Do you really"pass"?

[Joni Marie Cruz]

Good point, Nicki. And you are right, of course, we should be ourselves as TG people and gain acceptance for who we are, not try to disguise ourselves so perfectly that no one realizes we're even out there. However, I still believe we should strive to do the best we can. Of course anyone can dress, or ideally should be able to, however they want. If someone wants to wear a pink tutu and tights, as someone else mentioned, to go to the local Walmart, then that should be okay.

Speaking for myself and knowing that I will never in a million years completely fool anyone into believing I'm a natal female, I still try, to paraphrase that Army commercial, to be all the girl I can be.

Hugs...Joni Mari

[AKAMichelle]

I know that I don't pass, but then again I don't really care.

I have a friend who I play golf with regularly. She is always dressed when we play golf. The first time we played golf, the guy in the group was suppose to be her husband. See we played with 2 ladies and they just chatted her up. They asked all kinds of personal questions about marriage, kids and menopause. I think those 2 women had no clue.

The next time we played golf, some girl on the golf course asked me if she was my girlfriend. I laughed and said no - we're just good friends.

My oldest son knows that I am a crossdresser and one day at work while I was there I saw my golfing buddy buy a video game from my son. He never once flinced when he said ma'am. He has never brought it up to me about this person being a crossdresser.

There are some that pass, but it takes much more to pass than makeup, hair and the clothes. It is the personality. Women protray certain keys which if emulated correctly does lead to that person being passable.

All you have to do is look at some of the transexual who completely transitioned to see how they can get along in society as women. I think it takes much more practice that most of the weekend warriors are willing to put into passing.

[JenniferR771]

Sure some cds pass. I was shopping and a nicely dressed woman started looking at the same rack of dresses. I shyed away and moved over to shoes. I looked back a few minutes later and noticed she was rather tall, big-boned and overdressed for Goodwill. I got in her line of sight and gave her a big wink. She grinned and winked back and came over to talk with me. She said she suspected me because I was looking at the dresses in drab. She introduced herself. We traded email addys. Met for coffee next week.

[clive]

I don't really think I pass most of the time, but I could if I wanted to. I have before. Personally, I try not to. Not as a way of saying, "Look at me, I'm a crossdresser", but rather as a way of saying "Look at me, I'm an intersex individual". I'll dress in ways that accentuate all of my 'assets', not just my female ones. Kind of a way of saying "#%@$ you" to the guys at the park who will jog in the opposite direction just so they can watch my boobies bounce in my sports bra for a few seconds.

[Sarah...]

I've given up caring. Why? Because everyone I've told or who knows seems to simply accept what I'm telling them about my gender. So that helps me smile, be myself and contribute to society as a valued member.

I don't think it gets any better than that really.

Sarah...

[Miranda-E]

Passing as a woman is incredibly easy. People have trouble passing as their idea of an ideal woman.

[windycissy]

Oh, this is a silly question.

Of course some CDs pass, and no, there isn't a "secret" way in which you can "just tell".

The thing is - you never notice them. Because they pass. They may not be very numerous, and I only make one of them on very rare occasions for ten minutes at a time, but I know at least half a dozen whom the vanilla world would never suspect. And the vanilla world is 94% of the world, who never spend the slightest moment thinking about us transvestites, so why should they go looking for secret clues? They're more interested in shopping for dinner or getting home to watch the big game on TV.

So how do you know whether that person opposite you in the train is a tranny-who-passes? The answer is that they look just like a woman. So if you see a man who looks just like a woman...

Perfectly put...as I've said before, crossdressers fall into a bell-shaped curve, and for those of us lucky enough to be not too tall, not too broad-shouldered, etc. it's very possible to pass convincingly if you dress appropriately, have the makeup down, invest in a quality wig and behave like a confident, happy woman. And yes, it's important to me because the experience of passing through the world as a woman is the ultimate challenge and tons of fun!

[AmandaM]

When I was in my 20's, I was close. But, I'm sure girls could still tell. Now, forget it. But, I also care less now.

[Deborah Jane]

Nope, the only thing i pass is wind

[Misty is Kindafem]

It's been said so many times that it's almost a cliche but it really does come from inside. Confidence is NOT the key factor however. It's comfort and belief.

Gurls will be 100% confident and couldn't give a damn and their posture is straight and their head held high ...and they get read instantly by everyone.

I've been dabbling at this off and on for most of my life and lately (midlife crisis?) I've decided to finally quit the stupid boy act. I met Carla (from Carla's) yesterday and we were talking about me (my favorite subject) for a few minutes and the answer hit me like a ton of bricks.

I was always the sissy or the fag when I was growing up. Picked last for the teams, pushed around etc etc. I even overheard a couple of girls talking about me in the 6th grade once. "He's cute but I don't know" is all I heard because they were walking by the little water fountain cove I was in and to this day that moment stands out in my memory like it's been highlighted.

Growing up in the rural south, all I wanted was to be accepted but instead I spent a LOT of time alone and I'm ashamed to say thought about killing myself more than a few times. Anyway, I'm off the bend here,

The point is, I've spent my WHOLE life trying to act like a man. Everything from my walk, to my voice was subject to ridicule and I was working on it. Even my younger sister used to tease me about sitting, throwing whatever. I absolutely hated the phrase "like a girl" because it always meant somebody was picking on me.

Well now, I'm 39 and I'm all boy. My natural tendencies have been beaten and pushed so deep into my soul that until my meeting with Carla (she has no idea how important that few minutes was) I thought I would spend the second half (um two thirds) of my life trying to undo all of the damage done by a scared, insecure little boy. That time I spent in her salon being called "she" and "her" changed everything.

I do have a lot of work to do, (again) but I realized that in my heart I'm still her. My brain and body have been twisted and distorted but my first impulse is always feminine. I just have to let go. So many of you have a similar story and one of the biggest mistakes we make is to try and "be" feminine. That misguided effort to "be" is what will always give us away. we need to erase the years of conditioning and simply accept and believe that we "are".

I will no longer fight my movements or try to correct a gesture because it never works. I've spent so many years suppressing fem characteristics that I've become a bit of a blackbelt at it. Trying to "be" more fem becomes an awkward comedy of correction and over correction as my finely honed sense of the antifem is locked in mortal combat with the poor little girl inside who just wants some freakin' air.

I've decided to just let it be. Little by little the masculine will wither away from lack of attention and the feminine will grow and thrive in the sunlight until anyone looking at me will have no choice but to see me for who I am. They won't see a struggle so they will accept me as I present.

Will I pass? You better believe it baby.

-Misty

[Sam-antha]

In the dim distant past, when I was so much younger, my reply to the post would be a definite yes in terms of passing. I do have some old photos that I like to think supports the idea.
Nowadays, I am not be so sure about the "always" part of it.
I still think/hope that I can pass in a crowded street. But the people in a crowded street are busy, thinking of the crowded shops et al. I am the last thing that they see in their minds, even if they look straight at me.....

I believe.

However, that being said there is body shape to take into consideration. There are plenty of shapes out there to choose and to see walking around so that is not so important really. Dress likewise, but then one dresses to suit the body.

I like mine

More important is what one does with the body and the face/mouth above it. It is there that most "believers" must sometimes fail.

I repeat, sometimes.

The "unbelievers", well I am not so sure there, but then, if they are "unbelievers" and are out in the street, then "the hundred percent passing" is not on their active horizon.

They are out and that is what matters.

As far as the caring that one is "one hundred per cent", I feel that it is very important to care,

It helps.

That said, it also helps if one does not care, if read, but only in the secondary mode

No doubt I will return and edit/disclaim or whatever, but there are my random thoughts just entered as they occured.

~Samm

[Gabrielle Hermosa]

Good for you, Gabrielle. I applaud you. In some ways I think it's something we should all strive for (probly gonna get slammed for that) even though we may not think we can ever do it. It is what I try to do even though I know I'm not going to make it. Like you said, we should all have goals.

Hugs...Joni Mari

You'll never get slammed by me for saying that. I admit that it is important for me to pass. I think some will say it is not important to them probably because they feel they cannot achieve it so why bother. I think they will say this even though deep down inside, they really would like to pass. I don't to put down anyone who thinks this way, but rather pointing out a common psychological process that applies to many things in life. When one feels they cannot achieve [whatever], they simply say "it's not important" or "I don't care anyway". It's called being human. And no, I am not in any way implying or accusing anyone here of this kind of reaction. I am only pointing out that it exists, it is very common, and it is part of being human.

I don't pass..
At least I think I don't... I do get the weird look once in a while.. or maybe they're like.. "look at that ugly asian girl over there!" >.<

Please don't take this the wrong way, Devonny, but I think ou might be fishing for a compliment to boost your (seemingly) low self-esteem or low opinion of your femme appearance. Having said that, I'll bite.

Based on the only image reference I have of you... I WISH I looked as passable as you! Not only do you look passable in your avatar, you look very attractive as well. To see your avatar image on any other non-cd message forum would be like seeing any attractive gg. I'm not saying that to help out with your low opinion of your image, but rather just stating a fact.

What "ugly Asian girl over there"? I don't see any - that's the truth.

For what it's worth, I've often wished I was Asian. I think Asian women are the most beautiful in the world, and I also think that (more often than not) Asian crossdressers are the most passable.

[AllieSF]

I don't pass completely and accept that fact. Yes, I would love to be able to pass completely and no I will not underdo how I dress so that I can show everybody what a nice CD I am to further the "cause". Actually, I don't have to worry about that based on my first sentence. However, I am very comfortable in most situations when I go out. I am not a reactive person when out. I am pro-active, extroverted and am normally the one who brings someone else sitting at the restaurant, in the store, at the wine bar into our conversations and many times to our table, be they straight, gay, lesbian or whatever. I am a very happy and positive person, except when looking for that elusive close-by parking spot downtown.

Passing to me has a lot of definitions to me. One is completely passing whereby no one knows that the person is anything but a girl or a man (depending on who is doing the crossdressing). That is great and probably would be my dream situation as long as I could look a lot younger. Another is passing to casual observers and being read upon closer inspection. That is me. The last is passing for yourself, whereby you are confident, comfortable and can just be yourself without worrying about what others see or think. That is pretty much me too. I do this for the enjoyment it gives me, and that is a lot. Happy dressing.

[Deedee Dupree]

Hi Arianna, First I'm replying to this one without reading what's been posted so far, then I'll read & see how far off the wall I am.

Today I can pass at a distance, but within a year of coming out I realized that passing, aside from it's practical advantages, didn't matter so much. When I am out in a crowd(i choose the venue carefully) a large part of the satisfaction I get out of crossdressing is being seen by others as a person who is happy being a crossdresser. What you see is what you get. And if someone is curious and would like to chat to that "happy person over there", I am delighted to tell them all about it, satisfying their curiosity, confirming their observations and validating the way I feel.

If I could pass most of the time I don't think I would get much out of being "invisible". For me "invisibility" is an artifact from the dark ages. I put my feminine expresion on the table.

I realize many here may not feel that way.

[Shikyo]

Please don't take this the wrong way, Devonny, but I think ou might be fishing for a compliment to boost your (seemingly) low self-esteem or low opinion of your femme appearance. Having said that, I'll bite.

I don't really think the looks of someone has anything to do with how they think about themselves. We only see ourselves totally differently then other people, we have time to find all the flaws in our own bodies. For others, they most likely won't even see them at all, but as we know they're there it makes us feel ashamed. Especially girls have hard time to accept that they do look good, at least I haven't seen that many girls going around complaining about how good they look, have you?

Of course, there are also people who just seek compliments and other things, but is that so bad in the end? In the end it might be the only thing that cheers them up from their daily life or even helps to get rid of depressions.

Myself, I also think that Devonny looks great.

For what it's worth, I've often wished I was Asian. I think Asian women are the most beautiful in the world, and I also think that (more often than not) Asian crossdressers are the most passable.

Indeed, nothing beats the Asian beauty. I'm also very very jealous to any Asian girls I see (that's why I'm debating with myself if I should be jealous to my wife or not).

[vivianann]

I do not pass and I go out enfemme all the time and I have positive experiences all the time, I wear nice dresses and skirts, I am slightly overdressed but that is my style and it fits my personality, and peaple are accepting of it. I wear very little makeup, and my clothes and hair are conservative. And I behave like a lady because I am dressed like a lady. peaple seem to respond positively to me and it is reasuring to hear positive feedback about my presentation. If we behave in a proper manner and act like ladies peaple will be respectful. I like the fact I do not pass because it gives me an opportunity to educate peaple that we a normal, and that we comes from all walks of life, from very poor to very rich, all professions, and that most of us are married or in a relationship with women. and that crossdressing has nothing to do with our sexual orientation. It is sad and amazing the public perceptions about crossdressing, however when peaple realize we are not freaks or weirdo's, they are our best allies, and they in turn can educate others that we are just normal peaple trying to make it through life.

[Kelsy]

It's been said so many times that it's almost a cliche but it really does come from inside. Confidence is NOT the key factor however. It's comfort and belief.

Gurls will be 100% confident and couldn't give a damn and their posture is straight and their head held high ...and they get read instantly by everyone.

I've been dabbling at this off and on for most of my life and lately (midlife crisis?) I've decided to finally quit the stupid boy act. I met Carla (from Carla's) yesterday and we were talking about me (my favorite subject) for a few minutes and the answer hit me like a ton of bricks.

I was always the sissy or the fag when I was growing up. Picked last for the teams, pushed around etc etc. I even overheard a couple of girls talking about me in the 6th grade once. "He's cute but I don't know" is all I heard because they were walking by the little water fountain cove I was in and to this day that moment stands out in my memory like it's been highlighted.

Growing up in the rural south, all I wanted was to be accepted but instead I spent a LOT of time alone and I'm ashamed to say thought about killing myself more than a few times. Anyway, I'm off the bend here,

The point is, I've spent my WHOLE life trying to act like a man. Everything from my walk, to my voice was subject to ridicule and I was working on it. Even my younger sister used to tease me about sitting, throwing whatever. I absolutely hated the phrase "like a girl" because it always meant somebody was picking on me.

Well now, I'm 39 and I'm all boy. My natural tendencies have been beaten and pushed so deep into my soul that until my meeting with Carla (she has no idea how important that few minutes was) I thought I would spend the second half (um two thirds) of my life trying to undo all of the damage done by a scared, insecure little boy. That time I spent in her salon being called "she" and "her" changed everything.

I do have a lot of work to do, (again) but I realized that in my heart I'm still her. My brain and body have been twisted and distorted but my first impulse is always feminine. I just have to let go. So many of you have a similar story and one of the biggest mistakes we make is to try and "be" feminine. That misguided effort to "be" is what will always give us away. we need to erase the years of conditioning and simply accept and believe that we "are".

I will no longer fight my movements or try to correct a gesture because it never works. I've spent so many years suppressing fem characteristics that I've become a bit of a blackbelt at it. Trying to "be" more fem becomes an awkward comedy of correction and over correction as my finely honed sense of the antifem is locked in mortal combat with the poor little girl inside who just wants some freakin' air.

I've decided to just let it be. Little by little the masculine will wither away from lack of attention and the feminine will grow and thrive in the sunlight until anyone looking at me will have no choice but to see me for who I am. They won't see a struggle so they will accept me as I present.

Will I pass? You better believe it baby.

-Misty

That's really it isn't it Misty!! trying to pass as what!? many of us are female gendered and have just as much diffculty passing as a man as we do passing as a woman!!!

Be the feminine person you are and denigh it no more!! I love your perspective!

Kelsy

[Ruth]

When I started going out I would overdress for the situation and so was frequently 'made'. With experience I blend in better and I would say in public situations I pass most of the time. But remember this, I pass as a rather plain looking middle-aged woman, not the type to get admiring glances from men.
If I tried to 'glam up', which I often do in private, I would, paradoxically, look, to myself, more feminine, but would not pass nearly as well (if at all).
This is a pity, but I enjoy what I've got. I love to be treated as a woman, in the street and in shops. And yes, I can do the voice: I don't have a deep voice anyway, so with a little modulation, and as long as I don't talk too much, it's fine. Smiling a lot is also important (women smile more than men, particularly when interacting).

[Misty is Kindafem]

Thanks Kelsey,

After rereading my post I realized I totally forgot to say what I wanted to say in the first place, which was, I had so much trouble "passing" as a boy that I think it'll be a hell of a lot easier to pass as what has always come natural to me.

I'm such a dork, I started with the header and then got way off on a tangent. I have no idea how you understood me. I guess it was implied but, damn girl you are perceptive.

Remind me to never try to lie to you.

-Misty

[Nicki B]

Passing to me has a lot of definitions to me. One is completely passing whereby no one knows that the person is anything but a girl or a man (depending on who is doing the crossdressing). That is great and probably would be my dream situation as long as I could look a lot younger. Another is passing to casual observers and being read upon closer inspection. That is me. The last is passing for yourself, whereby you are confident, comfortable and can just be yourself without worrying about what others see or think. That is pretty much me too.

Perhaps worth reviving this?


What's obvious from this thread is how much it matters, to so many people...

[tanya1976]

No definately not. As noted here I had a short period of time, say late teens to mid 20s when passing, at least physically anyway, was achievable. However even then my mannerisms would have given me away.
But as I enter my30s, metabolism slowing down, weight gain, heavier hair growth it is not possible, or at least only possible in the most flattering of pictures. Although my legs are still in pretty good shape it's fairly obvious I have the upper body of a male. More so since I started weight training. Luckily it is not my aim to pass as a gg, just a well dressed/ sexy/ interesting/intruiging crossdresser...

[kellycan27]

If, by passing, you mean the world doesn't realise you weren't born female - then how are we ever going to gain any acceptance??? People will just assume we don't exist, if they don't know we are there..

Works for me....The less people who don't realize I wasn't born a genetic female, the better I like it. I want my life to be as vanilla as possible. I think I have paid my dues. it's been a long hard road for me, and I feel like I have arrived for the most part. It's like building your dream house, and finally getting the chance to live in and enjoy it. lol ( just a bit of landscaping left to do).
Kelly

[TJ Tresa]

In all honesty I don't know if I would pass or not. I have had two gay girlfriends tell me that I was hot but that isn't passing in public. My wife tells me I could pass and I have thought about trying to go out. But I am a chicken cluck cluck. Maybe someday if I do that will be around the same time I fell confident enough to post pictures.

[christinek]

I do not think I pass, I would like too. However I am out and happy so I guess that is all that matters for me.

[Nicki B]

Works for me....The less people who don't realize I wasn't born a genetic female, the better I like it.

So which do you think is more important for us, Kelly - passing, or acceptance?