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Thread: Last night on Larry King

  1. #1
    Girl Inside Jeanna's Avatar
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    Last night on Larry King

    Last night my wife and watched Larry King. The subject was based on tg,tv and ts. Very interesting but I almost gave away my secret when I defended the cross dressing Mayor on the show( forgot his name)she asked me "do you want a dress John?" (wanted to say yes)but then she went on to tell me she believed that all cross dressers were doing what they do out of pure fetish. I reacted by saying that women do it all the time what's the beef? I got shot down, burning in flames( Something told me to shut up) and I said you are probably right, for most men who cross dress, it's probably just a fetish and I thought to myself, if she only knew that she is so narrow minded and it will ruin us someday,,,someday soon

  2. #2
    Platinum Member Shelly Preston's Avatar
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    I think you missed a golden opportunity

    You could have explained in a factual way that that was not the case

    Maybe you can mention it if the subject comes up again
    Shelly

    Super Moderator....How to tell your partner......Abbreviations

  3. #3
    Girl Inside Jeanna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shelly Preston View Post
    I think you missed a golden opportunity

    You could have explained in a factual way that that was not the case

    Maybe you can mention it if the subject comes up again
    I agree 100% and I've been thinking about it all day.

  4. #4
    I hate pants Gabrielle Hermosa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanna View Post
    ...I said you are probably right, for most men who cross dress, it's probably just a fetish and I thought to myself, if she only knew that she is so narrow minded and it will ruin us someday,,,someday soon
    Probably best you stood down if the argument was only going to lead to trouble. I've stuck to my guns about (unrelated) things and ended up spending nights on the couch for quite some time as a result. Perhaps if/when there is a time you believe you can converse without getting into an argument about it, you might state your case, and explain why (which doesn't mean you have to out yourself, but rather explain exactly how prejudice is harmful).

    Ironically, this is cd myth #7... which isn't quite ready yet. It would be great if your wife ever found her way to the crossdressing myths some time. Not that she'd ever going looking for them on her own...
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  5. #5
    Girl Inside Jeanna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabrielle Hermosa View Post
    Probably best you stood down if the argument was only going to lead to trouble. I've stuck to my guns about (unrelated) things and ended up spending nights on the couch for quite some time as a result. Perhaps if/when there is a time you believe you can converse without getting into an argument about it, you might state your case, and explain why (which doesn't mean you have to out yourself, but rather explain exactly how prejudice is harmful).

    Ironically, this is cd myth #7... which isn't quite ready yet. It would be great if your wife ever found her way to the crossdressing myths some time. Not that she'd ever going looking for them on her own...
    Exactly how I interpreted the whole ordeal as well. I doubt that she will find her way to the myths on her own too lol

    P.S did I mention that I hate pants too!

  6. #6
    Hi! sherryleigh's Avatar
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    My ex dumped me when she found some photos of me on the computer. Oh well I guess right? Anyway good luck

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    Communicate... With purpose.

    >>>I defended the cross dressing Mayor on the show( forgot his name) she asked me "do you want a dress John?" (wanted to say yes) but then she went on to tell me she believed that all cross dressers were doing what they do out of pure fetish. I reacted by saying that women do it all the time what's the beef? I got shot down, burning in flames... I thought to myself, if she only knew that she is so narrow minded and it will ruin us someday,,,someday soon


    Well, yes, target offered, target acquired, target taken out...

    You defended the mayor? How? What did you say? W-h-y? Where you going somewhere with that effort? Somewhere useful?

    She offered her belief? It's a belief, an opinion, a point of view...

    Sooooo?

    You could have said, "Oh, so, you think some or all of it is a fetish, eh? I think there's a lot of truth to that. I mean, you didn't see anything on the show about collecting, oh, orchids, right? Yeah, could be a lot to that clothing fetish thing. I'm sure some guys are into that aspect of it. Guys are guys, right? Bound to be some guys who get more excited about the clothes on the girl than the girl herself. Why, I bet Victoria's Secret banks 10% of their profit on that kind of thing alone."

    (And, of course, when it comes to clothing fetishes, your wife is probably factually correct to some extent... "Some," but not "all.")

    But, instead you said, "women to do it all the time so where's the beef?"

    Ouch. I can hear the gun sight on the 20mm being cranked right around at you... Too late to run, duck!

    Actually, most women - from birth - more or less just wear what they're assigned to wear, just as most men do. Most women don't seem to attach a lot of thought to that fact, but work with what they are given. Not many are "true" beauties, but they offer what they have plus their time, love, and support to their partners.

    Double ouch. Biting the hand that's sworn to love you...

    I think the beef is with you. If you have something to say, just say it. Why blame her for being narrow-minded when you'd rather fight dishonestly than discuss openly?

    Pick your battles and expect to win some, loose some - as you play to win for both of you. And, make up your mind to be honest about what you think and how you feel. Feelings. Remember that... Anyone can argue facts, but very few can argue with, "feelings."

    Honest feelings...

    And, remember, if you can't say it in a normal tone of voice, it won't be heard that way either.

    Seems like a good time to go back to her and say:

    "You know that conversation we were having about the crossdressors? (Pause) Yeah, right. Uh, look, I was wrong to get mad. No, really, I apologize. Your point of view and your opinions are as important as anyone's, maybe more important, and I need to listen to what you say and respect your right to an opinion more... Oh, sure, you're welcome. Now, the thing is..."

    By the way, if she calls you on something like the dress thing, she's calling you out "as a man." Caving at that moment cuts both ways - a woman usually wants a man strong enough to take a stand - and, in any case, it's hard to get the ground back later. If she asks a question like that again, at least offer an opinion that you, "Might." If she get's a solid, "No" out of you, and that's not the way you felt/feel you just made your life and hers harder if you actually felt/feel like saying, "Yes."

    Just do it.

    Anything is better than a bitter life.

  8. #8
    Silver Member kellycan27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shelly Preston View Post
    I think you missed a golden opportunity

    You could have explained in a factual way that that was not the case

    Maybe you can mention it if the subject comes up again
    Missed a golden opportunity? To what? Walk into a buzz saw? Oh, since you put it that way..I totally accept the fact that men crossdress for reasons other than fetish. And....you seem to know a lot about this. Why is that dear? Er,well, um. .........
    I think you did the right thing by staying quiet. Didn't sound like you wife was very receptive to the idea. Her hackles were already up. I'd much rather read your post as stated than to have read:
    I totally F'ed up last night!
    But then again, it probably would have made for some interesting reading. I love it when people say.. Yeah just do it! You missed your chance. No sweat off their ass...You're gonna be the one that may or may not ( I'am betting on the "may") end up in a bad place.
    Last edited by kellycan27; 07-25-2009 at 08:06 PM.
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  9. #9
    Silver Member linnea's Avatar
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    "I love it when people say.. Yeah just do it! You missed your chance. No sweat off their ass...You're gonna be the one that may or may not ( I'am betting on the "may") end up in a bad place."

    We each have to walk in the shoes we choose. It's hard for anyone else to see the whole picture well enough to categorically say, "Yeah, just do it, etc."
    warmly, Linnea

  10. #10
    Joanie sterling12's Avatar
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    I would imagine that the result is probably going to be; you won't be sharing anything about your femme self with her. Not for a very long time!

    I'm from "The Old School," and my TG Experience is probably quite different from a lot of the younger gurls. Most of the people on here that approximate my age, have kept our secrets for most or all of our lives. My Ex's don't know, my co-workers didn't know. And the people in my family who did know, (My Mother and Sister's) chose not to speak of it with me.

    For the vast majority of us "Older Gals," keeping The Secret was not a choice, it was a necessity. Society, peers, family, they all thought just like your wife....."neurotic fetishist, and no doubt deranged!" Keeping The Secret sucked! But, we had little choice, Society sent all kinds of messages: "play the game...do it in secret, don't bother us with YOUR Problem." Inotherwords, keep your mouth shut.

    I'm sorry you ran into this wall. maybe it will change in the future, maybe it won't. Whatever the outcome, you might well have to do like many of us did in the past. Learn to live YOUR life without understanding and tolerance. If you don't, you will get to venture into the realm of depression, with all the dire consequences it might bring. "Cutting off" The Femme self is just about impossible, a choice may not be available.

    Your only other alternative? In a few days, you could sit her down when you two have some "quiet time" available, and just make a complete explanation. I think I might start the conversation with: "The other night, when you were talking with me about the L.King Show, you really hurt me." "There's something about me you don't know, and we need to talk about it."

    If you choose to do that.....good luck.

    Peace and Love, Joanie

  11. #11
    Girl Inside Jeanna's Avatar
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    Easier said than done!

    I appreciate the solid advice that some of you have given me here. The "just do it" advice will get me divorced quickly and hurt someone I really love. My wife is a very solid person in her beliefs and actions. I know ahead of time what the results are going to be.She is going to be hurt and she is going to go inside her shell. I need to be ready to lose my wife and all that I've worked for as well. In my opinion,there are some people in this forum,that are far too quick to give advice that they wouldn't/haven't taken for themselves.I'm not shooting anyone down here but I feel that we should consider that people have real feelings and our hobby has serious consequences when not executed properly! I'm a whole less confident about approaching my wife with my secret than I was two nights ago but I'll know when the time is right if ever. Jeanna

  12. #12
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    Well Said Linnea

    Quote Originally Posted by linnea View Post
    "I love it when people say.. Yeah just do it! You missed your chance. No sweat off their ass...You're gonna be the one that may or may not ( I'am betting on the "may") end up in a bad place."

    We each have to walk in the shoes we choose. It's hard for anyone else to see the whole picture well enough to categorically say, "Yeah, just do it, etc."
    I took me years to arrive at my present relationship with my wife. (She accepts me with just a few limitations) Each of us know our situation better than anyone and while asking advice is nice, the final decision must rest in our own hands.

  13. #13
    Silver Member Teri Jean's Avatar
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    Smart girl Jenna. Huggs
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  14. #14
    AKA Lexi sometimes_miss's Avatar
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    Without giving yourself away, you could always say that you took a psychology or sex ed class and did a paper on the subject. Then you can expound on all the various theories without subjecting yourself to scrutiny.
    Some causes of crossdressing you've probably never even considered: My TG biography at:http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post1490560
    There's an addendum at post # 82 on that thread, too. It's about a ten minute read.
    Why don't we understand our desire to dress, behave and feel like a girl? Because from childhood, boys are told that the worst possible thing we can be, is a sissy. This feeling is so ingrained into our psyche, that we will suppress any thoughts that connect us to being or wanting to be feminine, even to the point of creating separate personalities to assign those female feelings into.

  15. #15
    I yam what I yam,
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    A Hard and Dangerous road

    Jenna: Blessings on you, lass. You've a very rough road ahead.
    Ultimately, knowing what you know, you alone must decide if your life lived walking that road is worth it or not. There's no easy answer.
    Evidently, as you seem to be saying, your wife is set in her options and beliefs holding them in an unshakable way. Evidently too, you fear losing her.
    You are not in a good place. The double bind exists in your every waking moment. You can attempt to deny your nature at a very high price. You can stand your ground and demand acceptance, (with understanding which would be better than acceptance alone, surely.) The choice is yours.
    Put another way, you can accept (again with understanding bettering the situation) her JUST AS SHE IS. Or, you can work,plan, hope, and try to change her (a virtual impossibility since a person can change themselves, no one else can do it for or to them) by gaining her acceptance (with understanding of course) with the possibility (maybe even probability) of failure. In this case, (working, hoping, and praying for eventual acceptance) you can choose to walk the road laid out before you with all the boulders, cactus, and pot holes you face gracefully just simply making the best of your situation focusing on the POSITIVE things in your marriage and accepting the not so good parts of it as part of the price you have to pay for the positives.
    As you walk, step by step, you face decisions ... endless seeming decisions... Only you can make the choices you face. Only you can decide if the rewards of keeping on the road you face are worth what you have to endure.
    We, the folk on this board, can tell you of our experiences, thoughts, hopes, wishes, desires, goals, and such, but ultimately the decision: "Is it worth it?" has to be ONLY YOURS. Jaye

  16. #16
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    Better is still better, if not best.

    I have to agree with SometimesMisss that you really should make efforts, even small efforts, to talk with your wife about this topic of interest to you. Just do it, and do it in steps bigger than you seem to be willing to make - so long as you are stifled with your worries about, "all you've worked for."

    Forget the "stuff." Stuff is just stuff.

    Time, you and she will never get any more of...

    Do not live your life in bitterness and resentful silence... Or, have her live hers that way by your omissions.

    Let the chips fall where they may in hopes that both of you will eventually live better lives.

    Better, not bitter, lives.

    Understand that I am not giving advice in my post, I am sharing hard-learned experience of how people expect to be treated in relationships - especially their very own and very special personal marriage relationship.

    Your interest in crossdressing is not a hobby as you currently conduct your life. It has very little healthy recreational value and is a destructive presence in your life so long as it is a "secret" that could destroy your marriage and, "all you've worked for." Even you are aware of that or you'd not be arguing with your wife with your personal agenda hidden from her.

    There are many who will contend that you and your wife do not have a "real" marriage and what may end your unreal marriage is her being able to say, "I don't know who you are at all!" AFTER this comes to light someday or night without your having done anything to hint or prepare her for this - other than snipe at her opinions and beliefs from your concealed position.

    My friend, this is not a personal attack and my words are not directed exclusively at you. In the past twenty years I have been very concerned that the problem with most crossdressers I've met is that they continue to live their lives in fear and loathing long after they are adults.

    You're a crossdresser - not an ax murderer. As an adult, you are certainly entitled to your hobbies and past-times. But, you're not entitled to things that consume time and resources secretly from your marriage. Find a way to get used to discussing issues honestly and laying out how you think people should be able to live and how you, like anyone, should be able to do the same.

    Thank you for your post. Thank you for considering my experience. And, best of luck to you and the people you love.

    PS

    My SO listened as I proofread this aloud and wanted me - sat and "helped" me - to correct all the spelling before I pushed "send." She knows I'd spell check it anyway, but I let her direct me because it pleases her to be helpful. And, yeah, I might have forgotten to check and I would have had to go back to edit things. So, OK.

    But, she's an example of what can happen if you do things right. She considered my crossdressing concerns, when I brought them up, and decided, "The relationship is worth it." And, she's never said anything about how I look crossdressed, other than to suggest different shoes, or, a different belt. She does look on in amazement, sometimes, as I select earrings, or, just play at getting the look I had in mind by trading parts of outfits around. (As if "men" couldn't figure some things out...)

    She is the fourth SO I have lived and worked with as a crossdresser in my life. (Being older, I have been around the track more times...) Crossdressing has never been a major negative in any of these long-term relationships. I, on the other hand, have been a problem as they resented me not just talking to them about things I felt like I wanted, or, needed to do.

    You and your wife, like many, may not be able to work with this facet of yours happily. But, it can be done. If not in your current relationship, then in another. In the long run, there is no harm in trying, and trying again. There is, however, great harm in doing too little, or, doing nothing. If you both do your best, then you can both wind up happier somehow.

    If you want to put this in marriage terms - which you might - these issues and concerns do perhaps fall under the, "for better or for worse and in sickness and in health" clauses. Is this better or worse to bring out? And, is this a healthy thing to conceal, healthier to reveal, or.. What...? You two owe it to each other under the marraige contract to at least discuss this and try to work something out. It's about both of you, not you OR her so long as you live together in a marriage, any marriage.

    Why does, "No pain, no gain" only apply to sports? It doesn't. It can apply to many things. Although, "Less pain, more gain" seems to work even better over the long haul.

    I'd rather, for example, have my SO correct my spelling in my post, than have her wonder, "What the heck is he doing in there on the computer for so long?" - while I feel like I have to hide every breath I take from her...

    I've lived both ways, my friend, and this is better.

  17. #17
    Chelsea Von Chastity gender_blender's Avatar
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    Always counter sarcastic anti-transgender attitude/remarks such as "What are you, a crossdresser or something?" with a proud and outspoken "Yes!"

  18. #18
    Member Ralph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sometimes_miss View Post
    Without giving yourself away, you could always say that you took a psychology or sex ed class and did a paper on the subject. Then you can expound on all the various theories without subjecting yourself to scrutiny.
    So, you advocate that the OP lie to his wife? Good plan. That never introduces trust issues and other negative consequences into the relationship.

    I would have used the opportunity to be more open with my wife, but that's easy for me to say since I was upfront with her before we got married. The longer you keep it hidden, the more it's going to blow up in your face when -- not if -- she finds out on her own.

    There's still time! Bring that episode up again when the two of you are just sitting around talking. Read over other threads on "how to tell your wife".

  19. #19
    Loving Life Dressing Jill's Avatar
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    How many times good things have been shot down by narrow minded actions. You did the right thing by not getting into a 15 round fight.

    It is a good starting point to start her looking at that hatred that lives within her.

    Take it slow and if you truely love her and she loves you it can grow into something really beautiful.
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  20. #20
    Platinum Member Shelly Preston's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by linnea View Post
    "I love it when people say.. Yeah just do it! You missed your chance. No sweat off their ass...You're gonna be the one that may or may not ( I'am betting on the "may") end up in a bad place."

    We each have to walk in the shoes we choose. It's hard for anyone else to see the whole picture well enough to categorically say, "Yeah, just do it, etc."
    I did say discuss the factual aspects

    There are so many documentaries around the subject now it hard to miss them all that gives a lot of information which is able to be used. All of it need not be mentioned just a few facts

    I did not say suddenly confess to being a crossdresser

    Oh and I have been in exactly the same position so I know its not easy
    Shelly

    Super Moderator....How to tell your partner......Abbreviations

  21. #21
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    Jeanna,

    There is no easy way to tell her but doing after watching a show that she doesn't agree with is probably not the best time---so I'm glad you refrained from telling her.

    You have to eventually listen to your heart. What matters more to you. What are you willing to hide. I am a firm believer in telling our SOs and I wish I'd told mine before we were married. I didn't and it was very difficult but she at least understands and accepts but really doesn't participate.

    I told her when I had reached the end of my ope and she understood the pain. All of our SOs are different but I'm glad my SO knows.

  22. #22
    Girl Inside Jeanna's Avatar
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    Thank you

    I thank all of you for your input. I will face my truth with her when the time is right.Getting her to accept cd-ing will be like getting a redneck to accept being gay. It's only clothes and female expression she will be faced with and not the end of the world.
    Jeanna

  23. #23
    Aspiring Member Blaire's Avatar
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    Only you know the exact details of your situation.

    There is no point in getting in the ring after the opening bell has been rung, nothing good can possibly come of it.

    On the bright side, the seeds are planted. A little TLC and the right amounts of feeding could yield an unexpectedly good harvest.
    Life is simple math: Expectations - Realisations = Disappointments.
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  24. #24
    Senior Member Sarah_GG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanna View Post
    if she only knew that she is so narrow minded and it will ruin us someday,,,someday soon
    Didn't you know this before you married her?

    Communication is the key. You have a secret. Secrets cause problems in relationships. But you seem to have accepted that it will signal the end of your relationship at some point.

    You did miss an excellent opportunity to put your views forward on the subject, regardless of whether you decided to out yourself at that particular point.

  25. #25
    Closet crossdresser Gerard's Avatar
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    You know her best. All the advice here is nice and dandy, but in the end you are you and you'll have to handle it the way you handle it.

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