Transgender vs Crossdresser as an easy way to describe ourselves

I don't want to start a debate about using the term transgendered vs crossdresser in terms of how we define ourselves but I do want to know how we individually use the labels to describe ourselves to others. Personally I find it much easier to tell another than I am transgendered, and like to wear womens clothing and identify as a woman on occasion, versus saying that I'm a crossdresser. I think the term transgendered is more widely in popular usage such that people have a greater level of acceptance when they hear it. The term crossdresser I believe still has a bit of stigma about it. Does anyone else, who considers themselves strictly a crossdresser, prefer describing themselves as transgendered for the sake of easier communication?

Transgender is an umbrella term that may require further explanation. As crossdresser falls under that umbrella it does a better job narrowing the scope.

Kind of like how all homo sapiens sapiens are homo sapiens, but not all homo sapiens are homo sapiens sapiens.

I know thru experience that I am a CD. And, thru that experience I know it's better to describe myself to vanillas as follows, "Excuse me. Pardon me. I'm just leaving. Have a nice life!"

Most r either running away or laffing too hard to hear me anyway!:brolleyes:

At this point the only people I’ve described myself to are my wife and people on this forum. But this is a topic I’ve thought about a lot because the way I describe myself to people is the way I think about myself.

Karen, the way I think about myself is almost identical to you, especially as I have feminised my body somewhat and am continuing to do so.

But I’m also a practical person, and don’t like encumbering people with overwhelming descriptions of myself to people I’ve just met, as some of my friends who are vegan do. (Or worse, do cross-fit).

So I’d just describe myself as a Crossdresser.

Michelle

The term "transgender" is great and fair game for crossdressers. Saves a lot of time.

Xox,

Tina V.

I to am a crossdresser, this is accurate and simple to understand. I aint transgendered, to say this would imply I am something I'm not and that is unacceptable to me. I don't need to explain or justify what I choose to do or how I present.

I consider “transgender” to be a spectrum on which I am undoubtedly on...

I consider “crossdressing” to be an activity that I admittedly partake in, enthusiastically... but as a label in and of itself I don’t like that ignores the “why” in a blissfully ignorant way.

If a label is required, I consider myself to be both gender fluid (wearing nail polish to the office in boy mode) and bi-gender (as in I need to fully express both genders at different time in order to feel whole.)

Men wearing women’s clothes in public usually fall into one of four categories:

Hetrosexual men wanting the thrill of masquerading with the risk of being caught and embarrassed. This is sexually driven. It usually entails masturbation at some point. Cross dressers are usually trying to appear attractive and sexy. Because this is sexually driven, there is a tendency to go overboard to appear “sexy” that usually involves suggestive clothing, heels that are too high for comfortable walking or standing, unfashionably long or full hairstyles, and excessive makeup. Behavior patterns are sometimes bizarre because they are an imitation of what the cross dresser thinks he would find attractive in a woman. That behavior pattern sometimes expresses as a sexually aggressive “female” with a hot body and male attitudes. In spite of attempting to appear sexually desirable, hetrosexual male cross dressers are often frightened if they are approached by a man for a pick up.
Male to female transgendered persons (trans women) who feel more at home by expressing as females. Here, the objective is emotional rather than sexual. The idea is to be treated like a woman rather than to appear as a woman. Clothing and behavior tends to be more conservative and designed to blend in with other females. While this behavior is sometimes directed only at men, more commonly it is directed at both men and women. Behavior tends to be aimed at establishing longer term relationships rather than sexual hookups.
The trans-curious cross dresser may or may not be hetrosexual. This is usually someone who wonders what it would be like to be a woman. Costumes and behavior are similar to trans women, but aimed at discovering how it feels to be treated like (or be) a woman.
Drag queen cross dressers are performers. They get their kicks not from the clothing or from attracting sexual or emotional fans, but rather from attracting attention by stage presence. They do not particularly want either sexual or emotional attention
I see myself as a trans-curious cross dresser

Mistyjo, you copied and pasted that from a Quora answer I read last year. I knew I had read that verbatim before. And it’s super outdated anyway.

https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-di...ng-transgender

Yes I did. I still see myself as a trans-curious cross dresser

Transgendered people and cross dressers are really quite different types, language the way it is used these days does tend to embrace both types.

I think Karen that you raise a good point about tha social acceptability associated with the terms transgender vs cross dresser. Transgender seems to imply that the person has a desire,need and a preference to be their opposite gender where cross dresser appears to be simpler, implying that the person simply likes to dress in the clothing of the opposite sex possibly as some form of fetish. As such, I see that people identifying as transgender appear to get more sympathetic treatment - witness the recent Katie Couric documentary on gender or the National Geographic article on the same. So, while I personally believe I fall into the plain old vanilla cross dresser camp, on the very few times I have admitted to a SA that the piece of clothing is for me, I have referred to myself as transgender.

Gotta say, Mistyjo, there’s a lot I don’t like about those definitions. But having heard it’s from Quora I’m not that surprised.

Most of the Quora answers I’ve seen appear to be written by and for conservative midwesterners.

Michelle.

Another way to think about the question I asked in this post is to consider how we often choose to describe where we're from. I grew up in the Bay Area in one of the smaller cities near San Jose. When people ask where I'm from I say San Jose because everyone, for the most part, knows where San Jose is and it's close enough to the actual city I grew up in. That's how I think of the use of the term transgendered. I like Lacy New's comment about the term transgendered evoking a more sympathetic response. I think that's true. I also like KatrinaK's comment that transgendered is a term describing me on a broader spectrum and that crossdressing is an activity we engage in. I don't believe for me, and perhaps for many of us, that crossdressing is simply an activity absent the transgendered overlay.

I've been crossdressing since I was a very young boy and I'm now 50 years old. It wasn't until about 10 years ago that I acknowledged to myself that I was transgendered. It's not that I didn't know the term, it's just that I subconsciously was dealing with a lot of shame, guilt, and embarrassment which caused me to not acknowledge the truth about myself. A few trips to a well chosen therapist helped me to mostly get over those issues and to accept myself for who I am.

If I am introducing my self en femme, or as part of a conversation about my "habit", I tend to use the term crossdresser. However,y my understanding of myself is that on some level, I see inclusion under the Transgender banner. For me, dressing does tend to cross into a different gender presentation, and perhaps alter ego, or at least close. Not that I have a split personality, where I have totally separate histories, expressions and preferences and understanding of who I am.

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Originally Posted by Karen's Secret

I've been crossdressing since I was a very young boy and I'm now 50 years old. It wasn't until about 10 years ago that I acknowledged to myself that I was transgendered. It's not that I didn't know the term, it's just that I subconsciously was dealing with a lot of shame, guilt, and embarrassment which caused me to not acknowledge the truth about myself. A few trips to a well chosen therapist helped me to mostly get over those issues and to accept myself for who I am.

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Karen, I like this and I find your story similar to mine, though I've never felt the need for therapy. Also, I've always considered myself to be transgender as I approach this from the side of expressing myself as a girl and not for the want of wearing the clothes. When I started dressing it was specifically because I wanted to express myself as, and have the same feelings of (skirts hanging loosely etc), as a girl. But, we have to understand that there are probably as many reasons for doing what we do as there are people doing it, and no one person is wrong. We're a very broad church.

The problems with the definitions that MistiJo presents is that it labels all crossdressers as sexualy driven all the time, and if it's not then you fall into the mtf transgender. It seems to me third definition the MtF trans curious is really just any early stage of being transgender, or part time trans?


It seems obvious to me we are all transgender, as we are crossing gender roles.

The reason that transgender garners more sympathy from the world at large is because it is a medical term, it is a condition that drives us to do something. Where as many people who buy the sexual humiliation and thrill seeking crossdresser definition see us as sexual deviants. I would think that the transgender community would prefer to keep the fetish cross dressers away to keep them from being tainted, but it seems to me that they realize there is so much overlap, that instead they have generally embraced every type of gender non conformity which is one reason why I think there is so much progress going on. We're all playing for the same team, with the goal of liberty to do and be what we want regardless of label.

Since I grew up playing role playing games with skill trees I tend to think of character development in that way. So it's break it down.

Your character is a level one Transgender. You start with the free skill Crossdressing which allows you to wear opposite gender clothes and armor LOL. After training your crossdressing you can level it up, you can choose to add different specializations to the skill. You could add Drag Queen, genderqueer, fetish crossdresser, authentic woman.

You might save your skill points instead to purchase the skill Transsexual, which you can specialize by getting, HTR, voice training, emotional awareness, FFS, Top Surgery, Bottom Surgery.

I am truly sorry if I offended anyone with my original post.

It really depends upon who I'm talking to....or writing to. The average person just simply doesn't get it, because they've never thought about it much, if at all. For the most part, their only exposure to crossdressers is Rupaul, and transsexuals to Caitlyn Jenner, and that's it. They have no idea of the wide range of gender and sexuality that exists, and, it seems most of them are quite happy that way. Many get upset when you tell them anything that might change their view of what exists in this world, and, many religions still preach that anything other than straight, heterosexual sex is an abomination and a sin, and those of us who stray from the straight and narrow are to be shunned or even killed for our sins.

So you have to decide exactly how in depth you want to go in describing yourself (if you even know why you are how you are; most here seem not to have much of a clue, perhaps because they, too, don't want to know).

For while crossdressing doesn't fall under OCD, there are some crossdressers who DO crossdress for that reason. (Disclaimer, most crossdressing doesn't respond to OCD treatment, but unless you know why you do it, maybe it's worth a try to undergo OCD treatment to see if it helps and you want to stop. Only you and/or your therapist can deccide if it's worth a try).

For example, I'm not exactly 'just a crossdresser', nor am I transsexual. My personality isn't particularly feminine, but I do have certain female behaviors. I don't self identify as female, but do feel that I'm supposed to. Pretty mixed up, huh!

Many prefer to believe that they were born this way. Read my bio (link in my sig) to see how you can take a normal little boy and turn him into a crossdresser. If it happened to me, it can happen to others, and there's probably lots of ways to induce this in boys when their personality is still developing.

Mistyjo, the definitions you posted are no more inaccurate than what gets posted here all the time. Definitions of broad groups are never very accurate on an individual level. If you really want to see some howlers just ask for a definition of "sissy."

BTW, I don't define myself by one little thing I do sometimes. I have eggs for breakfast (more often than I CD) but I don't identify as a ovophiliac.

Karen,
Tracy calls transgender an umbella term but in fact crossdresser is also an umbrella term , we are all crossdressers using the basic translation , what labels we then use decribe how we deal with that label come after . I personally don't tell people I'm a CDer but TG , it tells people I'm a CDer but have associated gender issues .

My own personal feeling is most people consider a CDer is someone that dresses but prefers to keep it private , being TG means I'm more open with people because the issues connected with it go far deeper there is more to come to terms with .

The more I dress, the more comfortable I become and the less I really think about labels . I know the feeling early on and certainly when I joined the forum that i wasn't alone , there isn't anything seriously wrong with me , I just wear different clothes, at that point I felt I could shout it from the rooftops . Now I don't need to tell people what label I sail under I'm out dressed , they can see for themselves .

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Originally Posted by Mistyjo

I am truly sorry if I offended anyone with my original post.

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Mistyjo, I don't know why anyone would be offended by your post? But remember, u can always edit or delete any of your posts if u wish to!:thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by Mistyjo

I am truly sorry if I offended anyone with my original post.

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I don't think you offended anyone! We're all here for a healthy discussion and differing points of view are key. Don't feel bad hun.

hello,
It might depend on where you live. In the UK it seems that trans-gendered is now used a catch-all term to describe someone between the state of being male or being female; as in LGBTG. I hope it may lead to more acceptance.
luv J

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Originally Posted by Mistyjo

I am truly sorry if I offended anyone with my original post.

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Definitely not offended, interesting discussion.

Personally I think it is how you feel in yourself. Some are happy when dressed 'en femme' presenting themselves to world as female/male but on a part time basis, some are in the process of transitioning and want be their desired gender. Others, well for them it's a fetish, a means of experiencing a 'sexual high'. However, Society does likes labels.


Personally I've never really been a fan of labels. If you want to call yourselves a crossdresser, transvestite, transgender or a Drag Queen/King or Bob! Then really it's up to you, if it makes you happy. Happiness is what's inside, not what's on the label.


And that concludes today's table top philosophy :)

I use Crossdresser/transvestite (because i find pleasure in it more than the identity part of it)

Transgender should be used to identify people who used to be male or female but live their everyday life as the gender they believe themselves to be. Most CDers aren't living full time, Most don't want to live full time because they don't hate being male enough to want to never return to their male state.

I don't believe in the transgender umbrella. it makes the term too muddy.

For me I prefer the term transgendered in that based on what I am doing and where I am I gravitate to one gender or the other, but never fully one. But I have to realistically say that I am actually more happy on the femme side of the spectrum, but find myself running and hiding in the male side, because it is easier sometimes. It took me a long time to come to terms with the fact that I am not just motivated by the "gratification" part of this and that what I am feeling is not just some type of deviancy. All of the evidence was there to support it, it was readily available I just could not make that jump that said, it is OK to not fit into these so called gender norms. The evidence for me is that I always felt as if I would be happier playing on the girls team, that my purpose in life was not a part of my gender and that I like beauty and elegance of what it is to be feminine. I know that isn't everything when it comes to that, because my wife is very much a Tom Boy and tough as nails, but it is certainly part and proof there is more to me than the frank and beans if you know what I mean. For me, I would certainly love to explore a complete transition, however I have made the choice that now and in the point of my career that I am to stick right in the middle until such time as my presenting fully in everyday life would impact my income and position. It is a sad choice sometimes but it is mine and while I know that I would have a community of support and with my workplace having a very diverse and accepting group of people it still isn't something I want to do right now. Maybe I am just lazy, or maybe I realize that after waiting over 40 years to be comfortable identifying as transgendered and have been able to put that guilt, shame and despair behind me for the most part, that I can wait a few more years until I retire and can control my situation as we intend to move away from the area we currently live and will not have to make excuses for how things have changed. We will just pull up roots and plant the new ones where Mattea is clearly in the picture. I just think that would be easier. I know this was a bit more than the discussion called for but I have one last thing to say.

In regard to when people say the word "issues" or in as "Transgender Issues" for me I really don't like the word "Issue" after when coming out to one of my children, I used that term, that I have "transgender issues" to which his answer/question was "why is it an issue?, you are my parent, I love you, you love me and if it is something you are, it is no issue for me!"

While it is comforting to be able to identify as a group and to have support like we have here, there is one label that I think we can all agree and wish on everyone and that is to be "Loved!". Just by everyone taking the time to post their thoughtful comments proves that there is love and care in this group, thank you all and hope everyone has a wonderful weekend!

Mattea

Mattea,
I have to admit to using the term "issue " , sometimes it's hard to know how to word it when talking to people , to me " problem" isn't the right word , " issues " just means certain points that can raise a problem with some people which I'm happy to talk through with them . I can see your point and understand why the children would say that . Your children are quite astute to make that comment you must be very proud of them . Your last paragraph is a lovely thought I wish more would share it , once we take that big step to really come out it is surprising who cares about you and who doesn't .

Ms. Teresa,

You make a good point, if it were not for all of these words maybe we could communicate better!?!...... I guess every word has its meaning as it relates to the person who is using it. Everyone has their own experiences to draw meaning from and everyone is different so the way we define the words are personal in many aspects. I have enjoyed this discussion as I am gaining insight into others who have a shared interest and I think it helps me understand myself better.

Yes very proud of my children, I am not sure what I did to deserve them or what exactly we fed them for them to turn out the way they are. In all honesty it is my wife who made them the people of character they are.

Without reading of your post, for me the difference is clear.
The word crossdresser is someone that enjoy dressing as the opposite gender in which he or she socially is admired because there are some cultures where that is more relative and doesn't need an explanation or label.
Transgender is person which gender doesn't fit with the gender socially assigned to him or her st birth.
Usually a transgender will need to transition to live as his or her gender tells.
So what's the difference with a transsexual? For me is who needs to finally, after transition to change their appearance, corrects the sexual organs.
Of course, we human beings are not machines and there's no exact science and the umbrella 9f LGBT with its beautiful rainbow flag includes everybody.
My humble opinion.

For the love of ___, for the last time, we crossdress because we are transgendered. It doesn't matter how much we crossdress, on what day, at what time...we dress as women because we are transgendered. What's so hard to accept about that? Being transgendered means you occupy some position on a continuum that has, at one extreme, people who feel powerfully compelled to transition, and, at the other extreme, people who like to occasionally dabble in something like wearing lingerie because they enjoy feeling feminine (or, in the case of F2M, wearing men's work clothes because they enjoy feeling masculine).

I’ll be honest... I’m not entirely sure how important a label is. I’ve never been grilled that hard by the general public that I’ve had to explain “what I am”.

I am not Transgender. I am a man who likes dressing as a woman. A "crossdresser" or "Transvestite".

A Transgender person identifies as a woman. I don't.

I think Queen support my posture.
Gender is something really deep in the genes and the mind that makes the person see him/her self as the opposite sex. A crossdresser doesn't see himself as a woman though enjoy seeing himself as a woman but thinks of himself as a man and no moves into transition because in his daily life he's comfortable being a man, a transgender doesn't feel comfortable in his external gender.
Some can later find that are no longer crossdressers. That is my case. It wasn't just dressing so crossdressing g wasnt a solution for me and have to transition to my inner gender not related with my sexuality still enjoying and liking sex with my wife and o longer with men.

No...sorry. Not every transgender person identifies as a woman (or vice versa, if it's a woman who dresses as a man). Transgender is an umbrella term for anyone who doesn't conform with their biological gender. Even occasionally dressing as a woman is hardly conforming to your biological gender, is it? And what's wrong with it as an umbrella term that includes crossdressers, anyhow? I'm proud of it and wear the term proudly.

There are some vocal people on this site that insist all crossdressers are transgender. I know because, shortly after I joined, I was read the riot act about this very topic. Some of those same people want MIAD's to go away because it hurts their "cause". Whatever that is. Clearly, they have an agenda.

I just want everyone to enjoy life as they see fit.

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Originally Posted by Isabella Ross

Transgender is an umbrella term for anyone who doesn't conform with their biological gender.

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The umbrella term for those people is actually "Non-binary" :P

And yep, Tracy. Don't get me started on that Trans Authority crap. I sometimes wonder if they will be the end of us.

Give me a break. You all talk as though being transgendered is somehow the end of the world. Be proud of who you are.

I find it fascinating that it is unclear across the spectrum, even among most here, that it is so incredibly difficult to agree on a label that generally describes what we do. And for me therein lies the rub. We all do something different to degrees and feel differently about it. And clearly it is an emerging discussion on a broader scale in the LGBT community and one that many still have questions about. I don't think it is set in stone anywhere that Transgender is the label for everyone here and that is it. I would say for now that the discussion is "fluid" or at least it seems pretty clear to me that it is by the responses to the question so far or in even a cursory search in google.

That being said I can sympathize with wanting all to accept an umbrella term but I also know it is not realistic in discussions this diverse. I really don't understand the necessity to make someone take the label and wear it if they don't want to. I would never try to impose my opinion of what I think a label should be onto anyone else. If Transgender doesn't work for you then by all means find something that feels more comfortable.

As to the original question I am not one to let myself be labeled or actually care all that much if I have been labeled. I can put a label on and take a label off like I do my drab or female clothes. In the end it really doesn't matter unless I have to explain it to someone else and then even I know that can change. So what I will say is that I do not have a a strong opinion either way but I do not have a problem with the broader Transgender label for myself. I also feel Katrina's response and the label of bi-gender fits me at least for now.

After all. It's a woman's prerogative to change her mind.

I hate labels....

However, that being said, I understand ( I think) Karen's initial post.

The term "Transgender" though ( as said already) is an umbrella term.

MOST of us know this, but Ive had a few that don't know anything about literally...Anything....Regarding the most basic things.Its happened many times and it honestly annoys me.

One example was from a dating site where I listed my gender, sexual orientation, and the fact that I identify as transgender. Ive identified as a woman for many years but am not full time ...about 60-40 in favor as a woman. One man blasted me in a message, saying "If you're not out full time, your not a transgender person..I told him to stuff it....However most have just been curious

Yesterday I was pounding away on the keyboard and read the words before posting. Then I decided to delete and wait. Basically, I do not like labels for people and trying to put them in the proper pigeon hole. Years ago I thought I was a 'transvestite.' Of course back in the 1950's and 1960's to wear the label 'transvestite' automatically made a male a homosexual. That was the common thinking out in society. That was a tough nut for a hot blooded guy interested in women to absorb, if he also wore women's clothing on occasion. Next came the term 'cross dresser.' Now, it's 'transgender.' I have absolutely no idea how to explain that term to someone outside the community. You could be all the way over to left or the right on a line graph or somewhere in the middle. From the posts I read here it almost seems some are being pushed further in a direction than they want to be pushed.

I'm a person with male genitalia who wears women's clothing on occasion. Past that you're going to have to have a long conversation over a beer to probe my brain. Frankly, when I stumbled upon this site I thought it was a site for only 'cross dressers.' Obviously that's not the case. Everyone is unique. Express yourself in sentences and paragraphs and not single word catchalls.

I speak only for me and not for anyone else.
I am a cross dresser! I have a male side and I love that side of me and I don't want to give that side up. I also have a fem side of me and I don't care to give that side up either.
For me it take both to be whole. A transgender person is one who is going to live their life out as the other gender thus transition from one gender to the other. It is what it is people. I love transgender people and I am happy that they have found their way to happiness. God knows this life is though enough. However to call myself transgendered would be to bring and end to my male side. That aint going to happen.

Love you guys
Mandy

There is a very crude definition out there to describe the difference between a Cross Dresser and a Transgender: A hard-on.

It’s very crass, but this is what shows up as a definition among a lot of us who are Transgender females when a group of us or a mixed group of Transgenders and cross dressers meet.

Personally, I am a transgender female and even before HRT, I was not dressing for “pleasure” reasons. I dress because it makes me feel comfortable in who I am, not for sexual release.

I’m not saying every Cross Dresser is doing it for “sexual thrills” only, but from what I have observed meeting hundreds of you, it trends that way. Those of us who have realized who we really are, women, are dressed for other reasons.
Just my personal views, thanks.

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Originally Posted by Isabella Ross

For the love of ___, for the last time, we crossdress because we are transgendered. It doesn't matter how much we crossdress, on what day, at what time...we dress as women because we are transgendered. What's so hard to accept about that? Being transgendered means you occupy some position on a continuum that has, at one extreme, people who feel powerfully compelled to transition, and, at the other extreme, people who like to occasionally dabble in something like wearing lingerie because they enjoy feeling feminine (or, in the case of F2M, wearing men's work clothes because they enjoy feeling masculine).

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Only within the last couple of years have I become aware of the "gender fluid" label. Trust me, I thought what the____ is that? My SO has expressed that they think of themself as transgender, but only for a temporary period. That kinda lit the lightbulb of "Oh, maybe that's what's meant by gender fluid". There are so many labels now, it's difficult to keep up.

The more I read through the responses to my original post the more I have come to terms with how I define transgender versus crossdresser. I think of crossdressing as simply the action of wearing the opposite gender's clothing - with nothing else attached to the action. No feminine feelings, no desire to act feminine, no imitation of feminine movements, etc. Crossdressing would basically be the same as deciding whether to wear my SF Giants baseball cap or my SJ Sharks cap.

But I don't believe that this is what crossdressing is for most of us. When we crossdress we have a desire to act, feel, or actually be feminine. We move into or attempt to experience the opposite gender in some way, slightly or more fully. That is why I feel that crossdressing is a thing we do, while being transgender is what we are. I am transgender.

Karen, perfectly stated.

I consider myself as Transgender. I don't consider dressing as crossdressing, but a means of being what I am. Dressing is me being me.

I'm the latter. I have already been through enough introspection and reflection to know that I'm not transgender.

Ginni, Pixie, what are the arguments that make you arrive to that conclusion? If I can ask, because that would explain better the difference instead to know who is anything...txs