Dealing with hate...

So, I went to Pride last month and it was great. I decided that I need to be more open about myself, my sexual preferences, and my image of who I am.

I'm not shouting it from the rooftops or anything, just doing small things. I still wear my binder, I wear rainbow earrings when I go out in 'girl mode', I tell people I have had girlfriends instead of referring to my exes as 'they', I also openly admire men's clothing when I go out, and I tell people who ask that I'm gay.

However, there is a lot of hate. My mom has quit talking to me and unfriended me on FB because of my 'lifestyle'. I had one woman tell me that she had nothing against gay people but that if I tried to 'convert' her, she would 'end' me. I've had people say that they're uncomfortable with me being in the pool with them, or hanging around their kids. I've had people telling me that I'm going to Hell and that I'm disgusting.

My dad has been a huge comfort to me during this time and helping me to laugh it off. But sometimes it's really hard. How does everyone deal with being themselves in a world full of hate?

Hug

I'm sorry you have to deal with this mate! People are stupid!

Hug
Rita

Think of it this way, you're someone who can't fathom consciously trying to hurt someone.
That right there makes you a thousand times a better person.

I'm not sure about the whole Hell thing, Michigan isn't really my cup of tea anyway.
However, I'm going on the assumption that no benevolent creator would subject their creation to eternal torture (in Michigan).

I know the feeling of looking at all the hate in the world though, sometimes I can read or see something that makes me lie down and ponder the purpose of life itself.
Then I get up and watch something funny, your life is not theirs to control, not physically, nor mentally through fear.

Feel better :)

Princess Grandpa: Thank you for your support :)

whowhatwhen: Thanks :) I hate hurting people and go out of my way to be nice to everyone but it's frustrating to hear such hateful things directed towards me for something so silly. I want to stand up for myself but it doesn't seem like talking calmly with people helps much in that situation ^_^;

As far as the Hell thing, I'm not too worried about it. I'm pretty strong in my faith(or lack of it lol)

My dad suggested that I learn karate so I can become a gay ninja and throw Rainbow Shurikens of Love(TM) at people but I don't think that's an ideal solution either, haha.

I'm sorry you have to deal with that, Len.

Pride day is normally a day of affirmation. It is how we get to feel like there is a significant segment of folks who *get* us.

Most of my family (excepting my parents) are fundies. It really doesn't matter what I say, or which parts of the Bible I bring up to contest it, I'm still wrong. "Because Jeebus"

Be yourself, and be strong in your identity. *Who* are you trying to get the approval of and *Why*?

Do you want closed minded people to approve of you, or do you want to be with a community who *gets* you?

Yah, I thought so...

EDIT: Your Dad's reply is AWESOME. Give him a kiss!!


<3

- MM

Not so sure you shouldn't look in to the gay Ninja thing. Try googling Ninja and see what you ... oh, that's right if you google Ninja you don't find anything. Cunning Ninja's!
Seriously Len, your going to find a lot of haters in the world, they knock around with the narrow minded, ignorant, ill-informed bigots that make everyones life a misery. And I'd suspect that certain parts of the US are .. less tolerant, than others.
Be yourself, find good people and look after them, they'll return the favour.
Sorry to hear that about your Mum, that's not good for you, her either.

Take care,
Christen x

As someone who has spent more than 10 years doing martial arts.. it won't help with perception.

You need to be confident in who YOU are. You will NEVER make 'them' happy without lying to yourself about who you are.

They want you to fit in a preconceived set of rules... that don't fit you.

Be you, honey. If someone (even a relative) has a problem with you, then *they* have a problem with *you*!!

<3

- MM

mechamoose: Thanks for the good advice, as always :) Pride itself was great but it's the aftermath that's been strange, haha. It's like everyone wants to be super-hateful to make up for the amazing love that was present during Pride.

Ironically, my mother isn't religious and was planning on marrying a woman when I was younger. But right now she's very much 'what will people think?' and doesn't want to associate with me until 1) being gay becomes popular or 2) I become a famous novelist and people 'overlook that type of thing as being creative'. ^_^; Ah, my insane mother...

Christen: The ninja comment made me laugh XD As said above, my mom's a bit...odd. I'm not too worried about her opinion though ;) From what I understand Missouri has come a long way towards becoming more tolerant but gay people just aren't very common where I live, especially not lesbians.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LenGray

Pride itself was great but it's the aftermath that's been strange, haha. It's like everyone wants to be super-hateful to make up for the amazing love that was present during Pride.

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That's pretty much what's happening with some people. Four trans women of color were killed last month during pride month. Most likely not a coincidence.

The main thing you can do in a world full of hate is:
1. Avoid known haters - seriously, cut them out of your life. Good riddance. This is tough when it's family, but really, what choice do you have?
2. Ignore negative / hateful strangers. Who cares what they think? They don't know you, their opinion is meaningless.
3. Know that a fair size chunk of the world hates you for being who you are, and loving who you love. Expect it. Be pleasantly surprised (and make friends with) people who aren't hateful.
4. Be aware of your situation and surroundings at all times.
5. When the situation looks like it's heading for trouble - get out of it as fast as you can, however you have to do it. Don't seek confrontation, run.
6. If you have to enter a situation where trouble is likely, bring friends.

I think of myself as a mouse in a world full of cats - it's just sort of my mindset right now. I'm not afraid (I'm really not), but I also know I have to be careful.

Hi Len

Sorry to hear your having to deal with hate. the biggest problem is most can't cope with different. Anything they don't understand scares them. Unfortunately tolerance is a virtue never taught to some people.

All you can really do is be yourself and hope the eventually see you are jut a normal guy trying to get along in life.

Len, Im sorry you have to deal with this B.S. I dont really know what to say. You cant change some people, so just try to stay away from the negative ones. :hugs:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LenGray

However, there is a lot of hate. My mom has quit talking to me and unfriended me on FB because of my 'lifestyle'. I had one woman tell me that she had nothing against gay people but that if I tried to 'convert' her, she would 'end' me. I've had people say that they're uncomfortable with me being in the pool with them, or hanging around their kids. I've had people telling me that I'm going to Hell and that I'm disgusting.

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Firstly I'm sorry to hear how your mum has reacted, after all it's you life and not hers. Now the women she really needs to get herself educated, does she not know that you don't convert to be gay, if you're gay then that's who you are..silly woman. Mostly it comes down to peoples ignorance and not being educated about the subject, they are blinkered and most don't want to understand.

I know it's hard but try to ignore what is said, it's their problem and not yours :hugs:

I would guess one reason people hate those who are "different" is that they have someone to take out their own life frustrations on. I love you for who you are my friend and attempting to be anyone else would not be Len. Just continue being yourself. It shows you have courage and conviction when they simply go with the crowd. Be well.As far as gong to Hell, no biggie. I was already there but they kicked me out because I talked too much, not to mention the cooking sucks. :)

LenGrey

This stuff happens, you will always get the haters heaven knows I've had my fair share of abuse over the years for being gay and the physical scars to prove it, people that hate you are not worth bothering with they are the ones with the problem not you, see the thing is haters are that for one reason because their own life is so crap that they have to bring you down to their level and more often than not they are the one harboring feelings they cant deal with so ultimately they take out out on someone else and being gay your an easy target we are like sitting ducks on a drive by shoot out at times:straightface:, they are the lowest of the low in my book and what I like to think of as "SCUM" and not worth the steam off my piss, just be your self and keep your head held high, you are who you are nothing can change that and you should never change to suit others either, I think your mom unfriending you is truly awful and a wicked thing to do, at least your dad is supporting you that counts for a lot.

I could go on and on but it would just be a repeat of what others have said here, just look after your self and be happy

The world isn't as full of hate as your experiences suggest. There are pockets of gross intolerance, not so much geographic as ideological, where certain people think their "beliefs" trump the rights of everyone else, ideological caves where even a mother can "unfriend" a child and a grossly misinformed person can insist that being gay (or TG) is some how a contagion. The disease of willful ignorance has infected these people. The best advice is to remove them from your circle of associations and seek out people like your father.

Even here in (urban) Tx, with it's sometimes well earned reputation for bigotry, I find that I can go out, interact freely as a TG person and experience no overt prejudice. So, it's possible.

Thank you everyone for your support :) It makes me feel a lot better to know that there are so many supportive people out there! ^_^

It seems like dealing with this kind of thing is just disassociating from negative people and keeping a upbeat outlook, huh?

Yeah, you cant wait for them to change. It will just make you sad and crazy.

We can choose our friends but we can't choose our relatives.

We can, however choose who we associate with. If a relative persists in saying negative things then she does not need to be in your social circle. "Unfriending" you, however juvenile it might seem, is actually a good thing for you.

Hatred grows where there is ignorance and is encouraged by those who use it to acquire power for themselves. I'll bet that behind both of the people you mention there is some theological leader who is telling them that you will suffer a bad fate and that you will try to "convert" them if they allow it.

My advice is to educate by example, associate with people who are supportive of you, and don't worry about those who are not supportive. They aren't receptive anyway so any attempt to connect with them will be interpreted as an attempt to "convert" them.

No one mentioned this so I should say -
The problem isn't so much your "lifestyle" as it is the fact that you are young. Young people are constantly being told how they should live their lives. As you get older, it happens less. For those of us beyond 35, the world just doesn't tell us what to do. I know this helps very little now but you are just facing the problem all younger folks face. "Go to college, get married, have kids, stay away from partying, blah blah blah..." Hell with them. Y'all have to decide for yourselves how you want to live.

Haters - People gonna hate no matter what. I have had people hate on my cause of my healthy smoking habit, because of my appearance, even because I still buy and play cassette tapes.

And the lady saying not to try converting her - who the hell does she think she is anyways? Like her nasty stankin' (business) is so good that genetic females everywhere want it. Has she had Jehovah's lesbians come knocking on her door? That lady is a trip.
Not wanting you around their kids - If someone told ME that, I would be like, "Well good cause i don't want your nasty snot-nose brats around me". I am not a fan of kids though.
Pool - I assume people who say that are the same ones who take their screaming, booger-infested "blessings" to the pool while the parents are too busy texting or drinking liquor to keep an eye out?
Those who hate on you do NOT matter. They are not your friends, they do not add anything good to your life.

The other day at work I was going to the restroom and some meth-looking skank was on the phone and told the person on the other end something about a transvestite going into the bathroom. She was even trying to peek through the cracks on the side of the door. This hoebag had the class of a dog turd. Meth - not even once!

EDIT - As your confidence grows, you will find you receive more compliments etc than you ever will hate. I hear at least one compliment each day and maybe one insult every two months.

peopel have been doing this since the dawn of man --- if they do not understand it they hate it ,when they hate it and it is outside the selaapointed norms of that group they persecute it ,in fact in amaerica up until the civil war if you were a man or woman who thought society as it stood then sucked ,and you went to live with the natives and were caught -you could be executed. all of this because what the individual was doing did not fit in with ht egroup thought .Personally if I want to go further into the c/d and go from underdressing to toal dressing then i will have to think it out and be careful of where i display my other self due to the many reports of beating and killing gay people etc. One of the most ignorant things is stereotyping I/E all cross dressers are gay ! well moose muffins (alaskan for bs) there are some that are gay ,there are some that are bi, and then there are some who are straight ,however society as a whole does not identify with that and because it is easier they put a blanket definition on all of it . My first roomate in the airforce was gay and I had to take a lot of crap from the guys in the section, well being a typical 20 yr old when I got back to the barracks I told my roomy he better stay on his side of the room and if he tried any of that queer stuff he would be sorry. Well he started laughing and said sitdown we ned to talk , he told me that if he was queer he would have already tried something ,but he said he was gay and was only interested in his own kind,and that I did not send the right kind of signals to him . We became good friends after that talk and I am not embarrassed to say it he was my first bi encounter ,later however he was caught on post engaged in this behaviour and discharged ,this was way back in the original don't ask don't tell years.I have heard a lot of ignorant people talking "those gays better not come near me" the joke is on them as if one did sit down by them they would not even know it I know many people to this day that are gay and we get along fine with a mutual respect ,one did ask how come I tolerated them and I told him that for the most part they are normal acting people who do not go around flamboyantly advertising the fact ,I have learne dthe same thing on this site by reading and observing I find a mix of who we are and what stage we are comfortable in . Don't give up on your mom sometimes hope springs eternal and you 2 will see eye to eye as for the rest of them well #$#@#$%^%$!!! them and move on to people whoe respect and accept you for the way you are ,not what you are
hugs to you phylis anne

Sorry I missed this way back when you started this thread. First, I think your mother could use some education on the subject. Second, the gay ninja throwing Rainbow Shurikens of Love(TM) at people isn't a half bad idea but it isn't going to get the results you want. Mostly, it is up to you. Mom is scared. She is afraid that you will never fit into the world. It is up to you to show her by your actions that you will. Stand up and take charge of your life. Become the responsible, hard working, knowledgeable person you need to be and let her see that each and every time she is near you. Show her you are going to be just fine in the world. After a while, mom will be ok with whatever you do.

People who like to use the word Lifestyle as a pejorative usually have neither...

knowhatwhen.......
I guess you didn't read the thread very well. Or you don't realize that Michigan and Missouri are two different places.

I have been going OUT enfemme in Michigan for almot two years. Lately I have been frequenting venues that cater to the whole population as opposed to venues frequented primarily by gays. For no other reason than the music is better, a coincidence not a statement of any kind.

Thus far I have had NO problems in Michigan. But certainly if I was careless I might. This careless reference is in NO way referencing the experience that LenGray has suffered through.

LenGray:
You are a courageous person for doing what you feel good about. It is YOUR business what you see yourself as. You are not harming anyone. Actually you are making the world just a little bit better by being happy with yourself. So do your thing and hold your head up high. If I was your mother I would be PROUD of you! If I was anywhere nearby I would buy your dad a beer! Give him a hug from me and tell him that there is another person out there that thinks he is a GREAT dad!!!
And be happy. Life is short. Even when our closest relatives hurt us, we must pick who we hang with, who we tolerate even though we love them, and who we avoid. I have experienced all this. There is happiness out there, find it, don't let anyone cast a shadow on your life.

You could always learn to wave with your middle finger :)....wishful thinking. Stay strong and be you. If there is a God then I think he made you who you are and you should enjoy being that person no matter what people "think". Your mom will come around hopefully. Sounds like you have an amazing dad who supports you and are very lucky to have him.

Ginger

Len - just a few words from a very astute American therapist, the Late Virginia Satir,

I do not have to compromise my personal integrity.
I have a right to make mistakes and be responsible for them. I have a right to be wrong.
I do not have to be liked, admired, or respected by everyone for everything I do.

No matter what anyone else thinks, these are YOUR rights as an independent human being.

Even when it is hard, when you feel you just want to give in - stand tall and be proud. It is so damned easy to go with the crowd, just to fit in, and be comfortable, but Len, it doesn't work.

You are unique. You are valuable in this world, and in the next. As far as I know, there is nothing in the Christian Bible to say that you are not loved at that level.

So, ignore the nay sayers and be LEN!!!

There are two threads open now that deal with hatefulness. And there seem to be two camps...of course, aren't there always. One side says walk away, laugh it off, choose your battles. The other says face up to the haters.

I'm reminded of the civil rights movement. Black people had taken the course of least resistance through decades, centuries,really. Nothing changed. Then , returning from WWII, black people began to strongly insist on their rights. From Rosa Parks to MLK, the movement was peaceful, but assertive. And they were met with horrendous violence at times. But in the end, fundamental changes occurred. It's imperfect and Incomplete, but change happened. Imagine the courage required.

I believe that the strive for human dignity for all minorities has been advanced as a result. Lesson... Just ignoring hatred may be the safe short term path, and I don't minimize the value of self preservation. But, sustained, assertive, non violent confrontation ...facing up to the bigoted, as the civil rights movement demonstrated, will eventually lead to change.

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Originally Posted by kimdl93

But, sustained, assertive, non violent confrontation ...facing up to the bigoted, as the civil rights movement demonstrated, will eventually lead to change.

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I agree with this!!

Further though - Len, my wife and I were discussing people's hatred the other day and I was pondering not the hatred so much, but more about who hates.

It is my observation that it is often the people closest to us that do the most hating. And that is totally messed up! The number of people who report that their mother, father, wife, husband, brother, sister, etc. who are the ones committing the hatred is overwhelming.

Recently I have come out to a few friends and some of the responses were funny. More than one person said, "I am totally fine with it but you should be careful about letting ________ know because while I am open minded, they are not." In one incident I had two people say that exact thing about each other. It is kind of odd and disturbing.

So.... how do I deal with hatred? Honestly I have not encountered the types of bigotry that you have. With that being said, what I do is to not hide who I am. Those that will hate, will always hate. It is their narrow mindset that makes them afraid of the unknown.

I do wish that people would stop being afraid of what others will say, think, do. Which seems to be what lots of folks hide behind, as your mother appears to be doing. It is sad that she cannot see that she is the one committing the hatred out of her fear of what others might do.

I'm sorry that some of your family members don't accept you. That is hard. I can deal with strangers and even friends rejecting me, but people I love... that's tough.

Ultimately, though, I think it's important to be yourself. If you conduct yourself with dignity, confidence and conviction, then even the haters will secretly admire you, though their own insecurities will make them unable to admit that. The important thing is you'll be true to yourself.

If people have a problem with who and how you are, please refer them to the manufacturer.

Dealing with hate sucks. I am sorry to hear you have to deal with such. Family can be the biggest pain. The only one who know about me is my wife. She told me yesterday that she accepts me. She loves me for me, not what I wear. The rest of my family including my kids don't know. Although I think the kids would not have a problem. The rest of them would. All you girls who are out I am very proud and a touch jealous.