Just Your Opinion

You tell your wife while buying her panties for her birthday you were turned on by how pretty, soft, and sexy they were so you bought yourself a couple of pair, wore them and really, really like wearing them. You now want to wear them full time. Does she have a problem with this, after all they are just underwear, you wear what you like, why shouldn't I? I like baseball, football and golf, so do you, they are pretty much male sports but as a woman you like them too. Could she have any valid reason for saying no? Does she know clothing designers led her to wearing panties, honestly not her decision.

This post is just for discussion, it's not me. Just trying to get some opinions why and if women are against this; why, are women, wives, society against crossdressing whether it be M t F or F t M or are they. Why are male crossdressers afraid to dress in front of their wives and go public, seems like women that dress male and female couples that dress male aren't.

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Clothes and presentation should be gender fluid. If you are a male and want to wear women's clothes including a bra with forms (breasts you don't have) to present in your best female appearance you should be accepted. If you are female and like loose men's clothes and the male look it should be accepted. I have seen men that dressed as women look better than they do as a male and much better than a lot of women, if they like to CD why shouldn't they present as their most attractive self? At a Halloween party saw a woman dressed as a male Dr., looked great and very distinguished. Wish everyone saw this as I do. You should not be looked down on if your clothes/gender do not match what society has been trained to believe is right..

I've given this a lot of thought, and my conclusion is that sociobiology rules. The fundamental reason for the red line applied to men is maintaining special symbols for women that signal and reward their status as females.

The elements of status are. IMHO, in order: sexual attractiveness, soft nurturing emotional labor, and compliance with men's demands, as adjusted by whatever power the woman can obtain with her mate or suitors. This mirrors the courting and reproduction, and child rearing process which is so fundamental to survival.

Women are understood to have the short end of the stick, so they are given privileges to access the unimportant parts of manhood, like clothes. Men are motivated to maintain their social power, and most women cooperate because there are advantages to strong men for them, or they simply can't afford to challenge it. So men pretend that they don't like or want the sexy clothes, soft fabrics, etc., and everyone agrees that is the social bargain and cost to them for other kinds of power that is granted to them [also for no good reason.]

Everything you feel and the arguments for free crossdressing are logically correct, but cding is suppressed because most people are deeply trained in the opposite thoughts, and is currently agreeing with the mutual oppression of the gender expression duality.

I'm gambling that by my example and others going out crossdressed fearlessly, there will be more little cracks in the barriers, that will amplify because women in particular are rebelling now. They are struggling with how to gain social and personal power without upsetting the fundamental need to be attractive as a mate, and crossdressing for these women is understood as a rebellion, even if a relatively meaningless one.

Deebra,
Please refesh my memory but are you a total closet dresser or do you get out at all ?

The reason why I ask this is most of you threads have this same theme , wearing lovely underwear in secret and wondering how people will react to it . So now I assume it's all a turn on still , I don't have a problem with that .

If you read my latest thread about passing you may realise that any thoughts of what people think about your underwear have long gone . Basically they're not that interested , it's mostly in your mind . Outwardly I'm being accepted more and more as a woman my thoughts on what I wear underneath are more based on practicalities , does the bra give me the right shape , and do my knickers achieve a good enough tuck . Have I got the outfit right for the right situation I'm in ?

Most women truly don't associate their clothes with gender presentation , some do look more masculine than others and we think we could do better but it concerns us far more than it does them . Most GGs are just getting on with their lives, to many clothes aren't that important so they aren't going to see it from this particualr point of view .

I feel like this post is just fishing for people to reinforce your idea that women are wrong for not being ok with their partner crossdressing. I don’t think liking sports is equivalent to crossdressing. Most wives aren’t afraid that their husband who likes sports might one day decide he’s a professional athlete.

Some women just aren’t into it or are actively turned off by it, and they are just as entitled to their opinions and preferences as you are.

Is this another why aren't men allowed to wear dresses and women are allowed to wear pants?

I find it difficult to understand the question, maybe I am thicker than I thought. :-)

Debra, I agree with u on this one. And, I think a lot of posts here support your preposition. That if no one can see, or knows u dress, why would it bother your SO? If u change them before u go to bed it shouldn't!

But, unfortunately life doesn't work that way! She may worry someone will see your undies and out u at work, etc! Or, that this is simply the first step in a progression that will lead to u wearing her things. Then, buying things of your own. Then, going out dressed. Maybe to meet men!? Or, maybe 100 other fantasies that mite flash thru her mind!:doh:

The fact is, every relationship is different. Whatever a couple does that makes their union work is their business. And, that means working thru their partner's urges, desires, and changing needs as they mature! Cross dressing included!:battingeyelashes:

A lot of your posts are "what ifs," almost like a researcher trying to pick a person's inner thoughts. The nitty gritty of it is society likes conformity. Society really does not like things to be in a flux all the time. There are societal norms and expectations. It takes a long time for society to change those norms and expectations. Things do not happen overnight. I've said it many times legal rights do not automatically lead to acceptance. Your question seems to be directed towards cross dressing. Cross dressing is an activity that does not enjoy the same degree of acceptance as a transsexual. I suppose it boils down to a transsexual is now accepted by most, but not all, as a person born into the wrong body. It's not seen as a choice to emulate the other sex for the day, but, a person living his or her true inner being.

A cross dresser? Wha? A man who enjoys wearing women's clothing, but, cannot tell you why he does it? The very thought flies contrary to societal norms and expectations. A man with no boobs desires to wear a bra? Why? To complete the picture of emulating a womanly figure? And, hip pads too? Sure, at least in my state the laws protect a man's right to do that. Not in all states! Acceptance? That's a different deal.

If I presented to my intended spouse a depiction of a manly man and then later decided to present as otherwise. Why should she accept this change? Why should a woman accept a man if he decides to cheat on her or use drugs or become an alcoholic or accepted physical and mental abuse? She also has to deal with societal norms and expectations. She wants to fit in. She does not want to be shunned by her family, her friends, her coworkers, et al.

The same reasons why a man who likes to emulate a woman in mannerisms and attire seeks privacy are the same reasons why a woman does not accept cross dressing is conformity to societal norms and expectations.

Not another why or what if scenario again.

Life is guised in rose tinted glasses. It's also impossible to say what is right or wrong for every individual on the planet. Be it marriage, kids, work,play or any other scenario you wish to attach to my reasoning.

We all grow up with an understanding of what life should hold for us. It changes from culture to culture, religion to religion, country to country the comparisons are endless.

Fundamentally it comes down to when two people meet. If the prospective partner is aware of the others traits they will be, in the main, more acceptant of the others quirks. If their not less so or at least a gamble.

It's noones fault, it's life. It's just wether or not the partner is willing to accept or the other knows the impact it could cause.

I know from experience that my revelations were so far from the rose tinted dream my wife had that it has the potential to be catastrophic. On the flip side it could have released surpressed feelings she may have had hidden since childhood.

Either way it's pointless summising.

A relationship will either be suited to radical change or not. It may sit on the fence for years and continue regardless with either party accepting or not.

Ultimately it will find its path.

This is meant more as a message of hope than doom. I am an advocate as I'm in the middle of the journey :2c:

Society has a difficult time wrapping itself around CD'ing for many reasons. Men are considered to be the apex of the sex, so why would a male want to reduce himself to something that is not at the apex? For many CD'ing is a sexual release, with strong fetishistic overtones to it, and society for the most part doesn't like anything to do with fetishes. Most women want, or are looking for the strong male to support, protect, and lead them, the feminine male is not seen as being a strong male. A transsexual is seen as being in the wrong body, but a CD'er is seen as being a deceiver, one who is not who they appear to be. Gays and Lesbians are out of the closet, most CD'ers are still in the closet...so what are they hiding from...a cruel society, that's who.

On a more personal level, my wife doesn't understand why I like to wear nylon panties and pantyhose . She says that they are to hot and uncomfortable. She can't understand why I would willingly wear a bra, when I have little need for one. She can't wait to get out of her bra after work. She loves and accepts me, and if she doesn't understand why I do what I do, then why would the rest of the world understand, or accept? She does get why I like skirts, as they are cooler than pants in many cases.

I come to this site because I get understanding from others in a world that doesn't get it. There are too many wrong ideas and perceptions about many of us as CD'ers, and many other CD'ers do nothing to change the worlds idea of who many of us are. Don't get me started on why women can wear male style clothes!

For some reason I'm getting strange feelings of Deja vu.

I know my wife was all cool with my dressing for a year or so then I think she felt I was less a man when she got into a group of women that went to Vegas a few yeas back. They flew out to see a popular country star, they got facials, massages, mani-pedis, spent a tub full of money on shows and even ( she won't tell me ) how much she lost gambling. They spent a week getting catered to. She came back and from that point she didn't want to see me dressed any more. She finally admitted that they saw several gays holding hands and dressed in clothes over the top. The other women she went with talked about how could any one do something like that, remember these a hard core Texas GG that all have very hard working husbands. I feel they must have made my wife feel very low, and she couldn't tell them her husband enjoyed dressing. It would ruin our status in the small town back home. I think she felt betrayed by me know I was probably wearing my panties daily. Women are taking advantage of their new found freedoms as I mom would never have thought of leaving my dad for a separate trip like my wife took.
CD are just a taboo it seems and maybe because of the old manly guys that the older generation had to be to survive.
Don't yell me just what I am thinking.

The thing is this. If they made a film where a cder who started as a ridicule then ended by saving the day in either a mental or physical way and it happened to be a box office smash things would be easier as mainstream could digest it easier.

Personally what I find difficult to convey to my wife are that my natural male instincts do not change when it comes to protecting my family. Granted when presenting as female my Tammy side will come out and that is a given. However in extreme circumstances I would say that both of us would protect our family in the same capable way we would dressed any way we found ourselves in such a situation.

Plus, I would love to see me kicking the bad persons butt all dolled up in a dress. More fool them. :)

I get this feeling you are "asking for a friend" but if they can't be seen what difference does it make?
Do you have to pass underwear inspections by your SO?
Still I wonder if you are closeted or one that actually goes out enfemme.

Tracii,
It's the point I would hope Deebra may answer as it appears to be an underlining theme of many of her threads .

Be it my bad memory, not taking enough notice or whatever. Despite the content of anyone's posts it maybe the first time someone has seen them. The answers provided to those posts may help someone someday.

If you have seen it all before then why not leave it alone?

Just a thought.

Tasmin we are not being harsh many here just wonder where she is coming from sometimes.
She tends to be vague on purpose and distances herself like she is worried someone she doesn't want to see her comments actually may see them.
When she does that only she knows what she means and expects us to decipher her hidden meanings.
I'm not the only one that notices this.
I mean just come out and say what you mean don't beat around the bush.

Didn't have time to read all the threads so this is just a QUICKIE RESPONCE. I post different seneros and topics to get opinions on subjects that relate to M t F crossdressers. To make members think. Most are just that. Quit thinking they apply to me personally, THEY DON'T. I post them to help this forum. If I want to tell you about my personal life I will make it clear. As I've told Daisy, if you don't like what I write then skip over Deebra. Thankyou to Tamsin.

OK finally a response that makes sense. These threads are not about you but just scenarios. I get it now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DaisyLawrence

For some reason I'm getting strange feelings of Deja vu.

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So it's not just me.
So I'll give the answer that always applies to the "Why isn't <insert group of the day here> more accepting and understanding" question; fear and ignorance. It's a sad fact, but it's the simple truth. Maybe if we spent more time doing something that might actually enlighten, and thus remove some of that fear, the world would be a better place for us. No, I am not suggesting that anyone become a crusader for TG rights, though those that do have my undying respect and gratitude. What I am suggesting is that we do what we can. However humble your offering that might be, it still sheds light in places that need it. Few of us will ever be in a position to change the world single-handed, but each of can play a part.

Women generally want their men to be masculine, they are attracted to the masculine, and don't want to wake up one day married to a feminine man, or worse, a gay man or a transsexual man.
Women have a vested interest in having a mate who they feel will support and protect them. When we take on traits that in their mind, might make them question whether we will do that, they don't like it. This isn't rocket science.
Then add in those women who were brought up in a culture where they feel that our roles are set by their religious beliefs, and you have an even greater discomfort when they see their mate adopting anything feminine, because it strikes at the very heart of their very, very strongly held belief system.

I too was puzzled by this post initially, especially the dubious comparison with sports, but I have no problem with the question being asked because of the considered, thought-provoking replies that it has prompted, thanks :). It's this that brings me back here on a regular basis, even if I don't post very often. There's always a fresh outlook on topics that are important to us and, for me, it all helps with the ongoing questions of if, when and how to broach this subject with a person who I love dearly and would avoid hurting at any cost. It would be nice to assume that everyone should share the logical view that clothes and presentation should be gender fluid, and crossdressing perfectly acceptable but the reality is that you can't expect anyone to completely escape the pressure from societal norms.

Rachel

Deebra,
It's no good getting tetchy if people don't understand and give you a hard time , make it clear what and who your threads are about , otherwise you will get some very strange answers which don't relate to your lifestyle , we're not mind readers .

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sometimes_miss

Women generally want their men to be masculine, they are attracted to the masculine, and don't want to wake up one day married to a feminine man, or worse, a gay man or a transsexual man.
Women have a vested interest in having a mate who they feel will support and protect them.

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Sometimes Miss is telling it like it is. Of course there are women that are more open to effeminate men and even a few that really love crossdressed men. For a man to wear panties is just wrong for the typical woman that wants a real man. The traditional role of men is to protect and provide for their wives and families. Marrying a woman that doesn't approve of CDing doesn't make sense, but we've all made bad decisions haven't we?

Now man up and behave (and dress) like a man!

Modern day society (and even the past) forces us all to lie about something. I think the bigger question, one that I've asked myself 1,000 times, is why do we have to lie about anything? All of this started long before any of us came into this world. The root of this, IMO, is religion and governments (including schools). Since they're the one's who spew the divisions of "right & wrong."
Preachers will tell everyone what's right or wrong, according to their grand poo-bah. Followed by the threat of fire and brimstone. Government will pass laws about how society should be. Followed by the threat of incarceration. And what's left over, society just makes up.
Society has been sooo brainwashed into what is supposedly normal, that even something as simple as a man dressing as a woman, is considered taboo. How sick is that?

But that's been the direction of the bouncing ball for the last umpteen years. Instead of Alpha and Omega, it's now Alpha vs Omega.

Sometimes _miss nailed it and it is the truth whether you like it or not.
You can say it shouldn't be that way but it is and arguing semantics doesn't prove or change anything because it is what it is.

It's interesting that I began wearing women's panties as complain with wife because my trousers drawer was empty. So I got one of hers and wear it the whole day.
Then I gave her and excuse to keep using them. Later o buy for her and my own ones. That was around 30 years ago. Several close friends as well my kids knew it. For me was the excuse to wear them. The rest is history.
Your questions after that are based on sociology, moral, sex etc.
I always complain that sex between women in movies is almost morally accepted but no sex between men. Just last years some movies like Love, Simon and call me by your name, are being accepted. All that is basically for a distorted image about sex. Sex was for centuries a Sin.
It's not that today but in the social mind is something private. Nobody wants to talk or think on your parents having sex, it's a dust topic.
So homosexual relations are denied to experience love but just lust and perversion.
Minds are more opens today but crossdressing is not publicly moral accepted, not understood, so transexuality, tansgenderism is just begin to be accepted.
From now and in 20 years LGBTQ and all related will be as slavery is today, not a big deal.
Just be patience...