Why is there a need to pair them!

Sorry folks it is not a post about pairing bras and panties, next time maybe!

I am just wondering why so many people pair their sexuality with their crossdressing when describing theirselves on here?
Most often than not it is the heterosexual crossdressers that tend to do so.
Do you feel that you need to do so on this forum that is obviously not a dating site?
Do you feel that stating your sexuality gives you a different voice than someone with a different sexual preference on topics such as the recent one of the asking of cd being a ts in denial? That thread blew me away with so many folks pairing their sexuality with being a crossdresser/trans. I doubt the sexual preference would be much a factor.

I'm not sure I understand your concern. The question in your referenced thread was whether or not one was a ts. My answer to that particular question would be "No, I am a heterosexual male". Why would that be bothersome?

I did not see to many but then again I was not looking for them. I would rather spend my time coordinating bras and panties from my lingerie drawer!

Different strokes for different folks I suppose. For me being CD and bi go together.

I think for me I am new to this site and on many other sites there seems to be the question are you straight, gay, bi, trans, etc.

Shakespeare may have said it best. "Thy protestith too much!":o

I do not mind people being proud of their sexual preferences at all, just wondering why people tend to link them. Sorry for asking…..

I’ll just go back to just starting picture threads…

Same here your sexual preference really has nothing to do with anything CD related.
The thing that gets me are the straight CDs that say when they dress up and go out they talk about wanting a gay interlude.

I think it is because they (we) have spent a lot of their early lifetime trying to figure out why we (they) were not gay, because they (us) liked to dress like a woman! So when we (us, them) finally realized that you did not have to be gay to crossdress, we, us , them, they wanted to make sure everyone knew that and that we were not to be confused with gay crossdressers.

Because a lot of people, both on this board and not on this board, don't understand the difference between sexual attraction and gender.

One is who you want to "do".

The other is who you are.

They are not the same, although in the minds of many, they are.

But underneath it's probably the age demographics of this board. Many of us were reared in a time when homosexuality was "icky". There is, in some cases, the perception that crossdressers are attracted to men (something no one ever told the vast majority of heterosexual CDs).

I will disagree with Karen (and hope she doesn't hip check me into the boards). I always knew I wanted to dress, and when I got a bit older, I always knew I was attracted to girls. For me, there was never confusion between the two.

Pretty sure my hip checking days are over! Sigh.

Chantal.- you asked a good question. When I was younger I felt the need to point out who I was attracted to - I am older and a little more secure in myself esteem so I no longer feel that "pairing" needs to be made public.

My sexual orientation is deeply intertwined with my crossdressing, it ignited and is the reason for it. When I write about my reasons for crossdressing, it is inevitable that I write about sexual orientation.
As for protesting too much (Doc's reply) I was at one point interested in the reasons why members claiming to be heterosexual would sometimes engage into physical relations with other males when going out dressed. I wrote a thread about it in the Loved Ones section. There were some very honest and interesting answers.
About the "why do gay persons CD" threads, there has been a few. Like one of the members answered, there are as many reasons as there are CDers, so I think the sexual orientation doesn't necessarily matter.
Finally, heterosexual CDers may be tempted to be more vocal about their sexual orientation because the mainstream representation of CDers is of gay ones and the said members don't want to be misrepresented, for various reasons that do not necessarily involve prejudices. I understand that it may be resented at some point if you're not heterosexual, since it may give the impression that you don't fit in if you are gay or bisexual. I can't speak for others, but when I mention it, it is only because it makes a difference in the argument at hand.

If I understand this correctly, I think society has done a lot pair crossdressing with sexual preference. The very first question folks ask when they find out, or you reveal, that you are a crossdresser is always "Are you gay?" Accordingly, I think we have become conditioned to answer the question of our sexual orientation at the same time as we reveal such information. Our activity is so misunderstood, we want to identify ourselves as accurately as possible, even when not necessary.

I guess I don't understand the concern. Regardless, for me dressing is a separate issue in my life than my sexuality. The 2 have nothing to do with one another.

I've noticed the same thing, Princess, wondered why some people feel the need to define themselves as gay or bi in a forum that I think shouldn't require it. But I've also been surprised by how many go on to mention relationships or encounters they have when dressed that they wouldn't have when not dressed. For some there seems to be a switch from wanting women to wanting men, and the switch is activated by putting on a dress. I don't get it, but to each his own. It doesn't hurt me either, I just skip those threads for the most part.
For that matter, I skip a lot of threads that don't make sense to me, a practice I highly recommend to everyone on here.

Well, I don't feel that I NEED to pair my sexual orientation with my gender presentation (orientation?), but I probably do it anyway. For me, it's more because I'm trying to explain to the best of my ability just who I really am and how that colors my feelings about whatever I'm talking about. If you don't know me, you can't understand me - right? And there are a lot of people who might not keep track of everyone who posts in here, so a brief summary is certainly not uncalled for.

OK - with that said, I think I'd like to offer a comment, and a different perspective on the idea of presenting female and having -um- "encounters" with men.

I was once asked by my therapist to think about who I would choose to have as romantic partners if I were to transition. Would I be gay, straight, bi, or what?
After a LOT of thinking about it, I decided that I was probably going to define myself as "Hetero - but with a strong lesbian tendency."
Of course I had to explain what that meant in my mind, and here's what I told him: (I'm sure the quotation isn't exact, but it's close)

"Part of my desire to be a woman is to be able to be desired and loved by a man. Yes, that includes sexually. If I were to successfully transition I would definitely want to experience this.
BUT I'm only interested in this if I can do this AS a woman. The idea of a man making love to me while seeing me (or thinking of me) as another man - holds no interest to me.
In the end though, I suspect that my natural attraction to women would win out and I'd end up in a lesbian relationship."

I have had "lesbian" sex (hush up you purists!) but - no man has ever seen me that way, so I've never explored that side of the experience.
And now that I'm happily married, I never will.
No real loss, in my book. Mainly, I just want to be loved, and I've got that aplenty!

Generally accepted concepts in society kind of paints us into a corner in a way. Why is it so often that when we reveal our inner selves as being feminine or female-like, often the first question is, "Are you gay?" Society in general links them. It is a misconception, but perception defines the working reality more than the natural truth. For some the truthful answer is yes while for others it is no and for some it is "I really don't know." But it is confusing when dealing with gender vs sex. If one "feels female" but is attracted to GG's then that person, through gender, is Lesbian at that time and hetero at other times. If feeling female is combined with an attraction to men then that is straight in terms of gender and gay in terms of sex. See the problem?

Good question. I can only answer for myself. Being of an (ahem) certain age, I am still influenced a lot of deeply ingrained and falultynotions about gender and sexuality, starting with the idea that sexuality and gender were intertwined, that transvestites (as we called them back then), were gay, and of course, being gay and/or trans were both bad, shameful and likely to lead to doom. I was deeply afraid to being either one!

I suppose I have tossed in the modifier habitually as a vestigial expression of homophobia. And as I typed that I recalled the bard: ‘The lady doth protest too much, methinks.’

And to the heart of the matter, my panties and bras seldom match.

I don't typically pair my dressing up with my sexuality. I am who I am and I enjoy what I enjoy.

Princess, I think I understand your question. I believe we have been conditioned by society to rebut a falsehood that is spread by ignorant people. Every time there is a comment about "The Reveal," the first question out of a wife, girl friend or anyone is "Are you gay?" In this general section open to the public for perusing there are many people who are not cross dressers or transsexuals who may come here to read. Perhaps, a woman struggling in her marriage to a cross dresser? Or someone doing research? Or some hateful person getting their jollies off laughing at us? Who knows? My wife asked that question. Would she have asked that question if I was not a cross dresser?

I'm not sure what you mean by pairing the two statements. I treat them as two separate statements, that may or may not follow one another. Though I am not a fan of labels, I also think it is probably helpful from a statistical view point and allows each of us to view replies made on this forum in a slightly more informed way, as we probably all subconsciously group the answers to topics using those labels.

At a guess I'd say that it's probably more to do with the fact that because of the negative social stigma due to all of the misconceptions in relation to CDing, that might very well be the reason why some CDs tend to do this. I don't personally as for me, my gender (in my case i'm a straight hetrosexual male) who just occasionally likes to dress as a woman.

As many have said here, there is sometimes confusion regarding gender vs sexual attraction. But much of it has to do with the fact that society equates cross dressing with being effeminate and being effeminate with being homosexual. Many (straight ) CD's mention their hetero sexual attraction so others don't naturally assume they are effeminate therefore homosexual like a good part of society still unfortunately does.

I was going to make a funny response, but decided not to.

It's very hard to figure out what you mean by pairing. I don't think it's pairing at all, just saying which tribe they are a part of:

tribe one- heterosexual and cross dresser,i.e., just fun pretending and wearing femine clothes. Yes this tribe

tribe two - gay and cross dresser, i.e. in full flower a drag queen entertainer. No, not that tribe.

tribe three - trans and cross dresser, i.e., looking for male attention and even hook ups. No, not that tribe.

It's simple was way to focus the responding comments appropriate to the tribe declaring membership in.

So there is a wide assumption that most male gymnasts, florists, dancers, fashionistas, or interior designers are gay. Why do we not see heterosexual people say I am a heterosexual dancer, etc?

I can't say, I didn't venture much in male gymnasts and florists forums discussing their intimate life. And if you didn't either, you too are making an assumption here. Also, the subject of crossdressing verges a bit more on sexuality topics I suppose than discussions about floral art or parallel bars, it doesn't take a lot of browsing the current forums to realize that it is a frequent theme here; so let's not ignore the elephant in the room.
To be honest, it seems to me like you are asking a question that you may have already answered yourself. If so, why don't you lay the cards on the table so we can stop shooting in the dark and debate in a more interesting way? For example, do you think, like some suggest, that some of us ladies do "protest too much", and that everyone being vocal about one's heterosexuality is in fact bi or gay and in denial about it? Or, like others suggested too in past threads, that us members having a wife subscribed to the forums are trying to reassure her by stressing the fact that we are not gay?

I am heterosexual and not proud or ashamed of that fact. There are many here that fit other categories, and I've got no problem with that. I mentioned in the past to my wife that I follow this forum. She wasn't particularly pleased with that fact but dealt with that knowledge by just not acknowledging it. In her mind, without looking into the matter, she sees the possibility that this site is a hookup site. If she ever felt the need to ask/demand to see what I posted here, I want the fact that I state upfront, publicly where I stand to be totally evident.

But, there's also the fact that it is easier to understand where another person is coming from if they make certain things clear up front. I don't care if you are gay, bi asexual or trans. But, it's easier to understand your point of view if that's known up front. It avoids certain assumptions. Seeing our similarities and our differences is useful.

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Originally Posted by Princess Chantal

So there is a wide assumption that most male gymnasts, florists, dancers, fashionistas, or interior designers are gay. Why do we not see heterosexual people say I am a heterosexual dancer, etc?

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Because you don?t call out the generally accepted international cultural norm you call out the divination from the baseline.

Gender and sexual confusion can occur within young people. We just need to leave them alone to figure it out without outside interference. If somebody wants to wear the clothes they want to, so what! Would we get upset if any child wanted to dress like a cowboy for a season, or an astronaut? We spend too much time trying to pigeon hole people into boxes. CD'er come in all shapes, sizes, colours and sexual orientations.

Diane,
I am not of the protest too much mindset. If someone states that they are of one particular sexual identity that is what they are to me until they tell me otherwise. It is not my place to think or say someone is in identity denial.
I was asking the question(s) in hopes to strike out my initial thoughts that it could be most likely internalized homophobic (or is it transphobic) reasonings for the pairing of heterosexual identity with the person’s crossdressing.

Personally, I just pair colors

Chantal, I understand. Persons of a certain age like me were almost certainly raised in a society that did not accept homosexuality as much as it is now, so you can't discard the fact that we had influences like this, prejudicial to gay and lesbian persons, and as much as we try to not be subject to these biases, we may have internalized some, to some extent. But from what I read in these forums so far, prejudice doesn't seem to be the reason for members stressing their heterosexuality. I think that for some of us, the act of crossdressing may question your own sexuality since it is based on gender expression, and gender expression can relate to sexuality*. I have seen many people mentioning their heterosexuality in these forums, but many gay members did mention their homosexuality too, so it doesn't seem specifically related to heterosexuals. In my case, I almost never asked myself if I could have gay feelings or desires before I came out to my wife, after which I made it a topic of research, since this is something that typically concerns wives after a CDer's coming out, along with the transitioning question. This may lead to mentioning our sexual orientation more than usual in forum conversations. A gay crossdresser isn't in the same situation, her partner knows she is gay and won't ask the question, and I suspect she won't get questions about heterosexual tendencies (at least not in the context of a coming out as a CDer), although she may get ones about transitioning.

*sexuality may influence, for example, what you consider female cues

It was a good question, Chantal! I love your picture threads, but this was definitely thought provoking.

for me, at least, it reminded me of the very definite state of confusion, muddled with the fears of being ostracized and denied the possibilities of life. Repression is such a powerful force, whether one is repressing the desire to wear womens clothes (for whatever reason) or aspects of ones sexuality, or both!

I don't think I have ever mentioned my sexuality here except in response to a question.

I think many of the general public associates dressing as a woman with homosexuality. From my experience and what I have read here, that's not generally the case. Yes, there are many homosexual crossdressers, but there are many more straight crossdressers.

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Originally Posted by Barbara Jo

Personally, I just pair colors

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I’m with you Barbara Jo! And…I’m a florist!