More of us

Sorry, this is another post about Helen's holiday.

Over the years I've attended a support group based in North Wales called Unique. If my calculations are correct due to covid and other factors it'd been 3 years since my last visit.

So there were a few new faces and initially I got chatting to one of our community and we swapped life stories, as you do.

Later I found myself in a discussion with a group of about 4 or 5 one of whom was a F2M trans guy. During our conversation he made an interesting observation namely that F2M trans folk have an easier time when it comes to blending into the crowd. "Once the hormones kick in, you get facial hair and your voices changes it's easy to just merge into the background". He also added that it's a little known fact but there are more F2M trans people than M2F.

Because it's easier to effectively dissappear into the background it does mean that most of the media attention gets focused upon the M2F community. Those are the high profile cases we see often represented in an unkindly light and he said that while he felt the F2M community should perhaps be more vocal, it can be difficult to "Stick your head above the parapet".

Helen came away from that evening a little wiser and glad she went. We are part of a bigger community and having the broadest view certainly gave me food for thought.

It did make me think about where I sit on the CD to trans spectrum. I'm fairly confident I'll never contemplate transitioning but I think I've come to the conclusion given certain circumstances, which are not likely to occur, then I could go full time.

I will say that in meeting others of our broader community it does make you consider your own situation. While I can understand those who say support groups aren't for me, the occasional visit can certainly provoke a bit of self reflection.

Helen, in a recent meetup with my transgendered group, one of the guests was a transman. Im sure it is more common than we know.

Interesting observations. I have no way of knowing whether there are more ftm or mtf, but I can see where its easier for ftm to blend in to society. I suppose each of us, whether we occassionally express our gender variance or seek to live some meaningful parts of our lives as women (or men) can do something to help make society a more tolerant.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Helen_Highwater

"Once the hormones kick in, you get facial hair and your voices changes it's easy to just merge into the background". He also added that it's a little known fact but there are more F2M trans people than M2F.

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Glad to hear you had a good time, Helen.

I expect F2Ms also blend in better because generally average-sized men like them draw less attention to themselves than generally above-average-sized women like us.

The fact there are more F2Ms than M2Fs is surprising. One would not guess it from the overwhelmingly biologically male membership on this site.

I remember there once was an active (and thriving) Transmen section here, which has since dried up and gone. If your numbers are right, F2Ms should be outnumbering us by a great margin, yet, that's not the case. A pity really, because we're missing out on the benefit of their perspective.

What could possibly have turned them off?

helen i can relate to this,

my first outings were to p-flag support group meetings in a church in Shrewsbury nj.
i owned a seasonal rental business and would normally not participate over the summers....when returning there were new folks in the group.

after a few years i had stopped counting at 75 FtM. being who i was i was beside myself at this scenario, i had only met a handful of MtF.

all the FtM folks were younger and most of the MtF were older. the whole thing was inconceivable to me. who didn't want to be a pretty women.

the proudest thing for one such person was when they went to the restroom they were able to use the urinal.....the things we give credence to....

I don't know how anyone figures out whether there are more FtM than MtF. I don't read about bathroom laws banning FtM's from using the men's room. It's always the MtF who make the headlines. Back in the day it would have been great to have the internet and have a support group to attend. The 1960's were brutal from a psychological viewpoint.

Helen,
An interesting observation.
With all the replies I have read I can see that they slip under the radar than we do.
I also was sorry to see Transmen disappear from the forum as it gave me an understanding of what the other side was like.

I've no hard evidence to support the claim but as it was made by someone from within that section of our community I'm inclined to give it credence. There's also a certain logic in that if your aim is to live as a male within society and you're able to do that successfully, why would you then go and shout it from the roof tops.

One interesting comment he made was that being pre-op he as yet couldn't use the urinals in gents toilets so if the cubicles were busy it sometimes looked like he was hanging around, "Cruising", looking for a hook up. These are the things that we not unsurprisingly don't give consideration to but do highlight the different difficulties facing members of the LGBT community.

I would imagine it is massively easier to take hormones and grow facial hair, not worry about makeup and blend in a as a FTM than all the steps we need to go through. Their biggest hurdle is binding the breasts. We have to worry about removing the facial hair, height, masculine faces and hands, wigs, makeup lasting only so many hours etc. Unless I am missing something, it just does not compare. (I am only talking about the ease and ability of physically fitting in, not other aspects of transitioning)

I have not attended a support group meeting in a long time. I was the only CDer the other 4 were trans, 1 being a F2M. I would not have known he was a transman if he had not told me. Under different circumstances I would still attend meetings. Support group meetings have proven great for me.

It does make sense that FtM can blend in more readily. What makes me wonder are the other aspects of it. In the MtF realm, we go over a host of nuances from passing, to attitudes, emotions, relationships, etc. Do the FtM people have the same concerns / issues. Maybe we are a bit more chatty about it.

I've met a few FtM and they have the opposite height problem as us. They are almost enveriaility very short. The average female (in the US) is about 5'6", which is much shorter than the average male.

In addition, where we use gaffs and tucking to reduce the silhouette of our junk, they often want to "pack" to simulate junk.

Helen, before we went out together, I would have been out alone, thank you, Ive walked many steps alone, but omg !!!!, youve changed my life, we walked through the Trafford Centre like we owned it, so what im trying to say is FTM, wave as we pass you gorgous guys

The child of one of my archery friends is FTM, and attending the Leeds GID clinic, and the proportions are 65 percent FTM, against 35 percent MTF. So that backs up the comments made to Helen.
And yes Geena, The experience of my friend's son, would suggest that FTM's, go through much the same concerns and issues.