JC Penny's would not let me use the fitting room

I went to the mall today during lunch, and decided to pop into Penny's since I always liked their Underscore brand crisscross bras. (such a feminine basic) Anyway I have noticed since I have been losing weight that once you drop below a band size of 40 a whole new world of lingerie opens up. So I saw these JC penny's bras in 38A and 38 almost B. I grabbed a couple and went over to the girl who was stocking the racks and held up the two bras and asked if I could use the fitting room. She said "You're not allowed to use them". I said I understand her consern, but there is no one else in there (there was hardly anyone in the whole store) and said she could check first, it will only take me a couple minutes. But she insisted that it was not allowed. So I handed her the two bras and told her that Lane Bryant, has no problems with me trying on stuff so I will go there next time instead of here, and left in a huff. I know she could probably care less about LB, but I think I will send an email to JCP about how disappointed I was.

If she doesn't want your money, so be it! Her loss! And by extension, a loss for the whole chain of stores!

I hear ya about the under-40 size bras. I used to wear 40B, but those are generally so Ugghh, but a 38C (which I understand is the "sister size" to 40B) has all sorts of styles available.

The bra dept of our JCPenny's store, the lady wouldn't even talk to me on the phone. I never said if it was for me or for my wife. I could have been asking to buy a gift. But NO, she hung up on me. I vote with my dollar$. And Lane Bryant gets my vote and my dollar$. They knew I used to get 38C and the other day I asked for a 42B, she asked if I wanted to be measured? Now that's service.
Oh, the lady in the unmentionables dept at Sears, wanted to know why I was playing with the bras. I had 2 on hangers, hung on my finger and was looking at another. I handed her all 3 and walked out. But I did tell her, I was looking for new bras for my wife. We have been married for 21 years, buying pads and tampons doesn't bother me, so why would buying bras be such a big thing. Maybe she just couldn't cope???BJ

If I shop in person, rare these days as I greatly prefer to buy my female clothing over the Internet, I ensure that I am as uncontroversial as possible , know what I intend to purchase, the correct sizes, the style I want, etc. Select the items take them to the check-out and pay for them without comment or unnecessary chat with the shop assistant. If she does bother to ask, and over here in the UK most don't, I think they are trained not to at least with male customers, I will give them the answer they want to hear, e.g, if she says "If these don't fit your partner she can bring them back with the receipt" I will just nod and thank her and not tell her they are for me. If she guesses that is her problem, not mine. I am simply another customer buying the goods her employer pays her to sell, that is her job, any any comments by her are both unwelcome and un-needed. For my part I do not do or say anything to make the shop assistant or women customers uncomfortable. I will give any woman plenty of space if she is examining panties, bras, etc and wait till she had moved away before I go to that self . I have a quick look to ensure that they are the size and type that I want but do not fondle or intimately examine them . To be honest I would not wish to try on any female clothing in a store's fitting rooms, I will do so in privacy and comfort at home. The only exception to this was when I used to buy women's second hand clothing at a Charity (Thrift) shop and the manageress who was sympathetic to TVs and had many as customers did allow me to go into the back of the shop and try on items I wished to purchase. Unfortunately this shop closed when the area , a run down inner city, was redeveloped.

In an ideal world men buying female clothing would be able to use the shop's Fitting Rooms without question but alas bias still exists and it would only take an unfortunate incident where a woman (or female shop assistant) felt threatened and perhaps her husband or male parter became involved and this got reported by a largely hostile press for the cause of TVs and CDs to be set back years. I can just see the headline in the "Sun" (a prurient UK part of the Gutter Press) "Angry Hubby decks TV Pervert in Marks and Sparks Fitting Room" NOT the type of publicity we need.

I sent an email to J C Penney corporate headquarters asking about access to their dressing rooms. I will post here when I receive a reply.

Several years ago I was really into camping. I was looking a sleeping bags. I made the observation that mens sleeping bags are no different from womens, except they cost more. So I selected sleeping bag, and asked if they had any in stock. They looked at me wierd, uhhh.... that's a womens sleeping bag. What is the difference I ask? That sleeping bag is designed for the sleeping patterns of a women. What?!? It fit's me it's a sleeping bag, and it's 30 dollars cheaper, I'll take it! lol

as far as changing rooms go, just use the mens changing room. As far as that lady asking if you were playing with the bras, you should have asked if she asks all her customers that. I'm sure she was thinking pervert, but really, my word. Notice her word choice, she's not asking what your doing. Pretty low.

Before our last TriEss Chapter meeting I was shopping at JC Penney (dressed as Deena) and found two tops that I wanted to try on. I went to the female clerk and identified myself as a cross dresser and told her I wanted to use the fitting room. At first she was taken back a little but contacted the manager and found a fitting room I could use. One of the tops fit just fine and when I took it to her to purchase the item, all she said was "Did I find something that I wanted?". I guess it depends on who waits on you and how you approach that person. Being up front and straight forward seems to work for me.

Hugs, Deena

I just take things over to the mens.

I have never had this problem specifically in JCP. In this particular case I would have asked to see the manager. I WAS told in the local Coldwater Creek that I could not use the dressing room by a SA. The manager however was VERY welcoming and suportive. Managers have a better eye on the bottom line and usually know where the money comes from. I'm glad someone is writing to the corporate hdqts. This may make some difference.

Always ask to speak to the manager. If they turn you away, then you can close your purse and leave.

I think this problem will be getting less and less as time goes on.

Stephenie

the 1st person to bother me when I go out dressed for the 1st time. even if im not good looking, I'll go to any dam store I please and if a sale's person give's me a hard time i'll call a cop. and then my lawyer, God help them:( I served in the Army for 3 yrs for this?:(

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Originally Posted by noname

Several years ago I was really into camping. I was looking a sleeping bags. I made the observation that mens sleeping bags are no different from womens, except they cost more. So I selected sleeping bag, and asked if they had any in stock. They looked at me wierd, uhhh.... that's a womens sleeping bag. What is the difference I ask? That sleeping bag is designed for the sleeping patterns of a women. What?!? It fit's me it's a sleeping bag, and it's 30 dollars cheaper, I'll take it! lol

as far as changing rooms go, just use the mens changing room. As far as that lady asking if you were playing with the bras, you should have asked if she asks all her customers that. I'm sure she was thinking pervert, but really, my word. Notice her word choice, she's not asking what your doing. Pretty low.

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Womens sleeping bags are usually shorter in length and have a bit wider girth at the hip. Because they are a bit smaller, they usually contain less fill as well as covering and therefore are a bit cheaper. The design has nothing to do with the sleeping patterns of females. Some salespeople will say anything.:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by ava_bruna

I'll go to any dam store I please and if a sale's person give's me a hard time i'll call a cop. and then my lawyer, God help them:( I served in the Army for 3 yrs for this?:(

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In Canada something could possibly be made to stick, legally, under non-discrimination laws (the Canada Human Rights Act, and the Canada Charter of Rights and Freedoms.) We've had Supreme Court cases that ruled firmly against discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation, and even gay marriage was approved in Parliament (federal level) after having already been declared legal in high courts in more than half of the provinces.

But from your reference to "cop" and "the army", it sounds as if you are in the USA. I cannot think of the moment of what law you would ask for proceedings under in the USA? It would have to have been a fairly... energetic... incident for assault or protective orders to apply, and the First Amendment would cover a lot of ground in the other person's freedom to tell you exactly what they thought of your appearance (doesn't mean you have to stay and listen to them). I'm not aware that the US Civil Rights Act covers discrimination against CDers... and isn't CRA violations a matter of -civil- law (i.e., not something that the police would get involved in) ?

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Originally Posted by tess-leigh

In Canada something could possibly be made to stick, legally, under non-discrimination laws (the Canada Human Rights Act, and the Canada Charter of Rights and Freedoms.) We've had Supreme Court cases that ruled firmly against discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation, and even gay marriage was approved in Parliament (federal level) after having already been declared legal in high courts in more than half of the provinces.

But from your reference to "cop" and "the army", it sounds as if you are in the USA. I cannot think of the moment of what law you would ask for proceedings under in the USA? It would have to have been a fairly... energetic... incident for assault or protective orders to apply, and the First Amendment would cover a lot of ground in the other person's freedom to tell you exactly what they thought of your appearance (doesn't mean you have to stay and listen to them). I'm not aware that the US Civil Rights Act covers discrimination against CDers... and isn't CRA violations a matter of -civil- law (i.e., not something that the police would get involved in) ?

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In some parts of the USA, there are anti-discrimination laws at the city, county and state levels that prohibit discrimination based on gender or real or perceived gender identity. I don't know whether it would apply in Roberta's case, as I don't know what her local laws are where she is.

Carol:happy:

I've never tried bras on yet, but with all my other feminine clothes purchases I always take them (and I'm totallly open about doing this) to the mens fitting room....that is, if I'm in drab. If I'm dressed en femme, I'll always go to the women's fitting room.

The comment about "Playing with the bras"....I find this attitude offensive :Angry3:

I'm a changing room chicken! :eek: I have used the changing room at my fav thrift store a couple of times since that is unisex. Then a really agressive yet nice sales lady at Lane Bryant all but made me use their dressing room.

She was very cool I wrote here about it a while back...but she was so hip to what was going on that she even made sure I did not have to talk at the cash register. Which was a relief considering that all of a sudden a lady with like three kids came to the register at the same time.

That all being said I have developed a 'sixth sense' for what fits me...I have little trick like holding my arm againist an item and knowing about where it should line up to fit. So I skip all that...I can blend in fairly good enfemme...but the gig is up if I have to interact very much with my DEEP male voice.

But I am indeed sorry you had such an experience, thats why I am such a chicken to avoid that!

If it is a ladies fitting room, the solution is to ask "where then can I try on these items?" IF the store then continues to not allow you to try on an item, then that is a problem for sure. And no doubt you shoudl be taking your business elsewhere.

I am going to play devils advocate and say that I think alot of new-to retail-or uninformed about "life" might be hesitant because they might think he man is going into the change area is "peep". And let's be honest and real there are perverts out there who do sneak into ladies areas for the sole intent purpose of being gross.

I know cd's are not going into a change facitlity with that intention because I am informed regarding he tg community. But most women are not informed about tg issues and to jump to an assumption like I just brought up is very possible.

That said, ....way back in the early 90's I {a gg} was shopping at a huge Dillards and at the time there were these awesome men's shorts in very vivid colors that I just loved. The ladies and men's sections are miles apart...I saw a few that I thought might fit and when I asked the SA if I coudl just pop in the men's area to try them on {there are individual rooms with doors} he said that this area was for men only and that I could for sure try them on, but I would have to take them to the ladies area. Sounded reasonable, so I did and I wound up with my cool shorts.

I think not allowing someone to try something on at all, is without a doubt discrimination, but to insist on using the opposite's gender's change room is pushing it, espically if you were in male mode.

I had trouble one time I wished I had told them that my money must not be good enough and left. But me being stubborn I stood my ground and made my purchase it was a challenge to me after the first rude word.:Angry3:

i have to agree,

if i was in drab i wouldnt expect to be allowed in the LADIES lingerie changing room - and if i really wanted to try a bra on i would expect to goto the mens,

BUT if i was en femme - i would be upset if they didnt let me use it....


either way - i wouldnt try lingerie on in a store - i buy it - take it home, if i dont like it - take it back

much easier - and avoids any issues....

In the US, once you take underwear home, it is not returnable. Health law.

Even bathing suits must be tried on in the store while wearing underwear.

I like those laws.

Now, as far as genetic males in changing rooms....

Fitting rooms are a tad different from restrooms in that sometimes (I've done this often) if something is the wrong size, we'll pad to the door in our underwear,(or partially dressed) peek out, and ask a S/A to bring another size for us. Keeps us from having to totally redress to simply go out and grab another size.

I'd hate to know I'm padding around in stocking feet and underwear with a genetic male in the fitting room area.

I know that I've said when going to restrooms you should go to the one in which gender you are presenting. Restrooms afford privacy, closed doors on stalls, and you're "covered" once you come out of the stall.

This is not the case in fitting rooms, which are essentially for dressing and undressing.

I'm sure my position won't be popular on this, but it is what it is.

If I am shopping for ladies clothing and expect to use the ladies dressing rooms, I shop en-femme.

At a large dept store, I would personally feel like I was behaving inappropriately by requesting to use the ladies dressing room while dressed as a male.

When shopping en-femme, I don't ask, I just do, like the rest of the girls.
If I happen to be dressed in drab and I am shopping in the womens dept, I just grab what I want to try on and walk out, up the escalator and into the mens dept dressing rooms. I ask for permission from nobody.

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Originally Posted by GG Vanya

In the US, once you take underwear home, it is not returnable. Health law.

Even bathing suits must be tried on in the store while wearing underwear.

I like those laws.

Now, as far as genetic males in changing rooms....

Fitting rooms are a tad different from restrooms in that sometimes (I've done this often) if something is the wrong size, we'll pad to the door in our underwear,(or partially dressed) peek out, and ask a S/A to bring another size for us. Keeps us from having to totally redress to simply go out and grab another size.

I'd hate to know I'm padding around in stocking feet and underwear with a genetic male in the fitting room area.

I know that I've said when going to restrooms you should go to the one in which gender you are presenting. Restrooms afford privacy, closed doors on stalls, and you're "covered" once you come out of the stall.

This is not the case in fitting rooms, which are essentially for dressing and undressing.

I'm sure my position won't be popular on this, but it is what it is.

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I gotta agree with ya, if I was in a store trying on clothes and popped out half dressed to yell at the rep or someone that was with me for help I wouldnt wanna open the door and see a man standing there when its a womans dressing room....no offense to anyone here but thats why they have seperate areas

Not to mention some women are like me, im a plus size woman there fore when trying on something things im more shy than others and the last thing I wanna do is open the door and find a man staring me in the face...

I dont think its discrimination at all if youre a man, dressed as a man and you have to use the mens dressing room, regardless of what youre trying on....and sure Lane Bryant lets you use their dressing room, what choice do they have, they are a womens clothing store therefore they dont have a mens dressing room.....just my 0.02

Especially if one is shopping in drab, they should be very discreet and caring about the people around if they want to try on clothing of the opposite gender.
When i am shopping for my femme clothes, i always feel much better totally femme, then when i want to try something on ( as i will not buy it if I can not try it on ) i will just go and use the femme changing room, and i always feel better when there is an attendent there, and they direct you to a ladies fitting room.

I did have a very happy experience though, a few weeks back.
I had to go to the city for a medical appointment, so naturally i was in drab.
I had some time to spare, so i stopped into the mall, and went into a ladies store that i often frequent, but any time before i was always femme.
I was looking at some items on the sale rack that kind of struck my fancy. Guess the sales girl, must have seen me looking very carefully at them and holding them up to see how they might fit, she came over and asked if she could help me. I was looking at a dress and a matching skirt and top set.
We chatted for a few seconds, just passing time, then out of the blue, she asked if I would like to try them on, she would set up a fitting room for me.
The store was not busy at the time. When i was trying them on, she found another dress on the sale rack that was my size, and brought it over, and put it over the top of the door for me to try on.
I was so pleased to be treated like a lady, even when in drab, and ended up that day with 2 dresses and the skirt set. Needless to say, i will continue to go back to that store.
I find the biggest thing is that wether i am in femme mode, or drab, is to have confidence, treat the sales people with respect, and that is what you will recieve in return.
When paying for the items, we did get chatting for a bit, i asked her if they had many TG people come into the store, and her answer, was quite a few, and after all they are only clothes, and she saw no reason why we could not wear them if it was out desire.

Denise

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Originally Posted by Helen MC

I am simply another customer buying the goods her employer pays her to sell, that is her job, any any comments by her are both unwelcome and un-needed.

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as someone who used to manage a womens (mainly) clothing store I can tell you the above is VERY true, and some could do with been reminded about that.

and I will say one thing, if anyact wierd or refuse you something, if you are comfertable enough, ask for the store manager, the vast majority of times they know who has the money, and their job is to please people out of their money *grins* more often than not, they will take the SA aside after you have left and tell them off, and make sure thewy don't do it again.

To Sherrie and Vanya, I worked the floor as an SA for both Lerners (now New York & Co) and the Limited. Most of the time at Lerners, I worked the fitting room alcove. What would you do when opening the door if the SA was a dude? I had all things happen when working. I had women call to me and then hand an item over the door for a change of size or color. This was the norm. I actually had women come out of the individual room in bra and pantys right in front of me. I think they were trying to get a reaction. My way of dealing with it was to be cool and continue about my business as if nothing had happened.

Jodi

Jodi,

Those customers knew upfront that they were encountering a male SA, and thereby "consented".

*I* would not walk out in front of a male SA in my underwear. 1. my discomfort. 2. the male SA's possible discomfort.

Consideration should go both ways.

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Originally Posted by Bernadina

I just take things over to the mens.

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So do I. In most places in the USA there is nudity taboo. Most all people don't want people of the opposite sex to see them undressed. There is the chance you might if you are in the dressing room area. It has nothing to do with acceptance or not of CD or TG. They haven't been to Hippie Hollow or the Rainbow Gathering or the pagan campout or the naturist resort.

Sorry to seemingly abandon this thread I started but...

I could understand if the store was busy, or if there was even one other customer in the lingeire department. But there was nobody in the room, and by the way it is just one room, not a long hall with several fitting rooms that have only a flimsy curtain covering their openings. I am in a small town and many of our national chain stores seem to be scaled down in size, selection and aparently service.

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Originally Posted by Jennaie

Womens sleeping bags are usually shorter in length and have a bit wider girth at the hip. Because they are a bit smaller, they usually contain less fill as well as covering and therefore are a bit cheaper. The design has nothing to do with the sleeping patterns of females. Some salespeople will say anything.:rolleyes:

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In this particular case, I was back country camping, and weight is everything. I didn't need an extra pound and a half and 2 feet more sleeping bag. I didn't notice it any bit wider in the hips, it was a mummy bag rated for down to 34 degrees. Worked perfect for me. So much for their eye rolling, I thought they were the weirdos.

Back on topic,

I would never use the womens changing room ever. I would like to ad, have any of you gg ever thought the women in the changing rooms might be lesbian? I guess it goes back to the idea that all guys are perverts. So let me ask, why do they let women in the mens changing area? What stores give you that level of service to get a different size for you? I've never had that. Like you mentioned it's a pain to get totally dressed, and go get the same item a different size.

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Originally Posted by Jodi

To Sherrie and Vanya, I worked the floor as an SA for both Lerners (now New York & Co) and the Limited. Most of the time at Lerners, I worked the fitting room alcove. What would you do when opening the door if the SA was a dude? I had all things happen when working. I had women call to me and then hand an item over the door for a change of size or color. This was the norm. I actually had women come out of the individual room in bra and pantys right in front of me. I think they were trying to get a reaction. My way of dealing with it was to be cool and continue about my business as if nothing had happened.

Jodi

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I agree with Vanya on this one too, if I already knew it was a guy then I would be prepared...furthermore he was talking about a lingerie dept....how many men work in that dept of a store??? ive never saw a single man in any store ive ever been in working in the lingerie dept or even the womens clothing dept for that matter....maybe stores where you are have otherwise but not around here...and again if I already knew there was a man outside the door then I wouldnt open it, but if you think its only women and you open the door to find a man that would be the problem

That was then, this is now. Some opinions are of the past. Some ideas are the future. That song used to go like that, now it goes like this.

The line is easy, firm and simple to agree upon. Those places that have argued it, written it, and adjudicated it have found a clear and easy standard in “presentation.” If you look like a girl, go with the girls. If you present as a boy, go with the boys.

No DNA nonsense.

No pull you pants down for a wee-wee check.

That is the direction of the spirit and the letter of the law, whatever you present as, that you be. Kind of a nice zen standard, like ‘wherever you go, there you are.’ Who gets to be a boy, who gets to be a girl??? Whoever states that they are. So easy, so simple. If it walks like a duck, and dresses like a duck, and behaves like a duck, then lets assume its a duck already.

In no small way we have the FtM community to thank for that. As long as our sisters were running off to have SRS all over the place the law could hold to the genitalia test. Its was the FtM (where the SRS surgery is much harder, and much less - shall we say - convincing that raised an uproar over this and forced a change in the language of the statues, ordinances and laws.

It is I think - and why I involve myself in the fight - the most basic aspect of a free society. You are what you think you are. Are you deluded? Sure, could be, so what? You are what you say you are? Is that true like in Veritas? Doubtful, but according to Plato, who actually used veritas in day to day speech, nothing really is. Why not take the simple, yet radical step, of letting people identify as they wish? I doubt that the earth will spin off its axis and go careening through the universe. I doubt that outside of a relatively few (on the grand scale of things) lives, that much would change at all. Where it has been implemented, and we have places enlightened enough that these laws, ordinances and statues have been in place now for over ten years or more. They have been reviewed, altered, adjudicated. And guess what? Nothing really changed, except to give freedom to people who sought it.

This is the standard to which modern, rational, liberal Western societies are leaning.

So that......If he was in DRAB, he should have sought out the male side, if in fem, then the clerk was wrong. Of course, Penny’s is wrong too. Most out of date merchandizing I’ve ever seen. Like its so last century, so yucck, god willing they will soon go the way of Montgomery Wards and they will not bother you anymore.

And I’ve seen plenty of GGs in men’s dressing rooms over the years. They don’t seem to have a problem with it, neither do I. Vintage/Thrift stores - and other smaller ones - tend to only have one or two dressing rooms (if that, one place I go has a sheet hanging down from a rod and that’s it). Whoever is next in line, is next.

I don’t even have a problem (or thrill) with unisex bathrooms. I use one frequently. Everyone is in there. Everyone does what they came into do. Everyone leaves. Of course, we are grown-ups, big boys and big girls living in the big city at the vortex of the modern world - so potty stuff does not excite us. Hence, there is nothing to worry about. No mature adult should have any problem with any of this at all.


P.S.
Those hygiene standards - gross and tacky and very icky in terms of being brought into the debate (where they are not a factor at all) are about the lower naughty bits. Those naughty bits that on some GGs, that are serious disease vectors for the worst infections mankind has. Syphilis, HIV/AIDS and all the bad things. Needless to say, if you ain’t doin anything abnormal with your boobies, they are clean. Its stupid, and condescending to all reading, to imply that somehow women try on bras with another bra underneath. You don’t really expect me to belive that do you?

Don't expect much. It took two letters and three phone calls to remove myself from one of their insurance rolls. Then they tried to bill me for late fees of $30 /month for 3 months for a $10 premium I missed after I removed myself from their insurance plan. In other words, they tried to collect after I quite and charge me late fees to boot. They finally understood when I cut up both my wife's and my credit cards and mailed them a very blunt letter addressed to the customer relations department.

Gwen

I guess that she didn't care at all but it's not her store
It should be interning to see what the head office have to say

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Originally Posted by noname

Iught they were the weirdos.

Back on topic,

I would never use the womens changing room ever. I would like to ad, have any of you gg ever thought the women in the changing rooms might be lesbian? I guess it goes back to the idea that all guys are perverts. So let me ask, why do they let women in the mens changing area? What stores give you that level of service to get a different size for you? I've never had that. Like you mentioned it's a pain to get totally dressed, and go get the same item a different size.

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I want to clarify my post. I *personally* do not have a problem with tg/cd/tv/ts mtf using a females change area is they are dressed as female.

I run a shopping service up here in Toronto and back when I started it I did dozens of phone calls to various popular stores to see what their policies were. Most stores that large with multiple sections say go into the change area which fits how you are presenting yourself. For the clients I had who are dressed in male mode, they asked that the client use either a single door {not the kind with multipel rooms} change area or the mens area for trying on clothing. In stores where there is jsut women's clothing most stores either cleared out the area so my client coudl change or offered a restroom or storage room to use. Espically those which had the flimsy curtains and such. Many stores even have handi-cap accesible change area's and those are also offered in the case of being in male mode in a womens store.

So, as for this *lesbian* question, well I hate to say this but of all the sexual offenses that happen, lesbians attacking or peeping on women either dont' get reported in the news.....or they don't happen often. Where as police finding men in ladies restrooms with video cams or phone cams with the sole intent of getting photos or worse does get reported and does happen. There are dozens of net sites called "up-skirting" that do jsut that.

So I am not saying all men are perverts or all cd's are perverts. Let me make that very cyrstal clear.

But what we have as a KNOWN statistic is that on average men seem to do more raping/sexually assualting then females do. That is a fact. And spaces where women are in vulnerable positions {washrooms/change areas} are going to make us more nervous ...espically when we see a guy in them when we are not expecting to see a guy in there. As I said, I have enough knowledge to know if I see a tg person in my change area or in the washroom that I know they are there to do what I am doing, and nothing more. But to see a man...preseting as a man... in a woman's only area, well it is gonna make us nervous. Sorry that is just a fact of life.

Now, about having an SA come to the area and give us and bring us different sizes....I think that is extremely common. I have lived in Colorado, Texas, and now Canada and many stores have attentive sales staff willing to bring you different sizes/styles/colors. Unless the store is super busy or you go on a peak time then it might not happen. But I find it happens alot for me. Even more so when I have our daughter with us.

Anyway.... in conclusion I think JC Penny's handled the situation wrong and the sales clerk was either new or ignorant or even possibly trans/homophobic. It was her responsiblity to provide *someplace* for the poster to change. And she did not so that sucks.

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Originally Posted by noname

Back on topic,

I would never use the womens changing room ever. I would like to ad, have any of you gg ever thought the women in the changing rooms might be lesbian? I guess it goes back to the idea that all guys are perverts. So let me ask, why do they let women in the mens changing area? What stores give you that level of service to get a different size for you? I've never had that. Like you mentioned it's a pain to get totally dressed, and go get the same item a different size.

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Of course it happens, and not always when requested. Someone posted here a few days ago about it, and even gave a name for it: "feeding the fitting room".

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Originally Posted by tekla west

P.S.
Those hygiene standards - gross and tacky and very icky in terms of being brought into the debate (where they are not a factor at all) are about the lower naughty bits. Those naughty bits that on some GGs, that are serious disease vectors for the worst infections mankind has. Syphilis, HIV/AIDS and all the bad things. Needless to say, if you ain’t doin anything abnormal with your boobies, they are clean. Its stupid, and condescending to all reading, to imply that somehow women try on bras with another bra underneath. You don’t really expect me to belive that do you?

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I'm the one that made the post about hygiene standards, and I made it specifically in response to this post by Rachel:

if i was in drab i wouldnt expect to be allowed in the LADIES lingerie changing room - and if i really wanted to try a bra on i would expect to goto the mens,

BUT if i was en femme - i would be upset if they didnt let me use it....


either way - i wouldnt try lingerie on in a store - i buy it - take it home, if i dont like it - take it back

much easier - and avoids any issues....

I stated the US laws simply to clear up any confusion about taking lingerie (in general) home and then returning it in the US.

Be they tacky, icky, and gross, these problems DO exist, and were the basis for the laws.

And, for the record, I think these icky problems exist for males too. I for one, would not want to buy panties that some strange guy had tried one. LOL, especially in light of the "thrill" so many express here when trying them on. :straightface:

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Originally Posted by Billijo49504

The bra dept of our JCPenny's store, the lady wouldn't even talk to me on the phone. I never said if it was for me or for my wife. I could have been asking to buy a gift. But NO, she hung up on me. I vote with my dollar$. And Lane Bryant gets my vote and my dollar$. They knew I used to get 38C and the other day I asked for a 42B, she asked if I wanted to be measured? Now that's service.
Oh, the lady in the unmentionables dept at Sears, wanted to know why I was playing with the bras. I had 2 on hangers, hung on my finger and was looking at another. I handed her all 3 and walked out. But I did tell her, I was looking for new bras for my wife. We have been married for 21 years, buying pads and tampons doesn't bother me, so why would buying bras be such a big thing. Maybe she just couldn't cope???BJ

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I buy all my bras and tops at Lane Bryant and the SA's always ask if i want to try something on. Knowing all of the SA's at Lane Bryant helps too. I only wear Cacique bras from the Lane Bryant stores The only place i ever had a peoblem with a fitting room was at a catherines store, where the fitting room resembles a highschool girls locker room for gym class. I have mentioned to the Catherines surveys that I have done that The fitting room needs to be upgraded to allow crossdressers the opertunity to try something on in th e store.
www.lanebryant.com
www.catherines.com

I used to work in Retail and was a manager of drug stores for about six years for two different companies. At both of them the corporate line was always the customer is always right. My boss, the district manager, and his/her boss the area manager did not want to see a negative letter, ever.


If you have a problem in any store my advice is to go to the top, ask to speak with who is ever in charge of the store at that particular time. Calmly explain the problem and then stop talking. For me as the person in charge I would always ask what was it that I could do to fix the problem. In 90 % of the problems, I was willing to give more away to the customer than what the customer wanted. If the person in charge does not ask you what you would like to make you happy, suggest what will make you happy. If they can not make you happy be sure to get that persons name and send a written letter to the company with as many details as you can provide. Negative letters get read, it takes some time but they tend to get passed up the chain of command, it is best to send them as high as you can find from the start though, the trickle down approach works best. In any event if you are not satisfied with any level of service in a retail environment, write a letter. Let them know that you are unhappy. The squeaky wheel does get the grease.

This is what scares me. I am 22 and have never shopped for women's clothing in person. I know since I am fairly young that a SA would think I was just playing around or doing something else juvenile. Many of you have the excuse of telling the SA that you are shopping for your wife; I don't have that luxury :sad: .

Do you think Lane Bryant would help me eventhough I am fairly young? Or should I just wait until I get older?

at 22 lots of men are married. How is she going to know? You could just say it, like is the SA going to say let me see your papers? LB has been willing to help us, no matter the age as long as you are not a minor. If it were not for CDs LB's sales would be much less, and they know it.

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Originally Posted by Avsblues19

This is what scares me. I am 22 and have never shopped for women's clothing in person. I know since I am fairly young that a SA would think I was just playing around or doing something else juvenile. Many of you have the excuse of telling the SA that you are shopping for your wife; I don't have that luxury :sad: .

Do you think Lane Bryant would help me eventhough I am fairly young? Or should I just wait until I get older?

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I'm 23 and I'm in the same situation as you. The best options out there are internet and supermarkets... big places in big cities where nobody talks to you are a must. And also, don't try to proove it... learn by image your size and just buy and take it home. It's best to loose a few bucks than create an awkward situation.

My 2 cents! Good thred. Very entertaining.0.02
LOLOL:D
Still laffffinnnn I can see it in the comic strips now. A dressing room setting.:heehee:

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Originally Posted by Avsblues19

This is what scares me. I am 22 and have never shopped for women's clothing in person. I know since I am fairly young that a SA would think I was just playing around or doing something else juvenile. Many of you have the excuse of telling the SA that you are shopping for your wife; I don't have that luxury :sad: .

Do you think Lane Bryant would help me eventhough I am fairly young? Or should I just wait until I get older?

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In all my shopping experiences, I have never ever been asked if something was for myself. Ever single time, when the clerk says anything, they assume I'm buying something for my girlfriend. And even when it's not something that can be explained away, the store clerks have always been respectful.

I e-mailed JC Penney asking about their policy and mentioned this thread. They replied that there is no company policy regarding this, it is left up to the sales associate, if the sales associate feels uncomfortable then you may be excluded from a fitting room. This does not seem like the most enlightened policy, lets encourage Penneys to be a bit more crossdresser friendly.

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Originally Posted by trannie T

I e-mailed JC Penney asking about their policy and mentioned this thread. They replied that there is no company policy regarding this, it is left up to the sales associate, if the sales associate feels uncomfortable then you may be excluded from a fitting room. This does not seem like the most enlightened policy, lets encourage Penneys to be a bit more crossdresser friendly.

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why? if they dont want our money why should we give it to them? We can find similar or better items elsewhere.

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Originally Posted by Stephacuse

why? if they dont want our money why should we give it to them? We can find similar or better items elsewhere.

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This is so true, Yes I have alot of their thing's because they caught my eye;) but so does other's like Sear's ect. So maybe we should write a letter to the main office and inform them just how many C Der's but from them and will no longer unless they change and become more C D friendly. We could all sign it and boy, bet they will be surprised just how many of us there are;) NO? anything wrong in doing this? We could let all the other C D group's ect join in on the siging.

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Originally Posted by Robertacd

"You're not allowed to use them".

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A friend of mine had a similar problem at a Sears store, wrote the corporate office and ended up with apologies from Corporate and the store manager.

Sharifemme

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Originally Posted by Deidra Cowen

I'm a changing room chicken! :eek: I have used the changing room at my fav thrift store a couple of times since that is unisex. Then a really agressive yet nice sales lady at Lane Bryant all but made me use their dressing room.

She was very cool I wrote here about it a while back...but she was so hip to what was going on that she even made sure I did not have to talk at the cash register. Which was a relief considering that all of a sudden a lady with like three kids came to the register at the same time.

That all being said I have developed a 'sixth sense' for what fits me...I have little trick like holding my arm againist an item and knowing about where it should line up to fit. So I skip all that...I can blend in fairly good enfemme...but the gig is up if I have to interact very much with my DEEP male voice.

But I am indeed sorry you had such an experience, thats why I am such a chicken to avoid that!

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[SIZE="3"] Deidra like you I have had very good dealings with Lane Bryant in the past, their salespeople went out of their way to make a sale, making a changing room avaliable, even getting a top in a different size and style they thought I might like, brought both. Like you I don't care to try things on in drab often, but I do take things that are on clearance and could not be returned to the men's fitting room if I have any doubt they might not fit.

Reciently shopping at Macy's in drab (almost was wearing womens jeans and panties), found 2 pair of jeans maked down to $7.99 from $40 and a top marked down to $5.99. I have lost alot of weight and was unsure if I would fit into them, for they were a size 10. I took them 1 floor up to the men's changing room, they fit, I returned to dept to replace the things I tried on I didnt care for or didn't fit, and went to pay for them. There was a line at the check out counter waiting I chit chatted with the women, got to the register the woman rang up my purchases and said, "Your wife or girlfriend will be VERY happly to have these bargains," for which I replied, "She better not try". She looked at me and there was a moment of silence then just giggled.

I say to anyone the more you do anything the more it seems "normal" to do , I enjoy shopping(I have the shopping gene) I look on the internet but would rather shop in the stores.[/SIZE]