexual tension. Even a couple of hours after sex with my wife, I still feel "wrong" and want to CD. (She does not like CDing so we don't do it as part of our lovemaking.)

I'm also not making any sudden decisions. This will take months of counseling and thinking. I do not want to throw away my marriage and I'm pretty sure I don't want anything as drastic as SRS. But I do feel the need to be true to myself in some way.

Maybe after counseling and thinking I will step back from the cliff... or maybe not. I have to find out.

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Originally Posted by Lidea

May I agree with Jenny (my CD husband), that it may well just be a bend in the road, and not necessarily a fork in the path...

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I really hope you're right. I was wondering that myself... I basically did not CD for about 17 years and only about 8 months ago started up again and joined this forum. I'm thinking maybe the renewed CDing plus the discussions on this forum are making me over-feel what's inside. On the other hand, sometimes the feelings well up with such intensity that I have to believe they're real... I'm very confused.

Hi Dawn,

Love making test with your wife aside, I truly believe gender identity therapy is the best course of action here to bring order to your thoughts, so I am glad to hear you are going in that direction.

That is what they do best, if you have a medical problem you see a doctor if you are having emotional distress (which you appear to be having) you see a professional. Some may tell you that you don't need it, they are only a sounding board, they provide no answers. I can tell you from experience (both in therapy and as a counsellor) this is not true.

Hugs

Isha

I don't know if I can help any since I enjoy cross dressing but have never felt that I should completely male however I'll add my two cents.

Going through everything that it takes to make the transition takes quite a while, usually years from what I understand. I feel that having a gender counselor is a wonderful step, regardless of what you decide. Remember to keep your feet on the ground and to include your wife in this decision-making process.

If you do decide to make that decision, relax. It'll turn out okay. There's a reason that you're feeling this now and embracing that feeling will bring you peace :) One thing that you might try is to see how far you can go with cross dressing. If you wear flats, try heels. If you wear a wig, try decorating your natural hair. If you don't usually go out in public, try doing so. Find out what works for you and what you really want, both in counseling and outside of it.

Most of all, remember that the cliff is in your mind. Your mind obeys you, not you it. If you are afraid of falling, why not try flying instead?

A couple of sessions in electrolysis might settle the issue. If your ideas of being TS remain after an hour or two of electro they are probably there to stay. If you want to get up and never come back you can be sure it is only CD.

It is better to talk it out with other, than to keep it in, you made the right move with counselor and your wife. There is all ways a ear to bend here someone who will listen. Good Luck Dawn, hugs

Hmmm


Interesting thoughts by all. A lot of sound advice as well. Just a thought... Regardless of the amount of support, one may feel trapped or inclined to go further unless they explore their feelings further ... ie seeing a therapist.


I get trapped in my own mind, not by my SO. I have asked to go to counseling to explore my gender questions. the response was go ahead... then I did not feel so trapped in exploring and understanding my feelings. I never went, and may never go to therapy regarding GD... but that may be, because I am comfortable being able to explore that side, because there is an open door to do so and my SO would attend with me.


I hope that makes sense.


Lastly, if you have only been depressed over the last few days, I would not say that this means it is related to anything.. could be that you are human and have a lot on your mind... but I would think that if this was over months or years, that perhaps this ties in more strongly.


Only you know what is right for you.. but I thought I would add these thoughts, my thoughts and my feelings on this matter because this issue is very close to my heart.


Hoping you get some resolution to all this... just go slow and try to understand things over time than to rush into any major change...


Vanny

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Originally Posted by dawn03

I feel like I'm hovering over a huge chasm, waiting to fall...

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Hello Dawn,
It appears that you are reaching out for help via your skilled counselor, your loving wife, and the experience of this forum. I agree with others that these are very wise things to do.

The huge chasm looks scary but through all their combined advice and your own wisdom you will certainly locate the stairway. Take it one step at a time and see where it leads. Whatever you do, please don't fall. All manner of bad things happen when you hit the bottom.

Best wishes
MsVal

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Originally Posted by Lidea

Hi Dawn
(I hope as a gg that I am allowed in this section...)

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Everyone is allowed in this section and GG's are welcomed most :)

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Originally Posted by dawn03

I'm thinking maybe the renewed CDing plus the discussions on this forum are making me over-feel what's inside.

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Hon, I hadn't CD'd for about 18 years, and when my GD resurfaced, it came back with a vengeance. Everyone hopes the above is true. Sometimes it is, but the important thing is to figure out what's really going on.

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Originally Posted by dawn03

On the other hand, sometimes the feelings well up with such intensity that I have to believe they're real... I'm very confused.

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The most important thing you can do is be fearless, and really be honest with yourself and your counselor on your feelings about your gender, and to be willing to follow this wherever it leads, because you are powerless over your gender. It is a part of you and you can't change it. Hopefully where it leads is far short of transition - that is a real possibility. But be willing to really look hard at this stuff, and try to avoid denial about it. It's easy to be in denial - this stuff is really scary and hard to deal with. NOBODY wants to be trans. NOBODY.

And hon, I sure do understand your confusion. I'm so sorry, I was confused too when I started going through this about this time last year. Going to a gender therapist is absolutely the right decision, and it is the best thing you can do for yourself.

Be careful about walking off cliffs Dawn. It's really not the fall that gets you, it's that sudden stop at the bottom.:straightface:

The thing is Kate, as best I can tell now that I've fallen down the rabbit hole, there is no bottom to it.

Hi Dawn

Maybe it is because of living in the 3rd world (where we live more basic lives) that we do not have this penchant for over analysis that people in the 1st world seem to have. Though I have no problem with counselling, I've gone through a lot of it myself with my wife, I have to agree with her: You need to be careful here as well.

I found that one counsellor, whether willingly or inadvertently, steered me in the TG direction and after a while I started believing this to be true.

Like I said before, when we devote so much time to something in our lives it does tend to suck us in more and more. Then you find yourself one day saying: "If I like dressing this much, and I like dressing up more and for longer, I must be wanting to be a woman." Question is, if you were there 24/7, would the thrill run out?

Hi Jenny - what convinced you ultimately that you weren't trans? Denial tends to be pretty strong on this - nobody in their right mind wants to be trans.

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Then you find yourself one day saying: "If I like dressing this much, and I like dressing up more and for longer, I must be wanting to be a woman." Question is, if you were there 24/7, would the thrill run out?

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So I wanted to highlight this statement because it shows a mistake about thinking about transgender that I frequently see in this forum. If you are thinking about positive feelings about CD, thrills, joy, sexuality, happiness, etc. then you are really looking at the wrong feelings in terms of whether or not to transition. If your feelings about it are mostly positive, in my opinion you probably do not need to transition.

The negative feelings, GD in particular, are what leads one to transition, or that's how I see it. Transition is a way to alleviate misery - for some of us a hellish nightmare of misery. A therapist can help sort out these symptoms, but ultimately, no one can really say you need to transition except you. If presenting as female lessens your symptoms, it's time to talk to a professional.

Well said, Jenny.

I really hope you find the light that you are looking for... just remember, there is no light at the bottom of anything...

Dear Paula

To fully understand where I'm coming from you'll have to have the patience to read through my story posted in the intro section, I think it was called "New here but need help."

In short I have been dressing again for the past 18 months or so after spending many years out of the scene, I suppose "in denial" as you so eloquently put it. Over time I have found that the more you indulge in it the more it asks of you, to the point where the question "Am I TG?" transpires.

I am trying to strike a balance again in my life where I can put my crossdressing needs in perspective to the bigger picture. I think one should not allow something to rule over you, as it has done to a large extent in my life. We were made to be rulers, not subjects and I am trying to get myself back that point. Now this all sounds great and everything but I can assure you I am not even close to that point yet. But I am trying.

No, dressing I cannot do without. Spending time just being Jenny would be good. But giving up everything that is good in my (male) life for a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, no way.

So no, being a man most of the time does not make me miserable. Not being Jenny sometimes, makes me miserable and I think that is where the difference lies between CD and TG (which to an extent is what you said!).

Thanks for the engaging conversation but I really need to get back to work now!!!

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Originally Posted by Jenny Elwood

Hi Dawn

Maybe it is because of living in the 3rd world (where we live more basic lives) that we do not have this penchant for over analysis that people in the 1st world seem to have. Though I have no problem with counselling, I've gone through a lot of it myself with my wife, I have to agree with her: You need to be careful here as well.

I found that one counsellor, whether willingly or inadvertently, steered me in the TG direction and after a while I started believing this to be true.

Like I said before, when we devote so much time to something in our lives it does tend to suck us in more and more. Then you find yourself one day saying: "If I like dressing this much, and I like dressing up more and for longer, I must be wanting to be a woman." Question is, if you were there 24/7, would the thrill run out?

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I think this holds true for a lot young CD'ers in their early 20's. I've seen literally thousands of posts on reddit and 4chan from young adults who were questioning their sexual identity. It's hard to draw conclusions, but some said they thought they were in denial and tricked themselves in thinking they might be transsexual. I think it's hard to draw a line, especially when you're questioning pretty much everything. Also, I found those sites dangerous as I felt some people were really cheerleading people to just transition. Telling them they were in deep denial and that they were going to transition anyway.

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Originally Posted by Milou

Also, I found those sites dangerous as I felt some people were really cheerleading people to just transition. Telling them they were in deep denial and that they were going to transition anyway.

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i couldn't have said it better myself!

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Originally Posted by dawn03

But I do feel the need to be true to myself in some way.

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This is key. "In Some Way".

What are your self-expression opportunities? Are you free to dress at home? Do you go out much dressed and do day-to-day things like shopping, eating in restaurants, hanging out in coffee shops, going to shows, etc?

If you feel at all constrained or if you've only just gone out a few times, you know that it will make the feelings and need for expression worse. You need to construct a life such that you can go out and do things several times per week, in the next town over if you are concerned with privacy. And you need to do this long enough for you to get over the novelty and the excited feelings that come with these experiences in the beginning, especially if you are also working on improving your presentation and increasing your wardrobe.

You should set about doing this, and then revisit your feelings in one year. You may well find a difference. Or not. But at least you will have put yourself out there to see how the role may fit.

Seeing a gender therapist is a good idea, but find a good one. I've no doubt there are gender therapists out there who have tunnel vision and I can't say that I blame them, if the bulk of their clients are TS.

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Originally Posted by ReineD

What are your self-expression opportunities? Are you free to dress at home?

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Mostly no, because we still have two kids at home who don't know about my CDing. I manage to go out about once a month and that's to a local transgender social meeting.

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Originally Posted by ReineD

If you feel at all constrained or if you've only just gone out a few times, you know that it will make the feelings and need for expression worse. You need to construct a life such that you can go out and do things several times per week, in the next town over if you are concerned with privacy.

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You are very wise and have given good advice. I will not rush into anything.

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Originally Posted by ReineD

Seeing a gender therapist is a good idea, but find a good one. I've no doubt there are gender therapists out there who have tunnel vision and I can't say that I blame them, if the bulk of their clients are TS.

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I perceive that danger. If you go to a kidney specialist, he or she will find something wrong with your kidneys. :)

I have found myself in the same dilemma many times. It is a rollercoaster in terms of do I really want to be a girl or am I okay just being me.
If it seems to become an obsessive train of thought, as it has with me at times, counseling may be your only answer. I have spent most of my life on this rollercoaster only to find the best solution for me was the in between (as I am now). Sure I would love to be a real girl but hormones, sex reassignment just will not do it for me. I would probably be happier without the male bits but I am okay with them too. Definitely take the time to really consider the outcome. As I got older it does not seem to matter much any more, even though I wish I was a girl instead of a boy on a daily basis. I have learned to accept myself as I am, not a compromise.