Are you promoting the sterotypes.. right here in River City?

[kellycan27]

"The way I read your post was that you're claiming a few members making threads like this could tarnish our image as a whole. I do not think that is the case."



"I do not think that a few threads on the internet are going to make a difference. If "one of us" does or says something in the public eye, then yes it could happen. The weight of the task is on those that get real attention, not us."

Once again I never claimed anything, but rather asked if there might be the possibility. other than that... Thank you for your opinion. Oh wait! I did claim that I don't know the answer...

[Kaitlyn26]

Once again I never claimed anything, but rather asked if there might be the possibility. other than that... Thank you for your opinion. Oh wait! I did claim that I don't know the answer...

Well, now you know my answer. All of it. Like the whole massive thing. That was making my own head hurt. Maybe it will help you postulate your own answer.

[ReineD]

Kel, there are threads here that do in my opinion perpetuate the CD stereotype, but if you look at the section index page right now, there are some, but few compared to the others. To Sue & Donni, I do agree that a frightened new GG potentially will notice the red flag threads way more than the support threads. I did in the beginning and it wasn't easy, even when I saw no evidence of such behavior or beliefs in my SO. I took them all as omens of things to come. We tell the new GGs when they join there are all types of CDs who post here, and they should discuss directly with their SOs anything they read that causes concern.

That said, I do wonder if the views held by society at large of stereotypical CDs are not rather typical. Peole in general don't get their impressions of CDs just from this site. Just google "crossdressers". You'll find a plethora of shops selling fetish & fantasy wear, all manner of sexy lingerie, petticoats, 50s wear, etc, plus personal blogs from CDs showing crotch & butt shots, and CD dating sites filled with people wanting sex, right along side the few support forums such as this one ... not to mention all the racy CD pics on flickr and other sites with comments from all the admirers,

The CDs who hang out here may well be the exception, and not the rule? It's difficult to measure this.

there is something going on way beyond the fantasy level here, that there is a sense who you are in your own core self

It's hard to say. Maybe some closet CDs only give themselves permission to sexualize the CDing, since looking deeper might open up a can of worms, but honestly I think for many others it is just about fantasy and fetish. They're not here for support, but to have fun or maybe meet people and as long as they stay within the rules and don't post anything sexually explicit, and limit their flirting or meet-ups to PMs, they can. Many of our members aren't married.

The average person who stumbles upon this site looking to understand someone they know who is going thru the phases of TG life could be given the wrong impression from the threads they read on the main boards.

But many times the TG phases do begin with the stereotypical stuff. It's not unheard of for a CD to begin with the sexual aspect of the CDing and also progress to a pink fog once he comes out to a partner, with all types of problematic (to the SO) behaviors and attitudes.

Most of us share our pictures via the "attach file" function and I was curious to know if a non-registered viewer could see said attachments. Most message boards I'm on don't permit guests to see or download attachments.

No, the public cannot see attachments in the public sections. Do find a thread with an attached pic in it, and then log out and look at the same thread. You'll see a link that will take you to a "no permission" page.

[Kate T]

I think the original poster had a very valid point. We moan and groan about a "lack of acceptance" by the mainstream community and yet the public face (i.e. threads on public accessible sections of the forums) are not always the sort of thing I would want my wife, family or children to read.

I think this debate is also along similar lines to one in Loved Ones on Facebook issues. We need to be mindful of what is "publically" readable and what is not. There are some things that are personal and I talk about with my friends and family, I do not want eavesdroppers!

Yes I do think we sometimes exacerbate the perception. Perhaps we should have a thread devoted to education of the general public, sort of like an open forum for guests to pose a question and members can answer?

[Tina B.]

I don't know, I went through a lot of sites to find this one, and believe me, by the time you get here you have to think we are all a lot of sexual perverts looking to sell our body's to the first guy that comes along. Then you get here and find a lot of "guy" in dresses talking about make up and relationships, and real things that nothing to do with sex, then when sex does come up, you have a lot of people jumping up real fast to claim to be straight, while a few claim to be bi, or gay, just like in the real world. After all with gender confusion, there must come a certain amount of sexual confusion as well, at least for some. Most of us must have spent at least a little of our youth trying to figure out if this made us gay or not, I know I did. Besides I never felt this site was about visitors, but about the members, and that as a whole who we are, just like the rest of the world we come in all colors, and all sides of the sexual spectrum, there is no reason to hide it from the world, they are that way too!

[Karren H]

Maybe fantasy posts should come with a disclaimer? Lol. My guess is "guests" are not ones that need their view of us changed... Its the people who don't come here.... It's the people who see us portrayed as perverts on COPs, the news and on TV shows they just happened to be watching. I can't imagine Billy Bob saying "I think I'll go visit some crossdressing forums to better understand who they are"?? Yeah right. Its more how we behave in public forums. Like FaceBook! I can't count the number of friendship requests I've declined because they portray the wrong image of what I think crossdressing is! Yeah call me judgmental but that's the way I feel and I'm not apologizing for that..

[Maria2004]

The real question about baiting other CDs and TGs with these stupid type of questions. The general public won't just stumble across this forum without typing in key search words or questions relating, and whatever type if impression they get is on them, not us.

[kimdl93]

I think it all depends on the "guest". Some of the visitors are undoubtedly vicariously seeking sexual thrills, but I suspect a good number are CDs or Transgendered individuals seeking information, not gratification. Either way, I suspect they bring their personal biases with them, and like most people, filter out anything that doesn't fit with their personal preferences or prejudices.

[Aprilrain]

My guess is "guests" are not ones that need their view of us changed... Its the people who don't come here.... It's the people who see us portrayed as perverts on COPs, the news and on TV shows they just happened to be watching. I can't imagine Billy Bob saying "I think I'll go visit some crossdressing forums to better understand who they are"?? Yeah right.

Exactly! My guess is 99% of the members AND guests ARE CD/TG/TS or their loved ones. most people don't bother to educate themselves about things that are important in their lives let alone something as esoteric and "rare" as a TG person.

[Maria2004]

I think it all depends on the "guest". Some of the visitors are undoubtedly vicariously seeking sexual thrills,

Yes Kim, it's vicarious, which is why I prefer to get dressed and step out my front door in to the light of day and stand before John and Jane Q public and show them, their impression has been overwhelmingly positive and kind, the exceptions aren't even worth mentioning.

[PretzelGirl]

Which sections are viewable to guests? When I came here, it was really difficult to view anything without registering and being active. It is the main reason I come here. I will be very disappointed if I find out that this has changed.

The forums that are open to guests are Male-to-Female Crossdressers, Transmasculine, Transsexual, and Upcoming Events. Guests can read all of these and obviously not respond.

No, the public cannot see attachments in the public sections. Do find a thread with an attached pic in it, and then log out and look at the same thread. You'll see a link that will take you to a "no permission" page.

I was already looking at this in another browser when I came upon your answer (and I did flush my history and temp files first). One thing I did find is that pictures embedded in a signature do show up. But also you can log out, go to the "Thank god I was not in this video" thread and go to post #4. This picture shows up. So is that a difference between embedding and attaching?

[Karren H]

And all alone I always thought that the trouble .... With a capital T, That rymes with P and stands for Pool??

[NicoleScott]

The OP's question "Are you promoting the stereotypes?" No. I'm not promoting them. Whatever a person takes away from their visit here is beyond my control. Is this a suport site for crossdressers, friends, and family, or a site with a mission to promote general population acceptance of crossdressing? I'm here to read and discuss crossdressing-related issues of particular interest to me.

[Maria2004]

And all alone I always thought that the trouble .... With a capital T, That rymes with P and stands for Pool??

Once you're Really in the know, you can see an h to the right of the P

[Kaitlyn26]

And all alone I always thought that the trouble .... With a capital T, That rymes with P and stands for Pool??

I was not aware that a single letter could rhyme.

[LilSissyStevie]

No,nobody is suggesting any type of censorship, nor is anyone saying that anyone should hide their true selves in order to be accepted.Nothing of the sort was ever mentioned. Sometimes it's so hard to get a simple question posed when instead of people reading the lines, they read between them.

OK, if you are asking if engaging in stereotypical crossdresser behavior results in reinforcing crossdresser stereotypes, then my uneducated guess would be: Yes it does, but so what?

[Schatten Lupus]

Are these fantasy threads helping to promote the stereotypical way that the gp views cross dressers? I am not suggesting that these fantasy threads NOT be posted, just a thought with regards to their repercussions.

Not too mention that some will see such threads, and see it as an enforcer that cross dressers are gay. It may not be true, but to an outsider when they see that a cross dresser is attracted to men, even if only dressed, they will think they are gay, bi, or trying to deceive straight men. People will see what they want or expect to see, and whether a guest is an admirer, critic, or someone curious, such threads will stick out like a neon sign.

[Lorileah]

I simply asked if there was a "possibility" that when an uneducated "guest" comes in and reads these fantasy threads, "might" that give them the wrong impression? How can you know what's in one's heart? Where do people get "bad impressions" of us? Who said anything about any majority?

Yes absolutely. There are many things here that promote stereotypes. I probably fit a few as I like heels and (short) skirts. There are the I like to do "girl" things when dressed, no clue what makes up a "girl" thing and I have pointed that out. We are just as bad holding stereotypes as any. Cleaning -fem Building a house -masc. Driving a pink car-fem. Passive roles- fem. You can go on and on. The sexual thing is just the tip.

On the up side though, it doesn't get too graphic here

[Kaitlyn Michele]

And all alone I always thought that the trouble .... With a capital T, That rymes with P and stands for Pool??

one of my favorite movie songs... i stop watching the movie after the song !

[Noemi]

One can discuss the hypothetical forever. Who knows what the guests are thinking. Perhaps you could address them directly and get some feedback. As for polling opinions....Being trans gendered is a broad spectrum. There are those males who like to dress as a woman, but do not want to have sex or fantasize about having sex with men. Than there are those genetic males among us who do have sex with men, and in our fantasies usually play the role of the woman. Kelly, you know this, most likely, already.
I for one fall into the later category. I am more woman than I am man, but still live as a man for now....
If a guest reads my post, it should help them a bit, and hey being of use is what it is all about.

[Karren H]

one of my favorite movie songs... i stop watching the movie after the song !

Maybe we need to start a marching band? Worked in the movie! Kind of

[kellycan27]

[QUOTE=Maria2004;2590073]The real question about baiting other CDs and TGs with these stupid type of questions. The general public won't just stumble across this forum without typing in key search words or questions relating, and whatever type if impression they get is on them, not us.[/QUOTE

Actually that wasn't the real question... The real question was clearly stated in the OP and re-stated throughout the thread. Obviously people's impressions do affect us.. why else would so many people in so many threads try and dispel the myths? Why else are there so many threads about societies acceptance of us? Why do so many stay closeted? Because they worry about other people's impressions, whether it be strangers, employers, loved ones or friends.... we've seen this hundreds of times!


Scarlet Rose

You say no to the OP, but then you say that purely fantasy threads should be stomped on. why? Might you be thinking that those types of threads might reflect badly on us or give someone a false impression? This is a support site but if someone from the outside learns something we're better off for it. Maria thinks that this question was stupid and baiting, and basically F anyone who doesn't understand..... Maybe this thread and most of the reply's when read by a guest or two might help them understand us a little better. Much more so than having a chip on your shoulder that says F the world and getting your panties in bunch over a simple question. I think that attempting to educate the public is our job, and would serve us well even if it's one person at a time in one thread at a time.

[kellycan27]

Scarlet Rose

You say no to the OP, but then you say that purely fantasy threads should be stomped on. why? Might you be thinking that those types of threads might reflect badly on us or give someone a false impression?

Yes. If it is a TRUE impression and reflects badly on the subject then that can't be helped. If someone speculates about "What would it feel like if..." then that is all part of what it is about. But if it is pure fantasy put across as a real event then it gives a FALSE impression of what really goes on and that isn't helpful to anyone. Stories that are depicted as reality and are obviously some fantasy are obvious to us, but not to someone trying to understand the subject.[/QUOTE]

How does someone who is trying to understand going to know what's real and what's fantasy? Say for instance someone says.. I often fantasize about having sex with a man when dressed. How does one know if it is purely a fantasy, or something they would actually like to do?

[ReineD]

If someone speculates about "What would it feel like if..." then that is all part of what it is about. But if it is pure fantasy ...

I agree with this. I've seen stories here posted as if they were the truth that were highly questionable, and looked as if they belonged in a fantasy forum. But, they weren't breaking the rules, so ......

I also dislike the threads that seem to ask innocent enough questions, but it is clear by the way they are worded that the intent is to encourage fantasy from others (all within the rules, of course), for the sole purpose of titillation. You know, like someone who has a fetish for breasts and repeatedly asks questions about how women unbutton their blouses in such a way as to offer an optimal view of the voluptuousness enclosed within ..... you get the point. Or, asking questions like "what is your ideal fantasy about men", or "what is the ideal way you'd be treated as a woman, wouldn't you love it IF ...."

This place is primarily a support forum, not a mild erotica site, but members being human also love to jump in and fantasize too (within the rules of course). You just can't stop people since the bottom line is, no one knows for sure whether the question asked is a real sticking point for the OP, or if it is idle fantasy.

The best defense in threads like this is to go in and answer the questions in a nonsensical, real way and just not play along with the fantasy. IMO.

I'm not suggesting we should have a separate fantasy section (Tamara would kill me ), but it would be a way to keep the MtF section support oriented. On the other hand, if we did have such a section (and it would need to have high traffic, else what's the point of posting fantasy), I wonder how many people would bother posting in the other sections. lol This place might soon turn into one of those "other" internet sites. I can also just imagine the modding nightmare such a section might be.

[Pythos]

I in no way think those fantasy threads do anything positive toward the image of CDers. At the same time the threads concerning fake body parts, or other items that "realistically function" (eeeek), do all that great for us.

I am certainly one that believes images can be tarnished by a few. I am a living example of it.

Before Tuesday, April 20, 1999, my subculture was connected (wrongly) with dark brooding, depressed kids, that all wore black, and possibly were connected with devil worship (toddle).

Then after that date, my subculture, which was never as strong as say the hip hoppers, rappers, and gang banger cultures, was forever tarnished with a completely undeserved lable, thanks to two kids who only LOOKED, goth.

That label applied to us was "murder" "terrorist", and so on. It was completely wrong, and many of us dived for saftey into the world of conformity. Some of us were beaten, on of us litterally to a pulp. Why? Because two screwed up kids, who were not connected to the Goth subculture except in their clothing, decided to exact revenge upon their classmates.

What really damaged the subculture, was complete and utter ignorance on the part of the police and media (both of which 10 years after the event, APOLOGIZED for not correctly identifying those two as NEO NAZIS (one had red laces in his boots, which is a neo nazi symbol...as were the multiple Swastikas carved into the coffee table of the ever so proper parents, that were oblivious of the arsenal forming in their garage.)

The apology fell on deaf ears, most likely due to the timing of the airing of said apology.

Evidence of the damage to my subculture is still evident. My mother is a prime example. She accused me of being in a group that goes around shooting schools, and bombing kids. If one actually did their research they would see the only violent act that was enough to generate a police report directly relating Goths IS the Columbine incident. Gang bangers, hip hoppers, and thugs are perfectly able to be out and about as they are, whereas Goths are still looked down upon.

People like my mother, who do not actually do research on stuff, are the type that perpetuate inaccurate myths about groups of people. She would look at some of the threads here, and not even pay attention to what I have posted, and my responses, and proceed to accuse me of wanting those same fantasies.

Some people are truly ignorant. Adding more ammo for their ignorance only hurts.