My Unconvinced Dad...

I really need help here.

So I talked to my dad about crossdressing a month or two ago. I had an outfit planned and everything (which was way more than I could afford), but he refused. His only excuses were "It makes me uncomfortable" and "I don't want you to get hurt".

To make things clear, I was only going to dress up in my room, and around the house if he'd let me. If not, I'd be perfectly happy admiring myself in my room.

This time, I compiled a starter outfit that's a lot LOT cheaper. And I want to convince him again. And this time, it'll be all coming out of my wallet after Christmas. I want him to know that crossdressing isn't just "putting on clothes" or "feeling girly". I want him to know that it's a part of my gender. And I want to protest against him until he'll let me.

I just get nervous, I don't know what to say. I stand there and cry in front of him instead of being intelligent and telling him why it's important.

So I just need facts and details as to why crossdressing is important for gender and self-esteem and such. My dad already knows that I have terrible self-esteem. I've told him about my questioning as bigender. I've told him about these urges I've had. I don't care if I'm moving out sooner or later, I want to get this done as soon as I can.

So please, any facts you have, or motivational comments, let me know. I want a list. And I want to read him that list. And I want to stop at each one and see what he has to say. With your help, I might be able to convince him this time that I really need this.

Sorry for posting so many threads, although I just joined. I joined this community in need. And I hope some day to return the deed.

I've got 2 daughters, both probably older than u. Here's MY list for u Pink.

1. Find out what u want to do with your life when u grow up. Everyone your age has issues with something and/or someone. Which mostly have nothing to do with gender.

2. It's your dad's house. As long as u live there, it's his rules.

3. Stop trying to impress him with your need to express yourself. If u want do that now, start by trying to impress a professional. Someone who can understand and help u.

4. If u really want to do whatever u like u need a plan. That will impress your dad and give u something to work toward. And, when u succeed in accomplishing it, u will suddenly find u have become confident! And, u will also have found maturity. Something like: Graduate high school. Attend such and such college. Get a job in some field to pay your way thru. Graduate and get your own apt. in some up coming year. Etc, etc. It's your life. It should be your plan!

5. Your dad sounds very much on your side. Tell him how much u appreciate his open minded attitude. Ask how he would proceed in your shoes? Then, tell him your #4 above.

Have you ever thought why a lot of us stayed in the closet until we left home?
Also read the previous post again.

A few questions

1. How old are you? This can affect the level of responsibility a parent feels for their child and also may help you understand what your dad is thinking.
2. You mention your dad but not Mum or siblings. Is it just you and your dad?

That aside you say that your dad has said he is uncomfortable with you dressing and he doesn't want you to get hurt. It sounds like you guys have a pretty good relationship. Try changing your approach from trying to "convince" him to get what you "want". Instead you need to think of educating your dad to help him understand both Transgenderism and your feelings. That may mean you need to write down your feelings in a letter or an email. Perhaps showing or copying in to the email some links to websites on Transgenderism (not forums and not fantasy websites, real genuine information sites, there are quite a few support sites out there for parents of LGBT children). There have been recent articles in magazines on TG and TS individuals (Lauren Cox in Time magazine, Martine Rothblat in NewYorker magazine) that give great stories of not just the struggles but also the successes and joys that a transgender individual and their loved ones can experience, reading these can give transgenderism a different more personal face for your dad than the most likely impression he has of either Drag Queens or pornography.

Make sure you tell him what you want. I think it is quite reasonable to want to be able to dress at home and in your room. Hopefully perhaps with a little education and once your dad see's how your self esteem is better when you are able to express your true self then he will be able to understand better. Trust me, we aren't all set in our ways :)

From a Dad

Hi Pink

k, FIRST: This issue does not belong to you...it's your Father's issue (and I am able to understand his mind-set); however, stop trying to own it...remove the emotion from the argument, that will be:

First, download a Magnum P.I. video (or Baywatch...classy, 'eh?) and watch it together, then watch a current movie (with a clean shaven current Hollywood 'male image' icon) and watch that...After an evening of videos, if you two are able to talk about this then you're half way there. Make note of the difference between the two generations concerning maleness. Explain this to him, along with Tattoos and piercing and all the other 'stuff'. Times change faster than we do...

Any way, maybe the two of you can reach a compromise (for awhile, 'cause now your foots in the door;). Start with Ladies Jeans and a sweater/blouse (Unisex)...once everybody's cool with that then upgrade...actually, I guess, in this case...downgrade? ;)

I hope you two will work this out, good luck & keep your powder dry,

Ciao,
Mia

Now, please tell me that there is no chance of violence...before I send you out with this info

Quote:

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Originally Posted by docrobbysherry

1. Find out what u want to do with your life when u grow up. Everyone your age has issues with something and/or someone. Which mostly have nothing to do with gender.

2. It's your dad's house. As long as u live there, it's his rules.

.

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IMO the above says it all.
My take on the way you express yourself gives me the impression you are really not ready to decide / do.
If it is something 'YOU" want to do, find a way to 'earn' more money and do it.
Talk to advisers at your school / Dr etc etc etc.

Hey Pink...for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction...this is likely not what you want to hear. Sounds like you might be pushing too hard. Dad's are not good candidates for a hard sell...the harder you push, the harder he'll likely push back. You should not seek to "win" but rather maintain a loving relationship. It will probably not be possible to "convince" him. Get back on a footing of mutual respect and let him know you need your space. Love him as a son, show that you're worthy of the responsibility and that should be that ...

Hi Pink,
Dads are often old fashioned, and when they reach their 60s & 70s they soften (I'm old fashioned at 50 and have to swap to a feminine mode to be more open).
They understand how life works for them, but not for other people.

So remind your dad that you love him, and while you live in his house, respect his rules (no harm in asking if he would mind if you wore leggings etc during the cold months?).
Do seriously - get a good education, work towards the job of your dreams and keep your dad informed of these goals.
DADs want their children to have a better life that they had, and they measure it against your life goals (not pay rates)

Alright. I'm really sorry about all I said when I made this thread. I was a bit angry with my friends at the time (which at the time I was looking at clothing), and I just sparked up. Sorry for my immaturity, and thank you for the advice.

I'll try to be more considerate next time. Again, sorry. :)

OK, there have been quite a few here have been echoing things along the lines of "his house, his rules" or similar. Please I mean no disrespect to those who have posted these views, many of you I respect your opinions highly.

However this "My house my rules". NO. NO NO NO NO! NOT with this. This isn't some nonsense about whether you can play music loudly or have a double bed or have to keep your room tidy. This is at the core of Pinks identity and emotional wellbeing. "My house My rules" is the cause of the incredibly large number of LGBT youth that are homeless and emotionally abused. It is time to stand up as a society and say NO, it is NOT acceptable for a parent to punish a child for their identity, be that gender, sexuality or otherwise.

I think the piece of advice you were given about girls jeans is a good one as you can express yourself without it necessarily being obvious as to the reasons why. It's how I get through being at home and I've never had a comment about them being for girl from my conservative parents nor my laddish friends.

Adina,

I concur.

Mia

Hi Pink,

This is a similar conundrum many face here when they tell their SOs and try to make them understand why it is important albeit we are now talking about a parent. It is obvious your dad does not want to discuss this with you as I am sure it makes him uncomfortable. In a way you have now entered a Don't Ask Don't Tell (DADT) situation. He is aware that you want to cross dress but does not want to see you dressed or talk about. You do say you would like to be able to dress around the house but are perfectly happy admiring yourself in your room. If it is not an issue (keeping it to yourself in your room) then my recommendation would be to stay with the course of action for now and slowly begin dialogue (over time) with your dad. Give him some breathing room (time to adjust) after all you just told him. He still sees you as his son so it is going to be confusing. After some time (it will also give you a chance to collect your thoughts) broach the subject again and not from a "this is what I want to do" perspective but more from a this is what I am all about and why it is important to me. This may take several end runs to pull off but over time, he may begin to understand a bit better. Will he accept? I really can't answer that question anymore than I could say someone's wife is going to accept.

I take from your post you are young. You have time. Study, look for employment and begin to live your life and grow. If CDing or being TG is part of you, it will grow with you and as you move out it the world it will move with you at which point you will be free to do what you please. All this to say, there is no magical explanation that you can provide to your father which will make him understand. All you can do is attempt to communicate and educate but that implies the other person is receptive to listening. So you will need to work on getting him to listen to you. Once you do, then it will be easier to explain.

Hugs

Isha

Hi, Pink
I have to agree with many of the other posts here and while you may want to dress at home and have the support of your dad, It sounds to me that you are also after his financial assistance for an outfit that you would like to purchase.
I can understand that your dad has concerns about you and your wellbeing in general, and by you trying to push his limits will not only cause upset in the home for both of you, but arguments that will make you both feel uncomfortable to be even in the same room together.

I think that you need to step back and look what you wish to achieve in life, and if you wish to dress in your room that is up to you, but what if your dad pop's his head round the door and finds you dressed, that can then again cause problems between you both, unless you can say to your dad not to disturb you for awhile in your room.

Sorry if this sounds very negative but we all have to understand each others needs and wishes just to get on in our lives.

Martina

Quote:

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Originally Posted by docrobbysherry

Your dad... Ask how he would proceed in your shoes?

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Wow- is that ever a clever suggestion. Go ahead- try it next time. I can't think of a better way to appeal to his sense of fair play. Assuming he has one of those.

Having said that, my own advice would be stop looking for daddy's approval. You think it's about the dress- it isn't- it's about you living your life on your own terms, not his, and that's a struggle which will play and play- in my case till I was late thirties. Start practicing now. Keep your mouth shut about your cd habits- it's your business, not his, unless you make it his. If you need clothes, go to Goodwill, pass a few happy hours- they'll let you try stuff on in the dressing room- for a few dollars you can find an outfit for yourself without pressurizing the guy.

CD should be fun! Make it about the clothes, not about other people's opinions.

xNikki

Pink,

I'm a dad of two beautiful girls. One is bi and the other is hetero. I understand where your dad is coming from. Your dad's replies "It makes me uncomfortable" and "I don't want you to get hurt" tell me two things.

1. He's concerned about your feelings. He might be afraid he or others will say things that will hurt you and he doesn't want to do or see that.

2. He does love you and wants to maintain a relationship with you. Otherwise he would just say go all negative and tell you mean things like don't do that in my house.

I suggest you give him time to absorb what you are asking. I know that's hard for you. I consider it positive that he isn't throwing you out of the house or beating you for telling him.

Put your feelings in a letter, hand written. Suggest that he might become more comfortable the more he saw the real you. Maybe for an hour at first, then extending the time later.

What a tough situation to be in!

At least your dad knows.. and isn't completely flipping out... that's a plus. There's a reason that when I turned 18.. I chose a university on the other side of the country.. so that I could move out. (^{also because it was a good university.. don't get me wrong ;)} )

I don't agree with some of the posters here who say: "His house, his rules".. which I think should apply to things like curfews, chores and practical things. So I hope for you that he will come around, but the practicality of the matter might just be that you'll have to wait until you move out.

I do agree with those that say that you shouldn't push too hard. Dads are stubborn.. and a lot of times they see it as a failure of themselves to "instil the proper amount of masculinity" in their son.

However, your dad knows.. so I'd recommend slow and steady. Bring it up occasionally.. see how he reacts.. try to make him ask questions. Don't make it something he can easily ignore, because then it will just remain an untouched topic in the house.. and thus no progress.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pink

Alright. I'm really sorry about all I said when I made this thread. I was a bit angry with my friends at the time (which at the time I was looking at clothing), and I just sparked up. Sorry for my immaturity, and thank you for the advice.

I'll try to be more considerate next time. Again, sorry. :)

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Nonsense, Pink. U needn't appologize for expressing your feelings. As long as you're talking about yourself or your feelings. The thing is, some of us have had experiences much like yours. We're here to help u if we can. The only way we can do that is if u r honest with us and vice versa.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Adina

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However this "My house my rules". NO. NO NO NO NO! NOT with this. This isn't some nonsense about whether you can play music loudly or have a double bed or have to keep your room tidy. This is at the core of Pinks identity and emotional wellbeing. "My house My rules" is the cause of the incredibly large number of LGBT youth that are homeless and emotionally abused. It is time to stand up as a society and say NO, it is NOT acceptable for a parent to punish a child for their identity, be that gender, sexuality or otherwise.

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I believe the OP was discussing CDing NOT gender dysphobia, Adina. If Pink's gender issues r affecting her life then she needs proffesional help. But, that's a different and more serious problem than the clothes she wears. Adolescents and young people ALL face many issues on their way to becoming responsible adults. And, how young people present themselves, (dress), often is unacceptable to their parents. This is not just CDing kids issue.

As a parent, I would be very disapproving if my live at home, 20 y/o daughter, wanted to go out dressed as skimpily as Sherry sometimes does. If it's just about clothes? I strongly believe , "My house, my rules", should apply between parents and their kids!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Adina

OK, there have been quite a few here have been echoing things along the lines of "his house, his rules" or similar. Please I mean no disrespect to those who have posted these views, many of you I respect your opinions highly.

However this "My house my rules". NO. NO NO NO NO! NOT with this. This isn't some nonsense about whether you can play music loudly or have a double bed or have to keep your room tidy. This is at the core of Pinks identity and emotional wellbeing. "My house My rules" is the cause of the incredibly large number of LGBT youth that are homeless and emotionally abused. It is time to stand up as a society and say NO, it is NOT acceptable for a parent to punish a child for their identity, be that gender, sexuality or otherwise.

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Adina,
"My house, my rules" does not automatically imply emotional abuse or a parent "punishing" a child for their identity. Truly loving parents will challenge behaviour in their children which they either don't understand or don't approve of. That's part of the job description! Letting a child (by which in this context mean any offspring who is either dependent or below 16 / 18) do what they like is NOT "loving" them - it's abdication of responsibility. What separates the good, loving parents from the abusive ones is not whether they challenge but HOW and how they deal with the consequences of their challenging.

I know that lots of folks on here have had all sorts of struggles with parents who couldn't or wouldn't understand or who resorted to courses of action that amounted to some form of abuse. That experience leaves its mark in many different ways, one of which is a tendency to be perhaps too quick to criticise parents who don't just "roll over" and be accepting on cue. Many of us wrestle with this TG thing from the perspective of being CD / TS / whatever ourselves. Guess what? The best and most loving parents wrestle with it too - only from a different perspective.

So, "my house, my rules"? For better or worse, that's the way it is. The challenge for all of us is to create a society in which the "house rules" are at least open to some negotiation so that the LGBT to whom you refer do not feel compelled to leave home. As regards the emotional abuse problem, that runs MUCH deeper. That is embedded in the character of the abuser. In that context, "my house, my rules" is only one of many expressions of emotional abuse not the primary expression and certainly not the root cause.

Doc. In many instances I genuinely agree with your posts and as you know you have certainly in the past helped me to understand some aspects of this community that I have had little experience with. However with respect Doc, I must continue to disagree with you on this one. In Pinks OP she said:
"I want him to know that its part of my gender" and "I stand there and cry in front of him"
I think these are pretty clear statements that Pink doesn't just want to play dress ups.
Even so, if it is just some fun dress ups then what does it matter if Pink has some fun at home. And if it is more than that then I stand by my original statement.

Judith. There is a difference between challenge and denial. Pink is not wanting to do what she "likes" she wants to be able to express who she is and what she needs. So I'm sorry but NO. "It's just the way it is" is not going to cut it with me. The way it is, is wrong.

I don't have any hangups from some tormented childhood. I am astoundingly lucky that I had and still have an incredibly caring and accepting family. So I'm again sorry but this is too important, childrens lives are too important (and if you don't think that this sort of intolerance affects childrens lives in an adverse way then I would suggest you have a look at the various reports into LGBT youth homelessness and health) for me to placate and play nice.

Pink. I wish you the best with your father. I think you are doing the right thing in trying to get as much information and ideas as you can. You deserve to be able to express who you are. Indeed you have a right to express who you are under the United Nations Conventions on the Rights of the Child. You have a moral, ethical and spiritual right to be and express who you are. I do not know a single parent out there who truly loves their child who would deny them those rights. Communicate with love to your father and things will work out for the best for you.

Hi
So, somebody had to mention Human Rights...right

Solution
Pink: contact and discuss this issue in private with Adina (can I do this?)

Just my opinion
Mia

I'm surprised to see support for "my house, my rules". First, Pink may not have paid for that house but it IS his home. The dad is not a landlord.
More importantly, change the OP from a young adult male to a six year old child, born male but prefers to play with dolls and wear dresses instead of football, trucks, and boy clothes - as he sees himself as a girl. Anybody agree, in this case, to "my house, my rules"?

It may not be right but unfortunately the reality seems to be "my house, my rules". Pink, your only option may be to crossdress in secret until you move out.

Nicole,
What on earth has paying for the house got to do with parental authority? The dad isn't a landlord, he's a father - possibly confused, embarrassed or not quite knowing what to do but certainly, according to Pink's OP, concerned for his son's well being. The house in question is not only Pink's home, it's also his father's home.
As for Pink's "only" option being to dress in secret - what about keeping talking, that option hasn't been exhausted.

Adina,
When Pink said "I stand there and cry in front of him" it was in the context of nerves etc. what shy teenager, TG or otherwise, hasn't been in a similar situation?

Yes, there is a difference between challenge and denial. None of us have enough info to know which of the two this happens to be.

And children's lives ARE important, which is why we all need to be careful!

The argument as to whether it is right or wrong is ultimately irrelevant. When you are dependent on someone else for the necessities of life, they essentially own you. If dad says no dressing at home or I will throw you out, you don't dress, as unfair or wrong as it might be. If you are a TS, you may not be able to transition until you are independent from him, again as wrong as it might be.

Over the years I have known of people dependent on others who are in far more horrible situations than this (some were in situations which were truly horrific.)

I can relate to this situation, so I know what I speak of. When I was young and living at home, my father found out about my dressing. I wrongly assumed it gave me a little room to be open about it. I took my favorite red wig out and kept it out in the open on my dresser. I was away one day and I never saw that wig again (he literally burned it.) Be thankful your father isn't nuts or destructive.