Do we need to be forgiven?

[helenr]

My wife mentioned that she was going to an afternoon seminar today on 'Forgiveness'. I will learn more about it later. I am sure all of us could in a sense benefit from anything on this topic, but I sense part of her interest is her ongoing quest in dealing with her transgendered husband!
this lead me to reflect, do we require forgiveness? Are we out of line or errant such that we need to be forgiven--like someone who has committed a crime? I sort of react like this is an insult-I don't think private thinking or behavior that isn't meant to hurt another should be an offense.Naturally, being transgendered to any extent imposes pressure on wives , but it wasn't done 'intentionally' to hurt. how do you friends interpret this topic?

[Veronica Lacey]

Your thoughts may be accurate...yet perhaps your wife is looking to learn to forgive herself as well for any negativity she may feel towards the dressing? Another way for her to cope with something she may not have ever expected.

Just a thought...

[Deborah Jane]

We can't be forgiven for something that is born inside us!

We were born this way, how can it be wrong?

Only society decided that what we are is wrong, we had no choice about it, we were born as we are!!

[Sarah...]

Would you feel the need to forgive your wife for being female? Or your father for being male?

I wouldn't have thought so.

So there is no forgiveness needed for you being you.

Sarah...

[Angie G]

I don't think we need forgiveness I think it's more a need of understanding.
Angie

[Gabrielle Hermosa]

I'm pretty sure that WE are the ones who need to forgive those who have made our lives difficult simply for being who we are.

In saying that, I have a long, long way to go before I can forgive the world for the crap put into my head - how I was taught over and over how wrong it is to be me (a cd).

But forgive me? What exactly do I need forgiveness for? Aside from the things we all do wrong in life, which have nothing to do with cding. I do not require forgiveness for being who I am though. I'm not a bad person. I cause harm to no one. I just want to be allowed to be me. One does not require forgiveness for that.

[Crysten]

Fortunately, I'm not Catholic, therefore, nope, I don't need to be forgiven

Crysten

[TSchapes]

In other words, if I'm driving down the highway, and someone cuts me off, I can curse him/her or I can forgive them. Since they can't hear me curse them, it has no affect on them, but it sure would raise my blood pressure!

If I forgive them, because I have no idea what caused them to cut me off, I am less likely to get all worked up about it, and adjust my own feelings. I can't change their behavior, but if I forgive them, I can surely adjust mine!

This may be a good thing for her and I would not take it personally. Again, it is for her.

Love, Tracy

[TGMarla]

Forgiven? By who? For what?

[Daintre]

Forgiveness for being transgendered, no, absolutely not.

Entering into a marriage and withholding the fact you are a CD, finally telling your SO weeks, months even years later, then yes, you would need to be forgiven. Not for being a CD, but for the lies by omission in not telling your SO. Telling her before marriage would have given her the option to marry or not.

[<3 Keri Lynn <3]

Definition: Forgive #3 - to grant pardon to (a person)

Which can simply means they are apologizing for not being accepting which in essence, others can forgive us for being mean and not being accepting and in the same spectrum WE don't have to forgive for being our self but others can learn to forgive for not understanding.

Might be to wordy but the basic idea is there


*Hugs*Kisses*

[Sheila]

Forgiveness for being transgendered, no, absolutely not.

Entering into a marriage and withholding the fact you are a CD, finally telling your SO weeks, months even years later, then yes, you would need to be forgiven. Not for being a CD, but for the lies by omission in not telling your SO. Telling her before marriage would have given her the option to marry or not.

said better than I could Jenni thankyou

[trannie T]

Jenny Y was absolutely correct, crossdressing in itself is not wrong and there is no need to ask for forgiveness for the simple act of crossdressing. Stealing and lying however, are wrong and we may ask to be forgiven for these offenses.

[Kaz]

Forgiveness for being transgendered, no, absolutely not.

Entering into a marriage and withholding the fact you are a CD, finally telling your SO weeks, months even years later, then yes, you would need to be forgiven. Not for being a CD, but for the lies by omission in not telling your SO. Telling her before marriage would have given her the option to marry or not.

Yeah, that would be a heavy weight to carry I guess...

To be foregiven there has to be guilt... Guilt comes in many forms... we bring it on ourselves, we are given it by those whom we have injured, and then there is everyone else... their opinions, judgements, and their willingness to blame without understanding...

I am often foregiven by those I have injured...

I find it hard to live with what I bring on myself... my wife thinks I am too hard on myself...

Others... now there is a thing... this is what really stops me coming out and being myself... the unforgiving nature of others... who do not know me or who I am...

Kaz xx

[sissystephanie]

My wife mentioned that she was going to an afternoon seminar today on 'Forgiveness'. I will learn more about it later. I am sure all of us could in a sense benefit from anything on this topic, but I sense part of her interest is her ongoing quest in dealing with her transgendered husband!
this lead me to reflect, do we require forgiveness? Are we out of line or errant such that we need to be forgiven--like someone who has committed a crime? I sort of react like this is an insult-I don't think private thinking or behavior that isn't meant to hurt another should be an offense.Naturally, being transgendered to any extent imposes pressure on wives , but it wasn't done 'intentionally' to hurt. how do you friends interpret this topic?

My first question would be, are you truly transgendered? Or do you, like myself, just like to wear women's clothing? If you do want to change your life to that of a woman, without surgery, then you transgendered. If you just like to wear women's clothes you are a CD. Being a CD is NOT being transgendered! If it was, most women would be considered transgendered because of their "manly" clothing.

Now as to "forgiveness." Someone can only forgive you if you have done something to hurt that person in some way. If you have hurt your wife by crossdressing and not being her Man, then maybe she feels you do need forgivness.

I am a practicing Catholic, and have been told by an Archbishop that Crossdressing is not a sin in the eyes of the Catholic Church. And please don't anybody bring up the Bible reference that is frequently used. That is in the Old Testament and is not relevant today. The idea then was that men used womens clothing to get out of military service or to get into the womens section of the Temple. Changing your sex is a sin because you are defiling the body that God gave you.

Helen, if you really love your wife, let her know in no uncertain terms that you are her man first and formost! No matter what you are wearing. I did that with my late wife before we were married and we enjoyed 49+ years together. She was totally supportive!

[Mary Morgan]

We need to be forgiven for our transgressions, not for who God made us to be.

[Karren H]

I didn't do anything wrong so wy do I need to be forgiven???

[christinek]

I am not a religious person, that said. I agree with most above.

If there is a god then he wanted me to be this way. So why should I be ashamed, embarrassed or asking for forgiveness.

I love being Christine and want no part in someone shaming me.

It would be their problem not mine.

[Persephone]

That is in the Old Testament and is not relevant today.

While it may not be relevant to you, Stephanie, a considerable number of people on this planet still hold to the "Old" Testament.

Nonetheless, that particular line in the Bible, Deuteronomy 22:5, may not apply to crossdressers.

[Lisa Golightly]

Everyone who has wandered into my life has had it made clear who and what I am... I didn't apologize then... Just opened their eyes to the ride ahead... Have I any reason to apologize if they wander off... no.

And I'm happy to defile my body in the eyes of the Church... It's always been a abomination to my eye.

[ReineD]

Forgiveness helps the person doing the forgiving more than the forgiven. It is a way for someone to come to terms with whatever happened that caused them unhappiness, stress, or harm certainly if it was intended, but also if it was not. Also, the hardest thing to do sometimes is to forgive oneself for past harm caused to others.

Forgiveness for me leads to acceptance. It involves taking a deep breath, putting things in their proper perspective, and letting go of my expectation that the outcome should have been different. It is a good thing.

Please don't be so hard on yourself or her.

[tricia_uktv]

You what? I'm just being me!

[Adrianna_Sofia]

Hmmm...WWJD?

I think the "forgiveness" that we may seek is actually that of acceptance. I myself am a devout Catholic and at times feel conflicted by my urges to CD and feel guilty after the fact. Cross dressing per se is not, from what I know, a real "sin". The passage that some people cite in the book of Deuteronomy regarding CD whic goes like "a woman shall not wear a man's clothing. a man shall not wear woman's clothing. Both are abominable". But then again this and other rigid laws were given to the Israelites by God because that time the people of God were easily swayed by their own desires. Fast forward centuries later God sent His Son to be the savior of man kind...Most of Jesus' teachings were considered heretical by the scribes because unlike them who are rigid and interpret The Law as is, Jesus gave emphasis to the Spirit of the law...

Some passages worth considering:
"He who is without sin cast the first stone."
"Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven"

So I think that if indeed that your CDing might seem as an offensive act specially for your SO, then by all means ask for forgiveness. And if others are hostile towards you just say a little prayer in your heart and say "I forgive you".

[JoannaCaroline]

While it may not be relevant to you, Stephanie, a considerable number of people on this planet still hold to the "Old" Testament.

Nonetheless, that particular line in the Bible, Deuteronomy 22:5, may not apply to crossdressers.

Persephone, Those who still hold on to the Old testament usually only hold on to very selective parts. Devout Jews may be the exception but the old testament specifically forbids touching and eating pork, and eating shrimp and shellfish. I grew up in a very religious community and they completely ignored these restrictions.

Old testament also gives permission for things like taking slaves, selling your own daughter into slavery, and stoning your neighbors for breaking a few of the old testament rules. Most Christians seem to have conveniently forgotten about these things too.

[JoAnne Wheeler]

I agree with Debra Jane that we should not have to be forgiven for something

that we were born with - I feel so strongly that we are BORN this way - it

would be wonderful being this way IF we did not have to deal with all the hurt

and baggage that comes along with it - I think we are the ones who need to

try to forgive those who hurt us, those who mock us, those who harrass us,

those who harrass us, those who are ignorant about us, those who are

intolerant of us, those who are judgmental about us, those who refuse to

even try to accept us. We are the ones who have been abused. If there

is forgiveness to be given, then it should be by us.

JoAnne Wheeler