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Thread: Straight guys and transsexual women...

  1. #1
    Member KaraChristine's Avatar
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    Straight guys and transsexual women...

    This may be a stupid question or have been beaten to death, but it's something that comes up for me over and over since the transition. Why does it seem like so many straight guys have such a hangup about dating post op transgender women?

    I've always been attracted to men physically, and at the same time always known I was female, despite the shape of my genitals at birth. Now that I'm post op, I find myself wondering why so many straight-identified guys have such a problem with transgender women.

    I look in the mirror and see a person with 36D breasts and a vagina. If a guy was gay, he wouldn't be interested in this female person - so why do straight guys so often freak out when they find out that this female has a trans history?

    I'm asking specifically because I have been in this situation a lot lately. When I meet guys or they contact me online they are interested and complimentary at first ("you're so hot and beautiful baby") then very often when I tell them I'm trans or when they read my online profile then I get, "Oh sorry, saw that you're transgender, no offense but I'm straight." I'm dating someone and I don't need or want their validation, but why go out of your way to inform me that you don't consider dating me to be a heterosexual activity??

    I feel like saying why would a gay guy be attracted to someone like me?:



    wouldn't they rather be attracted to someone who looks like this?:



    I know that a lot of the trans women on this forum identified as "straight men" pre-transition so maybe you all might have more perspective on this issue that perplexes me.
    Last edited by KaraChristine; 12-18-2009 at 03:36 PM. Reason: altered myspace reference

  2. #2
    I Love to be fem
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    Kara, well I for one would love to date you, if you were free, you are a very attractive girl, I have no problems in dating a post op transgender, if I was attracted to her, as I would a natural born girl. I add however, I would not date a man, and class myself a straight, and as you say you are in every way a female.

  3. #3
    Senior Member joannemarie barker's Avatar
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    i would find you very dateable although i'm not best placed to give an opinion cos i would date some of the girls here regardless of whats in their underwear

  4. #4
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    They are afraid of feeling gay (they are homophobic) and have a hard time seeing transsexual women as women.

    An ex-friend implored me the other to tell men that I was trans after my surgery, so they would not be tricked into having sex with a man. That was one of the most underhanding dismissal of my gender identity that I ever faced. I was deeply hurt. Regardless how well I passed or feminine I was, in his eyes, it was very important that everyone know my status to stay clear of me. He also said that only gay men would be interested in me, which is very perplexing as you pointed out.

    I met a nice man a while ago who did not know that I was trans. When he found out, he was taken aback, but he eventually came around to it. If I had my surgery, I am not sure I would tell everyone. Probably only the ones I cared about and with whom I wanted to have a relationship.
    Last edited by Frances; 12-31-2009 at 06:12 PM.
    It's Frances with an E, like Frances Farmer. Francis is a man's name.

  5. #5
    Member Katelyn's Avatar
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    I have to agree with Caroline. they don't care about our minds being female or what we do to our bodies to look attractive. In their minds they believe that if we're not born naturally with female genetalia, we are not women and that thought disgusts them. Also, I think most people believe that we are gay men who can't accept that fact so we become women to be with a man. No matter what it may be, it's nearly impossible to change the mind of someone who is closed minded.

  6. #6
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    Hi Kara,
    I think it's admirable that you tell guys that you are trans, but I don't think that needs to be the first thing out of your mouth. You are a very attractive woman and should be able to enjoy the company of men,should you choose to,without giving your complete history the moment you meet someone. If you hit it off and wish to have a relationship then that might be a more appropriate time. You should be free to enjoy many casual relationships without full disclosure.

  7. #7
    Ice queen Lorileah's Avatar
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    My guess was the men aren't the brightest light in the string (had to throw in a holiday reference).

    Do you have some sort of full discloser sheet that you hand out when you meet guys? Can't imagine that when you are out guys look at you and say...yep..it's a dude. You know everything you have now is all custom made female. But should you tell them right away? I wouldn't (and thus I have now joined the ranks of the TG's here who say it is better to keep it a secret..in this case I agree).

    When most guys hear the word transsexual they jump immediately to that last inane teen movie they saw where the guy was all hot and into it only to find that the "girl" had extra parts (insert thousands of immature pubescent boys laughing hysterically in the theater because they KNEW all along). So when (if) you come clean early these now (supposedly) mature guys flash on the "I'm not gay" sign.
    Like I said, 10 watt thinking. So my thought is, don't tell until it is time to tell. If he dumps you after several dates because of this irrational fear, he wasn't for you to start with.

    You are a very lovely woman, you will find someone I am sure and he will be the knight on a white charger you are looking for.

    The earth is the mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it.
    Chief Joseph
    Nez Perce



    “Love isn't a state of perfect caring. It is an active noun like struggle. To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.” - Fred Rogers,

  8. #8
    composed yet compelled Emily01's Avatar
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    just crap they've deposited between their ears where ego lives side-by-side with inferiority complex.......you know years ago i was in a gay nightclub with some guys and gals having a wonderful disco-fever night and i noticed a gorgeous woman sitting off by herself having a drink. i approached her and asked if she would like to dance.......when she replied "no thanks".....well, let's just say she's probably a member here or somewhere like this. i left her to her devices but i will always regret not pursuing the issue and making her comfortable with the idea and perhaps having made a CD friend for the first time. it was my loss and so it is for the guys who's ego's force them to R-U-N-N O-F-T!

  9. #9
    Kim's girl Faith_G's Avatar
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    It's one of two reasons: Either they don't understand that you ARE a woman in every sense, which makes them think dating you makes them gay. Or they are afraid other people will think they are gay.

    So they are either ignorant or cowardly, and either way they are not worthy of you.

    Keep your head up and be proud of being a woman with no adjectives in front. Once YOU decide that a guy is worth keeping around, then you should tell him and see what happens. Don't tell him in a quiet secluded spot where you can't escape or defend yourself - too many women have been beaten to death already.

    That's my eventual plan anyway. I hope I look half as good as you when that time comes.
    "Impossible" is not a word, it's just a reason for someone not to try. Kutless - What Faith Can Do
    Quote Originally Posted by My sister Lilli
    Yes, your happy shows - you practically have unicorns and starbursts flying out of you.
    Physically female!

  10. #10
    Silver Member kellycan27's Avatar
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    Don't give up hope, there are open minded guys out there. I am pre-op and engaged to the most wonderful "straight" guy in the world. It took him a while to get his head around what I was and what I was going through. He loves the person, not what's between my legs.

    Kelly

    We aren't planning on getting married until after I have had my SRS, but more by happenstance than design. it's not a prerequisite for either of us, but I would ike to wait just the same.
    "one day I'll fly away..... leave all this to yesterday"

    http://youtu.be/kR7NlgwVHHg

  11. #11
    Gold Member sherri52's Avatar
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    This is why cd's have trouble as well. "Straight men" as the public percieves tham are very narrow minded. They do not like anything out of the normal. If you can't find a man where you live Kara, Give me a call. I'm 57 and i am a crossdresser, if you can deal with that.
    Put a little lipstick on you'll feel better

  12. #12
    Just an everyday girl Karen564's Avatar
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    Kara,

    I agree with Kel, and she has a Great guy, and there's more of them somewhere, where, I don't have a clue, but they are..and I'm still trying to get her to share him with me, but she ain't going for that for some reason..LOL

    I know what you mean, I've had the same experience, they come on hot to trot, I can tell they don't know about me, so I tell them...I think it puts them into Shock or something....then thats usually the last I hear from them, but they are always very nice about it, well at least so far they have..but they are typical males I guess, all they see is the pictures of me, but don't bother to read my profile info about myself, which I spell it all out there plain as day...I cant be any more open or clear about it...
    In up close encounters, I do tell them, especialy since I'm not postop yet, just don't want them freaking out by any surprises..

    But I think I will still tell them before any intimacy even when I am postop, just that I feel obligated to tell them just so they know who I am & what I'm all about, I want them to like me for being me, not some illusion, and put my cards on the table right away, and give them that choice to stay or walk by their own free will, otherwise I just would feel like I'm lying & dirty, and that doesn't sit well with me, and would feel terrible about it after if I did...I figured I did enough lying to myself & everyone around me all my life by not telling them what I really was inside, so I don't want to fall into that lying trap again like before...but I really cant say for sure until I cross that bridge until I am postop.. so we'll see, but I don't think I'll change that much, my body may change some more, but I'll still me inside..cant change that, nor do I ever want to, I'm happy being a nice girl..but I do want to be a little naughty too...lol


    My latest encounter was with a guy from Australia, but I didn't know where he was from at the time, he was just a straight8 guy, not a cder or anyting like that, so he started up a chat with me late one night on facebook, actually, I had added him as a friend before, but didn't remember that at the time either, so he comes onto me like no tomorrow, he got very sexual after 5 minutes of chatting, he said he was looking for a good woman like me to settle down with, and asked if I was dating or in a relationship, I told him I wasn't involved & single, but had 2 teenage daughters in my life to take care of............I think he wanted to do me right there on the spot....lol, then I could tell by the way he was talking that he didn't know about me being TS...so I asked him about how he feels about man made P...sy......and then the pause................ then he came back, but he still didn't really get what I was saying, and then it got to the point where I had to spell it out to him.....he came back with , you mean your TS??, & I'm like huh huh......and he's says, No Way!!, he didn't believe me, and I'm like, why would I lie about that!!!, then another long pause.................then he says he's a straight guy, and only like the real thing, so I told him that the ops are so good now that he wouldn't be able to tell the difference even with the lights on....lol
    He's like really???. and I said yeah, really!!!, and you may like it even better...since you told me you like it tight....lol
    then more, bla bla bla.....
    Anyway, our conversation lasted for over 2hrs talking about it...I told him I cant wait and have lots of time to make up for....lol, then he ask if I would wear stockings & stilettos in bed for him during the act, and I said, whatever my man wants, I will be glad to please him in every way & be more woman than he can handle....He said he likes that a lot..and me, So looks like I have a date if I ever go to Alstrailia!!!.....lol by the time we were done, think I converted him over ....
    Anyway, thats the very short version....
    I told Kellycan about this one, we both enjoyed it...right Kel?....lol

    Point being, they are out there!!!, but would be nice if they where a little closer to home......lol
    Last edited by Karen564; 12-18-2009 at 07:59 PM.
    [SIZE=3]Karen[/SIZE]

    [SIZE=2]I really do have the...Right To Be Wrong.. [/SIZE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkSTG...eature=channel [SIZE=2]and my mistakes will make me strong![/SIZE]

    [SIZE=2]Just call out my name...and I'll come running...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SxTo...eature=related just lovin classic JT again...[/SIZE]

  13. #13
    Isn't Life Grand? AllieSF's Avatar
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    I think that some people might want to be associated with someone, however their being on or over the edge of the typical "normal" male or female persona scares them away. They think that now they have to not only deal with the usual relationship issues, but also the "what will others think if and when they find out" issues. It is the fear of other's opinions that prevents them from doing what they really want to do. It has happened and probably still happens with interracial marriages, gay relationships with straight people (non-amorous ones), inter-cultural and inter-religious marriages/relationships, and any other types where other's peer pressure overrides just being and doing what one thinks is best. Unfortunately, just like us trying to come out and be accepted, these potential partners find out that they also need to go through a similar situation. I think you can see that from some of the comments on this forum where SO's, family and friends are afraid what others may think when they find out that their partner, friend or loved one is something else than they originally perceived or they had known, not how much they really care for the person.

    It is tough out there and as Kelly has said, they are out there, but just harder to find. Good luck. I may need that same luck someday (I HOPE!).

  14. #14
    Meberette Hope's Avatar
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    It's homophobia, and an uneasy awareness of their own homoerotic tendencies, that they try very hard to keep under wraps. They are afraid that if they are attracted to a girl who used to be a guy, that it will be the first step in the homosexual reeducation camp... and they know (though they will never admit) that they sort of like the look of guys in the shower all ready ... but it is wrong, so wrong... and so, they have to come up with some sort of pretext for you, and probably for themselves as well, that will justify their rejection of you. It's BS.

    Just be glad these self-loathing fire hazards are self identifying - it makes it easier to avoid them!
    "I don't mind living in a man's world, as long as I can be a woman in it." — Marilyn Monroe

  15. #15
    the inner beauty waiting kym's Avatar
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    honestly, if we were to meet and both of us were single, i would not care what you used to be i would however love to show you off to any one and every one. Most men are preprogrammed to think "one a guy always a guy" which is sad if you ask me.
    when in doubt, dress

  16. #16
    Aspiring Member dilane's Avatar
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    I can attest that they're out there -- nice, typically masculine guys who have no problem being with a T-girl, or who, after a little thinking come around.

    However, it's a minority of guys who are like that.

    I remember one guy asked me out after chatting me up for awhile, and I told him I was a TS, and he stopped cold for a second, then said "You know, I think I could deal with that", then gave me his number (which I didn't call since I don't mess around on the side). As I left, he said "Can I give you a hug?" I indulged him...

    -- Diane

  17. #17
    Senior Member Aubrey Green's Avatar
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    Gotta believe it is strictly in the head. I am sure you have no trouble getting dates and things go great until it comes up. Just a mind "roadblock", had the situation not come up for say 5 or 6 dates, he may begin to know you enough to be over that issue or at a point of discussing it. Geez, give me a call, I'd take you out, no problem!


    And as for you Kellycan, That is great news, I am so happy for you. I thought something was up, when you signature changed from boyfriend to fiancee. BIG HUG for you.
    NOT your girl next door!

  18. #18
    Silver Member Barbara Dugan's Avatar
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    I think is fear pure and simple fear...you are an atractive woman you will find someone worthy of you soon.

  19. #19
    Silver Member Starling's Avatar
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    The "one for you" may not be what you expected, and the same goes the other way. To quote a song that was already old when I was young, It's a big, wide, wonderful world we live in!

    Nobody knows love like someone who has unpinned it from the Simplicity pattern.

    Lallie

    PS: Please excuse me, but I'm in a euphoric mood tonight!
    Last edited by Starling; 12-20-2009 at 04:52 AM. Reason: to correct the lyric
    Time for a change.

  20. #20
    Silver Member Teri Jean's Avatar
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    Kara I have no clue how they can have such a distorted sense of sexuality. I find your picture very appealing and although I am transitioning, I'm attracted to women. You are every bit woman, blushing, so don't worry.

    Huggs Teri

  21. #21
    Senior Member Melissa A.'s Avatar
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    Yep, It's homophobia. For most guys, it's not just the idea that a transsexual "used to be male", but that anyone will even KNOW that they are dating someone that could even remotely label them as potentially, possibley, maybe, almost, could be, gay. Heck, most don't even know the difference between homophobia and transphobia, or that transsexuality really has nothing to do with actual sex. It's all the same thing to them, one big fagfest. To those not familar with anything about us, all the information they get is from the mass media. Not just the news but entertainment in the form of television and film, which typically portrays us as lovable but pathetic wretches(unpassable), decieving, seducing witches(passable), sex workers, or people who live on the fringes of society, in some alien, underground culture. We are he-shes, ********, its, things-The ease with which those words roll off of people's tongues, even many of those who ought to know and behave better, is a sign of, even with the tremendous strides in the last decade or so, of how far our culture still has to go.

    As someone who is still pre-op, and certainly not 100% passable, the ethical challenge of to tell or not to tell, and when, isn't an issue for me. The men I date(not an every weekend occurance!!!) at least know and either don't care, or prefer a woman like myself. Of course, in my case, I do have to weed out the tranny chasers looking for "the best of both worlds" (ugh!). I do make it immediately clear that I am not a "chick with a d*ck", and if that is what they are looking for, to please move on. I long ago stopped asking men why they want to date me. We whine and complain about transphobia in our culture, but many of us are guilty of it. For me to ask myself why a nice, attractive man is with me when he could be with a GG, is transphobia, directed at myself.

    My biggest problem is finding guys, period. Of course, it doesn't help that genius Melissa spends the majority of her out socializing time in a predominantly lesbian bar! (yeah, I know, not too bright, but it's where alot of my friends are, and I like it there!

    I was talking to someone about love and romance recently, and she asked me if I prefer straight or gay guys. I just stared at her incredulously for a few seconds. This is someone who you would think would know better. But it just goes to show you that even in proggressive, open minded, accepting circles, and also very often even in the gay community, myths, misunderstandings and distortions about us are often the norm. So anyway, I didnt say a word to her for many seconds. Finally, she goes, "What??" I waited even a few more seconds and said, "Sweetie, think about who I am, and what you just said. What in the world would I do with a gay man?" She stared at me blankly for a second until the light bulb finally went on. This is what we deal with, even from our allies. Oh well.

    Hugs,

    Melissa

    P.S.- Way back in my male days, I used to think the line-"all the great guys are either married or gay"-was just one of those things people say. Omg, It's not.
    Last edited by Melissa A.; 12-19-2009 at 12:01 PM.

  22. #22
    Silver Member kellycan27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melissa A. View Post
    As someone who is still pre-op, and certainly not 100% passable, the ethical challenge of to tell or not to tell, and when, isn't an issue for me. The men I date(not an every weekend occurance!!!) at least know and either don't care, or prefer a woman like myself.
    When I was dating, if someone asked me out, and I was interested I always told them first thing....before the first date. Who needs the drama? If they were cool with it.....good, if not....next!

    Kel
    "one day I'll fly away..... leave all this to yesterday"

    http://youtu.be/kR7NlgwVHHg

  23. #23
    Silver Member Teri Jean's Avatar
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    Kelly I have adopted the same approach and have had some very interesting conversations with some amazing ladies. No takers as yet and have not had any interested men either. There is time and after being married for 35yrs there is not rush to get that involved as yet.

    Teri

  24. #24
    Junior Member Tiffany6791's Avatar
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    Oh forget them, they might have missed on the best thing that could have happened to them but I know what your talking about though. I would date you.

  25. #25
    Silver Member Starling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kellycan27 View Post
    ...I always told them first thing...If they were cool with it.....good, if not....next!
    Kel
    That's the magic of commitment!

    Lallie
    Time for a change.

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