Bars and Coffee

[Sam-antha]

In general I find that the most accepting places to sit with others, chat and just be, are those of the Lesbian grouping.
Gay places are often filled with bed seekers of all kinds.
Is this your experience in the States or in the UK ? Particularly in the UK.
Incidentally I do sometimes feel to be an intruder when I go into a known Lesbian "cafe". But I rather think that this is my imagination.

[Jasmine Ellis]

Hi Sam. I'm from the UK. I'm not gay but I do think for cross dressers gay and lesbian bars and coffee shops are the best ones to go in! You don't have to go to bed with them to become good friends. Just sit and talk they know you are a cross dresser and you soon will be part of the family cos I do know a lot of gays and lesbians. As friends and do have a good laugh.

[Sarah Roberts]

I have been diing to get out of the closet and I was told that this is the best place to start. What was it like for you and are they really that excepting of us sudoo women.
I would love to be able to sit and have a nice cup of coffee and chat with some of the girls or boys and just chat. No sex, just get to know them. I think it would be so much fun.
Any tips on where to find these places?

Havae fun girls

Zaria

[Jasmine Ellis]

When you do find a gay and lesbian bar. Where a long skirt not a short one. Wear a nice top with sleeves but not low cut. Order a drink and sit by the bar never look at anyone never smile at anyone. If the barman talks to you then talk back he may be there to see if there is any information he can tell the otheres. Only tell him what you want him to know.
Or maybe, someone could also come and start talking to you. Which ever it is somewhere in the conformation let it nowen you are a straight cross dresser but never at the begining or at the end and always smile as you speek, never look down never make eye contack just be who you are a staright cross dresser and you soon have friends that you can talk to.
This is how I started out on my first day. Yes, it's nerve-racking, at the bar your nervous system is all over the place but that fisrt sip of your drink makes it all go away. I just hope this helps

[Sam-antha]

Do you have that wonderful book "A Roughguide to...." It lists some places suitable. If you do not know the book, it is not "rough" in the sex sense, just in the "approx" info style guide.

Look for CD and TV in Google

Good hunting

[Jasmine Ellis]

Hi Sam dear, no I have not got that book. Any good?

[Sam-antha]

Please understand that this book is a tourist guide. I do not know if it covers countries other than the Uk.
If you are Uk interested, then it is a starter book covering the cities and it is fine.

[Jasmine Ellis]

Hi Sam, yes I'm in the UK

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

FYI, the "Rough Guide" series has guide books on many countries and specific locales.

But back to the original question, gay and lesbian spots generally are accepting of folks on the TG spectrum because we face similar sorts of discrimination. OTOH, gays and lesbians often aren't much more knowledgable about CD/TG/TGs than the average straight person (although they usually know we're not drag queens and therefore are typically hetro).

Every so often you'll across someone who's got a problems -- gay men who think we're reinforcing the stereotype of the effete (gay) man and lesbians whose feminist ideology sees CD/TG/TSs as another way of men appropriating women's power, etc. But those are generally far and few between and for the most part, my experience is that they're willing to live and let live.

It's possible someone might flirt with you but to be honest, we're usually not sexually appealing to either gays or lesbians. Gays usually want other masculine men, and lesbians know what's between our legs and that's not what interests them. It's possible you'll have some friendly conversation, but especially at bars where gays and lesbians are out to meet people, you may find yourself benignly ignored -- i.e. they're not shunning you, you're just low on their interest level.

OTOH, if you want to be the social butterfly and strike up conversation, they're not going to run away. But you need to be judicious about this just as if you were doing the same thing en homme at a party, i.e. don't bust in on a couple who are making a play at other, or friends who are deep in a personal conversation, etc. That said, it can be easier to be the social butterfly (in gay, straight and mixed bars), because as a "third sex" there's not the usual sexual under-current. For example, en femme I complimented a GG on her top and we got into a nice conversation -- which probably wouldn't have happened if I was en homme, because she would've thought I was hitting on her.

Anyway, go have fun!

[sherri]

When you do find a gay and lesbian bar. Where a long skirt not a short one. Wear a nice top with sleeves but not low cut. Order a drink and sit by the bar never look at anyone never smile at anyone. If the barman talks to you then talk back he may be there to see if there is any information he can tell the otheres. Only tell him what you want him to know.
Or maybe, someone could also come and start talking to you. Which ever it is somewhere in the conformation let it nowen you are a straight cross dresser but never at the begining or at the end and always smile as you speek, never look down never make eye contack just be who you are a staright cross dresser and you soon have friends that you can talk to.
This is how I started out on my first day. Yes, it's nerve-racking, at the bar your nervous system is all over the place but that fisrt sip of your drink makes it all go away. I just hope this helps

Jasmin, I'm curious as to why you say no eye contact, no smiles etc?

You're probably right about the conservative dress, but I kind of flaunt that. No, not kind of, I do flaunt it. I'm clubbing, I'm wearing my mini. That's what makes my skinny legs look best, lesbians aren't interested and gays are a long shot, so I wear what I want. By the way, I almost never see lesbians at the clubs in anything other than jeans.

[CaptLex]

Jasmin, I'm curious as to why you say no eye contact, no smiles etc?

I'd be curious to hear the answer to that also, since I've never had a problem with that. As an FtM who likes to dress for a night on the town, I find that gay and lesbian bars are the most comfortable places to do so. Nobody cares, nobody judges - although people do assume I'm a lesbian. I'm okay with that, but I realize I'll never find a guy who might be interested in me in any of those places.

Anyway, I agree that they're good hangouts for us, but I find that gays and lesbians are just as unaware as straights regarding crossdressing, so you may get some questions and disbelieving looks.

[Jasmine Ellis]

Hi Sherribi, well, I think eyes and a smile at some one as you walk in or as you sit and looking around and seeing a guy looking at you, might make him think you are interested. All I was saying let them get to know you and you getting to know them and keep going into the same place so you can become friends, gays and lesbians are lovely people to know and you can have fun talking to them as much as they are talking to you dear. I didn't mean anything of it......I feel more at home in one of those bars then going into a cafe knowing no one is laughing at me or taking fun out of me hun. Like I have said I didn't mean anythink by it!

[Jasmine Ellis]

Sam was asking in general, asking us I think, how to stay away from "bed seekers" Her question, which I think I replied in the right way.

[sherri]

Like I have said I didn't mean anythink by it!

Baby, I didn't think you meant anything by it. I just wanted to know the thinking behind your strategy.

But here's my take on that: Not good. See, I tend to be a contradiction, bold in action but shy about personal encounters. Doubly shy when I'm dressed and out. So my natural inclination is to go into a gay club, sit alone at the bar, mind my own business and hope someone will strike up a conversation. Except for showing up, totally passive. Problem is, the other people there, who don't understand me in the first place, are likely to see me all alone and withdrawn and think I'm weird or aloof or something. Not good. It will always be a struggle for me, but I know I have to reach out too.

[Kierci]

In general I find that the most accepting places to sit with others, chat and just be, are those of the Lesbian grouping.
Gay places are often filled with bed seekers of all kinds.
Is this your experience in the States or in the UK ? Particularly in the UK.
Incidentally I do sometimes feel to be an intruder when I go into a known Lesbian "cafe". But I rather think that this is my imagination.

Sam we have a gay club/restaurant here in Scottsdale AZ its kinda kool you can walk in there and either sit at the bar or sit alone and watch everyone the wait staff treat you just like another patron, they dont judge you for what your wearing, I dont feel any kind of pressure there at all.

[Jocelyn Renee]

My wife and I love GLBT bars. Drag shows are a popular weekly event at many bars these days, so there is generally at least a small regular contingent of TG folks. Plus, without the sexual tension, it's a lot easier to just get to know folks and have fun.

Cheers,
Jocelyn

[Kierci]

How very true Jocelyn, it is amazing how many people think this is all about (having)sex. If I had to guess I would say that couldn't be further from the truth for the majority of us.