You Pervert!

In another thread (cd vs. tg) there was a good passionate debate about labels. Some disliked the topic, but I liked it - such a discussion is the only way we can learn about ourselves as individuals and as a group.

So I decided to dig up an old post of mine from a different site. Basically it's in response to an older girl struggling to describe herself (similar to the cd vs. tg thread). At some point she confesses to sometimes feeling like a pervert. Of course, several other girls jumped on her for using such a derogatory term. Below is my unaltered post, followed by my current thoughts on the subject - this new stuff may be a little over-dramatic, but you tell me ....

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Hi Evita, I totally understand your confusion… it’s confusing for all of us, especially because we change over time (and for some of us our perspectives change from day to day). I also understand the aversion many have with labels. However, it is perfectly natural for humans to seek labels and classifications – it helps us create order in our world and it can be very comforting to feel that we are seeing the big picture, even if that picture is a bit flawed. So, go right ahead and use whatever label you feel describes you best. If you’re like most, that label will change depending on how you feel at that moment.

Now let me turn to this term ‘pervert’ (there I said it and the world did not end). I understand that this is a toxic word, and for most of us it is extremely hurtful. But, I’ve been thinking about this word for the last few days and think that maybe we are thinking about it the wrong way. Rather than pretend it doesn’t exist (and we all know it does, and know it is thought and used by many that are unfamiliar with crossdressing, even those close to us), we should try to embrace this term – defuse it of its power. The LGB community has done this with great success. Back 20 years ago the term queer was extremely derogatory, but now it’s used to express pride and strength. Now, I don’t think we can have that kind of success with respect to the straight world. But, I do think that such an attitude can be empowering to each of us personally. So, let me be the first to say

“I’m a PERVERT and proud of it!!!!” or maybe “Power to the Perverts” or “I’m a perv, she’s a perv, he’s a perv … we’re all pervs!!”

Okay maybe I’m getting carried away (especially with that last one), but I think you get my point.

Yours in her most pervyisness Julie 💋💋💋
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Current thoughts:
If we (you, me, all of us) are going to lose the self-loathing, drop the guilt, find self-acceptance, achieve self-love and ultimately radiate self-pride (we actually have a lot to be proud of - think about it) we are going to have to look our demons straight in the eye, get right up in the face of that ugly beast and say "YOU DO NOT OWN ME!!!" And then, quietly say "I own ... ... ... you."

Any and all comments welcome....

💋💋💋 Julie

Julie, you are a gorgeous pervert!

Me, I'm not so much a pervert as a PRO-vert, which would be a professional pervert. I'm one of those people who can take something truly awful and make it sound suggestive. Double intendres and sexual innuendoes fall from my lips like a cascading waterfall. I have to constantly rein myself in around newer people so I don't offend them (much).

Julie,
Very interesting reply to the label question, some points to remember in it.

I don't go along with the pervert label, if you want to accept one then Deviant is possibly more apt . We all know now that our wiring gets a little mixed up in the womb , we develop as a female and deviate to become male , it's those stages that go wrong or not according to the plan that nature intended.

I would hate to be called a pervert , it doesn't fit, I'm not keen on deviant but it does fit for the TGs/ TSs among us because we have deviated from our intended path , I was going to say normal path but I'm unsure if there are many people truly normal in every sense . The more we discover the more we realise there are many shades of grey in our gender and sexuality .

I am not a pervert. A pervert is always looking to sexualize, a woman. bothering them and looking at their body and boobs and stuff. So it does not fit us at all. Most of us are sane and we are what we are.

per·vert

verb
verb: pervert; 3rd person present: perverts; past tense: perverted; past participle: perverted; gerund or present participle: perverting
pərˈvərt/

• 1.
  alter (something) from its original course, meaning, or state to a distortion or corruption of what was first intended.
  "he was charged with conspiring to pervert the course of justice"
  

  synonyms:

  distort, corrupt, subvert, twist, bend, abuse, misapply, misuse, misrepresent, misinterpret, falsify "people who attempt to pervert the rules"

  
  lead (someone) away from what is considered right, natural, or acceptable.
  
  • "Hector is a man who is simply perverted by his time"
    

    synonyms:

    corrupt, lead astray, debase, warp, pollute, poison, deprave, debauch "men can be perverted by power"

  
  

noun
noun: pervert; plural noun: perverts
ˈpərvərt/

• 1.
  a person whose sexual behavior is regarded as abnormal and unacceptable.
  

  synonyms:

  deviant, degenerate; Moreinformalperv, dirty old man, sicko "a sexual pervert"

Origin
late Middle English (as a verb): from Old French pervertir, from Latin pervertere, from per- ‘thoroughly, to ill effect’ + vertere ‘to turn.’ The current noun sense dates from the late 19th century.


interesting when you look up the definitions of these words : as a verb it makes perfect sense, as a noun....id likely pass on describing myself as one, and still not to keen on the term queer.....which by definition many of us are....for me i will stick with trans....

Pervert tends to draw a mental picture of a sexual deviant like an adult that preys on children for sexual satisfaction.
That word is the last thing I want to be associated with.
With the world driving itself into political correct speech and all the silliness and idiocy of the general public I would have to stop supporting the LGBT if they did anything as ridiculous as that.
Being gay I guess I have a sore spot for that word

Julie
I've always considered myself to a pervert and I'm cool with it, as for the child comment that's more under the pedophile title. I'm a pervy princess and damn proud!!

There are words I think we should reclaim but I don't think pervert is one of them. As noted above, in it's noun form it's describing an identity that I do not think we wish to claim. ;) Just speaking for myself, though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUAK7t3Lf8s

- Diane

I'll accept being called a mutant. We are a beneficial mutation of the "normative" genetic makeup of society. We're not understood by most, but we're not going anywhere. Society better get used to us.

Rhonda

This is nonsense! You're discussing a non issue. There's nothing perverted about most trans. sexual activities. I know. Because I definitely fit the dictionary description of pervert.

I date Sherry!:o

I would simply refer to myself as being 'strange' ... and then add on the rider that each and every human on this planet is 'strange' in their own, unique way.

I struggle with this aberration, until I realise that each of us (LGBT or not) has a cross to bear.

The best I can do is to be kind and forgiving, both to myself and to others.

Well I'm a lesbian seagull, I don't know about the pervert word it's kinda harsh but yeah maybe I see what your saying, so call me pervert call me dude looks like a lady,call me woman hear me roar!!

Not sure if Evita is a reference to Eva Peron and being not a fan of the word perverted!

Guess you know where Eva and I stand!

Stacy!

Would never use the word perverted , Julie.
I would however describe myself as kinky ;)

I deviate from the norm in several areas. I sometimes have deviant behavior. But I wouldn't call myself a deviant or pervert. I'm unique!

No! Do not like the word pervert! Enough (in the "real" world) negative connotations with transgender and crossdresser! We do not need any more negative things here! Hugs Lana Mae

I do not like the word pervert. It is thrown around too often and captures too many people within its net. Yes, a sexual predator is a pervert because he or she is so far outside societal norms and customs and causes injury to people who are defenseless. It really disgusts me to hear that word tossed around with reference to gays, lesbians and transgender men and women. I find people will label those groups because they do not understand why they are that way, and, those groups fall outside whatever "moral code" they adhere to. I won't go further into my views on religion related to these matters.

Next time someone tossed the term "pervert" around, ask them why that term? What does it mean to the person? When my wife and I had "the talk" decades ago I told her what the truth was and still is; "I don't know why I wear women's clothing." I've tossed this around my head for decades. In my developing years it caused angst, self loathing. Wearing women's clothing was not within societal norms and expectations. I heard it from the pulpit. Heck, the same people railed against girls who wore mini-skirts. Or long haired boys. If the person does not conform to his or her beliefs the person is labeled as unacceptable.

There is no way I can turn "pervert" around into something "acceptable." I do not accept the premise a derogatory word can be used by one segment of society and not by another. I can call myself a "pervert" but you cannot???? I don't buy it at all.

The mere word "pervert" gets my hackles rising no end, this is the 3rd time pervert has been raised within the last week. just the word itself suggest something sordid and not nice. There should be no room within our community for the use of the word pervert or for somebody to refer to themselves as being a pervert or feeling perverted.
WE ARE NOT perverts none of us but we are on different levels of sexuality within the bounds of the LGBT community so forr me it feels wrong that perversion and/or perverts should be encompassed within us.
Its just not a nice word to use these days at all!.

Also included in the pervert label: pedophilia, beastiality, necrophilia. No, I’d rather not lump myself in with those things. The problem is that it’s a very broad term and not specific to our community.

Both the words PERVERT and DEVIANT are used as insults by many people. Why would the CD/TG community ever want to accept these words as descriptors of itself?
Psychiatrists etc. used the word deviant to describe a host of behaviors including cross dressing but with increasing understanding of the wide variety of behaviors or lifestyles the question became "deviation from what?
A medical doctor once told me that spending a lifetime treating sick people did not give her an understanding of the majority of the population who rarely see a doctor. Likewise I have seen studies of transvestism and transsexualism that admit that the population they study tend to be just a subset of the TS/TG population and care should be taken in drawing conclusions based on skewed data.

The dictionary may define the word but what matters is how society as a whole perceives it.
Many years ago if you asked someone if they were gay you were asking them if they were happy or in a good mood, Today ask someone if they are gay and it has a whole different meaning.
The word pervert has too much negativity attached to it.
Although by the dictionary definition I may be pervert. i don’t want to be called one.

Given all of the negative connotations to the words pervert and deviant perhaps we should just say we are VARIANT.

Isn't it time this thread was closed? I am getting fed up with this word! I don't like it and personally it offends me

I prefer the term "kinky", it has more of a fun connotation. Pervert makes me think of peeping Toms and criminals.

Pervert, no way!
I think of myself as being quirky. Defined as; quirk, peculiarity of behaviour: peculiar trait: idiosyncrasy.
Peculiar; characteristic of only one person, or group: distinctive: different from the usual.
A kink is; a mental or physical peculiarity: eccentricity: quirk.
Not kinky, it has a strong sexual tone in the wrong sense, like pervert.
I know that this is getting into semantics, but some words in today's english do not bode well in defining oneself, or when others define you.

I agree with those that want to stay as far as possible from this word. We had a discussions at group about reclaiming words. I don't see the public changing their use or understanding of this word anytime soon. I have also had talks with average people about being seen and perceived as someone that preys on other's.

This is why I perfer transgender person. It says yes I have gender issues, but other then the way I dress I'm like anyone else. Not identical, you know what I mean .

I don't like the term pervert even as an "In joke." I struggle too much with fear and guilt to take on that label.

There is far too much transphobic hate in this world. I fear using that word would be turned against us

Fiona, nailed it in one! I totally agree.