Cd admirers, why are there so many?

[Debglam]

Men who dress as women are seen by other men as an opportunity for a good time. Why else would they apparently abandon their power as men? Men see women as sexual subordinates, they are the ones who get penetrated, so a feminine man is purposely subordinating himself. Obviously I know this isn't always or even mostly the case, but men who know nothing of this lifestyle except what they see on Craigslist have no reason to think otherwise. The fact is a LOT of cross dressing men are looking for sex too and to pretend otherwise is just kinda goofy.

Yeah, I think this is it. I think that it is why the admirers have such a hard time taking "No" for an answer. Why ELSE would I want to be out at a LGBT bar en femme if I didn't want to have sex with some sweaty, balding old guy? <heavy sarcasm, please!>

This forum is a refuge of sorts for those of us who want a place where we can be free from lewd come-ons or constant chat requests, but I've seen many of these CD.com girls around the net looking for some action because I'm doing the same thing. ;-)

Agreed as to the first part and I'll take your word on the second. Bottom line is why shouldn't any of us just be honest with our feelings, even if we keep it to ourselves?

Also, on the same lines, I was going to say that GGs have been dealing with creepy people forever...it doesn't phase me anymore. But, you can't encourage them. The weird guy at the bar that won't leave you alone and wants to buy you a drink, so you give up and allow him to buy you one... NO... Because, he's never going to go away now. You will literally have to leave the bar to get away from him. Why? Because, you give them an inch and they take a mile.

Oh yeah! Just say NO!

But I went to a few tranny bars with my SO when we were just beginning to out in public. And I tell ya ... the admirers I saw (all were middle aged but this doesn't mean there aren't more such as you describe) pretty well fit the M.O. described by someone who has been on the scene in the San Francisco area for years, and who wrote a book about it. His name is Dr. Richard (Alice) Novic. She wrote "Alice in Genderland".

It was actually LA.

*sigh*. And there are CDs who look hotter than other CDs, GGs who look hotter than other GGs, and GGs who look hotter than CDs. And men who look hotter than other men. Oh, and there are also men who look hotter than some CDs.
And men who are into the sporty girl, the athletic girl, the intellectual type girl, the girl next door type. In my last comment to one of your posts, Sean, I thought you were starting to get away from all those blanket statements.
And here we go again. Now you are telling a GG what her sexual preference is and how she wants to be treated.

Reine, you have to have the patience of a saint or be a mother, one,the other, or both. . .

Reine,
Alice Novik creeps me out to no end. I'm glad I didn't stumble upon her book when I was first introduced to this lol.

Me too a little bit. I am really open minded but the whole “almost polygamy” thing in the book is on the edge of what I can get my head around. Hell, I’m just a wannabe soccer mom though!

And, if two girls kiss at this bar. . .

Oh, a girl can dream. . .

[ReineD]

Reine, you have to have the patience of a saint or be a mother, one,the other, or both. . .

It's both actually.

But I'll tell ya ... my patience has now run out and any more blanket statements that I catch, about *all* CDs and *all* GGs wanting manly men, are going to be deleted. Let this be a fair warning to Mr. Muscle.

[Marleena]

It's both actually.

But I'll tell ya ... my patience has now run out and any more blanket statements that I catch, about *all* CDs and *all* GGs wanting manly men, are going to be deleted. Let this be a fair warning to Mr. Muscle.

Yay!!! You're my hero Reine!

[Lorileah]

In good humor, I like this quote. But, I think the gay community can be "pickier" sometimes.

Agreed in most instances. It is one thing I like about he gay community, I don't fit their requirements

We often talk about how if you are a gay guy, it seems like you have to spend so much more time on yourself to get a date than any straight guy. I often feel the same with women...it seems that women can be a lot pickier with each other.

I agree again but mostly in the perspective of older gays (and maybe women). Young gays I have met are still willing to jump anything that doesn't move quickly as you say

being bi means that you need to look and be the best of the best...or, people just assume that you are one of those people that are just looking to f*ck anything.

And to be honest there are many in certain areas of our community who buy into that. Which is why I tend to avoid the Tranny Bars

And Reine, you are a saint and hero to me

[Badtranny]

And Reine, you are a saint and hero to me

Agreed. She is a credit to her gender and one of the most empathetic people I've ever encountered. She understands things she's not supposed to know.

[Jenniferathome]

I have to agree that gg are not really that feminine anymore because of feminism. There are Cds who look hotter than gg. Straight men just love femininity.....pantyhose, heels, garter belts, dresses.

No Sean,straight men like WOMEN. NOT THEIR CLOTHES. No straight man in the history of time, would choose a crossdresser over a woman, regardless of their appearance. Those that would are bi or gay. I think you are struggling with your own identity.

[Marleena]

No Sean,straight men like WOMEN. NOT THEIR CLOTHES. No straight man in the history of time, would choose a crossdresser over a woman, regardless of their appearance. Those that would are bi or gay. I think you are struggling with your own identity.

Lol.. Sean has issues.

[whowhatwhen]

It's okay to be takei.

[JessicaM1985]

I'll be frank and honest, and hope that it doesn't send all you gals running in terror screaming "CREEP!".....

I'm a TG admirer myself and prefer to date them. Always have been. What it took me a lomg time to realize was that a lot of the traits I loved in women (both tg and gg) were traits I wanted in myself. I was also one of those knuckleheads that tried to justify being with a cd/tg was still straight. No, it isn't. Sorry to burst bubbles and sound like a cold B, but it's not.

That said, I like feminine things. Not all of them, but I like a lot of them. Girls, both gg and tg, do cool stuff that I enjoy and now my attraction is more about the fact that we have intersting things in common whereas before I was attracted to the "taboo" aspect of it.

Sling your arrows for I am ready. :P

[Prissy Linda]

What Lorileah said. Reine is a saint and my hero!!! I have been think the same thing for years, even my wife will at time read certain thread on the forum and will comment that Reine must be a saint. I just had to say it.

[Aprilrain]

IMO, any guy who wants a part time "girl" ie. a CD is probably gay or bi. I mean really! I don't think that is necessarily true of men who are interested in TSes. In my experience most of these guys have unrealistic expectations about a TS girls body, I can't tell you how many though my junk would work and how disappointed they seemed when i explained that was not in the cards! Also i'd say more than half of the men I talked to had gender issues of their own, either CD or closet TS! One guy had it in his head that we would become GFs and i'd like hold his hand through transition or something. NO THANKS! I think they feel that a TS woman will be more accepting of their gender issues. from what I can gather from talking to other TS woman that notion couldn't be farther from the truth, most TS woman I talk to wouldn't touch a CD or closet case TS with a ten foot pole!
I met my BF on a TS dating website, He told me he was a CD the first time we chatted and I was pretty sure I was not interested in dating a CD, also I thought he was too old for me. He seemed like a nice guy who took a genuine interest in me so we continued to chat over the course of a few months. In that time guys came and went most of those conversations were sexually charged which i didn't mind so much but it was clear there would be no real relationship. usually after a week or 2 I'd get pissed and block them, it was never like that with my BF though he was always a gentleman if anything I was the forward one! like when I finally decided that I was willing to meet him for dinner, I said "are you going to ask me out or what!" Anyway long story short it worked out we have been dating for about 6 months and it just feels like a normal relationship to me. I asked him why he wanted a girl like me, he said he wanted a girl who could think like a guy LOL little did he know! Ok maybe my "thinking" is somewhere in between and I can certainly relate to the male experience in a way that no GG could but still i don't think he considered how effective hormones are LOL

[Shananigans]

I liked your post. It makes sense...it kind of started out as a taboo type thing and then you realized you were attracted to people that reflect certain aspect of yourself.

I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

I don't think many people on here think that ALL people interested in TG people are creepy "admirer" types...I this were so, we would all be f*cling weird by our own definitions. Just some people who are interested in TG people are weird...just like some people interested in GGs, GMs, blah blah are weird.

Everyone seems scared on the forum lately lol

I'll be frank and honest, and hope that it doesn't send all you gals running in terror screaming "CREEP!".....

I'm a TG admirer myself and prefer to date them. Always have been. What it took me a lomg time to realize was that a lot of the traits I loved in women (both tg and gg) were traits I wanted in myself. I was also one of those knuckleheads that tried to justify being with a cd/tg was still straight. No, it isn't. Sorry to burst bubbles and sound like a cold B, but it's not.

That said, I like feminine things. Not all of them, but I like a lot of them. Girls, both gg and tg, do cool stuff that I enjoy and now my attraction is more about the fact that we have intersting things in common whereas before I was attracted to the "taboo" aspect of it.

Sling your arrows for I am ready. :P

[Alice Torn]

It seems like males that are not gay, are simply drawn like magnets, to pleasant feminine forms. I agree that many men simply cannot attain an attractive gg, so, when they see a gorgeous cd tg, they are drawn to us. The price is very high, on attractive ggs. We are easier, for them, at least they think so. I have only met one, almost met several others. Sadly, sex is what they want right away. The image of attractive feminine form is so hard wired in the average male, that many are willing to do "it" with a cdtg, if the cdtg looks great. Sex starved, lonely men are legion today, and many will take it any way they can get it. Which, makes us sex objects, just like GGs. Sad reality, in a sad world.

[Melissa Rose]

When out hunting, a hunter will select the forest with the highest number of desired prey. Admirers are going to frequent chat rooms or bars with the highest number of t-girls. It is simply a matter of numbers and statistics. I'm frequently out in a wide variety of mainstream places and have been overtly hit on only one time by a guy who read me. The occasional times I'm at one of the main t-girl hang out in town, the male admirers are there and I get hit on depending on the situation. They seem to fall into the two groups of aggressive/persistent or reasonably well mannered with most being in the former group. Then there are the ones that stay in the distance and just watch. I call them the orbiters. There are also the t-girls who have overtly or hinted at wanting more than just friendship. If I based my assessment on the t-girl and gay bars and places like CraigsList and chat rooms, yes, there seems to be a lot of admirers out there with many interested in one thing and wanting it now. If I look at the rest of my world, no, there are not a lot of admirers out there.

To echo what others have said, in my experience most of the male admirers are looking only for sex. Many only want discreet encounters and do not want to date in any form. Once they find out I don't dive right into getting physical (not that there is anything majorly wrong with that between consulting adults, it is just not the way I fly) and require getting to know each other by going out on a few public dates, 90%+ lose interest right away. Then there are the few that want to jump right into a LTR relationship, but they tend to be on-line and not in person.

From my experience and observations, it comes down to a simple thought......if you swim in waters with ample bait, there will be sharks of various types.

I've done a lot of surfing the net and find there are a lot of CD/TG/TS admirers, but they're mostly men. Many claim to be straight, so what are they really after? I wish more females were admirers.

If you're out in public have you encountered them?

Good or bad experiences?

Are they just all looking for sex ( I hope not)?

I know some of the TG girls here may be admirers too. Not being judgemental.

No Scarlet..I'm not one of them, although we do have pretty girls here.

[JessicaM1985]

I liked your post. It makes sense...it kind of started out as a taboo type thing and then you realized you were attracted to people that reflect certain aspect of yourself.

I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

I don't think many people on here think that ALL people interested in TG people are creepy "admirer" types...I this were so, we would all be f*cling weird by our own definitions. Just some people who are interested in TG people are weird...just like some people interested in GGs, GMs, blah blah are weird.

Everyone seems scared on the forum lately lol

Thanks.
I just get kinda shy when it comes to talking about attractions, particularly when it comes to transgenders on a forum for transgenders/cds, because it always seems to create a weird tension and I'd rather keep my mouth shut and enjoy the fun stuff. Im the same way in guy mode when talking about my attractions to men when surrounded by guys. Thougjts of creeper swell up and it makes me just as uncomfortable as they get. But I figure that I'd put this out here so that people realize that it's not all middle aged macho men that love tg/cds. Of course, awesome G.G.s like yourself exist to and we love you for it.

I suppose part of my nervousness is the fact that I'm still kinda new here and I want to be accepted.

[ReineD]

I'll be frank and honest, and hope that it doesn't send all you gals running in terror screaming "CREEP!".....

I'm a TG admirer myself and prefer to date them. Always have been. What it took me a lomg time to realize was that a lot of the traits I loved in women (both tg and gg) were traits I wanted in myself.

I don't think you're a creep, nor do I think anyone will sling arrows at your post. I agree with Shananigans, sexual preferences are not black and white, meaning there is no "rule" that says we must all be attracted to either men or women. There are many points in between the gender binary and it makes sense there will be people who are attracted to gender non-conformists. I believe, however, that members of the TG or LGB communities are more open to such attractions than cispeople.

That said, your post is honest. You are attracted to a CDer and you also are a CDer. You are not engaging in the denial over this, that is at issue in this thread. You do not try to tell everyone that you are in fact a straight male with no gender issues and that your love interest is a woman when he is dressed.




... to all the people who said nice things about me, thank you! But please, I'm far from being a saint. Ask my kids!

[Marleena]

I don't think you're a creep, nor do I think anyone will sling arrows at your post. I agree with Shananigans, sexual preferences are not black and white, meaning there is no "rule" that says we must all be attracted to either men or women. There are many points in between the gender binary and it makes sense there will be people who are attracted to gender non-conformists. I believe, however, that members of the TG or LGB communities are more open to such attractions than cispeople.

That said, your post is honest. You are attracted to a CDer and you also are a CDer. You are not engaging in the denial over this, that is at issue in this thread. You do not try to tell everyone that you are in fact a straight male with no gender issues and that your love interest is a woman when he is dressed.

Thanks Reine, I posted the original question to learn more about admirers. Once I'm out in the real world I may encounter them too.

This thread has given me answers as to why there are admirers, and it's not all bad either.

Just call me niave.

[ReineD]

This thread has given me answers as to why there are admirers, and it's not all bad either.

Just call me niave.

But don't forget ... just as there are some people like Jessica who look for genuine relationships (BTW, I don't see Jessica as an admirer ... I see Jessica as a CDer), there are others who are in it just for the sex and they will use every fantasy, every line imaginable to get it, if they do run into someone whom they believe is naive.

On the other hand, if both the CDer and the admirer own up to just wanting sex, if they both have active imaginations able to fantasize they are a cis-couple and they own up to this as well, then there's no harm, is there.

[Shananigans]

I believe, however, that members of the TG or LGB communities are more open to such attractions than cispeople.

I WISH there was a study on this. I hear this a lot on this forum, and it does seem to be true... However, I never really see any statistical research that has been done on this subject, so I just rely on what my friends say from their own experiences.

I know that I have always identified as bisexual since sex was on my mind...even if I had troubles admitting it to myself. However, I never really thought about dating a TG person. I kind of relied on the public image of what is a CD and what is a TS, and most of those images are kind of Drag Queenish/bad comedy/pornstar. If you had asked me 4 years ago about dating TG people, I would have given a very vague answer. Why? Because, I had no freaking clue. I wonder if once people in the "community" met people that were trans, if they would openly admit that they would be down for dating trans people. Not just for sex, but like out-and-out dating and saying, "This is my boyfriend (if FTM)...or, this is my girlfriend (if MTF)." (It may be very apparent that there aren't very many trans people in my college's LGBT group lol...and, when I say there aren't many, I actually mean there are none).

And, would you call us "admirers." I feel like this is such a sticky term. I feel I am no more an admire of a TG person than I am a GG or a GM. When you pretty much could have a relationship with anyone that you find attractive and interesting, what kind of "admiration" is this? It just seems weird, because I would call straight guys interested in bi girls "admirers"...and, likewise with lesbians.

I kind of hate the default admirer term. (Mainly because of the creepily implied special interest, and the other weirdness that goes with it). But, I don't really like pansexual either. With CDs and TSs, they are outwardly portraying a certain gender...usually. (I have met a few that are honestly just about the clothes, but they still are portraying their natal gender). So, unless you are having everyone strip down to the bare essentials, you are either judging this person's appearance as a woman or as a male. So, isn't this still bisexuality? Doesn't pansexual kind of imply that TSs can never really be women (or, men if FTM)?

IDK this is kind of a side-note, but feel it is somewhat applicable. I think the term "admirer" sucks because it implies that you pay some kind of special attention to trans people over other people. And, pansexual sucks because it implies that TSs aren't really fitting into the gender that they feel they should have been born.

So, hmmm....

Okay, done rambling.

[kimdl93]

I hesitated on responding to this one, because, Shanna. I have a somewhat perjorative opinion of "admirers", although I quite honestly have never met one. I assocaite the term with the seamier side of the internet - web sites that cater strictly to sexual cravings. (Not that I have anything against sexual fantasies or cravings, mind you) It may not be a fair association, but that's what comes to mind.

I would very strongly differentiate between individuals who are attracted to TG people in real life from those who may lurk around the aforementioned sites. In recent months, I have met a number of women - bright, intelligent and inquisitive women seemed very interested in getting to know me. I don't know that they were necessarily attracted to me because I was presenting as female, or not....but it wasn't a deterent. Are they admirers? I probably wouldn't characterize them that way.

As for men, I've been out to a number of gay bars in recent months, and have yet to be hit on by a guy. So, if there are admirers out there, apparently they don't hang out in the CD friendly places that I frequent.

[moondog]

Personally I think there are so many "admirers" because a lot of men want to try hot dogs without actually having the hotdog attached to a dude. So long as the hotdog is attached to a "female" they really don't have to accept the fact they had sex with another guy. Another reason, perhaps, is the whole "wish I had a girl with the sex drive of a man" thing. Maybe it's just a fetish...I worked with a woman who had a massive fetish for asian men. A quick look around the web will show you all of the white women who have sex with black men. They don't want to date them or have any meaningfull relationship, they just want a black snake. The "admirers" that I have seen all appear to only want sex with a CD or Trans without having any relationship. That shows me that most of them have a sexual fetish with CDs and Transgender people.

There are so many kinks out there it's nearly impossible to know them all.

I also do not like the term "admirer" because it almost sounds a little like stalker.

[Lynn Marie]

[SIZE="4"]To be quite honest, I'm attracted to well dressed and good looking women, and also to men who are dressed and made up to emulate well dressed and good looking women. Does that make me an admirer? When my CD friends and I go out to our favorite LGBT club and elsewhere, we are usually the best dressed and best looking females in the place! Need to find places with a better quality of females.[/SIZE]

[Shananigans]

[SIZE="4"]To be quite honest, I'm attracted to well dressed and good looking women, and also to men who are dressed and made up to emulate well dressed and good looking women. Does that make me an admirer? When my CD friends and I go out to our favorite LGBT club and elsewhere, we are usually the best dressed and best looking females in the place! Need to find places with a better quality of females.[/SIZE]

Hmmm...it might be NW Washington. I've never noticed a decline of beautiful people (in general) in the South. But, a lot of girls grow up competing in pageants...mainly, because our mothers did it growing up. Sororities are also REALLY huge here. I did the whole pageant and sorority thing too...so, did most of my friends. I always hear CDs complain about how GGs look/dress, and I wonder what rock they live under. However, maybe I'm the one living under a rock...but, it's a pretty rock.

[JessicaM1985]

You know Shana, I've always wondered about the term pansexual myself. I didn't want to offend people by using it at first in case they took it to mean that I think that TS aren't the gender they present themselves. (FTM or MTF)
I myself am now identifying as TS and get kind of mad when people don't fecognize me as female, so I understand the anger. But I still use it because there are CDs that still identify as their biological sex, but just love the clothes/style of the opposite sex. There are also genderqueers and such that don't fit into or want to be associated the gender binary. Pansexual covers them as well, so I don't see it as a degratory term.

[Marleena]

But don't forget ... just as there are some people like Jessica who look for genuine relationships (BTW, I don't see Jessica as an admirer ... I see Jessica as a CDer), there are others who are in it just for the sex and they will use every fantasy, every line imaginable to get it, if they do run into someone whom they believe is naive.

On the other hand, if both the CDer and the admirer own up to just wanting sex, if they both have active imaginations able to fantasize they are a cis-couple and they own up to this as well, then there's no harm, is there.

To each their own Reine. Married CD's like myself do not want to be hit on. I'm not interested in sex, or other relationships.

It is an interesting topic. I guess the main reason is the CDer is dressing feminine, and is attracting males that want to fulfill their fantasies. But then again maybe not??