I have kind of disappeared from this site for a while.

Hello again.

I dropped off this site for a few months. Why?

I had a big fight with my wife. Really bad, worst ever after 20 years of marriage. Why?

I had a dinner with a woman alone. Why?

Because I was hoping I could present myself as Natalie to her as time went on. Why?

My wife told me she does not want to see Natalie. I have to come out somehow.

So, in a effort to save my marriage. I locked up Natalie, threw away ALL her clothes, jewelry, makeup.....

Now 3 months later I am not very successful burying her away. I find my self doing a few things like looking in her clothes that do not fit.

Coming back to this site and see that my password was saved and I can just click and I am back in. I see my old pictures that I posted and wish I still had all the originals that I deleted from my PC.

It is clear to me that to save my marriage I need Natalie to be here at times. I already ordered some new underthings from Macy's. I went looking at the Discovery Shop in town where I Donated my clothes in a hope I could buy some back. But I have very good taste in dresses and they were gone.

One other thing, I cut my hair. It was 9" long down my back and I miss it. I loved trying new things with my hair. I had it colored to cover 90% of the gray.

So, could I be looking at a huge change in my life regarding being married? If my wife will not accept me as sometimes Natalie and I cannot bury her what can I do?

It is time for a new agreement one way or the other. Accept me or don't. I am feeling really bad about this.

I can only suggest joint therapy for the both of you. I feel for you, I am in more or less the same boat, totally non-accepting wife.

Going out with another girl was a No No.
Try to talk with your wife and set some boundaries for Natalie to come
out of the closet. even if DADT has to be established, you still can dress in privet.
trying some counseling might help.
Good Luck.
Rader

Natalie,
Sounds like that went rather badly. It is kind of difficult to have civil discussions about dressing once feelings on both sides have been hurt. It can drum up old feelings just to bring up the topic which is why I went underground.

It does seem you were going full steam ahead with the dressing. I am not criticizing. Even so it was apparently too much, and too fast for her. It is one of the hazards warned of frequently here. Coming out can make us feel there is a green light when it might be in our heads. Some people like my wife will never give in so I have to live with limited dressing or run the risk of living alone. Only you can decide what is right for you.

I am sorry for your troubles.

Sandi

Hi Natalie,

Sorry to hear that things went badly.
But I'm glad you are back here.

Marion

Most of us here, myself included, are not qualified to answer your questions. Oh, you'll get lots of advice, and much of it will be worth exactly what you pay for it. Which brings me to the point I'm actually trying to make. Talk to a professional. If nothing else, you need to sort out who you are and what it might take for you to be comfortable living with yourself under the restrictions you currently face. It might also be that you'll receive some suggestions on how to deal with your spouse's objections. "Working it out" is preferable to continuing the deception or chucking to whole relationship. Explore options before doing either.

Sorry for your troubles. I hope you both can come to some type of agreement. Some have suggested counseling, would your wife be agreeable to that?

Are there any social groups in your area? Perhaps meeting up with other CDers in a social setting would give you an outlet to be Natalie.

Best wishes to you both.

EDIT:

I wanted to add a couple of things. I don't know either of you, however,I would say that she had a right to be angry. She seems to be blaming it on CDing rather than on your actions. However, you may have over-reacted by getting rid of your clothes and cutting your hair. You already know that you want those clothes back and miss your hair. Don't make promises or overtures that you can't keep. My thought is that you should both decide on what your limits are (reasonably). Then you will know if you can go long term within the limits, and she won't worry that you will be pushing the limits. (Just my 2 cents).

Since you and your wife have taken a big step backwards, it may be harder to go forward. Make sure she knows you love her and as others have said "Communicate".

Counseling will be pointless if u r both set in your positions.:straightface:

Her not wanting anything to do with Natalie and u planning to bring Natalie out! Marriages require compromises.
If u both can't agree to do that? Your marriage may already be over.:sad:

Everyone is giving you good advice so I will not repeat some of it.
But want to say the promise of putting Natalie away never works and backfires looking like you we’re just blowing smoke .
What is important is for her to understand you wanted more than anything to do that but it is a part of you and I think basically impossible to do this in the long run.
The professional outside help might help you but either way she needs to understand this.
As far as the meeting the other woman for dinner YIKES . I hope that was you having the need to be acknowledged as Natalie by someone but still YIKES.Getting her to see that was the reason .
Hope 20 years can be saved but truth from here on out and hope understanding all around.

Natalie,
I understand how you need to work round your wife for me it was inevitable .

I may have suggested this before but a social group might help to dress away from home in the safety of others who dress , I was surprised my wife accepted that . The problem is we will keep pushing until we find some peace of mind or sanity , that is the part wive's sometimes don't understand . Counselling may help but I have the feeling you will hit the same brickwall I did as my wife wouldn't talk about what had been discussed so I had no where to go with it .

None of us want to walk away from a marriage the problem is it gradually becomes more one sided , there's no denying you need Natalie and obviously your wife doesn't , finding that middle ground is really hard , the problem I had was the goal posts kept moving , one day something was fine the next day it wasn't . Long term very few people can live with that . I hate to see a situation develop based on lies and deceit but you become more and more trapped in that lifestyle and you ended up taking another woman out to dinner because you wanted to be honest with yourself .

Lets not forget your wife could be beating herself up about all this , underneath she knows she's not dealing with it in the right way because she's also governed but what other people might think . She needs counselling to help her get things in perspective but she's possibly like my wife in thinking you are the broken one that needs fixing not her .

Some have jumped on me for saying this but the World doesn't end if your marriage can't survive the outcome of all this , my outcome has worked out well , we are both much happier which is also better for our children and grandchildren .

The bottom line is being truthful with yourself and decide how much you need to be Natalie , if you can't answer that then maybe you need to try and make the marriage work .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Natalie5004

If my wife will not accept me as sometimes Natalie and I cannot bury her what can I do?

---

Something's gotta give...
You,
her,
both of you,
-or-
the marriage.

It sounds harsh, but there it is.

It sounds like what's going on right now is hurting the both of you.

How long did she know? Before you were married? Weather she had known for a long time or short time obviously she is not comfortable with it. Do you know why? Explain to her this you and as much as you would like to stop it for her because you love her you can't. Marriage is a compromise. You might not get her to ever see or participate with Natalie but hopefully she will understand this can't go away. It is "hardwired" in you. It is you no matter what. What is something she does that is part of her that she will or cannot stop. Explain it that way to her. Hopefully at some point she will see that this is part of what make you YOU. And if she tries to take that part of you away you will not be whole.

There are all sorts of perspectives on this kind of interaction, but without knowing a great deal of the backstory regarding your marriage as well as each of you individually it is next to impossible to provide advice that helps unless it is pure luck that the advice fits. In my view you two are in a Cold War of sorts and each side is not very willing to compromise. So, the first step is to develop communication skills that are not polarized. That is the first job of a therapist in dealing with this and it is probably the biggest step and where correction is most likely to fail. Once the machetes are put away, so to speak, then the therapist can help you to find a compromise position and a better understanding of each other's view. No guarantees, but it does work if there is at least some love still present between you. Take that step and go see a couples therapist.

My 2 Cents only....

Communicate.
No matter how difficult it may be you both need to sit and communicate.

I went through similar things years ago. She found out, I swore to give it up, I purged, I bought new things and so on. Then one day I just said I can't do this. I went to her and said "WE have a problem and WE need to talk".
It wasn't easy, there were lots of tears and late nights talking and me being more open than I had ever been. I simply told her this is part of me and I need to be able to express it. If that means WE are no longer then I'm sorry, but I need to be me.
I told her I needed her to understand even if she couldn't accept. I wanted her to be part of this. I wanted to share ALL of me with her.
She came here and read the posts from everyone. She asked questions of me, how I felt about the posts, what I thought of what others wore and how they presented. She even joined the GG section and posted questions and answers with other women. She agreed to try and one night I finally dressed fully for her. It was more nerve wracking for me than it was for her but we got through it.
Now she is fully accepting, helps me with everything from style choices to makeup. We go out together all the time.

I was lucky. She loves me enough to TRY.
Now I dress whenever I wish which honestly is most of the time. But I never let it interfere with OUR life. She used to see me dressed and say she was thinking of going to a friend's and wanted me to come, "but you're dressed". I told her that's fine, I'll change. I can always dress again when we get home.

Communication.
If the love is there all will be well. If it's not ...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Stephanie Michelle

Weather she had known for a long time or short time obviously she is not comfortable with it. Do you know why? Explain to her this you and as much as you would like to stop it for her because you love her you can't. Marriage is a compromise.

---

Well in one of her first posts she comes right out and says she "warned" her wife not to come home without a heads up. "Otherwise she will be surprised to see how much I look like my sisters and how good I am getting with hair and makeup".

Ahem , ok ...
Its going to be hard to overcome that , I am not sure what could be done or said and no , I dont think the wife needs counseling unless you go together nor do I think the wife is "broken" . I think she got this handed to her in a VERY harsh way and no one would be ok with that

I dont take to kindly to warnings of any kind by my SO ( when I have one ) Especially about something like this . That sentence has managed to stick in my head every time she complains about this situation so I am sure its stuck in her head too . Teresa, even you told her to lighten up after that one .

Then going out with another woman ??? Lands ......

I have to agree with Gretchen. I wonder how your wife found out about you having dinner with another woman. Do you tell her? Or, did she find out you were sneaking around? IMHO, it reads and may be received as "If he does not get it at home, he'll get it somewhere else." That's not good for any marital issue.

Counseling may help. Your wife may become educated as to what cross dressing is all about. You want to cook dinner as Natalie. Your wife wants Natalie out of the marriage. There may be compromises. Maybe not.

Ok, so you screwed up by having dinner with another woman. As others have said, you and your wife need to sort this whole thing out together, or to paraphrase Ben Franklin, you most assuredly will do so separately. I would strongly suggest marriage counseling. The goal is NOT to persuade your wife to accept your cross dressing, but for the two of you to reach an agreement on the future course of your marriage...whether it is towards dissolution or continuation. If it is to be the latter, then there will have to be some sort of accommodation of your cross dressing, because it is highly unlikely that you will ever be able or even willing to suppress the desire.

Natalie, from what I perceive from the various posts you made about your relationship with your wife, it seems to me that she is never getting the real story of what you do or plan to do. It seems to me like a constant recipe for disaster. You were not in an actual DADT situation. You should take advantage of that for laying out all the cards on the table before your wife so she knows what's in store for her and makes her own decisions. Where there is love there is hope. But if you keep hiding things and lying you will only get more and more trouble.
Beware also of pink fog as it seems to veil your awareness of what your wife may think or endure. Natalie may be important for you but your wife should always come first. Listen, listen, listen to her. And talk, talk, talk together. Leave no stone unturned. If you plan to spend an evening out with a girl friend, tell your wife. If she doesn't want you to, then don't. Or try to negotiate. But do nothing in her back, it will backfire hard, sooner or later (in this case, imagine how you would have felt if your wife met with a man in secret). I hope you can restore communication with your wife. Good luck.

I tell her every day how much I love her.

I also tell her that I am a pain in the ass.

My dumping of clothes was wrong. I have new clothes on order again. I lasted 3 months with out them.

My hope is we can come to a agreement. I think so, I hope so. I will seek outside help if needed.

My thanks to those who reached out to me. I am listening.

Also, she loaned me a set of diamond earrings to wear today. How bad can I be?

Natalie, the recommendations to seek counseling are spot-on -- whether it's you alone or whether it's marital counseling with your wife. Going out with another woman and not having cleared it with your wife, or at least telling her about it before she found out, is a major mistake, and it is trust-destroying. I feel like counseling for yourself may be the first priority, because it sounds like you need to sort out what you want, which is important going into a discussion with your wife about what the two of you want.

Getting rid of all your clothing and other femme things is called purging, and from everything I've heard, it doesn't eliminate the urge to dress up. In my own therapy sessions, my therapist and I concluded that for me, crossdressing was an escape, and when I improved a number of things in my life that were making me unhappy, it went from being a constant compulsion to an occasional diversion. You may be in a similar situation.

Natalie ,
I never understand when they dangle the carrot ! If she disaproves so much why buy earrings ?

I had terrible days and then the next she would offer me some clothing items , are they feeling sorry for you are having pangs of guilt ? I never really found a true answer to that one .

OK, I (we) decided that there is a Natalie. And she is on one hell of a buying spree.

She has 3 pairs of shoes on order, 7 dresses, underwear, stockings all here or coming shortly.
She needs new makeup and some jewelry. Maybe a warm coat for outings. I found a stash of old handbags my wife is no longer using that I could use when I go out. If I go out. I am sure I will.
I am a Transvestite Man and I love dressing.

So, there it is.

Natalie, I may be staying the obvious, but if you plan to go out this means you had a discussion with your wife about going out, right?

We are having ongoing communications. We have a agreement where I can place Natalie's clothes. She has a closet all to herself. I am in the process of filling it up.

We are contemplating having Natalie come to our Birthday Dinner this December. It would be a fantastic day if that happens, she is very lonely now.

Natalie's other half...

Natalie's other half,
I am glad you two are working though this. I love my wife dearly and am so glad we are able to share this side of me with her. I am sure Natalie loves you too. I personally would like to be perfect, unfortunately I am who I am. Try as I might, I have never been able to bury Janet for long.

Hi Natalie, since you are walking on thin ice, and supposing the birthday you are talking about is a wedding anniversary, isn't showing up as Natalie on this event a bit on the insensitive side? Maybe your wife would like to have the man she married with her, in male attire, for such an occasion. Sorry, not meaning to be rude. But I don't think a wedding anniversary should be about Natalie, it should be about celebrating your couple. Was it your wife who brought up the possibility of having you as Natalie at the dinner? Or was it you? If it was you, do you think your wife is 100% onboard with it? Or have you been pushing the thing until she accepted to consider it?
I sense a lot of pink fog in your latest posts and am worried. Many CDs tend to get very oblivious of their wives' feelings when it happens.

Tonight we had a very good conversation. My wife agreed to me being Natalie for my birthday dinner. We will see where this goes. I will post photos if it happens.

Love to all