Thank you Reni. I couldn't say it any better. The only thing I would add is my internal need to submit to his every desire until he is completely satisfied. That way he squeezes me and kisses me again!Originally Posted by Renihoward
Thank you Reni. I couldn't say it any better. The only thing I would add is my internal need to submit to his every desire until he is completely satisfied. That way he squeezes me and kisses me again!
Yes, I have been kissed by a gentlemen on more than several occasions. The most recent time was just last week when I took a short vacation and visited Washington DC for a few days. On my last evening there, I decided to have a quick dinner and a glass of wine in the hotel lounge. While enjoying my wine, a gentlemen approached me and asked if he could join me, I of course replied that I would enjoy it if he did.
After another glass of wine, he asked if I would like to go to a club that had dancing, again I replied that I would love to. I excused myself, went to my room to gather my coat and change to a smaller purse. We walked the 3 blocks to the club, checked my coat and were immediately on the dance floor. After about 3 hours of chatting, dancing and drinking wine we left and he walked me back to my hotel. As we walked into the hotel he reached out and pulled me close to him and kissed me. It was a long soft sensuous kiss which was a very pleasant surprise. We finally said good night about 10 minutes later after several more kisses, each just as pleasant and just as sensual.
I have never been kissed, but my ultimate fantasy is to be with a man as his girl friend. I also want more than a kiss, I have fantasized that ever sense I started dressing.
No I have never done that and I cant say it is the biggest dream in my life.
I have been kissed and enjoyed it and what followed. Some men are better kissers just like some women are better kissers kissers than others.
Danielle
I never have, and don't expect to ever want to. But I had an interesting experience at a tg-friendly bar in Daytona Beach. I like to dress and make up over the top, and chose to go to that spot because I knew I would be seen as an obvious cd. On one occasion, I was made up as glamorous as possible, and as my eyes and brain define glamour. Heavy foundation (necessary), long thick black fake eyelashes and heavy black liquid eyeliner, and dark red lipstick applied as perfectly as I could, but very heavily. It's just the look I like. I had a long pleasant conversation with a rather scruffy blue collar type guy and out of the blue he said he wanted to kiss me. I politey declined, explaining that I'm not here for a hook-up, and that I just like to dress and makeup this way He just couldn't understand that I was not there, appearing as I was, to pick up a partner for some kind of intimate encounter. My guess is that he has a lipstick fetish. I do too, but kissing a man isn't in my fantasy library. I eventually left, without incident.
No, he just thinks along the same lines that GGs do.
When we make ourselves up to be sexy, it is to attract men. These are the rules of engagement in the cis world. The men look and admire, while the women seek their looks and admiration by being visually appealing. The birds and the bees and all that.
This is why so many GGs believe their SO's want to attract men when they dress, if they dress the way a GG would when she wants to attract a man.
I do understand why you dress, Nicole (or I think I do.) My point is that it takes a while before people who aren't plugged into the community can get it.
Last edited by ReineD; 01-10-2012 at 12:17 AM.
Reine
I like the answers
woo hoo
Wendy
This doesn't apply to all of course, but this is one way to think of it.
When a hetero male dresses up, technically he is still dressing to please a man as a GG would, the man just happens to be himself.
Last edited by Vickie_CDTV; 01-10-2012 at 04:08 AM.
To answer your question, yes I have been kissed. The only objectional part was his razor stubble. Guys, use a good razor and shave aganist the grain.
If the clothes make the man then the makeup makes the woman.
Sure, sex tends to be the first priority for men on the make regardless of the object of their interest, but the difference is that men chasing GGs understand that usually there is sort of a courtship ritual required. With TGs, however, all that goes out the window. For some reason, men presume that TGs don't need or expect the romance. They wouldn't dream of approaching a GG they've never met before and asking for sex point blank, but they have no problem doing so with a TG. I guess it's the old man-in-a-dress presumption. Clueless neanderthals.
I agree with you that there should be other venues for interaction, but the reality doesn't really match the ideal for most of us. Most guys can't even handle being seen with a TG in accepting surroundings like a TG-friendly club, let alone mainstream society. And besides, some bars and clubs are sleazy, some aren't.
I agree totally with the posts about stubble -- ewww!
Fwiw, by far the best kiss I ever had from a guy was from a black man. Just sayin'.
It is sort of like kissing a woman except you get scratched by the beard. It is also more firm and sometimes more urgent, with women. Since I am the worst kisser in the world, everyone seems better than I am.
I am not into facial hair at all so I usually avoid kissing anyone with a beard...which limits it to very few.
The earth is the mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it.
Chief Joseph
Nez Perce
“Love isn't a state of perfect caring. It is an active noun like struggle. To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.” - Fred Rogers,
sorry mod tamara. I meant to say its very romantic gianna wink...
I appreciate your perspective, Reine (post#57). Certainly a GG would understand that dressing and making up to be glamous doesn't suspend your right to decline his advances. He just never understood that, even after my clear explanation. But as I said, nothing became of it, except (hopefully) a bit of understanding on his part, and some flattery for me.
Vickie (post #59), right you are. I just never figured anyone would be as attracted to me (en femme) and as I am.
I've seen this argument from you before Reine, and I know there is some truth to it, however, *is* that the only reason GG's get dressed up to the nines? I don't think it is, personally. I know plenty of GGs who are in happy committed relationships, married or otherwise, that will get together for "Girls night out" type stuff and get all dressed up to the nines. I also know lesbians who have no interest in attracting men who will do the same.
My mother freaks out about going to the grocery store without her hair and makeup looking good, should I be worried that she's looking for a man in the frozen foods section, or should I probably still assume she loves my father and just wants to be presentable for other reasons, such as self confidence and such?
Actually this happens to GGs too. It probably happens at a much higher ratio amongst TGs but men can be pigs without discriminating. When out at bar and a club, guys looking to hook up are generally looking for someone who they can have sex with that night, if at all possible. Also with online dating girls get significantly more messages from guys, and every girl I know who dates online has at least one horror story or more about getting sent pictures of private parts or straight up propositions for sex on the very first message.
On the flip side, I will say that I have been hit on by guys at TG bars, and I have had some of them at least put in some of the courtship steps, such as asking about myself and trying to start a dialogue. The first time this happened I didn't quite clue in right away because I've never been a pick-up type guy, but I have figured out now, oh he's hitting on me. I politely excuse myself early on but I can see the courtship rituals being ramped up for sure.
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~Riley
Check out my trans themed standup on YouTube!
My Tumblr Blog
No, I'm talking about the very fundamental, reptilian brain type reason women have adorned themselves throughout the ages: to entice men.
Of course it's more complex than that. We are also socialized to embrace a cultural aesthetics. We don't like to be different. So, we comply and eventually it becomes a part of our routine even though we have no immediate designs on a particular man. Even when it becomes a part of psyches to adorn ourselves (styling our hair, wearing makeup & jewelry, etc, can you honestly tell me that the women on the left and the middle do not dress specifically for men, compared to the woman on the right?
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Ah! Yes, there is a word for this. It begins and ends with an "a", and it has "gyne" in the middle.
Reine
Of course but you haven't really played the role until you've gotten the kiss and possibly more.
Second star to the right and straight on till morning
Getting kissed by a man may float some crossdressers boat, but not THIS crossdresser. YUCK! It happened once as a joke. I was taken by surprise and in drab. This guy actually REALLY kissed me, and I'm surprised there was no tongue poking out...eeewwww... All I could think of was knocking his lights out! There was no fanciful fluttering heart or weak kneed blushing, just the strong urge to kick his @$$!
Ginger
When we make ourselves up to be sexy, it is to attract men. These are the rules of engagement in the cis world. The men look and admire, while the women seek their looks and admiration by being visually appealing. The birds and the bees and all that.
I have to agree with Ryan because I think many women dress to impress other women. Ask your mom why she does that and she will probably say "I don't want Mrs' so-n-so to see me without my make up. You know how she is." So in a way I agree with Reine and in a way it is the birds and bees but more competition for the male. You know the old joke "to attract a man show up naked and with beer." Men don't go somewhere and say "Look! Those two women have the same dress on!" More likely they will say "Look at the boobs on that one!" Women may think they are dressing to attract a man but they are dressing in competition with the other women. I don't believe that the TG's here are any different, that is why they post pictures (me included) hoping for approval of the others here. Otherwise they would post on a "different site".
And I agree that many guys are pigs.
The earth is the mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it.
Chief Joseph
Nez Perce
“Love isn't a state of perfect caring. It is an active noun like struggle. To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.” - Fred Rogers,
Like I mentioned, Lori, we've become socialized to look a certain way and for women it means altering their natural appearance with makeup, particular hairstyles, etc, in short doing what she can to adhere to socially prescribed "rules" of feminine aesthetics.
But, what do you thing is the fundamental reason we feel that our natural appearance isn't good enough? When you compare both ends of the full spectrum of feminine adornment (from just a bit of makeup and a cute, cuddly sweater, to the full on smokey eyes, sexy hair, jewelry that sparkles and attracts the eye, and low cut tops), what do you think is the ultimate goal for a woman who goes all out, such as in the two first pics above?
Fundamentally, it boils down to the birds and the bees, even if this isn't in the forefront of a woman's mind.
Reine
Ummm no, so not attracted to men whatsoever.
While on the subject of kissing, I have to admit, I never realized how many people (I guess mostly guys) are bad kissers. I say this based on what GF's of mine have said. They all said I am a great kisser and always asked me where I learned to kiss like that, thinking I have had lot's of practice or something. I dunno, I just always kissed the way I do but then again, I have always been a passionate person and as a guy, love an emotional connection to my partner but I guess most guys lack that quality. It's just something that has always been natural to me.
I've never kissed a man, nor have I that as one of my "bucket list" musts. In reading the various posts in this tread, I'm curious if those who have or would kiss another man would also do so if simply dressed as a male. There are many men iin this world who kiss other men and putting on or wearing feminine attire is not on their minds. So does crossdressing merely become an excuse to engage in conduct aside from the element of attracting a man by being so attired?
Ok, but here's where I still think you are being very black and white about something that is a lot more grey area than you give it credit for. Men are also socialized to look a certain way. Now, there are plenty of women who dress in the way that men are socialized to to look, and I am speaking about heterosexual women. Baggy clothes, collared shirts, no makeup, shorter hair. Do you automatically assume all women you see dressed like this are on some level trying to attract another woman? I'm guessing not.
With all due respect I think your samples were a bit biased. You specifically picked photos that were blatantly and over the top trying to attract men, in fact ones that were professionally done and photo shopped to attract men not just sexually but as a marketing strategy. It doesn't at all prove that dressing femininely and with makeup and such means someone is trying to attract men, it only proves that some do, specifically these ones in this case.what do you think is the ultimate goal for a woman who goes all out, such as in the two first pics above?
It's like saying "The purpose of going to McDonald's is to eat cheeseburgers," and someone saying "Well, no, they also have chicken sandwiches and french fries," and then posting two pictures of someone at McDonald's eating cheeseburgers and someone not at mcdonald's eating chicken. "See, the people at McDonalds all are eating cheeseburgers." But the argument isn't people don't ever eat cheeseburgers at McDonalds, it's that there's other reasons to go there as well. Yes, women dress sexy for men, and vice versa. But is it the only reason? No.
Here's a photo of three women dressed up in very feminine looks and with time and effort put into their makeup as well as their accessories and attempting to fit the socialized aesthetic we're talking about, but my immediate reaction to them is not "They're clearly trying to catch themselves a man."
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~Riley
Check out my trans themed standup on YouTube!
My Tumblr Blog
Not me. If I wasn't transitioning I would be queer as a three dollar bill.
After a couple of surgeries I will be so straight even a conservative won't mind if I kiss a guy.
Waaaaaay off the point here. I mean your argument is sound in the sense that Reine's would essentially be a straw-man, IF (big IF) Nicole hadn't posted in some detail about her look for that night. Have a look at her avatar and tell me what her picture has in common with the pic you posted. I think Reine's pic was much more in line with Nicole's presentation for that evening. She wasn't made up for a day of shopping, she was admittedly as glamorous as she could be, for her evening out at a club. The offending gentlemen may have certainly misread her signals, but he sure didn't misread her advertisement.
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