I often think "why not???" Many of the results are amazing!
that way , you could dress, go fully fem and pass. Then return to your normal male life. If it wasn't for certain restrictions, I really think I would.
-Gen
I often think "why not???" Many of the results are amazing!
that way , you could dress, go fully fem and pass. Then return to your normal male life. If it wasn't for certain restrictions, I really think I would.
-Gen
Problem with facial feminization are the side effects and horror stories ><
Like, on chin surgery.. you can lose some control of your lip (making some sounds harder to say) or lose sensation.
And then there is the entire period of recovery, where you are bandaged up like crazy! (try to explain that at work :P)
Then, there are the repeated visits. From what I have been reading, things might not go perfect the first time (so you have to keep spending more to get things fixed).
Though... even with all of that... still seems pretty interesting. And if you are getting surgery to feminize your face, you are just a couple steps away from going all the way :P
Stuff to think about thanks.
I just am being to hopeful maybe.
i think i'd like to.
Alana! You're close to perfect. What would you change?
only if I am able to accept myself as TS, and make my peace with it.
hahaOriginally Posted by Mrogredick
I think just my chin a bit (lessen the distance from my lip to my chin), and maybe work on my hairline. Overall my face is more rectangular than square, and to get it more feminine I'd like it to be a little less long.
otherwise i am pretty happy with my face as a lady.
i've never really liked my nose, but a lot of people tell me they like it and that it suits my face... and on the other hand my mom hates her nose tooso i guess I can live with that.
i don't really even see it as facial feminization, because most of my life i've been wanting to make these changes, before i even knew what a transsexual was even. it's just the way ive seen myself.
Last edited by Avana; 01-02-2011 at 02:07 AM.
I don't want to poop on your thread if it is just a fun "what if" thought. If so, then just ignore the comments that follow.If not, you might like a take on the reality of doing this and continuing to live in a predominately non-TG community.
How can a man who has a feminized face return to a normal male life? Or, while on the subject, how can a man with female breasts (implants, not gynecomastia) continue his normal life as a man?
I'm not wanting to be negative, but I do believe that the way people initially (and perhaps continue to) react to all of us has a great deal to do with first impressions, which is based on general appearance and the vibes that we put out. And people in general don't deal well with ambiguous gender. It makes them feel uncomfortable. This is why there is cultural anxiety about CDers and why the CDers have a hard time out in public. Or, if the CDers do master their presentation (providing they have the physiognomy to do so) they still find it difficult to make friends outside the TG/LGBQ community who will habitually do things with them dressed in the same way they would otherwise. Think of all the people you know. If you came out to them today and decided you wanted to do the same things with them dressed, would they all take it in stride and continue the friendship and the activities the same way as before?
I dislike this as much as anyone else here, but CDers are thought of as being odd at best, and even if people are polite enough not to say anything, they won't easily continue all their same activities with their dressed CD friends. So FFS (by this I mean real feminization, not just a nose job) and breast augmentation makes it even more apparent that a male (who wants to preserve his normal male life) is gender ambiguous.
I suppose there are the independent types who decide they are who they are and to h*ll with the rest. They will find happiness with a small circle of acquaintances, or if they live in an area with a sizable GLBTQ community, their lives might revolve around it. But, that's not for everyone. Edited to add there are also the genderqueers among the younger generation, and perhaps they find it easier to mingle in the mainstream than their predecessors (depending on where they live), but life as a genderqueer still does present its challenges.
My point is that I think it's hard to live on the fence unless you are the independent type I've just mentioned. It's hard enough being TS and dealing with complete feminization. I should think it would be even harder to solidly entrench yourself in the nether world of in-between. Might as well go all the way, whether you decide to have SRS or not.
That's just my. I wanted to open my thoughts to your and other people's comments, since I have read quite a few threads by CDers who want to permanently feminize themselves, but not go all the way and live full-time (with or without SRS). I've always wondered how they rationalize doing this.
Last edited by ReineD; 01-02-2011 at 04:12 AM. Reason: spelling
Reine
i don't know... i think your post is very cynical. lots of hard truth there, but the outlook seems so very cynical.
i guess i am an idealist and one of the 'independent types' you mention (which i take issue with in itself below), but i believe outward (societal) change starts from within and one of the things (not the only thing of course) preventing inward change is inbred cynicism like this.
Also as a biologically male person who lives fairly comfortably from day to day as 'genderqueer' and plays dress-up as a full on 'woman', I don't think it's fair to label people like myself as mere 'independent types', who are exceptions to some rule of gender binaries. I think the future of gender is far more progressive than this, and I'm excited to be at the cutting edge.
BINGO! You're my new best friend if you let me!
I guess I playfully simplified an idea that deserves more input. I have seen some video and had friends who were corssdressing, trans, ladyboy..or geez whatever label ......and they make STUNNING females when they dress up and play that role. I have also seen them take the make up off and engage in daily routine as men.
I thought it was a cool concept that's all.
To tell you where I'm coming from, I was raised by an overbearing violent mother and a controlling oder sister.
For many years, while I was young they made me wear dresses, tights, and pretty shoes. They surely instilled a confusion in me. I wanted to be like them. I remember watching them shop at this store called Clothestime which way near our house. I so wanted to go with them try on the denim skirts and white tights.
So what was at one point a little joke to them became such an innate desire of mine. In fact, if my parents weren't old school immigrants or had an open mind about what would make me happy, they should have put me on hormones because there was no point in my youth until now where I enjoyed being a man.
I recall being 11 years old wearing my sisters dress praying to god to make me a girl. I was raised to believe that he could do anything.
I could go on and on but I''ll save it for another time
Sorry,I ranted a little but I don't want anyone to think that I'm making light of something that is quite painful and complex to many of us.
The main pint of the post is that it would be possible for some to get minor adjustments done to their appearance and depending on how this person represents himself, it could be quite possible to exists as both male and female.
Alana, to be cynical is to be skeptical, but with scorn. I can promise you that I don't put down or judge anyone who wants to do this, and I don't scorn anyone.
I am also in a rather odd position for a member in this forum. I've read thousands of threads over the course of 4 years, I'm fully and enthusiastically supportive of everyone here including my SO who is dualgender, and at the same time I can be objective when it comes to dealing with issues in the non-TG world because I'm not caught up in the struggles for self-acceptance or acceptance by others. I'll admit that I tend to be analytical, but it is in the spirit of putting everything out in the light and on the table for discussion, and not as a put down.
I applaud you for being genderqueer. I have friends who are genderqueer as well and I admire them. But my impression from the OP was that he wanted to get back to a "normal male life" after FFS, which is entirely different. It was in this this spirit that I responded the way I did.
I don't think there's anything wrong with being independent and unwilling to follow the crowd, but if you feel offended by being categorized as such, I'll edit the particular paragraph in my post to also include genderqueer.
To Mrogredick, there's nothing wrong with your wishes, your needs, or your question.
Last edited by ReineD; 01-02-2011 at 04:04 AM.
Reine
Hi,
This was brought up to me , would i have F F S at the time of my other surgerys the idear sounded great now then im 63. & would there be any point . you quess. ill say later.
One of my friends who is a trans has had hers done , now i know her & met her over in austraila for her yes it was good & of cause iv seen the changes take place for her over the last 3 years. she is about 1 / 2 my age. & yea its good.
I have never tryed to look any different than who i am & how i look . i have not tryed to be a girle girl its just not who i am. i did not try to be male ether. being both is who i am.
For me its not about my looks as a woman its about being accepted for who i am if it were about looks then no i dont look much like a woman.so would surgery help me , to answer , its no, because i have acceptance & thats more important to me than how i look . & as a woman.
...noeleena...
I have had a few TS friends over the years who had the whole FFS treatment (as opposed to just one cosmetic procedure such as a nose job or such.) Their recovery was brutal, and I mean brutal; it looked like someone unloaded on them with a baseball bat. They all said the pain was far worse than their SRS and it was really miserable for weeks afterward.
They both, more or less, said it is not the kind of thing one wants to go through unless they really have to (and their ability to blend and survive depends on it.)
Not to mention the expense, I believe it rivals, or surpasses the cost of SRS.
I just want to fix my hairline, thin my nose and remove my adams apple. I think I can live with the rest.
No surgery for me, facial or otherwise. I'm just going to try and do the best I can with clothes, makeup and attitude.
Not unless I had a partner who thought of me as a woman Hon.
Second star to the right and straight on till morning
Reine was just pointing out the "freak of nature aspect" to surgical modifications.I think there are a few ways non surgically that help a face become less gender specific...Getting rid of wrinkles,SLIGHT lip injections,hair removal,skin rejuvanation,all help a whole lot. Put the makeup on,and you are mostly there...certainly good enough..Are you going to change your neck and cut off your man hands as well? Of course not!!You have to make the best of what you already have.Living as a freak of nature could get very lonely.
Wow, Reine, you hit this subject pretty hard. "The lady doth protest too much, methinks."
I took the OP as meaning only changing enough to make passing more possible, as in her last statement.I agree that, for me anyway, its important to maintain my masculinity to stay connected to the non-cd world - which I do. But I would also love to not have such masculine facial features (ie my chin) that keep me from blending very well. I will never have such surgery because I don't have the finances, neither am I willing to take the substanial risks involved, but it certainly has been an idea I've pondered.
I also fear for those who can never be satisfied with their looks and even though they look perfectly fine, still opt for more surgery. Myself, I would want an independant panel that would be able to say "change this or that to keep your face from shouting 'male', but let the rest be just as it is, it's blendable enough".
Joni
"Yes, to dance beneath the diamond sky with one hand waving free" Bob Dylan
If I could pay for it I would in about 2 minutes. I spend most of my time as a woman and make money as a woman. To have a more feminine face would be wonderful!!
Hugs, Christine
For me personally, no. First, at 6', and being born with mostly masculine features, such as big hands, broad shoulders and size 12 feet, and spending 26 years in the fire service dragging hose, lifting and carrying heavy equipment, I don't think FFS would do much good. There's just too much maleness to the rest of me for a feminized face to make a difference.
Second, I'm a guy in a skirt, and I'm OK with being a guy in a skirt. I can't pass, and I no longer worry about trying to pass. But I don't let that keep me from going out, from expressing who I am. I am who I am, and I like who I am. So, why change who I am?
Grace,
Bobbi
Regardless of the motivation for thinking about it (and there are good and bad reasons), remember the "S" in "FFS" -- it is surgery, with all of the attendant risks. It's not to be taken lightly, like changing your hairstyle. Your face will be carved up like a Thanksgiving turkey, and you will spend a long recovery in pain and discomfort while looking like a car crash victim whose face had intimate relations with the windshield. And the results are not universally good -- you might end up with a dramatic, positive change, or end up looking like a freak. Or the results may be so mild as to leave yourself staring into the mirror saying, "I spent how much time, money, and agony...for this?" And whatever the results, you're stuck with them unless you want to go through it all again.
I come at this as someone who cringes at the degree to which plastic surgery is so blithely and casually embraced by so many who look fine to begin with. Vanity can be very self-destructive, and you should be extremely reticent to do anything involving a scalpel and stitches. Unless you look like Abe Vigoda and/or are transitioning to full-time and need to have a more "mainstream" appearance to blend in and not scare dogs and small children, use what God gave you and refine your makeup techniques to make the best of it.
Frankly, judging from the couple of pics of you I see here, if I saw your face looking back at me in the mirror, FFS would not even remotely enter my mind. You look great as is -- and will only look better as you learn more tricks of the trade. Go get a makeover -- hell, get 2 or 3 for "comparison shopping" -- and let an expert show you the sometimes simple things you can do to enhance your natural beauty.
"Television is very educational. Whenever somebody turns it on, I go into another room and read a book." -- Groucho Marx
as a dream yes in a hart beat...so long as someone else pays the bill.
make my jaw smaller. lift my eyes. loose some of the under fat layer. aka puffiness in the face. but not bone skinny.
would not care what the people at work had to say, it would be there problem.
but the after effects on the body. as one said the second, third O no fourth time under the knife.. after a bit you just have a hard monkey looking mask, not even looking like a human anymore.
.
I am just too logical to push that button. Have I fantasized about it...sure.But if I would ever take that step with my luck...I would probably end up looking like Joan Rivers. Now that, is scary.
If I considered a best case scenario, where I came out with attractive results...
Based upon my overzealous curiosity, I would probably end up in the porn industry eventually...
So, I know myself well enough to realize that in some areas...I am just too dangerous to be released from my cage...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Couldn't agree more. The whole culture originating in celebrity circles that plastic surgery is the easy option is actually quite scary. Any operation carries risks, including death, so is it worth this and a huge amount of cash for something you that is only cosmetic and only applies to part of your life?. Skillful use of makeup and a confident demeanour can work wonders
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