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Thread: To Pass or Not to Pass?

  1. #1
    GG Tulip's Avatar
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    To Pass or Not to Pass?

    I am a GG who loves her transvestite pal. This question has come up many times, yet for my friend there is no choice. He is so athletic, broad shouldered, passing is not going to happen. I've read opinions on using forms, cinchers and such versus all natural you for better comfort.

    For my part, I would like going along on a vacation, where he feels he can dress with anonymity without tension to "pass." He says, "Its a goal, but I know I won't."

    What is your take on this? If you have experience passing for female, was it all you thought it would be? If you are more like my friend, what helps you accomplish goals? Or are you happy to be the best you can be, and find some pleasure dressing around accepting loved ones? Is it about passing so no one knows...or others know but the acceptance is the overall goal? Acceptance is passing?
    Last edited by Tulip; 08-09-2010 at 10:11 PM. Reason: Left out an important word "would" for would like to go along...

  2. #2
    Senior Age Member sissystephanie's Avatar
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    When my late wife was alive, I did, and could, pass! That was because my dear wife was an expert with makeup and fixing my wig! Now that she has passed on, I don't even try. I am not good with either makeup or my wig. So I go out as a man in a skirt or dress. I get smiles from people, but in 5+ years have not received one bad comment. Have had many compliments on my outfits!!! If you are happy with what you are wearing, that is all that counts!!

    I never wanted to be a female, I just like to dress like one. but it was fun to sometimes look comletely feminine and "Pass!" BTW, I think your friend is really a Crossdresser, and probably not a Transvestite. A Transvestite dresses in the clothing of the opposite sex primarily for sexual reasons! If your friend does not do that, he is a Crossdresser!
    Stephanie

    Lady on the outside, but man underneath!

  3. #3
    Aspiring Member Violetgray's Avatar
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    The right makeup can go a long way toward helping one pass. Also, wearing clothing meant to distract the eye from the masculine and decieve it with the feminine. For example, I still have the biceps and shoulders from my weightlifting days, so I avoid anything with a tank top. Also, my hip pads are better disguised when wearing an empire waist top or dress.

    I've been known to pass off an on, so I hope that helps! Anymore questions please let us know!

  4. #4
    Isn't Life Grand? AllieSF's Avatar
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    Hello and congratulations for having such good taste in an SO! I personally am fortunate because I am short, small boned, petite, and except for my little friendly belly, thin. I try to dress well in the styles that I like to see GG's, including my EX, my daughter and past girlfriends wear. I pass from a distance only. I also go out regularly to mainstream venues like any other person, male or female.

    Why do I tell you all this background? Passing for some is a serious goal, but not for me. I work at fitting in, blending in and being accepted by those with whom I converse, and that is with everyone I come into contact with when dressed! I believe that if one has the correct attitude, confidence and personality, they can accomplish the fitting and blending in with others while out. Now, a thick skin is also required because you never know when some idiot will make an unnecessary negative comment. Yes, some will have a very hard time blending in, however, to me the key element is the confidence and personality.

  5. #5
    Southern Belle Phoebe Reece's Avatar
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    I personally think "passing" is overrated. I used to worry about it when I first started going out, but soon realized that there was no way I would pass in all situations. Nothing ever bad happened as a result of being "read" as a crossdresser, so I stopped being concerned about it and started having a good time. I found that I actually had more fun when people read me as a crossdresser and gave me an opportunity to talk with them about it. I've cleared up a lot of misconceptions about crossdressing with these one on one encounters. It doesn't bother me if a couple of people walk past me and I hear one say to the other, "That was a man in a dress" - as long the other one replies, "Yes, but doesn't he look good in it."

    For me, crossdressing is about going out and having fun with it.
    Phoebe

  6. #6
    Silver Member AKAMichelle's Avatar
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    Getting out in public is more like a journey. Like the butterfly in your profile pic. We start out as ugly ducklings. Some not ugly and eventually over time turn into a beautiful woman. I don't feel like I pass very well, but I definitely am able to blend in. I don't attract attention at 1000 yards, but up close everyone knows that I am a guy. That's ok since I am only being me.
    Michelle

  7. #7
    Silver Member kellycan27's Avatar
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    I don't wish to offend anyone, but i personally think that passing is only overrated if you can't do it. If you can pass it's like walking through a magic door that is usually reserved for GG's. The attention, the extra service, guys vying for your attention and bending over backwards to try and impress you or to make you happy. Just about everywhere you go someone is willing to go that extra mile to please you. At the grocery store, the box boy will walk past the mom with her three kids and two carts of groceries and ask if you need help carrying a gallon of milk to your car. The hardware guy in home depot ignoring 10 other customers in his isle....to help you first. Cuts in line at the clubs... It's way better than i ever imagined it would be to pass. And that's just a part of it. is passing the most important thing? NO, but it can be a lot of fun. I think that if more people could actually experience passing, there would less people saying that it is overrated.

    Kel
    "one day I'll fly away..... leave all this to yesterday"

    http://youtu.be/kR7NlgwVHHg

  8. #8
    Senior Member Stephanie Miller's Avatar
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    That may be true Kelly... if you're young and cute. But what the rest of us see when we go out is something all together different. I think a lot of GG's tend to over-rate passing because they themselves have fallen into a form of "everyday normal". Before I get flamed by the Gg's, let me explain. Ever since they were young, society has treated Gg's different (I'm talking in general here. I know there are exceptions.). Mom and dad would hollar at the boys to take it easy on your sister. Open the door for ladies. Carry that for her. Give her your coat if she's cold (while you freeze your butt off), etc. etc. For instance I watch all the time as a GG and I will converge on the door at the same time and they EXPECT me to open the door and let them in first. They expect the man to get the drinks.
    So when a man wants to emulate, be, or just experience what it is to be a woman (as much as can be) the Gg's don't understand. They don't understand that we haven't had any "perks" like you talk about. We don't get the attention like they do. We don't get the clothes options they do. We don't get to choose to put on make-up that makes us look/feel younger/prettier. Because they are use to it.
    Yes, both sides of the fence experience different things. We just want to experience what is "normal everyday" to them. Good and bad. I've had bad hair days. Hate them, but glad I experienced them.
    (O.K. flame away.

  9. #9
    Gold Member Kaitlyn Michele's Avatar
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    you don't have to be young and cute to pass... sometimes i think we all have a fantastical notion that being a woman is the same as being the woman we spent our youth fantasizing about...

    gg's get the chance to learn the truth at 17 as phoebe snow said..

    passing to a ts woman is not underrated in any way ...it is meaning of life important to some, and i have to agree with Kelly that it seems to me that you will not hear a truly full time stealth passable transperson say its overrated..

    but the original OP question was really good...i think your answer should center around how you asked the question! your pal needs to answer the exact questions you asked the forum..

    my answer is different today than when i thought i was crossdressing for party time...in those days, i just did my best and was happy with it...i had my awkward moments, but i had more and more enjoyment from being out...

    if you guys think you can handle a goofball giving you a hard time, or a smirk from the maitre'd or a group of teenagers following you around, then go for it!!! ....just know this is a possibility be careful and safe.

    however, going with nerves wracked over whether your pal passes is probably not gonna result in a fun time..

    some folks can say f*# the world, i'm doing my thing, and others can't get to that point...you really have to be closer to the first one
    Last edited by Kaitlyn Michele; 08-10-2010 at 08:36 AM. Reason: lol...janis ian???

  10. #10
    Silver Member kellycan27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephanie Miller View Post
    That may be true Kelly... if you're young and cute. But what the rest of us see when we go out is something all together different. I think a lot of GG's tend to over-rate passing because they themselves have fallen into a form of "everyday normal". Before I get flamed by the Gg's, let me explain. Ever since they were young, society has treated Gg's different (I'm talking in general here. I know there are exceptions.). Mom and dad would hollar at the boys to take it easy on your sister. Open the door for ladies. Carry that for her. Give her your coat if she's cold (while you freeze your butt off), etc. etc. For instance I watch all the time as a GG and I will converge on the door at the same time and they EXPECT me to open the door and let them in first. They expect the man to get the drinks.
    So when a man wants to emulate, be, or just experience what it is to be a woman (as much as can be) the Gg's don't understand. They don't understand that we haven't had any "perks" like you talk about. We don't get the attention like they do. We don't get the clothes options they do. We don't get to choose to put on make-up that makes us look/feel younger/prettier. Because they are use to it.
    Yes, both sides of the fence experience different things. We just want to experience what is "normal everyday" to them. Good and bad. I've had bad hair days. Hate them, but glad I experienced them.
    (O.K. flame away.

    I totally understand what you you are saying... but the OP asked about passing and I answered. Yes, there are a lot of perks, and those perks are what makes passing a lot of fun. And you are absoultely right in saying that men are raised to treat wemon differently. TBPO... I have no problem with men treating me in this way. And I can tell you for a fact that men don't only do these things because they were taught to, men have an agenda too, and their intentions are not always to be a gentleman.
    Not everyone can pass, all i was saying is that if you can....SWEET!


    kel
    "one day I'll fly away..... leave all this to yesterday"

    http://youtu.be/kR7NlgwVHHg

  11. #11
    mini kilted chick t-girlxsophie's Avatar
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    I dont pass,but am happy to be out there enjoying my girlie time,It may be the Holy Grail to some,but I think it can put a lot of pressure on you,I try to look as femme as I can,and dress nice but It still wont make me Pass,but that fact doesn't put me off being myself

    Sophie xx
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    A woman who loves to wear beautiful clothes is like a flower.
    A man who loves to emulate these women is a special flower-a rose
    Facebook:Sophie Johnson

  12. #12
    Platinum Member
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    right now, I know I can't "pass" but I am spending more time in public in clearly feminine tops, heels and a little makeup...with my SO's support and encouragement. Its sort of an intermediate step - and perhaps one day we'll just go all out.

  13. #13
    Silver Member Loni's Avatar
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    Smile

    look lower on this sight and look in
    "up coming events"
    then
    "holiday at sea October 30 2010"

    maybe not quite what you two want but i hear it is a great thing for couples.

    loni

  14. #14
    Fab Karen Fab Karen's Avatar
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    You may pass well, but that special treatment will fade with your youth, Kelly.
    We who go out in the world are explaining to those who want the fresh air of freedom to unlock the cell door because they hold the key. You don't need to be young & gorgeous or pass 100% to live life. That's the point.
    [SIZE="3"]Gender is a state of mind[/SIZE]
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  15. #15
    fearless transowman juno's Avatar
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    I think that the practical aspect of passing is to get treated like your presented gender without strange looks. With time, people get used to not passing, and it becomes less important. Hopefully, crossdressing will one day be considered normal by the general public, and you won't have to pass perfectly. If you can't pass, but have courage to go out anyhow, just take pride in expanding public awareness, and maybe helping a closet crossdresser feel better about themselves.

    Juno

  16. #16
    ADMINISTRATOR Sandra's Avatar
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    My SO is a TS for her it's not what's on the outside but what on the inside. She's not bothered about passing ans never has been, yes she likes to looks nice but that's about as far as it goes for her.
    Sandra
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  17. #17
    GerriJerry Gerrijerry's Avatar
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    MY feelings on passing It was important to me. In the beginning I was totally afraid to go out and hear the words. Look that is a male dressed as a woman. I joined a group called TRI ESS and there learned to relax and in time I was told I pass. Was it a big deal to pass. To me it was because the day came when I was out and I just had to use the ladiesroom. I always avoided that. I also knew it would not be safe using the mens room in female mode. So having no other choice I went in and did what I went in there for. Yes others were in the room when I can out and washed my hands a women looked at me and said. I like your bag where did you get it. I said it was a coach bag and the store was in the mail where we were. She said thank you and that was it. When I left there a few minutes later I knew I passed. I actually finally felt I was one person again not two people in one body. Many may say they love to be noticed I don't I just want to be just another woman and fit in.

  18. #18
    Girl in disguise Emily Ann Brown's Avatar
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    Head to a gay club and get some confidence.

    "Passing" is about being confortable as a woman whre you are. Act like nothing is wrong...because nothing is!!!!!

    Dress like the GGs when you are going, and don't standout !!!

    I find being with a GG seems to add credibility to my presentation. What I don't know.

    Em
    Living with a heel in each world.

  19. #19
    Member Barbra_in_Tulsa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoebe Reece View Post
    I personally think "passing" is overrated. I used to worry about it when I first started going out, but soon realized that there was no way I would pass in all situations. Nothing ever bad happened as a result of being "read" as a crossdresser, so I stopped being concerned about it and started having a good time. I found that I actually had more fun when people read me as a crossdresser and gave me an opportunity to talk with them about it. I've cleared up a lot of misconceptions about crossdressing with these one on one encounters. It doesn't bother me if a couple of people walk past me and I hear one say to the other, "That was a man in a dress" - as long the other one replies, "Yes, but doesn't he look good in it."

    For me, crossdressing is about going out and having fun with it.

    Pretty much sums it up, doesn't it?

  20. #20
    Time Lady JiveTurkeyOnRye's Avatar
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    I'm a broken record on this subject, but I personally hate the power "passing" has over the TG community, like it's the holy grail we should all strive for. I think there's a false equivalency between "passing" and "looking good."

    I'm not saying that everyone needs to go to my men in skirts extreme, but that doesn't mean someone can't look good in women's clothes without looking convincingly like a woman. Instead of trying to "pass," everyone should try to find the combination of things that both make them look their best, and feel their best. In Kelly's case, she's lucky enough to not only pass, but to pass as a cute girl. That's great for her, and she should flaunt it while she can, and that's her perspective to share. It just isn't the case for all of us, that's all, but we don't need to hide who we are because of it.
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  21. #21
    Silver Member kellycan27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fab Karen View Post
    You may pass well, but that special treatment will fade with your youth, Kelly.
    We who go out in the world are explaining to those who want the fresh air of freedom to unlock the cell door because they hold the key. You don't need to be young & gorgeous or pass 100% to live life. That's the point.
    I understand that Karen, but as I said..The OP asked a question to which I answered, and the answer was based on what I have experienced so far. What happens in the future....happens. I didn't say that one had to be young or pretty, nor did I say that passing meant everything. I simply said that if one could pass... it 's pretty nice. What was it that I said that seems to have offended a couple of people?
    "one day I'll fly away..... leave all this to yesterday"

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  22. #22
    Southern Belle Phoebe Reece's Avatar
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    The real problem with "passing" is one of definition. If "passing" means that someone thinks you you are a genetic female when you are not, then very few of us will meet that definition all the time. However, if "passing" means that you have been accepted as the woman that you are presenting, a much larger number of us will achieve that. The thing is that unless you ask someone, you never know for sure if that person really thinks you are female or if they just accept you as the woman you are presenting.

    I am almost always accepted and treated as the woman that I present. I have had women that I don't know come and compliment a blouse or shoes I was wearing or initiate other conversations that would only happen between two women. Men hold doors open for me and observe other courtesies usually afforded to women. Yes, there are perks to being accepted into the world of women. And yet, I know at least some of the people that accept me as a woman are sure of what my true sex is. Am I "passing" then? It is a matter of definition. What interests me the most is acceptance of what I show to the world.
    Phoebe

  23. #23
    Tricia Dale tricia_uktv's Avatar
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    Hi Tulip,

    Its the person, not the passing that matters. I pretty much pass but sometimes I get a bit cheeky and don't wish to. Its then that I am at my best. Its just about having fun,

    Good luck
    I strut my stuff, I feel so proud,
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  24. #24
    GG Tulip's Avatar
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    Thank you to everyone answering my question. I'm so pleased with this site. And yes, Barbra, it pretty much summed it up. As a GG, I'd hope that statement would be the perspective of my SO.

    Whatever perspective you have, best wishes to all of you!

    -Mel

    To quote Stephanie "I think a lot of GG's tend to over-rate passing because they themselves have fallen into a form of "everyday normal". Before I get flamed by the Gg's, let me explain. Ever since they were young, society has treated Gg's different (I'm talking in general here. I know there are exceptions.). Mom and dad would hollar at the boys to take it easy on your sister. Open the door for ladies. Carry that for her. Give her your coat if she's cold (while you freeze your butt off), etc. etc. For instance I watch all the time as a GG and I will converge on the door at the same time and they EXPECT me to open the door and let them in first. They expect the man to get the drinks.
    So when a man wants to emulate, be, or just experience what it is to be a woman (as much as can be) the Gg's don't understand."

    I like to think I'm a GG who understands this. I've enjoyed those perks, and as a hot young woman. It can be great. I'm a realist, too. I think everyone who has posted on this thread is likely a realist. I don't get the perks as much as I used to, and it will probably happen less and less with time... Well, until I can be an adorable old lady ; ) I plan to get away with murder then.
    Last edited by Sandra; 08-11-2010 at 07:47 AM. Reason: merged consecutive posts please use the edit function, as multi posting is not allowed

  25. #25
    Mischief Maker Lexine's Avatar
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    Passing and acceptance are two different things: Acceptance implies that, regardless of how one looks, the third party acknowledges that the person is still an individual and that's what's important. This is something that is dependent on a third party, and the most we can do to help gain acceptance is to pass more because, unless your SO can read minds, you don't know how they'll react... at least that's how I view it.

    As much as I believe that one's attitude attitude can carry you far, passing is something that I really worked on when I decided that I wanted to go out, interact and mingle with people. The reason why I put so much emphasis on this is because I felt that I want to make people who I approach completely comfortable in dealing with me, and to ensure that I'm treated in an appropriate manner fitting of that role.

    With that said, fashion has a lot of ways to mask a lot of things that we feel would prevent us to pass in public. If we have a beard shadow, we use concealer to correct the color. If we have broad shoulders, we can use cardigans to mask their size. If we have no figure, there are blouses and body shapers that help define this more.

    This site, which I found a couple of weeks ago, has some of the basics but doesn't have tips on makeup:
    http://www.shopwiki.com/wiki/Figure-...thes+for+Women

    Of course, this forum has a wealth of information should your SO require it. Hope this helps and let us know how it goes!

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