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  1. #1
    Coda...
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    Red face Milestone...first real date with a guy...

    I've met and had drinks/dinners with a few people from OKCupid with limited success. But Wed I had a real date. It was so nice to be...normal. The issue of trans never came up. Drinks, dinner, a movie in a suite at the theatre, coffee. It was so nice to walk around downtown at night with his arm around my waist or holding hands. Got a lovely hand massage and some arm caressing during the movie, and a goodnight kiss. He's a cute guy with a great sense of humor and works in film, we talked and laughed all night. He may or may not be the one, I must find a way to tell him before we become intimate. I dread that. But for now I made a real connection.

    On a similar note...I've grown so much on this site. A few years ago I was even to embarrassed to even pick up a copy of "TransAmerica". Now the time is nearing for me to leave the nest...

  2. #2
    I'm a beauty killer! GirlyBits's Avatar
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    I am squealing for you on the inside right now! That sounds amazing! I hope you get more!
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  3. #3
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    Zenith,
    Wow, it sounds like you two had a great time. Isn't it great to be treated as the woman that you are. Good luck with your second date. By the way, what outfit did you wear and how did you do your hair and makeup? Leanne

  4. #4
    Just Saying Hi Traci Elizabeth's Avatar
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    You surely deserve all the love a man can give. Congrats! He may or may not be the one but either way have fun and enjoy the moment!

    BTW, do you feel compelled to tell him?


    Just call Me: "W - O - M - A - N"

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  5. #5
    Senior Member pamela_a's Avatar
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    That's wonderful Julie. I'm so happy for you. Enjoy the ride as long as you can.

    I'd like to follow on Traci's question. You're post op and just like any other woman. Aside from the "honesty" answer, what do you believe telling him will accomplish?
    "Willfully turning aside from the truth is treason to one's self." - Wizard's Tenth Rule:
    "Life is the future, not the past." - Wizard's Seventh Rule
    "Deserve victory." - Wizard's Eighth Rule
    "Be justified in your convictions. Be completely committed. Earn what you want and need rather than waiting for others to give you what you desire."

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  6. #6
    Platinum Member Shelly Preston's Avatar
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    Rebecca
    I guess if you not anatomically and biologically perfect then you will never be a woman judging by what you have said

    Have you any idea how many women you just offended just because they cant have children.

    Julie IS an attractive woman who has every right to go out and find the right partner for her
    Shelly

    Super Moderator....How to tell your partner......Abbreviations

  7. #7
    Fearlessly Independent RebeccaLynne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
    It was so nice to be...normal. The issue of trans never came up.
    So you didn't tell him you're not what you appear to be?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zenith
    He's a cute guy with a great sense of humor and works in film, we talked and laughed all night. He may or may not be the one, I must find a way to tell him before we become intimate. I dread that. But for now I made a real connection.
    So you've deceived him. And you feel you've "connected"? I beg to differ. Send him a text, e-mail, or call him. He deserves to know the truth before seeing you again. He showed you a good time; reciprocate honestly.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by RebeccaLynne View Post
    So you didn't tell him you're not what you appear to be?



    So you've deceived him. And you feel you've "connected"? I beg to differ. Send him a text, e-mail, or call him. He deserves to know the truth before seeing you again. He showed you a good time; reciprocate honestly.
    Hun I'm a post-op. I "appear to be" a woman and I have a vagina. It's really no one's business until intimacy comes up, and some believe not even then. I'm a woman and a defect was fixed.

  9. #9
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    I don't agree that you need to tell at this early stage. You will have to at some point, of course, but on the first date? I don't think so.

    Before sexual relations? Probably a good idea. But until then? Just have fun.

    S

  10. #10
    Be free - overcome fear!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
    Hun I'm a post-op. I "appear to be" a woman and I have a vagina. It's really no one's business until intimacy comes up, and some believe not even then. I'm a woman and a defect was fixed.
    Zenith I agree totally & I see your point, its your prerogative if & when you choose to tell him. My only concern for you right
    now is that I hope you don't invest too much of yourself emotionally, especially at these early stages or you might end up hurt
    again. But hopefully you are a lot wiser now after your previous disappointments. I think when the time comes to tell him that
    you need to explain to him that you were born with a gender defect & gender identity disorder. because I think this way it can
    be understood & accepted a lot better. But still I wouldn't tell him anything either at these early stages. I don't think its even
    necessary to tell him if you are dating & having sex. Maybe only tell him if the relationship was getting really serious where he
    wants to get married & have kids.
    Goodluck & I hope it all keeps going well.

  11. #11
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    I'm really happy for you Zenith. It couldn't happen to a nicer person. I wouldn't worry about telling him anything until you are sure he's the one to be trusted. Have fun and be safe, and don't forget us here.

  12. #12
    Gold Member Kaitlyn Michele's Avatar
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    I'm glad you had fun Julie

    Good luck!

    This point about deception is a very sad thing about being TS.....in the end, there is probably a time that you will have to say to a person that your past is different.. and it's not that it's simply different, it's different in such a way that someone you care about may actually be disgusted by you, or that they may feel lied too and/or hurt...ugh!..in rare cases you may find that you become a victim of violence!!!!!
    it's just a sad thing.... for me, i just try my best to forget about it...and i don't really date, and this is probably why...

  13. #13
    Fearlessly Independent RebeccaLynne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
    Hun I'm a post-op. I "appear to be" a woman and I have a vagina. It's really no one's business until intimacy comes up, and some believe not even then. I'm a woman and a defect was fixed.
    Partially. You've been surgically transformed into what "appears to be a woman". Yet you possess neither ovaries nor a uterus, making you unable to bear children. So do you wait to tell him until he expresses the desire to raise a family?

    Quote Originally Posted by Frances View Post
    Wow! That is amazingly transphobic! So, if a trans woman does not divulge her secret right away she is seen as deceiving, but, on the other hand, if she announces it right away she will be seen as pretending to be a woman. It is a no win situation either way. What is the point of telling? So that the guy can back out from a perceived gay relationship? Dating and relationships are tricky no matter how interesting the past may be for either person. Why would a connection not be real? what if the guy went to prison and has not told Julie yet? Will he have deceived her?
    I'm certainly not transphobic. I'm a realist. The point of telling is honesty. If he'd been to prison, it wouldn't preclude him from fathering children. So your point is irrelevant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frances
    As a trans woman who lives stealth and enjoys all the cis-privileges of a regular woman, I can assure you that dating men is quite complex. Telling or not, and at what time is not cut and dried. Some never do.
    I'm sure it is. So what do you tell him when he tells you he wants children?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sharon View Post
    She IS what she appears to be!
    Nope.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sharon
    Deception? No, not at all because Zenith is a female!.
    In her outward appearance, and in her own mind; but not physically. She cannot bear children.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sharon
    If the relationship builds to a point where it's time to divulge those secrets meant to only be known by a select few then it is her decision when and how to tell him.
    The sooner, the better. That's my point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Allana71 View Post
    What a slimey comment. She has every right to be who she is now. She is what she is - woman. She may want to tell him her past in the future, but her present status is purely woman.
    I disagree. Read my above responses as to my point of view. If you have a qualifying argument to the contrary, by all means elaborate on your position.

    Otherwise, shut up.

  14. #14
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    Julie, congratulations! I'm so happy for you!

    I'm sure you'll know when it is the right the to tell.

    So. I've gotta ask. Who paid for dinner? Believe it or not, I'm dumbfounded by this. I'm in a relationship now and it's comfortable, we take turns. But, the days are long gone when it is taken for granted that a man should pay. Yet there must be some guys out there who would feel insulted should the girl offer to pay on the first date. So how did you navigate this? Was it awkward?
    Reine

  15. #15
    Member Felicity71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RebeccaLynne View Post
    Partially. You've been surgically transformed into what "appears to be a woman". Yet you possess neither ovaries nor a uterus, making you unable to bear children. So do you wait to tell him until he expresses the desire to raise a family?

    I'm certainly not transphobic. I'm a realist. The point of telling is honesty. If he'd been to prison, it wouldn't preclude him from fathering children. So your point is irrelevant.

    I'm sure it is. So what do you tell him when he tells you he wants children?

    In her outward appearance, and in her own mind; but not physically. She cannot bear children.

    I disagree. Read my above responses as to my point of view. If you have a qualifying argument to the contrary, by all means elaborate on your position.

    Otherwise, shut up.
    If thats your argument that due to her not being in possession of ovaries and uterous, that makes her deceptive? By your definition, a huge number of GG women who lack reproductive parts due to birth defects only appear to be women?? They do not need to prove their status anything other than women. Neither does Zenith.

    Anyway the ability to reproduce in this point in time maybe hindered, but that will change in the next 100 years, unless society collapses from an unforeseen disaster.
    Last edited by Felicity71; 05-07-2011 at 01:43 AM. Reason: condensed quote
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  16. #16
    What is normal anyway? Rianna Humble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RebeccaLynne View Post
    You've been surgically transformed into what "appears to be a woman". Yet you possess neither ovaries nor a uterus, making you unable to bear children. So do you wait to tell him until he expresses the desire to raise a family?
    I take it from that statement that you consider any infdertile woman to only "appear to be a woman", and what about someone who has had to have a hysterectomy. Again by your definition, se is not a woman. Get real.

    Quote Originally Posted by RebeccaLynne View Post
    I'm certainly not transphobic. I'm a realist.
    The common cry of most of your fellow haters.

    Quote Originally Posted by RebeccaLynne View Post
    The point of telling is honesty. If he'd been to prison, it wouldn't preclude him from fathering children. So your point is irrelevant.
    Does this mean that if he was unable to far=ther children you would not consider him to be a man? I think you need to get some professional help to flush this bigotry out of your system.

    Quote Originally Posted by RebeccaLynne View Post
    I'm sure it is. So what do you tell him when he tells you he wants children?
    All that she needs to tell him is that in common with about 1 in seven other women she is unable to have children.

    Quote Originally Posted by RebeccaLynne View Post
    Read my above responses as to my point of view. If you have a qualifying argument to the contrary, by all means elaborate on your position. Otherwise, shut up.
    Your above responses show your point of view very clearly. You consider that anyone who cannot procreate is not a man or not a woman. As to whether our arguments "qualify" - luckily it is not the bigots who get to decide this.
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  17. #17
    FTM ~ Andro ~ Boi Areyan's Avatar
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    Dammit, RebeccaLynne - Zenith IS a woman. does she really need to spell out her life in trannyland for this guy? really, i understand the activism but it's not needed in this case. please try to respect some folks might like to live stealth and it's none of our business whether it's a wise choice or not.

    i am personally very happy for you, Zenith. i hope it works out great and i wish you much luck with this man if you decide to tell him your story.
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  18. #18
    Fearlessly Independent RebeccaLynne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rianna Humble View Post
    I take it from that statement that you consider any infdertile woman to only "appear to be a woman", and what about someone who has had to have a hysterectomy. Again by your definition, se is not a woman. Get real.
    Then your take is wrong. As are your inferences regarding my position on the issue, which has to do only with honesty and openness.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rianna Humble
    The common cry of most of your fellow haters.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rianna Humble
    I think you need to get some professional help to flush this bigotry out of your system.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rianna Humble
    luckily it is not the bigots who get to decide this.
    More name-calling. The last resort of those unable to construct a reasoned argument.

    Rianna, I'd like to reference the last line in your signature:

    "Thou canst not then be false to any"

    So which is it? Honesty or obfuscation?

  19. #19
    Aspiring Member Veronica_Jean's Avatar
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    Julie,

    I am so thrilled you have had this experience!! I know you will know when the time is right, if ever.

    Don't worry about the rest, as you are the only one must be happy with your choices. That is the beauty of being whole.



    Rebecca,

    You seem to have numerous narrow definitions, whcih to apply to yourself is up to you, but to apply them to others is not your place.

    As for honesty and openness, is everyone truly honest and open with everyone else? Do we not all... trans or not... choose who to share what details of our lives and under what circumstances? It is not wrong to keep these things to ourselves based on the circumstances. As my lawyer once told me "Am I under oath?"

    I find your explainations of what defines a woman to be quite lacking, but you are entitled to your opinion, and I am entitled to disagree.

    Veronica
    Last edited by Shelly Preston; 05-07-2011 at 01:28 PM. Reason: Merged - please use the edit button

  20. #20
    Silver Member AKAMichelle's Avatar
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    We all knew that you would. I hope the experience is everything that you have hoped for.
    Michelle

  21. #21
    Woman and loving it Jennifer Marie P.'s Avatar
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    Thats great Julie being treated like a woman and hope both of you enjoy the moments.

  22. #22
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    Hey Julie! Enjoy it all. Trust your intuition about when to tell. I'm so excited for you.
    Last edited by 7sisters; 05-15-2011 at 08:51 AM.

  23. #23
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    Rebecca! If being able to carry a baby is the #1 measure of being a real women then you are basically saying many GGs are not real women because infertility is a problem for millions of GGs worldwide. And then how soon should a barren woman "come clean" with a new love interest? Should she inform every new guy on the first date that she's infertile and not a full woman?

    Jeepers. This forum is meant to support and for edifying. But your tone is rather harsh.

  24. #24
    Silver Member "Mary"'s Avatar
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    Wow

    1 - Very happy for you Julie. It's wonderful that you're connecting with folks since you seem to be a wonderful person.
    2 - Dangerous ground on the trans/tell matter. Follow your heart and I'm sure you'll do the right thing.
    3 - Don't leave us.

    Thanks for sharing. Best wishes as the new relationship moves forward.
    Mary

  25. #25
    Silver Member noeleena's Avatar
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    Hi ,Zenith.

    I think its so wonderfull that ....YOU ....can have this nice chap take an interest in you as your friend said go with it ,

    just because some of us where born with out a womb does not change who we are as women or female intersexed , any way thats not the issue , the issue is be accepted as who you are ,

    Have a good time & when it leads on to more. youll know when & what to say .
    Hey you are a woman like i am so as i was told very strongly .....be one ....even tho our bodys are different ,we are who we are.
    Enjoy the time to gether & let the flower blossom, have fun, you know what , im really pleased for you,

    ...noeleena...

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