I think i've been "caught" again. Waiting for the backlash.

I'm away for the weekend alone, and will be in a hotel with free mornings pre 9am, and evenings after 6pm. Naturally that means that I will be taking away Charlotte's gear, and I had to get all of my clothing and makeup out and packed whilst my wife was out.

I have a guaranteed 15-20 minutes on a lunchtime whilst my wife takes our daughter from childcare to family, and another 30 minutes later when she picks her up to bring her home.

Cue me setting a 10 minute timer and emptying my complete stash across the floor to pick the outfit and extras that I needed.

Unfortunately she came home, and straight up the stairs in order to grab some extra clothes for our daughter, and I didn't realise until she was half way up the stairs. I chucked the wigs and bras into the corner of the room where she couldn't see, and I think she probably spotted me throwing a hoodie over a pile of "something".

She's been longer than expected at her mum's house, so now I am wondering if she's talking to her mum about it, if she's just taking a break to process, or if she didn't see anything.

It's so frustrating to live in this DADT type relationship where I have to continually hide everything. If I could simply have clothing on show it'd make such a change for me.

Wish me luck..

This really hits home! Although apparently you are out with your wife you still find you are hiding, and probably just as concerned about being caught as you were before. Maybe for both of you, although by coming out you had hoped for a change, nothing really has changed, you are still hiding, and maybe she is still looking for evidence of what you are doing.

For me , my paranoia extended even to writing and communicating with other CDs in our forum. She "caught" me a couple times...saw the thread up, knew what I was doing, said nothing. It was this sort of thing, the sneaking around, which told me I had to come out, and although I did, this sort of thing remains...like you're having an affair, or leading a double life. Stress inducing!

I'm hardly in any position to dispense advice, but here's how I am handling the situation. I confronted it headlong, told my wife what I was doing, that i was communicating with others, that I enjoyed that but at the same time it was really no different than communicating with anyone, as she also does in various interest groups. I the same time I told her I had a "stash" of clothing, and told her where they are, and said that I will not display them if she does not want, but she might see "evidence" from time to time of dressing or having dressed. This conversation went surprisingly well. She went as far as to say that what bothered her was that I was being sneaky, not what I was doing. That really cleared the air a lot, more questions followed, which was also good. I think we're in a good place. As an example, she knows exactly what I am doing right now!

I wish you good luck. Again, I can hardly dispense advice, and I'm not...just describing how I am handling a similar situation in a way that appears to be working for me. It also shows me you care deeply for your wife and your relationship...otherwise none of this would even matter!

Kris

If you are figuring on ten minute "safe times", you will get caught, it's not a matter of "if", it's a matter of "when". If you are living in the same house as someone and trying to hide your crossdressing from them, you will eventually get caught. It's just a matter of time.

You might think "My wife is at work, I have eight hours to dress." Suppose she gets sick and comes home early? Suppose there's a power failure at work and they shut down early? Suppose she leaves for work but the car starts acting up so she decides to come back home?

You are going to have to deal with her at some point, it's better to do it where and when you are ready than on the spur of the moment when you get caught.

Part of the problem with a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" marriage is tip-toeing around. Walking on egg shells. Apprehension. Why do we have to sneak around? Is that what we need to call it? I viewed it as "I do not want to rub it" in her face. My wife does not even want to talk about my cross dressing. She does not want to see it. On occasion she has found an article of clothing left out; bra or panty or water balloon in the kitchen sink. Ugh! She has stumbled upon the browser open to this site. She did not go ballistic. The world did not end. Yet, because she does not want to "see it" I do not proclaim "look at the panties I bought on ebay," etc.

I would follow Kris' advice. Tell your wife you do not want to "sneak around" but don't rub it in her face. I think most wives are going to believe their husbands are going to engage in cross dressing while away from home. If she has apprehension about that, then establish some ground rules. If you and her agree to dress and stay in the hotel room, then honor that limitation. The problem with this secret life is it becomes a shared secret with any consequences shared by both, even though only one is engaged in it.

When reading your postings I get the feeling you're waiting for the hammer to fall on your marriage. Being overly secretive is not going to help because you are not developing a level of trust in the relationship. If I was a wife I would be overwhelmed with "what if and what is he doing behind my back." Maybe your wife is off talking to her mother because you and your wife are not communicating.

Don't you think "if your clothing was on show," i.e. hanging in the closet that would be to her, "rubbing it in her face?" Perhaps, that is a level of acceptance she cannot get to.

I can understand the intense desire to dress up, but do any of the CD's on here know the '7 P's"?

"Proper Pre-Preparation, prevents pish poor performance"

To the OP, did you NOT know that you would be away for the weekend before hand? If you knew, why didn't you start preparing your girl things in advance?

To me, it seems like you took a tremendous effort to BE caught, by waiting until the last moment.

For all of you folk in a DADT situation, or are totally in the closet from your spouse, y'all might want to memorize this little adage:

"ALWAYS EXPECT THE UNEXPECTED!"

A failed attempt to hide becomes another source of distrust, another weight bearing down on the supporting structures of your marriage.

Conversation is needed! The more you try to re-create Checkpoint Charlie the worse you are making it. Yes YOU. Clear the air, set boundaries, establish trust.

When my wife went from a strict DADT to "I know, just don't throw it in my face" we both got along much better. I think it relieved a bunch of stress for both of us.

Sorry to hear you are stuck! Too bad she wouldn't relax the DADT a bit and allow you some freedom to not have to hide you clothing.

Lots of good advice, thanks all.

Well, I can add my 2 cents worth here. I did come out and told my wife one early morning while still in bed. The usual questions...
I told her that not to worry about it. It is just me doing a different thing. I got bold enough over time to hang clothes in our closet. A few items were not seen but I got bolder and hung a few more dresses up.

She asked me to stop doing that and move them away. I did move everything to the guest closet. It is getting a little tight in there now.

But getting back to the point, it will get better if she knows. Talk about it before it blows up. It will be hard and scary but worth it in the long run.

Natalie

"The fear is in our heads".

So at this moment in time you don't know if you've been caught or not and are figuring the worst. This is natural but you need to wait and see what happens. You'll instinctively know if something is amiss upon her return so deal with what's in front of you at the time.

Yes it would be great if we closet dwellers could just leave things in plain view as we would a pair of socks but until then it's a matter of playing the cards we are dealt. Sometimes it's a full house, sometimes it's a busted flush.

It is my unprofessional opinion that some CDers in so-called DADT or different shades of it, are actually not in DADT. They seem to be more dressers with accepting wives, but who want to go far further than what they condescended to reveal to their spouse. No matter how hard we try, I am afraid these members will never discuss boundaries with their wives. Because it would set rules in place and that is apparently the last thing they want, since they could be held accountable for dishonesty and deception. By not setting any rules, they can keep doing anything they want, embracing the delusion that since what they do in the back of their spouse wasn't discussed, then it has to be on the table. See for instance the frequently used "can't read wifey's mind" excuse, which justifies absolutely anything that has not been explicitly forbidden. Problem is, wives can't read minds either, in particular of hubbies pretending it's just clothes at home while quietly collecting intel about going out, transitioning, dating other fellows etc.

-- TL;DR --
The recipe is simple. Discuss. Set boundaries. Then respect them. If it gets difficult then discuss again. Instead of hiding and lying again. Hint: you may not
always get what you want.

[SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]

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Originally Posted by Natalie5004

I told her that not to worry about it.

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Natalie, as long as you're telling her 10% of the full story, you can't really call this a coming out. She's still being lied to and treated as a child. If we trust your posts, she has a lot to worry about.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DianeT

It is my unprofessional opinion that some CDers in so-called DADT or different shades of it, are actually not in DADT. They seem to be more dressers with accepting wives, but who want to go far further than what they condescended to reveal to their spouse.

-- TL;DR --
The recipe is simple. Discuss. Set boundaries. Then respect them. If it gets difficult then discuss again. Instead of hiding and lying again. Hint: you may not
always get what you want.

[SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]
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Charlotte, the first paragraph that Diane wrote is what I always worry about with you. I know you are trying to keep the peace, trying to do what you think your wife wants.but I fear it does more harm ?..the drip drip drip.
The recipe DianeT wrote?..I-feel the same way.
Granted we only know the snippets we read here of your life ?..and maybe I am not seeing it all but the way I interpret it you are only kicking the can down the road . I wish you only the best.

MOD HAT ON
Trying to keep this post open.
Had to delete many post not giving advice to the OP but comments to other members / give your advice / let others give theirs .
The constant disagreeing and sniping at others opinions is what makes the threads to be closed . Address the OP , give your opinion and stop the snide comments to other posters. . I am sick of it .
Knock it off

Quote:

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She's been longer than expected at her mum's house, so now I am wondering if she's talking to her mum about it, if she's just taking a break to process, or if she didn't see anything.

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Yup gigs up...or not but you need to fix this. Or not and continue on your path of inner stressors to relationship self destruction...Good luck!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CharlotteCD

She's been longer than expected at her mum's house, so now I am wondering if she's talking to her mum about it, if she's just taking a break to process, or if she didn't see anything.

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So don't keep us in suspense! What happened? Are you OK?

To DianeT, BRAVO, you are spot on the money on this one! A marriage is supposed to be open and honest, hiding and lying only creates problems. My life as a CD'er only got better after communication started. I admit that some things took time and after 25 years there are still some boundaries in place, but my marriage is strong.

Like the Rolling Stones said, "you can't always get what you want"!

To CharlotteCD, So talk to her, then live with it and move forward in your relationship!

Charlotte, it has been at least 24 hours and presumably your wife has returned home. Was there a confrontation? Or, was the elephant in the room ignored? My understanding is you live in Great Britain. From the postings of another member it is my understanding counseling on gender issues is available through the national health insurance. If that is true I would advise joint counseling to resolve issues. Perhaps, it would be easier to have some sort of discussions through an intermediary rather than a face to face confrontation where nothing is going to get resolved. Most counselors who do joint counseling typical meet with husband and wife separately to get a true understanding of their separate viewpoints.

Sometimes a wife makes it perfectly clear where she stands on her husband's cross dressing and effectively "draws a line in the sand." My wife drew that line. However, she also told me it was alright with her if I joined a support group. She offered an alternative.

U don't need luck, Charlotte, u need to wise up! DADT is not, "sneak, hide, and lie"! How can u enjoy sneaking in dressing in a 15/30 minute time slot? All the while worrying, "Will she catch me this time?"

Wouldn't acting like a grownup and discussing this openly and fairly with your SO be better? Don't u owe BOTH OF U that effort?:thumbsup:

Hi Charlotte,
Best of luck! My wife knows I crossdress, but doesn't want anything to do with it. I consider this DADT. While having an open line of communication would be best, it is not an option. She has explicitly told me she doesn't want to talk about it or see it. This means:
1) I had to stop feeling guilty about sneaking around. I would be more open about if she would allow. This is her decision.
2) I have to take measures to not crossdress around her. If I'm in the bedroom and not sure when she will return, I will lock the bedroom door. If I'm in some other part of the house, my male clothes will be close by for a quick change.
3) I decided ( without discussing with her, because that is not allowed ) that to be as honest as possible in this circumstance, that I will keep my clothes stored in boxes marked with my name or in my dresser drawers. They are out of sight unless you go looking. If she wants to poke around then that is on her, but it would not be difficult for her to find my clothes if she wanted. Prior to our last talk where she said she didn't want to know/talk about it I would hide my clothes in hard to find places.
4) I accept the fact that if she does find my clothes, then she probably won't be in a good mood for a while. This does in turn have an affect on what stuff I have or don't have (for example no breast forms). I'm not trying to please her, if she had her way I wouldn't crossdress at all. But I feel better about myself knowing that within the parameters she insisted on I'm as open about this as possible and if she did look through my things I fell like I could weather the storm. It is a balancing act.
I don't expect this will work for others, everyone's situation is different. You mention wanting to have "clothing on show", consider that this might restrict what you have. You may be better off keeping it out of sight, and your wife might be better able cope not having to see it.
- Nyla

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Originally Posted by SaraLin

So don't keep us in suspense! What happened? Are you OK?

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No time for discussion before I went away. Baby, work and packing saw to that. She's been really off with me and we'll be having the chat tonight.

I explicitly asked if we were ok, and she just said hopefully we will be. I don't hold out much hope.

I know I'm facing the same conversation I've already had, which is why can't you just stop, because she equates it to my eating disorder, and it's just a mental addiction I can just stop.

I've got to get through another 10 hours of smiling and talking to the general public and potential business partners now, then I might just be back early enough to talk tonight.

From all that you have shared here I don't think you are headed for disaster but rather a time for honest compromise...a negotiation neither of you looking forward to. You would not be helping your own position if you were to immediately capitulate and "quit" you know you would not do that...but she is not likely to back down either from what you say.
Again as many here have said straightforward honesty is best yet at the same time be ready to meet her demands as well. It kind of sounds like I'm talking about a contract negotiation but it might end up kind of like that. And don't we often find ourselves in negotiation with our SO's about a lot of things?
Best wishes you do have an excellent support group here.

Absolutely, it is a negotiation and a contract. Agree on terms, then respect them. It is negotiation because Charlotte needs to know what her wife can take, and her wife what Charlotte can yield. In the end, nobody will get what they want (her wife won't get a non-dressing hubby, Charlotte won't get an unlimited hall pass). Everybody will be frustrated. This is normal. But if everyone is at least in one's acceptability (hard to call this "comfort") zone then the couple stands a chance. This supposes that everything is laid on the table, a condition that apparently wasn't met so far. If Charlotte keeps some cards up her sleeve the current history will repeat itself.
It is a contract because you need to respect it, and not break it the instant the going gets rough or the pink fog comes back. Otherwise you just wasted your time and damaged the relation further by breaking trust further (broken trust is the major issue for GGs in these matters if you read their posts carefully).
By the way, it took my wife and I many "negotiation" conversations to understand each other's limits, to reflect about them, to draft possibilities for a deal, and finally agree on one. I don't believe you can seriously do this in an evening since it involves a long time thinking and carving a project.
In my case, my wife was very uneasy with the full nines, especially wig and pads. Finally she told me that she could accept that I dressed to that extent twice a year, or without the prosthetics four times a year. I chose the first.
She also asked that we would not rediscuss boundaries too often and stick to the current deal for a few years at least. This is for her to have time to adjust and find some peace. This way the dressing does not become a constant subject of anxiety and tolerance/acceptance can be eased (note that this is the exact opposite of the drip drip drip method used by some members, who constantly put their wives to the test instead and stress them to no end).
We stuck to it so far. The couple survived so far.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CharlotteCD

I know I'm facing the same conversation I've already had, which is why can't you just stop, because she equates it to my eating disorder, and it's just a mental addiction I can just stop.
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To answer your latest post especially the part above
I have suggested to you before to have her go to a therapy session with you so she does understand .and the therapist can help you both understand each other.
Best Wishes I am hoping for the best.

I think anyone reading this thread realizes you are 99% venting and 1% looking for solutions.

I don't think any one here can give you a solution, because we're not your wife.

It seems to me you're not in a DADT type relationship, you're in a don't relationship, as in don't CD.

I will echo Di's comments about therapy, because you may find answers there you are unlikely to find here.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CharlotteCD

I know I'm facing the same conversation I've already had, which is why can't you just stop, because she equates it to my eating disorder, and it's just a mental addiction I can just stop.

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Oh Charlotte, what you described in your original post and what you say here is exactly my life too. I'd be happy to settle for a DADT relationship but that is never going to happen; it's more a case of NANA - Never Accept / Never Admit. And before anyone starts to lecture me about trust issues, I get it. Absolutely. I do. I know I shouldn't, but when the choice is divorce or secrecy, I'll risk the secrecy. I love the life I have with my wife and don't want to give it up but equally I can't give up Sandra either. Maybe this is an addiction, but that discussion probably deserves it's own thread.

Hi Charlotte;

I've read through some of your previous posts and your love for your family shows as does the fear and angst of being in a DADT relationship is doing to you. Some have written a heartfelt letter to their spouse ( a sample is in this forum somewhere) sharing how you don't want to surprise her, but without some kind of communication , she may happen upon something like you dressed or semi dressed. My spouse is accepting and supporting so we do not have a DADT, but she does like to bring her friends over for a visit from time to time , after work or on weekends. So in order to keep from an unwanted surprises, I let her know when there are Kelly Day(s) and she will call me to let me know if friends are on the way to the house. Communication , even in a DADT relationship.

Without some kind of communication both of you may be unintentially building stress in your marriage.

Just a couple of questions.

. Have you and your spouse discussed crossdressing in any depth ?
. What does DADT mean to you ?
. What does DADT mean to your spouse ?
. Can you discuss what stress means to you and what stress means to her ?