Hows your social/love life?

[Ashley S]

Wow, I can relate to a lot of what's been said here.

I'm recently single. Made a tough decision (mutually), about two months ago, to break up with my SO of 6 years, because we feel we want different lives.

I work a lot, so little socializing happens during the week, but most of my acquaintances are through work as well, with few having similar interests to mine, so I tend to just stay home on weekends.

I've been trying to establish how much I want crossdressing to be a part of my life, and battling depression at the same time. So it's a bad time for me, because I'm low on confidence, and worried that I'm not in a good enough head-space to be able to make new friends. Most days I'm able to play off a care-free outlook, but some days can just crush you, you know?

Short answer: No love life (not looking anyway), almost no social life, but trying to improve that...we'll see what happens.

PS. This thread makes me sad. Everyone get's a hug

[CourtneyBleu]

non existant

[Babeba]

Here's how I figure it, as the GG SO of a CDer who found out right away about the dressing: it's not down to the crossdressing to make us accept or reject our partners, it's about respect, chemistry, personality, etc. Most of us GGs haven't really given a lot of thought to crossdressing or trans issues, because we've never gone through them - maybe we have negative stereotypes, and maybe we don't. What we CAN and DO make our impressions about you on is the way you present yourself to the world.The more you accept and love yourself and become confident in who you are, the more that shines through in your personality. That's what is attractive - and that goes for friendship as well as dating.


Also, CherryZips makes a good point: if you want to have friends, it takes time and real effort to meet them and make them!

[Andrea Reynolds]

Lets see. Social life. I work retail and my social life became extinct about 4 years ago. Love life- Wife and I have been together 35 years now. No, wait. 36 years now. Wait. It's been a long time. Since she knows about my dressing there are no problems, however, dhe is just tolerant of it, which is good enough for me. Andrea.

[BRANDYJ]

I have read every single post and find it depressing. My heart goes out to all of you that feel that you will never find an accepting GG to love and love you in return. As Babeba so beautifully put it, you have to make an effort. I see a lot of low self esteem here. I see many that think no woman will or can accept you since you have this feminine side about you. If you only knew how very wrong you are! Read the posts and you will see many of us have found a loving, accepting woman as a partner. It's knowing how to go about it that you lack. Someone said they don't believe there is someone for everyone. Wrong again! Ther eis IF get over your esteem issues, feel good about yourself and stop thinking like a CD and start thinking like a male. You have to make an effort. it does not come easy, but there is hope if you want it.
I have bene married 3 times. The only wife that never knew I was a CD was my first wife. But hell, I did not know what I was back then either. For the most part my being a CD was buried and I was not actively dressing, My second wife was the very first person I ever told. In a short time, she gre to accept it, understand it and even have fun with it. She died in 1984 after 10 good years together. Then came my third wife. I told her before we were married. Her reaction was "so what" It did not upset her or cause an issue in our lives. She too had fun with it. After 18 years together we divorced. But it had nothing to do with cross dressing. We had other issues. Today we are friends.
My present SO knew from day one that I was a CD since we met at a website for those that are into D/s or BDSM. It's called collarme.com. I had pictures of both my male and fem self in my profile. I was open and honest about what I was looking for. She wrote to me and that started our long distance relationship. I'm in Florida and she was in Michigan. We have been together for over 4 years now. Unfortunately, she had to move back to Michigan to take full guardianship of 3 grandchildren, so it's back to long distance until the state will allow her to move back to Florida. For now, I fly there as often as I can ( darn Spirit Airline strike)

My point is this. I found not only one, but three women that accepted my being a crossdresser. However in each case other then my present relationship, they got to know me, the man, the person first. So man up and go find a woman to date and get to know. You will know when it is proper to tel her more about yourself once the chemistry suggests that their might be a future with her. In the mean time, get to know her, how she feels about alternate lifestyles. Her view on gays, religion and such will give you a clue as to how she may accept your being a CD. Stop letting cross dressing be an excuse and reason you are alone.

There are a few good an totally FREE dating sites. You don't have to pay any money to meet others on-line. Go to POF.COM or DATEHOOKUP.COM. Put a profile of yourself there complete wiht pictures of just your male self. Tell the women that are looking a little about your likes and job, your values and the fun things you like to do. Be positive, do not include anything negative. That is simply not attractive. Get involved with there forums and be seen.

From these two sites I mentioned, I have found some really good friends. The only reason I am there now. Of all the women that I am friends with, I have told 6-7 of them that I am a CD. Guess what? It made no difference to them at all. In fact, it drew us closer as friends. BUT they knew so much more about me, before I trusted them enough to tell them about my other side. I know I could date several of them if I was available.
They have expressed that they would date me and see me in a romantic way if I was not attached.
I have even met 2 women at one of these sites that is dating a CD. So stop the excuses, put your crossdressing issues aside and spend a little time in finding the one that's right for you. It is possible and will happen if you want it and make an effort.

I sincerely hope this positive post helps some of you. So much negative posts in this thread. It needed the truth and another point of view. Good luck to all of you in finding what I have found.

[LisaTaylor]

I was married for 7 years, got divorced in 1998. I've had a few girlfriends since then, nothing lasting longer than 2 years. Interestingly enough, while all of them knew about my femme side, none of the relationships ended as a result of it (so far as I know), and all ended on friendly terms.

My last relationship ended in late 2007, and I've been on my own since. To be honest, I rather like it that way. The benefits of being with someone never really outweighed the negatives for me. I no longer have to constantly cater to another person's demands, tip-toe through the minefield of their ego worrying about saying the wrong thing, and/or carrying another's financial weight. Best of all, I no longer have to worry about how to tell someone about my femme side - or worry about doing it too often or going too far.

I do have friends that I hang out with occasionally, but most of them don't know about Lisa. It isn't that I think they'd shut me out for it, but they wouldn't want to see that side of me, either. And I think it would be unfair of me to put that kind of strain on a friendship. How would you feel if someone close to you turned out to be not that person at all, but someone completely different? Some would say a true friend wouldn't care, but I still think it would be an unfair strain on things.

Anyway, I get my fill of people at work every day. It's nice to come home to nobody by the pets!

[SophiaGirl]

I think I may have felt the way a lot of you all are. I was married with a GG who I told early on in the relationship about dressing. She wasn't down with it. I really did love her so I felt I could push it aside. Well, that didn't work. I would find myself "sneaking" dressing. I still wasn't happy. Having to hide my femme side. I suppose deep down it hurt. Well, anyway, that marriage failed, though, I have a beautiful daughter!

I told myself after that marriage that the next person I was in a relationship with would, no, must be able to deal with my dressing. Strange enough. Shortly after I left my wife I met the most amazing girl. I told her on my second date about my dressing and she didn't even flinch! I thought, "WOW!!". Could she be down with it? Well, now we are getting married and the dressing is actually something she likes! She surprised me with some clothes the other day. We even went shoe and dress shopping the other day!

[My Lady Marsea]

Part of my problem is that I am a 24/7 girl or wutever, so yeah someone (either male or female) would have to like accept me (obviously) just as I present myself, there is no other me lol. The town of Yuma is sorta like not near as large as Denver, and we do indeed have a Gay Rights group and just like 2 months ago a new PFLAG (Parents and Friends of Lesbian And Gay) was started. At least three of us girls attend(ed) the meetings because their mission also states Transgender, although I see no"T" in the acronym. None of these groups has like too much action and I would not mind starting a "T" group, I don't really know where to start lol.

[NiCo]

Me and my bf found each others as kids, best friends, and then lost contact because I moved to England but then I asked a mutual friend to get us back in contact and we’ve been together ever since.

As for a social life, I don’t know what that is and doubt I will find out until I’m post-op. I do not want people knowing me while I’m like this. I cannot wait for the health board to finally make up their mind so I can pick up my shattered life and piece it all back together.

I think most of us end up feeling all alone. It’s about overcoming that and doing something, and even if it feels like nothing can be done, keep trying. Been there done that got the scars to prove it. Nothing is darker than death and while still alive, you still have hope.

Remember that x

[My Lady Marsea]

While those of us who get out in public to whatever degree are discovering there is more tolerance out there than some think, the plain fact of life is that to be a crossdresser is to be marginalized. Tolerance is one thing, acceptance quite another. This is true within the gay community nearly as much as mainstream society when trying to cultivate a network of friends or seeking romance.

The odds of a single crossdresser finding an accepting GG are slightly better than winning the lottery, I suppose, but not enough to make much difference. Those GGs are rare, exotic birds indeed. What's more, those of you who are thinking, as I once did, that turning to men for romance will solve the problem are in for some disappointment. Sure, you can find guys who want to have sex with you, but you can forget about the whole romance thing.

Here's the thing, you see -- very few people of any gender or sexual orientation are prepared to cope with the social stigma associated with crossdressing. Even if someone has some genuine interest or attraction, he or she isn't going to be able to handle the embarrassment by association. This is as true for friendship as for romance. That guy who will gladly meet you in a motel room turns into a spineless wimp at the mere prospect of being seen at club buying you a drink. What's worse, those "friends" who are gushing about how much they love you after a few drinks at a bar can never quite seem to clear their schedules enough to go to a movie or dinner with you, and somehow you're always overlooked when the party invitations go out.

Of course I'm painting with a broad brush here, and there are exceptions, as is evidenced by a few gurls right here on this forum. But it's much like the lottery -- someone's gonna win, just not you.

So that leaves us with three viable action points:

• You have to find a way to get comfortable with more solitude than you'd like.
• We gurls have make a huge effort, a real commitment, to be friends for each other, and not just online. We need face-time and stuff to do together. We need friendship. Maybe even a little romance.
• We have to keep trying, keep interacting with people, keep giving them chances to see beyond the covers to the books inside. Cuz if we don't, nothin's ever gonna change.

OMG and I like thought it was just me. I totally agree that we gurls need to be there for each other, just for friendship and another warm human being to spend our social time with, and like not just bars or dark hiding places. My biggest problem is like the gurls I do know are closet 95% of the time and go to those big events in Las Vegas or wutever (more money than I have lol) to basically do what I do here in my town everyday, like today is movie day in 2 hours, and I'm like going totally alone as always. The local alternative lifestyle bar here got boring (and waaay too far to like drive to/from...esp after a drink or two what with the DWI penalty) to really bother because we gurls are in a little nitch of our own I guess. I only get like friends for the moment there. I'd just luv to have either a GG,GLBT, straight guy, ANYONE to go with once in a while. And this:"clear their schedules enough to go to a movie or dinner with you, and somehow you're always overlooked when the party invitations go out." is like so totally true and lame on others part I might add.

[My Lady Marsea]

WHAT social/love life??

Get the point? lol

You've got to be kidding girl lol. I.ve seen you here and there on the site and if that's your picture, OMG how could anyone not want to be with you. All average GGs would like die to be seen around and be friends with you and any guy...well what needs to be said there? Even a surface social life would be better than I have lol.

[My Lady Marsea]

>>I'm actually asking those who are single without a current (understanding or otherwise) or previous SO or partner/girlfriend/boyfriend in life before you started acting on your new or other lifestyle.

Wow... That really narrows down who can respond and what they'll probably be able to say.

It's said, after all, "That nothing succeeds like success."

Ask only people who haven't been having much luck how it's going and you're not going to get a lot of happy noise...

This reminds me of my "friends" after my divorce - years ago - and before I hooked up and married my wife. Talk about "birds of a feather!"

What I noticed was, "Nothing fails like failure." Honestly, because I was the new "odd man out" I met a lot of guys who had been having no luck for years.

It struck me, however, that it was THEM, not the ladies they kept getting ignored by.

When my second wife died, I did all the Internet dating stuff that people do now and saw it from the other side. I had had a long "successful" marriage, and now I was meeting a lot of women who'd failed... Again, "It's not them, it's you!" Only this time it was the women who were out of luck.

There's good news and bad news here. If you're having problems, it's YOU that may be the problem. That said, YOU can do something about that.

I have known, and know, many TS, TG, CDs who are attractive, busy, happy folks. If people like something about you, they like you and overlook a lot of "the other stuff."

You're not just TS, TG, CD... You're much more than that. Something else may be putting people off... Figure out what it is, apologize for it, and make some changes.

Plenty of good people to have a life with... But, it all starts with you thinking you are one of them - and making it obvious to someone else.

I worded my question as I did because I figured ppl with another in their present life wouldn't know the feeling or wutever. I do however, concede that you might have like a valid point and am open to it. You're right, think negative and most times you'll get what you wish for. Figure you'll not win the lottery and you'll never be disappointed, and on & on.
Maybe it's because I like over try to find someone. I KNOW I'm sorta doing this because as I stated I'm the one who like keeps initiating most of the time. I was like so totally the aggressive on my one guy thing, I'm like 95% sure I scared him off. It's the same as what would have likely happened if I were my old (I hate me) self and had found a overly aggressive girl. I also KNOW that not all my current "friends" have other friends who are "comfortable" with me. I KNOW that most other "normal" ppl have a life, (read spouse, kids, job,hobby,other commitments) and it doesn't center around me. I'm PRETTY sure most of it stems from my being a T-Girl and them not wanting to get involved deeper. All that being said though, I'll still not like change who I have become, I am happy and like in luv with my choice, just not with my social/love life or wutever right now.

[Von]

I'm single, never married, nor have kids. I don't have a GF or a SO and so I enjoy being on my own, living on my own, and doing whatever I want to do.

Hugs!

I think this is part of my problem. I always enjoyed my time alone, and never seemed to get enough of it. There are perks to being alone. After a couple of failed relationships, I just reveled in it a bit. Then got used to it. Now it's getting old. I live a long way from the few old friends I had, and my family. After being alone for long enough, it becomes difficult to know how to do anything else.

Then I discovered women's clothing (that'll make it easier!). As an adult, i'm always uncomfortable in social situations with people I don't know (a pool that now includes almost everyone), and I'm naturally shy. The few things I am invited to do socially seem either horribly uninteresting, or so stressful to participate in that any semblance of enjoyment is entirely negated.

So, no social life. No love life. Part of me thinks that this makes for a perfect opportunity to embrace dressing (something I haven't really done - only 'experiments'). The other part of me thinks that if I do embrace it, there will be no going back (which, I realize, may already already be the case) and any chance of future romance will be be even less likely.

Unfortunately, my observations confirm Sometimes_Missy's point(s) - femininity is a turnoff for the vast majority of GGs.

I've said since I first came here that the guys here with understanding SOs are really lucky. Sherri makes as close as I see to a legitimate positive point - but with limited options for love.

Sorry to add to the downer-fest. Now go look for a nice success story thread to make you feel better.

[My Lady Marsea]

Here's how I figure it, as the GG SO of a CDer who found out right away about the dressing: it's not down to the crossdressing to make us accept or reject our partners, it's about respect, chemistry, personality, etc. Most of us GGs haven't really given a lot of thought to crossdressing or trans issues, because we've never gone through them - maybe we have negative stereotypes, and maybe we don't. What we CAN and DO make our impressions about you on is the way you present yourself to the world.The more you accept and love yourself and become confident in who you are, the more that shines through in your personality. That's what is attractive - and that goes for friendship as well as dating.




Also, CherryZips makes a good point: if you want to have friends, it takes time and real effort to meet them and make them!

Now we can get like a kewl point of view here. A real GG one. My question is like since I am a full 24/7 gurl, assuming I was not a older bitch (as I jokingly call myself) and you meet me, or like "make" (figure it out or wutever) me somewhere, as the gurl I am or in the second case, am not, would you even in the first place deal with me, whew lol? What would be the attraction to a guy who really wants to be a girl? How would you feel about dating with a guy who dresses 24/7 with intentions of maybe transitioning at some time down the road? Where are the kind of places you would be willing to go in public? Would you like have to or be willing to give up friends to make this work. A GG thoughts on all this would be like so totally awesome, and the promise here is no one would hold you to it. It's just to get a totally different perspective or wutever. I guess we can all take it if it gets bad lol.

[Lexine]

At the beginning of the year I was an emotional wreck. But as I discovered a part of myself that was there constantly and never really acknowledging it, and finally embracing it wholeheartedly, my social life and love life are at an incredible point right now. I recently celebrated my birthday and, incidentally, both my boy and girl sides in different parties and none of my friends actually had any sort of hesitation as to accept who I was as a person deep inside, despite the gender I presented to them. I can't say that acceptance took a while because all this happened within the past three months. I stopped feeling sorry about my current situation and just started loving myself and it was because of this that I found the woman of my dreams, who accepted me for being trans on day 0... before our first date. I continue to grow my friends base and, while its exhausting to explain to people why I'm transgender or everything around it, I welcome the curiosity and the open-mindedness of the people around me.

[Crystal Alberta]

Your odds of finding a TG friendly woman are very, very slim. Women are attracted to alpha male traits; any display of female traits or behavior is usually a strong deterrent to any feelings of attraction. They only want 'sensitive', nurturing men when those qualities are an addendum to standard male behavior like leadership, physical strength (they like feeling safe), and well, just look up alpha male and you'll get the idea. Basically, women want a nasty, successful, dominant prick, but one that treats her nicely.

The odds of a single crossdresser finding an accepting GG are slightly better than winning the lottery, I suppose, but not enough to make much difference.

Whoa!

I don't think we can generalize about what women want any more than we can generalize about what men want. And we all know that different men have very different tastes in women. Sure, some women are attracted to nasty jerks, but in my experience, there are many more who value honesty, empathy, and thoughtfulness above those "alpha male" traits. It's true that you won't find many women specifically looking to date a crossdresser, but I think there are an awful lot who will to judge a person as a whole package, and accept crossdressing as a part of that package, if they are otherwise attracted to him.

Personally, I've never really spent much time "looking" for love. I've only had two more-or-less serious relationships. But both have been with women who were not only accepting, but downright encouraging of my crossdressing, and who fully embraced my femme side. In both cases, I told them early on, and was completely honest about myself. I've found that the odds of finding accepting partners aren't nearly as bad as they're sometimes made out to be.

Crystal

[Anneliese]

I too enjoy being alone. I too have enough involvement with people at work, as well as family and a few close friends. I've always felt better single than as a part of a pair. I literally get sick to my stomach when in a relationship after the initial rush. I just want to be able to do what I want to do when I want to do it, and I am literally allergic to guilt-trips and nagging. If I want to clean up the house every few weeks rather than daily, it's my call. If I want to dress 24/7 when at home, there is nobody telling me I can't. My dogs are accepting of me as I am.

I was married for five years to a gorgeous insatiable blonde, and I divorced her after finding out she was a serial adulteress. I had more sex in those five years than most people have in a lifetime. That, and having my daughter, who I raised completely, were the good things that came out of that relationship. Literally everything else about it was pure torture.

Although I've had eight serious relationships since, I refuse to be somebody I'm not in order to make them happy. I have only lived with one woman in my life, and that was the ex. The rest have had to settle for a weekends only boyfriend, because that is all I'm willing to be.

I continue to be amazed at all those here with accepting girlfriends, not because they exist, but because of the dating process where they're told early on. I just can't imagine the moment of truth, the stunned silence (or loud horror), the rejection, etc. which seems to be inevitable the majority of the time.

I have no plans to ever have another girlfriend. I've had enough sex. Truthfully, although it's unfair to compare, none of my SOs since the divorce could hold a candle to my ex-wife in bed. She should have been a hooker. She could have made a lot of money.

I might be willing to expand my horizons, so to speak, at some point, but I'm not there yet.

[sherri]

In my own mind, I think I can distinguish, among those posters admonishing negative attitudes, the ones speaking hypothetically and the ones speaking from personal experience. I have nothing but respect for the latter and wouldn't think of arguing with them. Attitude and effort are essential ingredients. And too, Babeba's perspective is obviously the ideal we are all seeking. Oh too be so fortunate.

I will also admit that in hopes of finding an accepting GG I haven't been looking in the right places since my "public appearances" and social interaction tend to take place within gay/lesbian circles. For the same reason I don't meet many "straight" men who might be interested in a TG.

But I have worked pretty hard at this for quite a few years, always striving to maintain a positive, hopeful attitude and being persistently aggressive in my social and romantic efforts, online and out in the real world. I'm not young and I'm no raving beauty and I'm not full-time TG and I can be a bit shy at times, but I've worked hard to overcome such limitations and I do have some good points, not the least of which is that I am a loving and loyal friend, and I would make someone a wonderful gurlfriend. I honestly feel like that over the years I've given lots of people a good look at Sherri and given them lots of chances to embrace me into their circles of friends and/or become romantically involved, all to little avail. I have some "bar friends" and some online friends and an unending line of guys looking for no-strings sex, that's about it. So to me, my pessimism is not only understandable, it's realistic.

[Tasha T]

WHAT social/love life??

Get the point? lol

Ditto.

[Tina P Hose]

Single here, do whatever that I want to, it is good, sometimes a little ho-hum, as I have yet to meet others like me in my town. But my life is good.

[Babeba]

Now we can get like a kewl point of view here. A real GG one. My question is like since I am a full 24/7 gurl, assuming I was not a older bitch (as I jokingly call myself) and you meet me, or like "make" (figure it out or wutever) me somewhere, as the gurl I am or in the second case, am not, would you even in the first place deal with me, whew lol? What would be the attraction to a guy who really wants to be a girl? How would you feel about dating with a guy who dresses 24/7 with intentions of maybe transitioning at some time down the road? Where are the kind of places you would be willing to go in public? Would you like have to or be willing to give up friends to make this work. A GG thoughts on all this would be like so totally awesome, and the promise here is no one would hold you to it. It's just to get a totally different perspective or wutever. I guess we can all take it if it gets bad lol.

Alright. Hypothetically speaking, let's say that my SO (who happens to be the lovely Crystal right here on this thread) was a 24/7 kind of gal when we met. We met taking classes towards a master's degree together, and bonded over the course of many months before taking the dating plunge. We were firmly friends before dating. Would I have still gone out with her? Hell yes. I know that a few of our social circle would be scandalized to know about the Crystal part of my boyfriend, but she's special enough to me to completely outweigh that. If those friends couldn't wrap their heads around it, well, then they aren't the lovely smart people I had once thought. Whether Crystal is presenting as a man or a woman, she's still the same person and that's what is important to me.

One of the things that DOES attract me, though, is her willingness and ability to get out and do things - she's just as happy strapping on hiking boots and going for long rambles as she is clothes shopping. That's pretty much my attitude, too - and I love it that we can share so much of our favourite pastimes.

Now, it's really easy for me to say these things, because I DID take the time to get to know Crystal, and we just happened to be in a relatively small group of students together - and if she had been presenting as femme in class, even if there had been some tension at first with not knowing how to approach or talk to a her that was kind of a him, it would still have happened. The ice would have been broken sometime (I made a point of talking to everyone) and I would have found the funny, kind, generous person there. But meeting someone new, who is dressed? There is little enough reason to approach a stranger on the street, and to be honest I think it would be a bit daunting to just randomly approach someone who was out in femme - what are we supposed to say? Do we mention that we noticed they're actually genetically male? Do we just dance around it (although honestly I would probably be dying to ask a bunch of stupid questions and be kind of afraid of sounding like and ignorant ass?) I would say, Marsea, that if I met you at some sort of a social gathering that gave us something external to talk about (like a program set up at a local museum, or something, that encouraged people participating with each other) - once the ice was broken, it wouldn't matter to me who or what you were, what you were wearing, so long as I thought you were a nice person (and you didn't smell like an outhouse). But - that icebreaking is the hardest part with any stranger, and any stranger who has a strong trait which is unfamiliar to a person is harder to break the ice with.

[Sheren Kelly]

In my experiences, I have found several women who were interested in crossdressers. Some had issues of their own (past abuse from "manly" men), some were just curious. I had a rather full social life (but not romantically) when I was dressing up more routinely, but felt the world was limited in places that were accepting, and I was not willing to make the career and family sacrifices necessary to be more fully feminine. In the 10 years since that period, people are a bit more accepting, but you can't always bank on it.

I am in a new relationship with a woman who knows about my femme side, but doesn't want that part of me in the relationship. On most other aspects, we are well matched. So now I am navigating the waters of where the boundaries are and how significant my femininity is to me. I dont want to be alone, but nor will I accept apologizing for/hiding my femininity for the rest of the life. As the saying goes: "something's gotta give!"

[My Lady Marsea]

Alright. Hypothetically speaking, let's say that my SO (who happens to be the lovely Crystal right here on this thread) was a 24/7 kind of gal when we met. We met taking classes towards a master's degree together, and bonded over the course of many months before taking the dating plunge. We were firmly friends before dating. Would I have still gone out with her? Hell yes. I know that a few of our social circle would be scandalized to know about the Crystal part of my boyfriend, but she's special enough to me to completely outweigh that. If those friends couldn't wrap their heads around it, well, then they aren't the lovely smart people I had once thought. Whether Crystal is presenting as a man or a woman, she's still the same person and that's what is important to me.

One of the things that DOES attract me, though, is her willingness and ability to get out and do things - she's just as happy strapping on hiking boots and going for long rambles as she is clothes shopping. That's pretty much my attitude, too - and I love it that we can share so much of our favourite pastimes.

Now, it's really easy for me to say these things, because I DID take the time to get to know Crystal, and we just happened to be in a relatively small group of students together - and if she had been presenting as femme in class, even if there had been some tension at first with not knowing how to approach or talk to a her that was kind of a him, it would still have happened. The ice would have been broken sometime (I made a point of talking to everyone) and I would have found the funny, kind, generous person there. But meeting someone new, who is dressed? There is little enough reason to approach a stranger on the street, and to be honest I think it would be a bit daunting to just randomly approach someone who was out in femme - what are we supposed to say? Do we mention that we noticed they're actually genetically male? Do we just dance around it (although honestly I would probably be dying to ask a bunch of stupid questions and be kind of afraid of sounding like and ignorant ass?) I would say, Marsea, that if I met you at some sort of a social gathering that gave us something external to talk about (like a program set up at a local museum, or something, that encouraged people participating with each other) - once the ice was broken, it wouldn't matter to me who or what you were, what you were wearing, so long as I thought you were a nice person (and you didn't smell like an outhouse). But - that icebreaking is the hardest part with any stranger, and any stranger who has a strong trait which is unfamiliar to a person is harder to break the ice with.

I like totally appreciate your responding to this Babeba. You are a special one. At least it is sorta encouraging although I somehow think you are truly a rare and special gem in the general overall GG world.
I do get out and as an example thru all my census work (as a T-Girl 24/7) I did meet a GG about a year ago in one of the training sessions who is at least willing to hang with me. Over the last few months we have shared some deep "girl" time or wutever as I like call it. We know things about each other that I guess girls like only tell each other. We have been out in public for lunch, on the job, and spent some time at my place just kicking back. I know she is like totally comfortable with me now that she knows I'm not going to hit on her, that I really do breath and have feelings and that overall I'm like really a interesting giving genuine type that ppl can like given the chance. (My hygiene is excellent btw lol.) Of course nothing other than fleeting moments of happiness will come of this as she has a life. Husband (who seems to be OK with me, knows I'm harmless I guess?) sorta grown kids (do they ever really grow up?) job tensions, financial tensions and just large doses of hectic life. We aren't spending as much time now, there is precious little time like left over in her remaining hours. So yeah, anything is possible I guess.
One trend I'm like picking up thru this thread though is that 24/7 means different things to different ppl ( hey this might be my next thread). I am 24/7 Marsea in dressing and actions. After reading all this stuff I have discovered..OMG! I AM IN THE CLOSET. But it's the person I always hated and never wanted to be that is like in there. "He" is never going to show up ever again, no reason to, "he" was....well..not me. I do not alternate between Boi mode & Girl mode. I know who and what I am, I'm a girl like stuck in some prison body. I have also discovered that I HAVE PURGED too LOL. Goodwill got it all like 3 years ago and nothing else even resembling boi is or will be allowed in this dwelling (unless Mr Right comes along, then it's his and there will be no sharing lol).
So herein I think lies the big problem with my social/love life, I'm not starting at the Boi level as I don't ever want to be there ever again. This sorta is like starting the Indy race 12th row back, outside position. On the plus side any relation which may like ever start would be a what you see is what you get situation.
Again though Babeba, I like truly appreciate your response and it has opened up my thought to a deeper level or wutever. And to any other GG who might read this I say, like yeah for sure feel so totally free to ask ANY stupid questions and DON"T feel like an ignorant ass lol. Being like totally open within myself and any interaction with others comes with the territory that I'm in.

[sissystephanie]

Since I have always been a "social" person, that part of my life has not changed much. I do occasionally go out socially as Stephanie with another CD, not real often maybe once a month. Most of the time the social life concerns my Church group.

Since I lost my wife 5 years ago, my love life is non-existant! There is a lady that I do love, but she lives in another country and is married! I would never do anything to break a marriage!! I have learned to live my life as it is!

[sometimes_miss]

I wasn't trying to be a downer; but I really like people to be prepared for reality.

I don't think we can generalize about what women want any more than we can generalize about what men want

Uh, yes we can. I didn't get my information out of thin air. Look at what and who women 'in general' are attracted to, and guess what? It's not feminine guys! Same for the reverse; men 'in general' want young prime fertility age, healthy looking women, with a waist to hip ratio of approximately 70%, and again guess what, men predominantly prefer feminine women, not women with men's haircuts wearing steel toed shoes and men's suits. Yes, there are anomolies. But by percentage, really not many. Yes, you can take statistics and view them any way you want; but as an example, in a high school, at least half the girls would consider dating a football team member, probably more. Less than 1% would want to date a crossdresser. So, yes, we can generalize and be quite sure we're on the right track.

I have known, and know, many TS, TG, CDs who are attractive, busy, happy folks. If people like something about you, they like you and overlook a lot of "the other stuff."

They will overlook a lot of other stuff, but crossdressing is a deal breaker for nearly all of them, especially when it comes down to choosing a mate. And if you push the issue, if they find out you're a crossdresser, they won't want you around their young children. Ever. Try showing up for a babysitting appointment for a 6 year old while in drag. Think they'll let you stay?? Uhhhh, not likely.

Tolerance is one thing, acceptance quite another.

This is a concept that a lot of people fail to grasp. Basically, most people adopt a 'not in my back yard' policy regarding crossdressing. We're no longer routinely in physical danger of being beaten or killed just because we crossdress, but no one's chasing us down the road to be our friends or lovers either.

I was really disappointed to find that the crossdresser dating site I joined is mainly full of guys showing their privates, wanting to hook up with TV/TS people for sex.

Yes, that's the general experience. No women. None.

it's not down to the crossdressing to make us accept or reject our partners, it's about respect, chemistry, personality, etc.

Babeba, unfortunately, that sentiment doesn't hold true for most women (I only wish it did!). I don't try to present all my good points vs. the crossdressing; there's just the feminine connotations that seems to destroy any sexual attraction most women might feel for us. I understand it. I don't necessarily like it, but I understand it.

But meeting someone new, who is dressed? There is little enough reason to approach a stranger on the street, and to be honest I think it would be a bit daunting to just randomly approach someone who was out in femme - what are we supposed to say? Do we mention that we noticed they're actually genetically male? Do we just dance around it (although honestly I would probably be dying to ask a bunch of stupid questions and be kind of afraid of sounding like and ignorant ass?)

And this contradicts another person's advice, to get out there and be ourselves 'en femme' in places where women can see us for who we are. Interesting, is all I can say right now, because now once again I don't know which way to go. A guy who says he supposedly has success going out dressed, vs a woman who says she wouldn't approach a guy who is.

As Babeba so beautifully put it, you have to make an effort.

You can make all the effort you want. If someone isn't attracted to you, or more specifically, if there's something about you that turns them off sexually, there's nothing you can do to change that. We have no conscious decision making that lets us decide what turns us on, and what turns us off. None. It's not a choice. If it were, I'd choose to be turned on by short, fat, ugly, smelly women with bad dispositions, lousy complexions and bad hair. I'd be having so much sex that I 'd have to quit my job. Life doesn't work like that.

Of all the women that I am friends with, I have told 6-7 of them that I am a CD. Guess what? It made no difference to them at all. In fact, it drew us closer as friends.

Yes. Friends. NOT girlfriends. There is a difference. And not everyone that expresses interest in someone who's 'taken' will actually follow up on that; it's easy to say it, because you don't actually have to 'show up on game day'. I've known many married people that profess to single unattractive ones that if only they were single, they'd date the other person in a second, yet in private, admit they'd do nothing of the sort. And, I've also seen many single men tell ugly married women how sexy they are, and that there must be something wrong with their husbands if he's not 'totally hot' for her. I'm not saying your friends are insincere, but it is always possible they were telling you what you wanted to hear; friends do that.

I do have friends that I hang out with occasionally, but most of them don't know about Lisa. It isn't that I think they'd shut me out for it, but they wouldn't want to see that side of me, either.

That's what I've experienced. I've slowly made clandestine inquiries about crossdressing, whenever any even remotely related subject comes up in conversation. I don't see any positive viewpoints returned; at best, they just don't care either way, but that's not a positive thing at all, and you can be sure that when people respond like that, if they were confronted with it, they'd want nothing to do with us.