Hi all, it has always been a tug of war for most CDs between them and their wives/SOs on whether to dress freely and be who they are or hide their CDing and become frustrated, in that line i wanted to know who are CDs suppose to marry (especially bi-CDs) cos it looks as if there are always marriage issues posted on this forum.
Yes, there are a lot of marriage issues. Many often stem from not being open with full disclosure prior to marriage. Some due to developing CDing tendencies after marriage that again are kept secret.
As for who to marry, I can only speak from experience. My wife knew before we were married, was and still is very supportive. She has helped me a lot and has only one rule. I cannot go out dressed unless I'm completely dressed and made up.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Hi Sosoft-
Well, I am very happily married, my wife assures me of this on a regular basis. We will be celebrating our 26th anniversary this November. Apparently it is her who I was fated to marry and that is pretty much that.
To be serious for a moment, instead of how I usually am, I am a very, very lucky girl. My wife did know about my tendencies before we were married, but at that time it was more a bit of bedroom kinkiness involving lingerie and so on. Just for fun, more or less. As happens to so many of us, though, as time wore on my girlside seemed to begin to assert itself more and more. So finally I came out to her (and somewhat surprisingly, to myself as well) about the true depths of my feelings some seven years ago or so.
Fortunately, she is a very smart and practical woman and understood that my being TG is a fundamental and virtually unchangeable part of who I am. My girlside is me, just as my male side is as well. So she has been supportive and understanding. This is not to say we have not had our issues, we even seperated for a brief period and, in all honesty, if there were some way to make it all go away and give me amnesia for it all, she would do it in a heartbeat. But being TG is not something that just goes away, though you can hide it and stuff it and pretend like crazy.
As to finding someone who is understanding of it, I guess it's just pure luck, more or less. All I can say, from reading about other's relationships and from personal knowledge of what has happened to friends of mine, is to be honest from the beginning. No, you don't have to wear your pink "TGIRL AND PROUD OF IT" t-shirt on your first date, but once you realize that things may be more than just casual you need to climb up on the high dive, pull up your bikini bottoms nice and snug and take the plunge.
Oh, wow. I can ramble on, can't I? Sorry.
Hugs...Joni Mari
"Because equality is not a concept. It's not something we should be striving for. It's a necessity. Equality is like gravity. We need it to stand on this earth as men and women. And the misogyny that is in every culture is not a true part of the human condition. It is life out of balance, and that imbalance is sucking something out of the soul of every man and woman who's confronted with it."
--Joss Whedon, to a reporter who asked, "So why do you create these strong women characters?"
That's simple. Someone they love surely. The problems are caused because of our unacceptance of who we are when were younger. We didn't know any different then and fought it too hard. Many of us felt that meeting someone we loved would magically cure the cd side - only to find out that it didn't. I think we need to accept who we are first before going looking for love. But then thats easier said than done.
I strut my stuff, I feel so proud,
I need to shout, to scream out loud,
I am Tricia I am she,
I am who I want to be
http://tricia-dale.blogspot.com/
Whe I find out that answer I'll let you know....I thought I had the perfect one...but evidently I was wrong...so now I've got to find the anwer to that question all over again!!! Not sure if I will ever try again though....leave it for you younger girls to find out....who are CDs suppose to marry (especially bi-CDs)
Discovering the female self aka "Bitch with an Attitude"
Newsflash, kid. There are "issues" with marriage regardless of how mainstream the couple is. You both go into a relationship carrying some baggage from the past, and it affects how sensitive you are to some subjects.
The trick that seems to be a lost art the past couple of generations is how to deal with those differences in a mature way and keep the marriage intact, even stronger for your differences. You go into it expecting perfection, of COURSE you're going to be disappointed and want to change your mind. Go into it knowing you're both human and both going to make mistakes... and you can be one of the few couples who make it 50, 60 years or more.
But NOOOOOoooooo, now it's all "Ooooh, he snores! I want a divorce!" "She shops too much! I want a divorce!" "There's nothing good on TV! I want a divorce!"
Stupid, shallow, selfish children who should never bloody get married in the first place, they... I'm sorry, what was the question?
[edit: Seriously, no disrespect intended for y'all who have been through a painful divorce after trying like crazy to keep it together. My wrath is purely for the idiots who really do divorce for trivial reasons.]
Amen, brother Ralph. Preach on!
AS one Special CDER marries me in OCT, I wish for the rest of you to also find that special someone
I allow myself to set healthy boundaries ..... to say no to what does not align with my values, to say yes to what does.
Boundaries assist me to remain healthy, honest and living a life that is true to me
Who are CD's suppose to marry?
OK, imagine me saying this in a drag queen voice -
Gurl, a CD is suppose to marry a trah-nny, that would be like totally fierce gurl!
It takes a true Erin to be a pain in the assatar.
[SIZE="3"]Well, you marry the same sort of person you would if you weren't a CDer. The person you love who loves you back.
No matter what goes on in life, you aren't going to like everything your partner does. Why would you want to marry a clone anyhow?
No, the issues on these forums are usually person A wanting to expand/explore while person B wants everything to be exactly the same. Now the cder could be either person A or B, mind you.
Its a matter of one person deciding they can no longer live with and/or accept something about their partner.
CDing seems to be a topic because when you are trying to break up with someone you usually try to pick a fight with them. What better way than about something as sensitive as CDing?[/SIZE]
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
[SIZE="3"]"We're all born naked. Everything we wear is drag," said Boy George
[/SIZE]
It looks as the answers are really far away from our grasp.
Yeah some replies are really nice.........but are CDs stuck with no partners? How many of us can have successful marriages wihout rifts caused by CDing.
This really is a core question, and many of us on this site (most?) are intimately affected by how and whom we might partner with for life.
Speaking from the point of view of a M2F transgendered, there are some clear answers to the question, and then there are some less clear:
Clearly, those women who think that men presenting in the female gender is an abomination and a sin will not make good life partners. It might be an altruistic thing to try to "bring them around", but doing it by marrying them is probably not the best of ideas.
That leaves us with those who are either uninformed/neutral, or those who are educated to realize that a M2F tran is someone who will be very very sensitive to their thoughts/desires and outlooks on life. When you find the latter, you are already in business, but my guess is that the former make up the biggest block, so:
It comes back to being alert to those with whom you come into contact to find intelligent and intellectually curious women who seem to be compatible in general, and then start to discuss transgenderism. When intelligent and mature people start looking at each other's ideas and ideals, this is one topic that tends to be left out, but in our case we don't want to leave it out. Once the discussion is started, it will go forward or not, as will the discussion of any other idea/ideal. This is not the only one that could be a "deal-breaker" but it is certainly an important one to all of us.
In the long run, this is just one of the many issues and personal beliefs that should be discussed before marriage for any two people who understand what marriage is all about.
tina
Unless you are one of the Lucky Few,I am guessing if you want to dress freely you may as well resign yourself to being alone.
Hi Sosoft,Originally Posted by sosoft73
You asked a very relevant question.
I can relate your question to another question I just answered a few days ago in another forum in the course of a more general discussion.
That question was :
. " (...) Does this indicate that crossdressers by and large are actually bisexual, despite their thinking that they are not?"
Then I answered this way :
"We « know » that gender and sexual orientation are « independent » from each other. Therefore I doubt it were promising a hypothesis to link crossdressers to bisexuals and spend much time to check its possible validity.
However I would well hypothetize some transgender people - among those who feel they are simultaneously male and female, without denying to the least extent any of their both genders - can experience being/feeling a straight man when in drab, and a straight woman whenever they are crossdressed and feel like a woman.
For such TGs I’m inclined to believe there might not exist a satisfying (sexual) long-term relationship with any standard GG.
The current choice for them would be to have multiple partners, whether men, women or TGs. Possibly a promising long-term relationship might be the one with another TG just similar to them, able to take the reverse role of either the woman or the man they need, at the moment they would need. If this reverse TG were a born woman being somewhat FTM, then the situation would be quite close to an ideal.
A very accepting, broad-minded, and loving GG can take this dual role, I mean. And can mimick with her TG husband this TG/ reverseTG ideal relationship. Yet a straight GG has to « play a role » to a certain extent – to please her TG partner .
And we know that some GGs have a real talent at simulating. :-) "
I think that regardless of sexuality they should be married to a person that makes them happy, is open-minded and will love them no matter what.
On the other side of the coin, we as cds need to be patient and understanding as well.
It's not an easy road; My wife is accepting and helpful but that doesn't mean we haven't had our share of arguments and crying sessions. Marriage is difficult enough without throwing extra issues in, but EVERYONE has extra issues, not just tgs.
Well said, Jessica.
Hugs...Joni Mari
"Because equality is not a concept. It's not something we should be striving for. It's a necessity. Equality is like gravity. We need it to stand on this earth as men and women. And the misogyny that is in every culture is not a true part of the human condition. It is life out of balance, and that imbalance is sucking something out of the soul of every man and woman who's confronted with it."
--Joss Whedon, to a reporter who asked, "So why do you create these strong women characters?"
[SIZE="3"]Saying "who can crossdressers marry?" is the same as "who can goths marry?" or "who can artists marry?" It doesn't matter your quirk, someone is either going to love and accept you or they aren't. Crossdressing is just another name for your quirk.
I mean, what if you cd AND guzzle beer every night in front of the TV while watching musicals! What if you pick your nose on a daily basis while drinking your morning coffee? What if you make annoying clicking noises while you eat?!
Those are all things someone will or wouldn't put up with. You have as much chances of someone accepting those as you do cding. Why? Because everyone's different. Some people think cding is as "evil" as pink bunnies at Easter. Some people think pink bunnies are Satan's messengers.
To put so much emphasis on only ONE facet of your personality is implying there is NOTHING else about you that could make or break a relationship!
Who should cders date/marry?
Well if you are referring to sexuality, bisexuals seem to fit the bill a great deal better in my opinion.
If you're referring to a social group, goths have the most androgyny.
Now once you find yourself a bisexual goth all you have to do is find THE one and see if they don't mind your other quirks outside of cding.[/SIZE]
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
[SIZE="3"]"We're all born naked. Everything we wear is drag," said Boy George
[/SIZE]
That is the best compromise ever.
Key word "most",not all.
I am definitely one of the "Lucky Few". In fact, the nicer looking lady in the house often surprises me with an item of clothing. It helps that we both wear the same size. :-)
Juliew
Agree with the bulk of this thread (as one who's been out as a CDer to two wives, tho the first didn't pan out...):
1. Wife knows before you get married (i.e., don't "spring" it on her later, etc.)
2. Compromises will be needed, having to "let go" of some of your desires/wants, in exchange for spouses support (i.e., tough, given the "typical" ramping up of femme urges of most of us t-gals: I was fairly thru this stage, and at something of a plateau, as in out, fairly passable, before meeting 2nd wife)
3. True love and compatability is #1, regardless of adding gender issues, making a life together requires a lot of committment & effort.
4. Don't "put all your eggs in a single basket," as in letting someone's support/interest in your dressing, undermine vaious other red flags, etc.
Between my two mariages, I had sorta assumed I'd partner up with another t-gal, but (re. point #4, above) ended feeling there wasn't enough basis to partner up with any t-gal I knew. Its esp. tough dating other t-gals, as there is so much focus on attentions from guys being "needed" to reinforce the TGs sense of femininty, and wanting/needing the fella as a "beard," but being bi, myself, were I in the "spousal hunt" (my which time, same sex marriage ought to finally be legal in CA!), I'd opt for a t-gal as my husband/wife, and then the arguing over who gets to wear the dress, at the wedding, would begin ;-)
In terms of the gap/"gulf" in understanding what drives & motivates a t-gal, logically having someone on the same page, would appeal, and since marriage is typically defined monogamously, the chances/odds of getting one's bisexual needs met thru a single partner, might also be highest, with a t-gal wife/husband (tho tough if one/both are interested in fully transitioning...).
One thing I've noticed in my decades of being an out & about tranny, is that there is no shortage of niche within a niche sorts of behaviors & desires, as to what "floats one's boat," so this diverse, yet, seemingly highly specific filtering/screening aspect, combined with the typically (and so unfortunate) transitory nature of connections with a t-gal, do present daunting obstacles to on-going, long-term, TG romantic partnerships...
Thus, the "Ideal" spouse likely another TG, but, statistically, prolly a supportive GG ends up being both more "findable" and with more overlap in commonalities to give better odds to the connection (and then have to contend with bi urges outside the house??? so, ultimately not as genuine & honest of a marriage, but better than never having found the elusive "ideal?")
cheers,
Paula
I am also one of the "Lucky Few" I was very open from the start and have been happily married for 11 years now. But it has only really been in the last 6 month's that my wife has been gently encouraging me to come "Out" more. In fact she insisted I join this site.
True dat! I keep trying to point out that this is not the wedge issue in unhappy marriages, even when the wife attacks it.
When I do find a mate who'll put up with all my quirks, my wardrobe will probably be about the least of her concerns.
Nadia and many others are recommending other TGs as potential partners while Joni Marie is talking about "pure luck" as a source of salvation for CDs in getting life parners. With same sex marriages being antagonised and issues of "pure luck" proving to be stressful, my prediction that CDs will find it really hard/impossible to get "ideal" partners is being vindicated ......... this brings me to the question .......what did nature plan for us am really getting anxious.
After I transitioned from male to female and became a beautiful, feminine pre-op transwoman, (on estrogen, had facial feminization surgery, breast implants, etc.), I live with a handsome masculine man as his wife.
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