Is doing the only way to find out?

Thanks to all for sharing your thoughts on my earlier question.

I have been thinking hard on this and have been asking myself these questions for a while. It looks that a lot of you would like to go 24/7, or spend significant amount of time dressing. I definitely feel the same way too. But feeling that way does not mean that is what I wanted if I get it. Because so far my experience with dressing has been just maybe once in a while, so theoretically only 5% of my time. But guessing what would happen at 100% with only the experience at 5% would for sure give unrealistic results. It is like guessing how I would feel zooming with a Nascar driver, while indeed I have only ridden a moped. From my current place, I definitely would like more. But how much more? How do I know how I would feel if 24/7 would make me happy, or I will miss being a man or being bothered by the amount of preparation needed everyday?

Is actually doing it the only way to find out? (By the way, I think you know that the life price to pay for trying it might be pretty high for those of us who are married). What are your thoughts? Any experience to share?

Yes I believe is the only way, I used to do it just for a couple of hours now is whole weekends and the more often you do it becomes second nature... it feels good and normal

Yes and no.

I do think there's a fair amount of consideration you can give to what you're willing to risk before doing anything, and I strongly encourage people to do so. That said, it is true that you don't really know what things are like until you try. Like badtranny always points out, full-time is no joke, and will pretty much always weed out anybody who doesn't really need to do this. It's not worth it if you don't.

I think it's worth seriously considering what your motivations are for wanting to present as female more often. Do you identify as transexual, and feel compelled to spend more time as your authentic self? On the other extreme, are you a fetishistic dresser looking to spend more time in the "high"? Somewhere in between? Knowing your answer (or at least the one you think is true right now) is important, I think. If you are a man, then I think it's a near certainty that you will miss being a man. Wearing dresses everyday doesn't really make you less of a man though, and it definitely doesn't make you a woman.

I think you'll find that the closer to 100% you get, the more you have to realize that being a woman is not all fun, games, and lingerie. Being a woman is being a woman, dirt and errands and ugly days and sweat and day 3 hair and good looks and bad looks and sometimes fear and almost always how-many-days-ago-did-I-shave-my-legs-screw-it-I'm-wearing-these-jeans-again. To use your metaphor, it's not like driving Nascar - it's just like your current life. You drive a big construction site loader and try to keep up with the massive pile of dirt that just keeps growing, only now you might wear a different helmet, take a lot more time and effort to be considered acceptable by a bunch of people who don't matter but always seem to, and get paid less for it. Being trans is a difficulty multiplier on all of that.

Great question which I think we all have struggled with ( or will ) at one time or another...it's kinda like looking into a pool and wondering if you should dive in....i cant REALLY give advice cause your married ( i'm not & clueless on how to deal with those issues)...
if you were not married I'd say hey..try it for a week , try it for two.....or even 3.....after that you may hang up your heels and say ehhhh....I like it once in a while but its exausting and too much. Lots of gals do this....
OR you may love it which then would open a whole new can of worms with the wifey.
If it were me and I was married...right now I'd find a safe balance between the two first and see how that feels. You may grow tired of it quickly.

Not every woman wears make-up every day - some do, yes, others do not.
I think my SO has worn more make-up in the last 6 months since I started to CD than in the previous 6 years, as she has kept me company.

So the thing is, what does 24/7 mean? sleeping in wig and make-up? Really? Many women take off their make up before going to bed.

I can do 24/7 man-in-a-dress, and occasionally fully dress-up with make-up and wig, I can just shave and shift my hair to a femme way, I can be bearded in a dress. So the question you can ponder is what you really want. For me it's the FEEL of the clothing, and the look of the colours, cut of the clothes. It's no good wearing bright manclothes, just does not cut it.

One thing you can think of trying is to represent a temporary 1-week to family and colleagues and friends a social experiment or "bet" to dress as a woman for that time. It will show you enough, and allow everyone else to at least feel ur still "a real man" etc etc

xxx

Hi Leslie,

I guess it really depends on your specific circumstances. Yes, I would posit that in order to fully appreciate what you are thinking you would have to try it for 24/7 at some juncture but then again as Zooey pointed out what is the reasoning to do so. If you are truly TS then the drive to be a woman (not in just the dressing sense) will consume you and drive to present as a woman full time so you will probably have no choice in the matter. However, if it is just a requirement to dress a bit more then perhaps 24/7 is not required and just stepping up your game is a better solution. Of course personal circumstances (relationship, work, venue, neighborhood) is going to be the big leveler as that would mean going to work, family functions, social events, as a woman and that might not be possible for some. For me, I reach points where I identify more as a woman than a man and I have need to do so in public including work, social events, family and what not. I don't see myself as a man during that time but as a woman. However, he (the man) is always there and sometimes he takes over at which time I identify as a man and see myself as a man. So 24/7 in one gender (right now) is not an option for me.

Cheers

Isha

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Originally Posted by LeslieSD

Is actually doing it the only way to find out? (By the way, I think you know that the life price to pay for trying it might be pretty high for those of us who are married). What are your thoughts? Any experience to share?

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Hi Leslie,
My experiences have been on both sides of these feelings. I have been a CD for a very long time and have been out countless times fully dressed, partially and sometimes for days.
All the times that i have done this, i always want more but that i think is the norm for me.

One rush i certainly like and have done is being 'stuck' in my girl mode for three days with 'no chance' of getting my guy stuff until done. Kind of a fantasy that i play out from time to time.

My longest time 'dressed' albeit at night was 5 weeks in a cold Wisconsin winter for a set of training classes.
The company was good since i met a like minded CD and it was a blast. On the weekends we went clubbing and nearly never came back to the hotel for 2 days!

At the end of it the usual depression set in leaving Charlene behind for a time. It was very hard-truly.

Over the years, i have managed to compartmentalize my life in a way that tempers what and when Charlene needs to be free again. I don't mean to make it sound like she is a captive but i can be calm and patient until the planning is done for my outing. Daily i under/bottom dress complete w/ flats or heels for over 4 years now. (yes that's at work).

This lifestyle has enabled me (Charlene!) to compromise and live comfortably with her urges and desires.
If i had my way, Charlene would be out 100 percent having experienced many of those challenges, fashion, social hurdles etc already.

You have some good points here, thanks for bringing them up!

Hugs
Charlene

Hi Leslie, 24/7 sounds like fun but be careful what you wish for,
For me it's more fun playing on both sides of the fence.:daydreaming:

Too little info to give you an opinion as to you, but this may be of help'
"No battle plan survives the first engagement with the enemy." Whatever you plan or contrive in order to experience this needs to have a lot of contingency options in order to have a chance at undamaging success.

I think that 1) by "a lot" you really mean very few cross dressers. Respondents do not represent the masses. It's selective response so in no way statistically relevant. 2) the "grass is always greener" phenomenon. One takes the enjoyment they get from an hour or two and extrapolates. Not the case. Multiple shaves per day will hurt. A bra worn for 24 hours will hurt. Heels hurt. Why do you think women change to "comfortable" clothes when they finish work? 3) doing may be the best way to prove it is a fantasy and not something easily done. And lastly 4) yes, I can't imagine many marriages surviving this.

If you were to start dressing and presenting as a woman every day, it would affect not only your wife, but your job and your relationships with your friends and neighbors. Coming out as a crossdresser is not something that you can easily undo. Dressing every day, all day is in effect "transitioning", a very big step in anyone's life.

If you want to try it, I suggest taking some time off from work and driving to another town or city, getting a motel room and giving it a shot for a week or more. My bet is that reality will set in and you'll come home and go back to being a part time crossdresser.

Hi Leslie,

I think this is a question we each have to find out for ourselves. Some of us are content with the very occasional dressing, or under dressing. Some of us may go out, find it uncomfortable and not pursue it. Some of us (many of us?) try going out and find out that it is so cool that we just have to do it again (and again, and again). Some of us may dress daily at home, but either never go out or do so only occasionally. Then there are questions that others raise about the implications of going full-time in the context of work, neighbors and family. these are issues that we each have to face individually. For myself, I dress daily at home and am out and about as much as I can be (some of my neighbors know). But full-time 24/7 is for me not an option, and as I've posted elsewhere, I would not consider dressing at work, or under other circumstances.

So I guess my answer to your question is look at your circumstances and lifestyle, and if 24/7 is really the way you want to go, give it a try. but it does lead to the issue of transitioning.

I don't agree that alot of people here really want to "go 24/7"
if you are thinking hard on this question you should talk to a therapist... most crossdressers i've met don't think very hard on this very obvious question... ita a fun fantasy or part of a femme side to explore and indulge..but its not a serous consideration..

you need to talk this out with your inner dialog and get better in touch with your own gender identity..

alot may talk about it and enjoy the thought of it which is cool but real life is a different story

Also i'd add "dressing 24/7" is an almost impossible idea that exists only in your head.. just think for a moment about a real day or even a weekend...and what you'd need to do, how you would actually look..wigs, sweat, shaving , makeup, girdles..on and on.. its a terrible burden actually...almost any person that tries this will not pass either...

if you are transsexual and that dawns on you over time its a different story...but transsexuals don't "dress" 24/7, they just change their gender role (yes of course that includes dressing in female clothes)...to change the role they take hormones, legally change name and gender status, get electrolysis and potentially get surgeries,...many still do not pass as genetic women although surgery and/or alot of time under your belt improves this part of it over time..we do not wear heels and wigs everywhere.

one idea for you is to go to a conference and spend the time "dressed"... there are lots of opportunities and lots of conferences all over the country...you check into the hotel and for the long weekend you dress and see what it means to you..

another advantage of this is that i view your question as potentially a deep dive for you, and you'd meet lots of cds that dress for fun for fetish for their identity and some ts people as well...it would help you alot to get exposure to other people

I like the description Gender Fluid that is now starting to become mainstream.

I have a different perspective than most, I appreciate that I'll most likely cause debate on my thoughts,

Just wear what you want..... I take it that you're married.

Have you already talked to your SO?

There's some pretty simple ways of introducing unconventional clothing to your life that your SO's can accept without is being an issue.

Getting fit, exercise, cycling ect. all lend themselves to wearing tights.
Man skirts are in fashion right now ... So taking an active interest in modern fashion is another way.

There are so many ways to test the waters without having to commit to 100% female transformation.

Dip your toe in the water you'll soon find out if it's just a novelty, something that you enjoy, or a way of feeling normal.

And Speaking fro experience.

There's no shame in discovering it's simply a joy of wearing feminine clothing.




XXxxx

When you go 24/7, or something close to that, female clothing becomes the new ordinary, the new normal. You don't have to wear makeup every day, but if you did it would become "no biggie."

I'm not 24/7, but I spend several hours every day in female clothing. (Heading for 24/7.) Every once in a while I think to myself "This dress is just ordinary clothing to me. Why bother? Why not just wear male clothing?" But the answer is obvious. Female clothing is normal. Male clothing is icky and weird. I don't want to be icky and weird. I want to be normal.

I suspect that most folks here don't want to go 24/7. I suspect that most folks want dressing to be special, not ordinary.

Not something you can learn second hand, it's like throwing a baseball, I can tell you how to hold the ball, and how to throw the ball, but until you put it in your hand, and give it a toss how do you know if you can do it, and if it feels right to you.
I dress a lot, maybe up to 25 % of the time, I've gone a couple of weeks without ever wearing anything male, but I could not come close to telling you what it must be like to dress 100% of the time, or how I would feel about giving up my male side 100%, how can anyone tell what is right for you, but you?

I'm not sure if you mean dressing full time as a male with male identity or actually transitioning physically and in all other aspects of life...

I think you would need to be driven by a very deep and serious need to do it though, to take such a huge and risky step in your life.

I don't think being full time transitioned is what most crossdressers imagine it to be. I mean for me getting up and getting dressed everyday is just a normal everyday thing and there is no thrill or fun or excitement in it. I feel the same in a t shirt and jeans with no makeup as I do in a dress. Being a woman is not about which cloths you wear.

It's my understanding that in medieval times, in remote areas where they only saw a priest or monk on rare occasions, when a couple wanted to marry, they could do so "temporarily" for a year in something akin to a handfasting ceremony. Then, either when the priest finally arrived on his rounds, or at the end of the year, they could decide then whether to stay married permanently or not.

In a way, I've done this in regards to crossdressing - getting into it off and on over the years.

But it gave me a taste of that life and, even during my "off" periods, I never really let go of it. Now, I'm back and my suspicions are that it's time to make a decision, like those couples in medieval times - to keep going permanently or not.

And it's looking like "keep going" is the direction I'm taking (not every day, mind you... but enough to keep myself happy).

But for those who are debating going 24/7 with your dressing - maybe a little medieval thinking might be in order. Remember, nothing is written in stone.

I and many others here have been lucky to spend some extended time, in my case 24/5, enfemme. It is truly liberating to be able to go to sleep and wake the next morning knowing it's a Drab free day ahead. Even more so if you're able to go out and about.

However, and this is a common response, after a while maintaining the look, shaving, makeup, heels, wearing a wig etc it can become a bit of a chore. Would I recommend to you, should your circumstances permit, spending some extended time enfemme, hell yes; and that takes us to your question which is also the answer. You have to try it to know.

I become female only at night time, on daily basis.
I won't be able to sleep without wearing bra and panty.
This has been my routine for last 5 years and my wife is used to it and helps me to buy correct size bra and panty. I have my own collection. She doesn't know I wear her dresses in her absence and I have no courage to tell her.
she doesn't even know I m member of this forum.

Leslie,
If you really wanted to do it 24/7 you would probably try and if you couldn't you would be fairly miserable because you didn't succeed !
To me you don't appear to be showing the overpowering need to do so , what ever level you achieve you sound as if you're comfortable with ! The question is why worry about it if it doesn't bother you too much ?

I think that dressing everyday for an extended period of time would be a great experience for those that want to try that. The reasons for trying it could be many, including pre-real life experience, for fun, to better fit wherever one is on the TG spectrum, for whatever reason. Presenting as female, or male for out FtM cousins, can have some side benefits, like learning how to dress down wearing comfortable clothes with little or no makeup, how to manage facial hair, how to manage makeup over a full day of routine activities, how someone full time, like our TS sisters and brothers, has to deal with real life and still accomplish what they need to accomplish during the day, like grocery shopping, running errands, etc.

I think that one could try this away from home during a vacation to someplace where you are not known by renting a cottage, room, or whatever to give you a temporary home base to live that period of time as the opposite gender. It is not for everyone, but I believe that for those that are comfortable going out and interacting with strangers on a regular basis, it could be a lot of fun and a great learning experience.

I personally wouldn't mind trying that somewhere. Since I am not out to family and friends, and do not currently plan on doing that to everyone (maybe a select few), I would need to do it far enough away from home to feel totally at ease of not being seen by someone who only knows my male side. I would enjoy dressing and going out more than my current 2 times a week, especially for more daytime outings. I would like that experience and freedom to dress and go out when I felt like it. Since that is not a pressing need, yet!, I am more than fine with my current routines. They are just desires not yet fulfilled that may never be fulfilled, which is no big deal.

Thanks a lot for sharing your thoughts.

There are a lot of good questions asked by you, which gets me to think a bit deeper into the question. Sorry I would share my thoughts here and answer these questions together. First of all, I may need to add more information about why I came to the point of facing this question. I am in my mid-40s and have been crossdressing for a long time. My wife knows about it early in our relationship, and her attitude slowly evolved over time from not accepting to DADT at this time. I currently dress about once every couple of weeks and venture out. So I would put my dressing time at about 5%. For a long while, I thought I have come to somewhat an equilibrium point on my dressing time. I had fantasied about going back taking college courses or find a secretary job en fem when I got older or retired, but that is largely just a thought. My most wish at the time is hoping my wife would becoming more accepting and one day maybe we could have some good time together dressed.

That wish hasn't had much progress for a long time. Recently, there are two other events recently that gives me new thoughts. The first event is a few inspiring story from the members here who come out to everyone (especially of Isha, who is still in military), and of course Cathryn. This gives me courage to come out to a friend couple of mine, which is the second event. The acceptance and understanding I received from my friends is so overwhelming to me and at the same time are so enlightening. I have a few long conversation with my friends, and going through various issues of crossdressing, how the society and everyday person sees it, and other issues. They don't know anything about this particular topic, but they are caring, open mined, and straight talking. Their questions is really intriguing, and made me think more about what I wanted to do.

Of all the questions we talked, a particularly intriguing one is "whether I want to dress as a woman all the time". To be honest, I have never thought of it as an option before. Of course, this option has a great amount of appeal to a crossdresser like me. "I want that!" But seriously? Really? I asked myself. I can see all the daily issues, and things get boring that all of you have mentioned. I know by thinking "I want that" I am really thinking "I want more than what I have now". That's for sure. But where is it that I would feel comfortable at? That's the key point. Life is short, and we should not waste time now if that is what I want.

A rational approach would be of course to try it out. Spend a week in vacation en fem (which I doubt would mean much, as that is not real life), spend weekends and spare time en fem and with friends, or further more coming out at work and try full time for some period of time (I have seen a few people do that on Internet, and definitely we have our pioneer Isha here). But that would be somewhat unrealistic in my current situation with my wife. I don't feel any of those options are possible without a significant risk of leading to a divorce.

But if that is what bring me happiness in life, I will weight the options and maybe find some good approach that could lower the risk. So I asked the question, and I believe the consensus from you and the word of wisdom is "yes, you have to try it to find out".

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Originally Posted by Helen_Highwater

I and many others here have been lucky to spend some extended time, in my case 24/5, enfemme. It is truly liberating to be able to go to sleep and wake the next morning knowing it's a Drab free day ahead. Even more so if you're able to go out and about.

However, and this is a common response, after a while maintaining the look, shaving, makeup, heels, wearing a wig etc it can become a bit of a chore. Would I recommend to you, should your circumstances permit, spending some extended time enfemme, hell yes; and that takes us to your question which is also the answer. You have to try it to know.

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My reality check came when I went 24/5. By day 5, getting a close shave almost hurt enough to rip my face off. And I would need to wear makeup every day to cover my beard. While I guess I could solve that with some laser hair removal, I would still have to go thru electrolysis because my beard is "salt and pepper" with about half of the hairs white.

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Originally Posted by LeslieSD

How do I know how I would feel if 24/7 would make me happy, or I will miss being a man or being bothered by the amount of preparation needed everyday?

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This is what so many women ask about; why any man would want all the extra hassles of being a woman. Because right now, all of us who do it, enjoy it because of either the relief we feel, or for those who get thrills, the excitement makes it all worth it. Few of us have any idea of what it would be like to do all the little extra female activities every single day for decades, those same behaviors that women find exhausting.
But the tedium and/or extra pain or discomfort felt of doing all that girl stuff, must be compared with the ever present discomfort that a lot of us feel because we feel that our body is wrong or our presentation is wrong so we must act the part of someone that we're not nearly every waking moment. And it's that last thing that no normal woman, or normal man for that matter, will NEVER be able to comprehend. Only you can decide if it's worth it. And that usually means trying it out for as much time as you can. Of course, that may mean that you'll have to move to a more gender friendly neighborhood if you're going to go 24/7 and don't want the hassles accompanied with being treated like a freak at times. There are places like that, just not a lot of them. However, I really believe that if Jenner stays in the news long enough, this will become less of a problem.

Leslie,
That question keeps going through my mind, I was thinking of coming out to my painting group but thinking it through and talking it over with the tutor you do realise that it's not as simple as that . Some of the complications come from the DADT situation with my wife but to feel good in yourself by coming out is not going to make everyone feel good. As far as my friends in the painting group are concerned I would hate to lose them by offending them and possibly risk causing an uncomfortable situation in the class . Besides I know at that point it would have to be all or nothing, I couldn't just change at the class so it would mean totally coming out in my town in order to get to the classes and I'm not ready for that in my current situation, but I do wish I was !!

The amount of time to get ready is fun,picking out a short mini skirt,a silk blouse,a pair of pantyhose&a pair of heels.The better part is sliding into silky soft pantyhose,then the blouse&last the skirt.When you put it all together when you step into a pair of heels&begin to walk around the place is heaven.I live at home,so
I can secretly dress in my moms clothes,we are about the same size.I order pantyhose online&have it delivered to a friends house,so I never have to disturb her
hose drawer

Teresa your situation is why Red Roof Inn exists

Just a thought

If you don't dress that much build up the time you dress. If your wife is good with it go til you find what you want. If it's not what you like don't dress so often.:hugs:
Angie

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Originally Posted by Angie G

If you don't dress that much build up the time you dress. If your wife is good with it go til you find what you want. If it's not what you like don't dress so often.:hugs:
Angie

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I am in a DADT situation, so any increase in dressing time has a significant risk factor associated with it. That's why I would like to have some insight before I take the chance (talking to her).

What insight do you think you need? You are exploring your identity here, not deciding which car to buy. If you think this might be something you need, you have the right to ask for it. Your partner has the right to give you whatever answer they want. I don't want to get into a debate about the merits of DADT relationships right now, but trust me - if you need this to be happy, you're not doing anybody (you or your partner) any favors longterm by flying a holding pattern...

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Originally Posted by Zooey

What insight do you think you need? You are exploring your identity here, not deciding which car to buy. If you think this might be something you need, you have the right to ask for it. Your partner has the right to give you whatever answer they want. I don't want to get into a debate about the merits of DADT relationships right now, but trust me - if you need this to be happy, you're not doing anybody (you or your partner) any favors longterm by flying a holding pattern...

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Zooey, I know I am agonizing and turning with fear of uncertainty. Even though I "think" I need that to be happy, I am constantly questioning that assessment for it might be just like a kid wanting a roomful of candy. That's where I think some insight might really be helpful. People who have been through this might look at my situation as so clear and simple, just as I was looking at those who is just stepping out the door for the first time. Indeed, I think what you said is very insightful. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by LeslieSD

Even though I "think" I need that to be happy, I am constantly questioning that assessment for it might be just like a kid wanting a roomful of candy.

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If you currently "think" you need that to be happy, then here's another way of looking at it... Do you think you can be truly happy while always wondering "what if"? With never knowing?

There is not a person on this planet who can tell you whether you need more, whether or not it's worth it, etc, other than you. If you can't be happy with always wondering "what if", then you do NEED to at least try/explore things further, in my opinion.

"If you currently "think" you need that to be happy, then here's another way of looking at it... Do you think you can be truly happy while always wondering "what if"? With never knowing?"

This is exactly why I decided that I needed to attend, if only ever once, a meeting with other CD's. I knew I needed to know how that felt. I didn't want to go to the grave thinking, "I wish".

However, I would caution that you need to know what limits your situation dictates and if you go beyond those can you live with the consequences. Don't let we who say yep go for it, it's great, blur your vision. Perhaps if you can explain to your SO that you feel this is something you need to do at least once in your life she may grow to understand. It doesn't have to be in front of her. Have a few days away, perhaps get it out of your system, or not, there's always the danger of wanting more, but at least it may give you the experience to articulate your feeling better to your SO in time.

I would agree that it's very difficult to assess how much of a life change one wants to make without getting first hand experience. For me, living first a whole day, then later for a week to ten days en femme, and traveling en femme were revelatory. I found myself, in a very real sense.

Once one has reached that level of self awareness, the challenge is figuring out how to make it all work out. If the full immersion isn't possible, one is forced into accepting sometimes difficult compromises.

Leslie, I think I get what you are saying. And I am one who spends the vast majority of my time in male mode. So using your number, 5%, a common number for many of us i am assuming, yet internally, we are far more than 5%. Lets just throw out 50% as a baseline, so many of us would still not be presenting our internal gender even if we tripled it. I think it can be possible that because we are so unequal of our physical presentation to our internal feelings of gender, that those times in which we do seem euphoric in nature, so it can seem that when we do present as women/female, the thought would be omg I could live like this forever. Do we have to go 24/7 to find out if those feelings are real? probably not, but definitely our time presenting would have to increase significantly. There are quite a few people on here who once contemplated transition or at least full time, then later realized when they came up to the actual level they were at gender wise that they didn't, or that it wasn't right for them.

Then there is one more way to think about it, and I think many CDers could live full time, maybe not even mind it, but do not need to in order to have fulfilling lives.