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Thread: Im Afraid

  1. #1
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    Im Afraid

    I use the word "crossing" to sugest another perception on crossdressing. I use the term as the act of our spirit to cross over to the unkown world. To our world of insticts, impulses, and emotions.

    First lets look at what crossing is. From the stand point of an image, crossing is embodying the female form through material objects (clothes). Clothes are object in the world which hold no power of their own. They are not alive, they don't have a spirit, they are empty. They are material. But anybody here knows that is not what it seems like.

    Our hope is to understand the spirit that hides behind and within the clothes.

    The reason why im writing this is because I have been around this site and i seen middle-aged men and older men still crossing. Which is perfectly fine, whatever makes you happy. The thing that bothers me is that i see myself in your place. Which scares me. Not because im afraid of rejection or feel shame or guilt. I am genuinely scared.

    Im scared of realizing that what i feel as "me" is somehow always wrong. I don't want to be in your position. Because i want to deal with the hardships of life as 1 not as two. I don't want a different personality to get certain things from the world (attention, love, affection) just because the other is incapable of doing it. I want it to be all through one....ME! Not a side,Not a gender, but the androgynous ME!

    And if im still crossing at thirty then i feel what im writing now is empty. The person i am now is not actually here. As if there is something bigger which i am completely powerless against and no matter how much will i put into it will always checkmate me. And if thats true, then what is my life? What is my word? What is the point of trying to live as "you" when "you" don't exist? An empty vessel for something bigger.

    I have purged before. Each time different, in a different light. The last time was after a horrible birthday followed by couple of hours of crying/sleep intervals. It was then i realized that it is my younger self which needs to be loved. I crossed because i was incapable of loving myself since no one loved me. So i gave my younger self an illusion. A fabrication of the presence of my mother when she actually wasn't there. So i could get rid of the responsibility of loving my younger self.

    Im an adult now (early twenties) and i can't willingly and consciously divulge in fantasies, in illusions anymore. I am. And because I am then I am the only person capable of loving my younger self in all his innocence and mistakes. An illusion can't love him, she only showed me what i was missing.

    Yet im afraid.

    All this understanding yet i see in front of me future selves. And sayings like "it never leaves" or "it always comes back" which leave me with no defense or offense. And im afraid.

    Afraid that after ten years i might still be incapable of loving my younger self. After ten years i still might be tightly tugged under the bosom of my spirit mother, my anima, still chasing something that is not as real as me.

    Infact reality seems to be quite opposite. Here i think i will be thirty and living life as me, no need to consult material objects to get love. Yet i see the opposite. Men giving their anima names. Who have their own reasons and their own philosophy but i see myself in them, in you.

    And for you i have a few questions:

    Did you ever think that you will never cross again? If so how many times? And how sure were you? What was your reasoning behind it?

    How did it grow to be a bigger and bigger part of your life? When did you name her? Why?

    Do you ever feel "spiritually" trapped by the clothes?

    Rather then feeling guilty/shame afterwards do you ever feel empty?

  2. #2
    Kirra Scythe crusadergirl's Avatar
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    I never feel empty, guilt are shame its like i'm missing something. I too do not want to go tho the world as 2 different people yet that is what i do.
    The clothes don't make me who i am its what do that does.
    Good bye i'm at wacko taco .com now

  3. #3
    The 100th sheep GaleWarning's Avatar
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    The clothes are only that, clothes.
    I throw them away when they no longer fit or wear out.

    But your use of the word "spiritual" got me thinking on another tack.
    Is crossdressing a threat to one's personal spiritualism?

    Is that perhaps why you sometimes feel empty?

  4. #4
    Silver Member Jonianne's Avatar
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    Ruroken, obviously, you are super introspective. Probably, too much so. Some people have to find themselves by delving inside themselves, but often those of us who are extremely introspective already, must sometimes look outward and find ourselves in others, outside of ourselves. If we didn't get the love we needed as small children, it may take learning how to receive it from others, by really letting in the love others can give. It took me nearly 8 years in individual and group therapy to make a dent in learning that, but it was worth it.

    One way to find the love you need for yourself, is to give it to others. Volunteer, make yourself to be a part of social groups, find ways of helping and nurturing others. The more you give, the more you receive. In time, as you start to accept others as who they are, you also begin to accept yourself as you are and the fear gradually subsides.

    "I find my reflection in all those around, where inner connection so longed for is found" by Aliciaweb
    http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...t=#post1584489
    Last edited by Jonianne; 10-26-2010 at 04:22 AM.
    Joni

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  5. #5
    Fearfully MTF Steph.TS's Avatar
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    ruroken, I see you are having trouble here, I can't speak for you, but this have been some in the background of my life, at 4 I thought to myself what's it like to be a girl. at 12/13 I started to crossdress and my family showed their lack of approval, I purged a couple times but finally kicked it. this yer I started working with a beautiful woman that wear wonderful clothes, while I appreciated her beauty I was also jealous that I couldn't get away with wer those clothes or if I could I wouldn't look nearly as good.

    struggled with it several months but eventually gave in, once I felt I had enough scriptural information saying it was ok, since then I've realized that what I want is more than simply to wear clothing but to actually transition to become a woman.

    I hate to tell you this but from what I've read on here, people can keep dressing and purging their whole life, the only thing it'll get them is they have to go out and buy more clothes when they want to dress again. to uses your term 'checkmate' but I personally don't see it that way atleast not anymore, and I am still 'me' I'm simply more receptive to part of myself that I've ignored for years.

    to answer your questions:
    1. when I stopped after my family were opposed to it I thought I had beat it, but it came back with a vengeance. I was so sure I didn't even thing about it, and went on with my life, my idea was out of side out of mind, and it was sucessful for a time but it ultimately failed.

    2. well I explained that with the beautiful woman I work with once I started expressing myself even in private I started to realize what I ultimately wanted. the name I have selected I'm not sure I want to keep, I chose it as an alias so people IRL wouldn't know it's me, I'm thinking of Jane or Stephanie right now to be honest.

    3. only when I thought it was a sin, I even took off my fem clothing when I was going to pray to God, but after I found what was enough for me to indicate it was safe, I pray to God in whatever clothing I'm wearing.

    4. never empty because of my dressing, I look at my life that I've lived up until now, and it's that life I find to be empty, I never really lived my life, I was/still am afraid of what others think and what they might do. but I'm moving forward and feeling good about myself.

  6. #6
    Miss Conception Karren H's Avatar
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    Very well written and deep... But imho your over thinking the whole thing... For me I'm driven to crossdress and no amount of spiritual self examination into all those questions will change that fact.. That's why I accept what I do at face value and without question and make the best of it. Don't think I could live this way if I was always trying to analysis why.. I would go crazy... I am who I am and like what I like... Nothing wrong with that. And I have never felt empty for any reason..
    Current Obsession - Breasts and Lingerie!

    .......My Photos

  7. #7
    A Brave Freestyler JohnH's Avatar
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    I'm sorry if I sound a little bit abrupt in a masculine way.

    I do have some feminine feelings - otherwise I would not want to wear women's clothing. Before I allowed my feminine expression to develop I was chronically depressed - and that is not pleasing to God.

    Don't feel bad for wanting to wear feminine clothing. Women freely wear masculine clothing and no one thinks anything about it. We males simply are exercising something that should not be disapproved.

    I for one am glad I got past the stupid "masculinity anxiety" straitjacket of what a man can wear and what a man cannot wear. I still have to respect my wife's feelings, such as my not wearing a dress when she comes home from work.

    I will never purge my feminine clothing since it is wrong to throw out perfectly good items, and I realize I would buy more in the future to replace the discarded items. To purge my wardrobe of skirts, dresses, and heels would be the same as a woman purging her wardrobe of her plaid shirts, jeans, and hiking boots.

    And if anybody tries quoting Deuteronomy of how a man should not wear women's clothing point out that that passage forbids women from wearing men's clothing. Also that passage forbids mixing linen with wool.


    Kind regards,

    John
    Last edited by JohnH; 10-26-2010 at 08:17 AM.
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  8. #8
    fearless transowman juno's Avatar
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    Men are typically less in touch with their emotions than women. The result seems to be that crossdressing men are often confused about why they do it, and wonder "What am I?". You seem to be on a journey of getting in touch with your emotional side, but still have hangups from the early days of confusion. You just need to stop thinking of crossdressing as an attempt at being something you are not, and just listen to your feelings. There are people here who do a good job with the androgynous look. I have done plenty of feminine things in my life, but only started fully crossdressing around age 40. It is a lot of fun, but doesn't mean there is an identity crisis. Just relax and take pleasure in the things you like, without worrying about what it all means.

  9. #9
    Aspiring Member Freddy12's Avatar
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    Ruroken,
    I see that you are scared, and don't want to be 2 instead of 1. For many of us here, it's not a case of being two, but a case of letting one aspect of our being shine at one time, and another aspect shine at another time.

    When I am at a ball game, I may yell loudly for my team, and even get too enthusiastic. That's one aspect of who I am. When at a classical music concert, I am quiet and enjoy just sitting and listening. It's not that I'm 2, but there are different aspects of the 1.

    As we mature, many times we let different aspects of who we are come "out". I think that's what it is for me. I have always enjoyed women's clothes, but surpressed the urges. I purged, but have always come back. Now I embrace this aspect of who I am.

    Best wishes as you struggle with this.

    Freddy

  10. #10
    Aspiring Artist Kelly DeWinter's Avatar
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    Ruroken,

    A lot of deep thoughts there. From time to time people come to this site and post a thread, that suggests a 'new' aspect to being Transgendered or being a Crossdresser. Like you they don't like the idea of being a Crossdresser, and they purge, start over ,purge again. Vow that they can't live with themselves if they continue to dress. It becomes an endless cycle that wears them down mentaly,emotionaly,work, just about everything. OR you can take a deep breath, accept that you are who you are, and that that person is a great gal/guy who happens to like wearing the clothes of the opposite sex. Life become simple and enjoyable again. The fact that there is a whole community of people in the world composed of thousands of people in very diverse backgrounds should give you peace that you are not alone.
    Kelly DeWinter
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  11. #11
    Silver Member AKAMichelle's Avatar
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    Fear can hold you captive forever unless you conquer your fear. There is a point where the two spirits balance out into one functioning person. It takes time and understanding. I wish I could tell when you would feel that way, but I can't. I didn't begin to find my balance until I was 48 and I have it now at 50. You will know when you arrive at that point when fear no longer controls your every movement. When you feel the same way regardless of the clothes you are wearing. At that point you don't feel different when dressed but you. It becomes just an extension of you (a part only).

    It is a journey and the only advice that I can give you is to conquer your fear and enjoy the ride.
    Michelle

  12. #12
    Aspiring Member Christy_M's Avatar
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    You have a lot going on. I feel deeply for you as you work through these things. You see yourself in a lot of us becasue a lot of us have been you. You are fortunate that there is so much more acceptance than we had growing up. It doesn't make the feelings within go away but it certainly provides some light that there are people in this world that will love you regardless of the guilt, shame and even emptiness you decribe. You have your whole life in front of you and you have the ability to shape the path you choose based on your own comfort level and self acceptance criteria. I too have always felt it is ME and not some half to a bigger whole. I have feared my whole life that I may end up with split personality that I would wake up somewhere not knowing where I am and my bung hole hurting. I know now that isn't going to happen. My brain isn't wired that way. I have this part of my being that I have to express and since society doesn't accept it, it stays closeted (per se) with very limited time in public. You have a large support center here to work through these things and if you are comfortable with it, counselling is an option where you can seek professional cupport from someone who may actually have experience in dealing with these types of issues. They are harder to find but if you put in the work, you can get the right one.

    Now, for the questions:

    Did you ever think that you will never cross again? All my life. Early on, as soon as I put my stuff away, I knew it was the last time. All three of my marriages were intended to get me to stop (in my mind).

    If so how many times? Too many to count. I stopped purging when I was 38 becasue of the cost associated with it.

    And how sure were you? I was as sure of quitting as I was when I quit smoking. It's been 13 years on the smoking part and I am putting on pantyhose this morning - go figure

    What was your reasoning behind it? A strong sense that it was wrong and I shouldn't be doing it. I knew that if anyone found out, they would think I was a nut and not like me anymore.

    How did it grow to be a bigger and bigger part of your life? This has only happened a few time, one of which I am in the middle of now. I can't really say how but that the "need" became so strong that I made decisions that I wouldn't normally make in terms of buying in the open and/or dressing closer to typically taboo spots like the bedroom while my wife slept.

    When did you name her? Christy got her official name when I joined this site. Why? I had thought when I was younger what I would like to be called if I was a girl (ages 7 though 13) and had a list of derivitives of my real name (Chris). When I joined this site, Christy was entered into the page.

    Do you ever feel "spiritually" trapped by the clothes? That is a big loaded question. When I dress, I need to feel "pretty" or at least good about myself when dressed. Connecting spirituality with emotional perceptions like self loathing and/or self acceptance and then on to faith from above (which for me is at times mutually exclusive of spirituality) causes a huge turmoil in me. I do feel that the need to express myself en femme pushes my decision making into a different direction than the facade I created to deal with the harsh realities of life.

    Rather then feeling guilty/shame afterwards do you ever feel empty? Yes, all the time. There is a huge hole when I have dressed for hours and then have to get undressed and hide my stuff until the next time. As I get older, this hole seems too big to fill. When I dress, it goes away. once I get involved with my family or other activities, I think about it less but I find myself thinking about what I am going to wear the next time throughout most days.

    I am sorry for the long post but I hope you are able to gleen something from all the posts you read here. Your OP seems a little down on yourself and you should always know that who you are matters if for no other reason other than you are here. You give a lot of us middle aged folks a glimmer of hope that your days will be better than our days when we were your age. Thank you for that.

    Chris

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    Quote Originally Posted by Freddy12 View Post
    Ruroken,
    I see that you are scared, and don't want to be 2 instead of 1. For many of us here, it's not a case of being two, but a case of letting one aspect of our being shine at one time, and another aspect shine at another time.

    When I am at a ball game, I may yell loudly for my team, and even get too enthusiastic. That's one aspect of who I am. When at a classical music concert, I am quiet and enjoy just sitting and listening. It's not that I'm 2, but there are different aspects of the 1.

    As we mature, many times we let different aspects of who we are come "out". I think that's what it is for me. I have always enjoyed women's clothes, but surpressed the urges. I purged, but have always come back. Now I embrace this aspect of who I am.

    Best wishes as you struggle with this.
    See the thing is that i have not suppressed my urge. I expressed the shit out of it. And by doing that i began to understand and slowly it started to fade and become nothing. It was like all the content that was held within my "femine" side had been encorporated into my "self" (not male or female). All the emotions that had been locked away for years came back and it felt great. I feel great. I love being what i am right now. Im totally fine with crossing. I even spent couple of months wearing womens jeans in my apartment with roommates around. They didnt say anyhting. Eventually that wore thin too. And stopped wearing them because i got tired of it... it didnt excite me anymore because i was fine with it and so were the people around me.... so it was like wearing any type of clothing and became empty like my male clothes

    the reason fot the post was because we had a new roommate move in, an 18 year old girl. Which brought on not just the feeling to cross but also brought sexual fantasies with her. I crossed when i was younger because it was an attempt to "connect" with the females in my house who did not "connect" with me in a normal fashion (as a family). I knew this was going to happen before she moved in and i just observed it come on.

    And i have the urge to wear her clothing, not buy my own clothing otherwise i would have done it by now. Which i think is my "instict" to be loved by a girl. But since i can't do that otherwise i try to do it with her clothing (an introverted short cut).

    But i also had "daydreams" of me and her getting along basically like good friends or brother and sister which gave me a peace. even made me smile.

    Why im afraid is similar to the fear of some people who are afraid to be their parents. But no matter how much they think about it or try to be something different they somehow become like their father/mother. And that fear has no place to go when they are younger, yet it keeps an eye on the very thing they don't want to be like (their parent). My fear is keeping an eye on you guys and is strenghtened by sayings like "it always comes back." Theres nothing i can do about it because i havent lived that long and i have never met someone who has genuinley stopped crossing, not because of fear, shame, or guilt but because they just got over it.

    There is only one story here. JUST ONE. and thats "it always comes back".... wheres the other story? Where the story of "i grew out of it"?

  14. #14
    Silver Member Rhonda Jean's Avatar
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    I almost stayed away from this one because it seems to deep to tackle, and I'm not quite smart enough to sort through it. Here's my shot, though.

    "The other story?" I'm sure it happens, but you won't read it here because whoever "grew out of it" just wouldn't care anything about hanging around this forum anymore.

    Without slicing this issue too thinly, as much as you read the stuff on here with fear and dread of becoming too much like us, realize a little about who we are. First, take away our one similarity, that to one extent or another we all like dressing like women. I know that's a stretch, but hang in there. Without knowing us, what do you think you have left that defines us as a group? Probably nothing! I tend to think of us as a little more compasionate than the norm, maybe even smarter, maybe even more financially successful. But maybe not. It doesn't matter. If your fear is that you'll become like me or like anyone else on this board, then you have little to fear. You'll be you, of course! Whether you view this thing of ours as a blessing or a curse, you'll find your own balance with it, just like the rest of us have.

    Will you do it forever? Who knows. If you don't want to you don't have to. You'll probably cycle through a lot of interests in your life that at the time you're doing them it seems like you'll do them forever. If you were on a golf forum you probably wouldn't find any who'd quit that either. (And before anybody chastises me, yes, I know it's more than a hobby!)

    You see snapshots of peoples lives on here. Keep in mind that most, if not all, of us have very well adjusted and fulfilling lives outside of obsessing over our hair and makeup. That's just the only snapshot that merits discussion on this board. If it turns out that you crossdress for the rest of your life, whether that's a blessing or a curse, that won't be everything you are. It's not everything "we" are. This is just a snapshot.

    One other thing... I've been accused of being overly analytical. You, sweetheart, have redefined overly analytical. Thanks for getting that off of me!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhonda Jean View Post

    One other thing... I've been accused of being overly analytical. You, sweetheart, have redefined overly analytical. Thanks for getting that off of me!
    hahaha thanks i guess. but i guess u (or i) have to be somewhat analytical about this. it just so happens the first step is a step into a spiral and the only way to get out is analyis things around you. analytical does have "anal" in it.... hmmm....

    and yes that does make sense and the more i do read the posts of people here the more im actually understanding where you guys are comming from and where you are. i can tell you one thing though which im telling myself really.... is that my life has been waaayyy different then most people here. i came from a third world country when i was a kid, leaving my family behind. so i have a little different perspective. when i was a kid i was a kid. i didnt do anything fem or anything. i roamed around my village, played with sticks, looked at the stars and did a whole bunch of stuff that i loved.

    Every since crossing i just never felt that way. like crossing is suppressing that side of me rather then the other way around. but it wasnt crossing that put me in a hole it was my reality. crossing just served to tell me what happened when i got old enough to understand it, and thats what i have been doing. but i feel like if i continue to cross it will keep me in the hole that i fell in when i was younger. keep me attached to a fantasy of a mother. i dont care about fitting in, im an outsider in this country to begin with. dont care about shame or guilt (no family near me). all i care about is the truth.

    I just have to ease my mind of my unfounded fears, thats why im on here. To bud heads with you guys and try to understand your situation, your perspective, your phiosophy so i don't stereotype and paint everybody with a broad brush (i would be painting myself with it too) thats the only way i will ease my fears, by confronting them....


    so.... thank you

  16. #16
    Formerly Deborah Whitney
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karren Hutton View Post
    Very well written and deep... But imho your over thinking the whole thing... For me I'm driven to crossdress and no amount of spiritual self examination into all those questions will change that fact.. That's why I accept what I do at face value and without question and make the best of it. Don't think I could live this way if I was always trying to analysis why.. I would go crazy... I am who I am and like what I like... Nothing wrong with that. And I have never felt empty for any reason..
    I gotta agree with Karren. I've been doing this, off and on, for a long time .. nearly forty years. I still periodically go through periods of what I'll call "angst" because I'm just lazy that way ... the angst really gets old, and nowadays when I feel it coming on, I'm like, "meh".

    Life is too short to dwell on stuff you can't change. Yeah, sometimes I wish that I could change it, that I could stop crossing ... but for me, I've faced that it just ain't gonna happen; my wife is more accepting of me than I myself am, and that's not right (hey I love that my wife loves me so much, don't get me wrong -- it's just that I should be in the same spot).

    It's so much easier when you allow yourself to be yourself, without hating a part of yourself, without wishing for the umpteenth time that you could just quit.

    I invite you to step into the light. It's a damn long hard road, but the steps get easier the more you take.

  17. #17
    Complex Lolita...
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    Quote Originally Posted by ruroken
    Im scared of realizing that what i feel as "me" is somehow always wrong. I don't want to be in your position. Because i want to deal with the hardships of life as 1 not as two. I don't want a different personality to get certain things from the world (attention, love, affection) just because the other is incapable of doing it. I want it to be all through one....ME! Not a side,Not a gender, but the androgynous ME!
    [SIZE="2"]Try looking at it from the standpoint (or idea) of gender integration, with crossdressing merely as the surface aspect of what is really going on inside. I am me, regardless of whether I’m dressed or not. The clothes just bring me closer to a state that I am desirous of, consisting of tactile sensations and their attendant mental benefits. My basic under-painting is androgynous...[/SIZE]

    Did you ever think that you will never cross again? If so how many times? And how sure were you? What was your reasoning behind it?
    [SIZE="2"]Crossing over and not crossing over is the same thing. I’m standing at the junction of the two genders, making a third by straddling the line. It’s not a conscious decision to be in one place or another. My shape-shifting is ongoing, and it’s not a struggle for control...[/SIZE]

    How did it grow to be a bigger and bigger part of your life? When did you name her? Why?
    [SIZE="2"]I named “her” purely for purposes of posting on this forum. I only have one personality.[/SIZE]

    Do you ever feel "spiritually" trapped by the clothes?
    [SIZE="2"]I really don’t believe in spirituality, via clothing or not, so I never feel trapped (by any definition).[/SIZE]

    Rather then feeling guilty/shame afterwards do you ever feel empty?
    [SIZE="2"]I never feel empty. I feel fulfilled, complete, and satisfied...[/SIZE]

  18. #18
    Silver Member Kathryn Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ruroken View Post
    Im scared of realizing that what i feel as "me" is somehow always wrong. I don't want to be in your position. Because i want to deal with the hardships of life as 1 not as two. I don't want a different personality to get certain things from the world (attention, love, affection) just because the other is incapable of doing it. I want it to be all through one....ME! Not a side,Not a gender, but the androgynous ME!

    Did you ever think that you will never cross again? If so how many times? And how sure were you? What was your reasoning behind it?

    How did it grow to be a bigger and bigger part of your life? When did you name her? Why?

    Do you ever feel "spiritually" trapped by the clothes?

    Rather then feeling guilty/shame afterwards do you ever feel empty?
    While I have dressed very occasionally, I have spent my life becoming Kathryn Martin. She is one. I have cultivated my female soul, I have lived in gestation of my self and have taught her, comforted her and loved her. And when she was ready, some six months ago she was named by my life companion and was complete. Then, she learned to dress and to socialize. I have found that my birth was a phase transition, the sublimation of my male solidity to my female fluidity. When you speak of being trapped by clothes, I see the trappings weighed against your femaleness and find in the emptiness that she may be too light.

    Bodies and Clothes are just cloaks we wear not what identifies us or makes us whole. Nurture her, but without the trappings, and give up loving her proxies, she needs your love, not the clothes.
    Last edited by Kathryn Martin; 10-26-2010 at 08:29 PM.
    "Never forget the many ways there are to be human" (The Transsexual Taboo)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bethany Marie View Post
    I gotta agree with Karren. I've been doing this, off and on, for a long time .. nearly forty years. I still periodically go through periods of what I'll call "angst" because I'm just lazy that way ... the angst really gets old, and nowadays when I feel it coming on, I'm like, "meh".

    Life is too short to dwell on stuff you can't change. Yeah, sometimes I wish that I could change it, that I could stop crossing ... but for me, I've faced that it just ain't gonna happen; my wife is more accepting of me than I myself am, and that's not right (hey I love that my wife loves me so much, don't get me wrong -- it's just that I should be in the same spot).

    It's so much easier when you allow yourself to be yourself, without hating a part of yourself, without wishing for the umpteenth time that you could just quit.

    I invite you to step into the light. It's a damn long hard road, but the steps get easier the more you take.
    aahhh see theres my problem. As if stepping into the light belongs only in the realm of me being a female. As if "stepping into the light" could not be the other side. Theres also this willing assumption of guilt/shame/fear. Not everyone has that. I dont hate that part of myself at all. But i don't like it, i dont like it in the same way i don't like my male side. They are both too one sided.

    Heres my point....

    The balance like buddha said "is the middle way," not a third gender but no gender. Thats what i feel i am at. The begining of my "will." And my will does not want to be tied down to clothes because i consider it a protective shell, which protected me from ther harsh realities of life (like a mother does). But since i understand both sides, the other side says "your wrong" just a fear that im wrong. not something that is substantial but just a feeling, a small feeling which existis and is supported by people who believe "it always comes back" and "i cant change it". Now your situation might be different then mine... it most likely is. Some might be born with it others (like myself) used it to compensate for a lack of love.

    but this philosophy that people on this site hold might do harm to us younger kids who might have different reasons for doing it. To me its like the female side holds more power...but only for one reason and thats because its socially inacceptable. Its like if you go to the side thats socially acceptable --- your running away. If you go over to the female side--- your running to. the balance has nothing to do with whether its acceptable or not. This power might be in my head only or it also might exist outside, in groups, and in society.

    you ever wonder if there are any straight gay guys just like there are gay straight guys? Laws of the universe (there are no absolutes) say its true. But nobody would ever question a straight gay guy, while everybody jumps on the gay straight guy.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frédérique View Post
    [SIZE="2"]Try looking at it from the standpoint (or idea) of gender integration, with crossdressing merely as the surface aspect of what is really going on inside. I am me, regardless of whether I’m dressed or not. The clothes just bring me closer to a state that I am desirous of, consisting of tactile sensations and their attendant mental benefits. My basic under-painting is androgynous...[/SIZE]
    totally agree. The image is the very surface of whats going on. The real substance is within.

    But has anyone ever tried to get the content from the anima inside in any other way? other then crossing

  21. #21
    Aspiring Member Bethany38's Avatar
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    Ruroken, here are my responses to your ?'s


    And for you i have a few questions:

    Did you ever think that you will never cross again? Oh yes When I was a younger man I had a lot of guilt and shame over dressing. If so how many times? A few, when I was in my early teens. Then I buried that part of me so deep She stayed away for thirty years, What a waste! And how sure were you? I was, without any doubt in my mind, going to succeed. What was your reasoning behind it? Many reasons the shame and guilt I felt. My grandfather was a C.D. and was talked about like a freak. I can remember my Father telling me I had better never turn out like that panty wearing f#&&*t. So from my earliest memories I know there was something wrong with me. I did not want to let my Family down, I did not want to go to hell, All I wanted was to be normal. I did not know then that normal for me is dressing as a she.

    How did it grow to be a bigger and bigger part of your life? As I said earlier I repressed her for thirty some odd years. Bethany re-emerged one fateful night whist the Wife and I were playing around and I put on a pair of her stockings. When did you name her? I named her the very day I joined this site. I knew her name without thought though. I have always loved the name Bethany. Why? It would be kind of awkward trying to present as femme and be introduced by my male name.

    Do you ever feel "spiritually" trapped by the clothes? No I used to have a whole lot of spiritual guilt over my dressing. Some times I still do, but I have talked with different theologians and they do not seem to believe (my crossing as you put it) is that big a deal.

    Rather then feeling guilty/shame afterwords do you ever feel empty? Nope
    One day your life is going to pass before your eye's, Make sure it is worth watching.

    Eddie Izzard said it best "I am an action tranvestite".





    http://www.flickr.com/photos/bethanyannstratford/

  22. #22
    . Aprilrain's Avatar
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    I think it is incorrect to say that clothes have no power and they are empty. Of course they are empty literally and figuratively when no one is wearing them but put them on and both wearer and clothing change. The human mind is hard wired to interact with and to interpret symbols. In a highly organized and advanced society clothing is a powerful symbol. Leaving the whole gender expression issue aside look at all of the different ways people can dress within the norms of a single gender. What you wear when and where are often very important. One does not go to a formal wedding without a suit or dress on for instance. You would however look quite odd climbing a utility pole in such garb. On the other hand I could have no business climbing a utility pole but if I were wearing coveralls leather gloves and a hard hat no one would think twice. We usually wear what is comfortable say jeans and a teeshirt but most of us can't wear that to work why because some type of uniform or dress code is the standard. Imagin the person who read your electric meter wondering around the neiborhood without some type of identifying uniform on S/he would soon be have a talk with the police.

    The point being that for most of us on this site there is a real and subsatial power that comes from cross dressing. For many it is an imparative that society interact with them as female and society knows to do that by interpreting our symbols.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aprilrain View Post
    I think it is incorrect to say that clothes have no power and they are empty. Of course they are empty literally and figuratively when no one is wearing them but put them on and both wearer and clothing change. The human mind is hard wired to interact with and to interpret symbols. In a highly organized and advanced society clothing is a powerful symbol. Leaving the whole gender expression issue aside look at all of the different ways people can dress within the norms of a single gender. What you wear when and where are often very important. One does not go to a formal wedding without a suit or dress on for instance. You would however look quite odd climbing a utility pole in such garb. On the other hand I could have no business climbing a utility pole but if I were wearing coveralls leather gloves and a hard hat no one would think twice. We usually wear what is comfortable say jeans and a teeshirt but most of us can't wear that to work why because some type of uniform or dress code is the standard. Imagin the person who read your electric meter wondering around the neiborhood without some type of identifying uniform on S/he would soon be have a talk with the police.

    The point being that for most of us on this site there is a real and subsatial power that comes from cross dressing. For many it is an imparative that society interact with them as female and society knows to do that by interpreting our symbols.
    i agree and well put. any and all emotions/sensations we have attached to clothing comes from us.

  24. #24
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    AHA! Found it.

    "article about crossdressing"

    At midlife, he experiences unhappiness due to the unrealistic and limiting nature of his masculine persona. At this time he may feel a strong, even overpowering interest in wearing women's clothes, or of being a woman in fantasy. This urge is natural and healthy: it is because his completeness as a person requires expressing the potentials he has repressed.

    Lacking societal cues that validate or guide his impulses, he experiences confusion. The world says crossdressing is wrong, but his 'heart' says it is right. Guilt, shame, moral concerns, and his own overly idealized view of masculinity constrain his crossdressing. He also asks questions like "Am I gay" and "Should I change my sex?" The stage of confusion can last years and decades. The crossdresser may dress often, delve into the culture of crossdressing, or even take female hormones. Or he may remain highly closeted. But the hallmark of this phase is that he remains confused and highly ambivalent, uncertain how to proceed.

    This seems a terminal point for many. However, the theories of Jung and others imply that this is not the proper end point, but merely arrested development.

    If the crossdressing urge is really adaptive--a response by the organism to remove barriers that have effectively repressed half of the man's potentials--we can speculate that further developmental stages are possible: The crossdresser recognizes the positive, healing meaning of crossdressing. At this point, crossdressing becomes supported, rather than rejected, by the ego; he may then pursue crossdressing as a constructive activity, now freed from previous moral constraints. But, by the same token, recognition of the positive meaning of the urges also brings an appreciation of sensible limits.

    The crossdresser gradually experiences his "inner female." As he does, he finds parts that are of fundamental importance, and realizes that these transcend labels of 'male' or 'female'. He also learns to distinguish the positive, profound parts of the anima (spirituality, love, beauty, etc.) from the trivial (promiscuity, vanity, etc.).

    For a while the crossdresser experiences his male and female personalities as distinct. Eventually he allows parts of the female into his ordinary male personality. This stage gradually merges with the next.

    The inclusion of the female effects a change in the male personality, producing a new personality that is better than either alone. The female empowers and transforms the male. This stage is ongoing. The new self continues to grow--presumably in the direction of greater spirituality and service to others.

    [SIZE="4"]It is consistent with the anima theory that the urge to crossdress may diminish during these later stages. The crossdresser now understands that it was not the clothing or being a woman that he sought--these merely symbolized the deeper aspects of his personality he sought to express. Once he experiences and expresses these aspects directly, female clothing itself has less meaning and importance.[/SIZE]
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelly DeWinter View Post
    Ruroken,

    A lot of deep thoughts there. From time to time people come to this site and post a thread, that suggests a 'new' aspect to being Transgendered or being a Crossdresser. Like you they don't like the idea of being a Crossdresser, and they purge, start over ,purge again. Vow that they can't live with themselves if they continue to dress. It becomes an endless cycle that wears them down mentaly,emotionaly,work, just about everything. OR you can take a deep breath, accept that you are who you are, and that that person is a great gal/guy who happens to like wearing the clothes of the opposite sex. Life become simple and enjoyable again. The fact that there is a whole community of people in the world composed of thousands of people in very diverse backgrounds should give you peace that you are not alone.
    never read this article before...

    and it was this that i am trying to convey. If somebody comes to you at this stage of his crossing do you just tell him that he needs to accept his crossing and give in?

    "Its okay if you feel shame and guilt."
    "Don't hate that part of you."
    "just accept yourself"

    There is definitely a dogma attached to certain people's philosophy. its as if that group constantly negates the idea that you can actually "grow out of it" by accepting "it always returns" and spreading that philosophy around. And it was that which scared me. As someone who is young and has much less experience in life i am liable to listen to older person's words and especially about a topic such as this.

    When i started yesterday it was this inevitable truth that scared me. That there were/are people who have thought of this as over but always returned. You have no defense/offense for that. And because your left in the middle the fear of not knowing becomes bigger and bigger. And no body can give you a good perspective. All the perspectives are coming from one side and some are even dogmatic.
    Last edited by ruroken; 10-27-2010 at 02:54 AM.

  25. #25
    Member TinaMc's Avatar
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    Well the article says that it's only anima theory that suggests that it may be the case that the urge diminishes. I wonder if Jung actually witnessed that happening, or if it's just a part of the theory? Which incidentally was highly speculative anyway (anima and animus are constructs of the theory and don't exist in reality, a lot like Freud's id, ego and superego).

    People can only really talk about their experiences, and it seems that for most crossdressers they purge and then un-purge. This is also in the literature. It may well be that you can stop it or grow out of it or what have you. I'd say that the healthiest way would be to try more to integrate the feminine side of you into your normal existence, sure. That's definitely got to be better than throwing all your clothes away as an expression of the shame and guilt you feel about what you are doing. Can it be done though? I'm not convinced.

    Am I right in thinking that your negative feelings towards crossdressing are that you don't really want to picture yourself as a middle aged crossdresser? Maybe you should focus less on the future, it's a bit of a trap. When I was 19 I was supposed to be a multimillionaire by the time I hit 35, but here I am and I'm basically skint ...

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