Getting increasingly frustrated with DADT...

[Leslie Langford]

As many of you know from my previous posts, my wife's reaction to my crossdressing over the course of our lengthy marriage has pretty much paralleled the classic "5 Stages of Grief" that people typically go through when faced with a life-altering change, and this has now defaulted into "DADT" mode. This is still a work in progress and we have our good days and our bad, but overall, she has pretty much resigned herself now to the fact that that I am transgendered, and that this will never change.

What has made this realization exceedingly hard for her is that she is of a generation (the MAD MEN era) where men were men and women were women, men were the head of the household, and the gold standard for masculinity was embodied by the likes of Sean Connery's version of James Bond. Well, I can tick off all three of those boxes when in male mode without any great difficulty; trouble is, there is a bit more to me than that, and "Leslie" will not be denied.

So for us, DADT means that I get to shave off all of my body hair year-round now, I have a substantial wardrobe of women's clothes that she knows about but neither wants to see me in (or even see altogether), and my going out in public on a semi-regular basis without incident in "Leslie" mode for over 5 years now. My part of the deal is that I do this discreetly and take no unnecessary risks that would "out" me to family, friends, or others who would have the power to negatively impact our lives through their disapproval. As far as the rest of the world and the "normal" part of our lives are concerned, for all intents and purposes, "Leslie" doesn't even exist. I also do other things to enhance the quality of our marriage to make up for what my wife may be missing out on by now having "Leslie" to contend with.

But as we all know, women can be fickle, and what is fine one day can inexplicably become an issue the next. And whatever concessions I have been able to negotiate with my wife have been hard-fought over the years, and the emotional cost has been high. Others in our situation might have been inclined to call it quits after all these years because of this, but the truth of the matter is that we have a fundamentally solid marriage otherwise and share many values. The reasons for staying in it for the long haul far outweigh the reasons for potentially throwing in the towel at this point.

And yet - sometimes I feel so frustrated by this total rejection of such an important part of who I am. This has been compounded by the fact that over the last several years during which I have been actively going out as "Leslie", I have met a number of women who are no only totally fine with "her" but are also intrigued by "her" and appear to feel privileged to have made "her" acquaintance. And when I say this, I am not talking about extra-marital affairs or any other type of fooling around behind my wife's back. I am talking strictly about platonic relationships with ladies such as my makeup artist, nail techs, consignment store owners, feature story writers, photographers and the like, some of which have since blossomed into actual friendships.

Just as an example, last month while getting a makeover - and after complimenting me yet again on the particular outfit that I was wearing that day - my makeup artist mused aloud that she really needs to bring me along the next time she goes clothes shopping. Whether or not this ever comes to fruition remains to be seen, but the spontaneous way in which she blurted it out really caught me off-guard - but in a decidedly good way. I think that I would spot a pig flying over a frozen H*ll before a similar comment would ever be made by my wife.

Yes, I "get" the fact that for most women, finding out that the man whom she has a romantic/sexual relationship with is a crossdresser is far harder to accept than if he were just a friend, an acquaintance, or even another family member. Still, it hurts when the person whom you have dedicated your life to and who should be in your corner unconditionally cannot fulfill an emotional need that someone who only knows you in a more superficial manner can...

Sorry for venting in this way, but this has become a major frustration for me. My wife and I are both extremely strong-willed when it comes to such matters, and marriage counseling has been only marginally successful in this regard. For those ladies on this forum who are in a similar situation, any advice that you might have in overcoming this impasse (short of divorce) would be most welcome. Input from the GG's here would be especially valuable...

[RADER]

Leslie;
I am not a GG as you requested for, However, I must commend you for all you do for your
Wife to keep things together.
My wife is OK with my dressing, as long as I stay in the closet. I can under dress to a point
and go outside, but nothing real fem must be showing.
She does not let me shave off my mustache, or my chest hair forest. She says that belongs to her.
So compromise to say the least is the way it must be played, I guess I am lucky that way,
I am really just to big to look anything like a girl, so he closet is my home.
Rader

[outhiking]

My wife knows, but prefers "not to know". I keep it in the house and that's OK with me as it is a private thing. But, I do wish she could talk about it. I figure the burden's on me since I was not up front about this when we got married and so she didn't sign up for it.

[Barbara Ella]

Leslie, I am in the same situation as you, a DADT wife who knows about it all, and supports me, but wants nothing to do with it. I have only been in this situation for some 6 months, so I fear i have a long time to go, and anything I could say would have been something you have already gone through, perhaps even several times. What hurts me so much is to have lost her unconditional support and acceptance at first, to this position, I lost a dear friend that I could talk to, and now do not feel I can talk to about anything I am doing. This hurts because I am a very new dresser (9 months) who is progressing on her journey at a rapid rate as i am 65 years old, and may not have another 45 years to develop. It is lonely, and yes frustrating not to have someone beside me, unlike the previous 41 years.

I am afraid to talk to her about the advances I am making as Barbara begins to develop her personality. No joy in the first outing enfemme, no comments on the first dress purchased enfemme. Just plain vanilla recognition that I am a crossdresser, but no emotional connection. Sorry to just vent with no real ideas for you, but that is my life. i can only commiserate.

Barbara

[busker]

Leslie, like Rader, I'm neither a GG nor a do have this particular problem but I am always puzzled by what happened to "for better or worse" (and 'til death do us part) in the marriage vows and the fact that "trust" always seems to be an issue afterwards. Women don't ask up front if their men are CDs or if there is anything that they cannot' trust " them with. Better means you won the billion dollar jackpot, and worse means your a CD? The wives might get something "better" in a more compatible mate and could certainly do "worse" with someone else. What if she had discovered--after marriage--that you had 6 toes or undescended testicles. Would that have made you less of a man in her eyes. It shouldn't have. The problem is that men let women believe the Hollywood nonsense about "men" like Bond and any number of "heroes" and likewise women let men believe that Marilyn Monroe is the epitome of femininity. If you look at some of the old Bond movies, and other movies with leading men where skin is shown, you will see a lot of hairless chests, arms etc.. The examples are there and women didn't complain. If they could swoon over them--hairless and phoney hereos, why not their own husbands? Are women the "second sex" and so low in their own opinion, that a man dressing as one is one more step removed?
for those that say they have lost trust, was there any agreement up front that mentioned trust? If you have robbed your employer, it would be difficult to imagine that they would repeat their trust (in at least some circumstances) , but what has a wife lost? Just because a guy doesn't say he's a CD doesn't make him any the less trustworthy. With-holding information is not the same as lying about something .He hasn't actually stolen anything, physical or mental, from anyone, because the issue was never there in the first place. If one had retired then confided that their job at the foreign office was one of being a spy, would a spouse cry loss of trust? Not likely. So what is it about a person's mental makeup that women can't seem to get to grips with when it comes to being a little or lot feminine? We are still the same MEN. Are we all consigned to being knuckle-draggers just to please the opposite sex? And, when a woman accepts her spouse as a Cd, just exactly how does she rationalize that acceptance?
sorry this doesn't answer your question, but perhaps provides a road to alternate thinking about ways to approach her on the subject.

[busker]

My wife knows, but prefers "not to know". I keep it in the house and that's OK with me as it is a private thing. But, I do wish she could talk about it. I figure the burden's on me since I was not up front about this when we got married and so she didn't sign up for it.

I used to subscribe to that line of thinking but have changed my mind. No she didn't sign up for it, but if you won the Multi-state lottery, she didn't sign up for that either, but would gladly accept it, wouldn't she? We sign up for what we sign up for--that's the "for better or worse" part of the vows, isn't it? Maybe you didn't sign up for "rejection" either. It is a two-way street. It is a part of the individual's personality that comes out over the duration or it is there and waits to be revealed. The basic human being is there flaws and all. That is what we accept when we say "I do". So if you want to bring in trust issues, then one could say that the husband has a right to "lose trust" because now he is NOT accepted ":for better or worse." well, just a thought.

[KellyJameson]

There are certain energies born out of nature that are always in force in relations.

Some create a hierarchy based on physical power as seen in a wolf pack with the dominant alpha male and female leading the pack that you see operate within groups of people but on a much more sophisticated and complex level.

There is another energy that comes from nature that in general empowers the female to chose a mate over many available suitors so symbolically she is the sun (the center) with the planets (males) in orbit around her turned and focused on her moving toward and around her.

A transwoman interrupts this flow of energy from male to female and threatens to push the female from the center which is her natural position to being a planet orbiting another planet much like two overlapping circles with no center.

This can feel very destabilizing to the woman because it forces her in some ways to stop being a woman.

Other woman who do not expect you to orbit around them will not be threatened by you because you do not push them out of the center where they naturally live as a woman.

[WifeofWrenchette]

I used to subscribe to that line of thinking but have changed my mind. No she didn't sign up for it, but if you won the Multi-state lottery, she didn't sign up for that either, but would gladly accept it, wouldn't she? We sign up for what we sign up for--that's the "for better or worse" part of the vows, isn't it? Maybe you didn't sign up for "rejection" either. It is a two-way street. It is a part of the individual's personality that comes out over the duration or it is there and waits to be revealed. The basic human being is there flaws and all. That is what we accept when we say "I do". So if you want to bring in trust issues, then one could say that the husband has a right to "lose trust" because now he is NOT accepted ":for better or worse." well, just a thought.

I have to agree with your line of thinking. It's a two-way street for the husband and wife. When you marry someone it's supposed to be forever, warts and all.

I've seen husbands leave their wives when they got cancer and couldn't deal with it. I've seen wives leave their husbands when they lost their great job. Marriage, to me, is supposed to be forever and ever, no matter what. I guess that is just lost on some.

I accept my husband unconditionally. I wouldn't want him to suffer needlessly or not be who he is. A person cannot "change" another person and I think it's wrong to ask them to.

I have things about myself that others probably wouldn't be so accepting about and it works both ways. I accept my spouse unconditionally and he accepts me unconditionally. Love is patient, love is kind...

[Lesley_Roberta]

Hmm sure is odd reading all the comments directed at "Leslie" which is your female self? I say that as my male self is Leslie, and it has been an interesting life already wearing a 'girl's name' according to enough people to matter.

I have not yet done the wear anything angle. All the wife has had to deal with is the knowledge I wish I could. That and realizing I have no intention of using MANLY bath soaps or deoderants and I prefer NO hair to my original black bear appearance. If my wife told me she couldn't handle the attire, I'd suck it up and live with it. But it wouldn't come free.

My wife (thanks to her own depression driven conditions) is also disabled (from depression) and is a represented as a portion of the whole of the family funds (ie it isn't just me generating the ODSP cheque each month), something she is glad I see as being that way (but it has never been, this is MY money), my father made that mistake, and I am aware how little mom appreciated it.
But thanks to her depression, and I suspect some of it is her medication, her sex drive has been battered to hell. It's likely also is partly from one of my dumbest mistakes (which I wouldn't have made if I was as smart as I think I am). But the thing is, her loss of sex drive is her burden to deal with. It's her own personal wall to cross. Mine is my current transgender issues.

I personally think it is NOT unreasonable for her to make a request I remain looking like the man she married. Not even trying would be the same as my not even caring.
On the flip side, it is NOT an unreasonable request for me to expect her to be ok with play time for my male half, even if SHE doesn't really need to go OMG I'm cuming during it. She might not need it, but Leslie sure as hell does. And when he doesn't get it, 'I' get to hear it all friggin day without any means of escape.
If you think you have had to endure whining ladies, try and live with it coming from between your ears.

Marriage works BOTH ways.

If a husband won't go out of his way, why should the wife? If the wife won't go out of her way, why expect it from your husband?

Nothing in life is free, and THAT is the hell of it. What are you prepared to give in equal trade? That is for both groups here, the people needing to be something else, and the SO's dealing with being married to something else in addition to their husband. And that is to be fair, a great big something. Being transgender is a big deal to the wife. You are going to reeeeeeeeally owe her, be prepared to be considerably in debt to her. It won't be cheap.

I have been telling the wife for the last while, play time equals something in return. It doesn't have to be anything specific, but it has to be something. I have been thinking, it is only right that Leslie (who might as well be me) is more or less stuck doing her chores in the morning. The kitchen is supposed to be her area (I got the bathroom by mutual agreement). But if Leslie gets play time (it's just 30 minutes of the usual, but that is what he wants), he gets to clean the kitchen (even if it takes longer than 30 minutes).
The wife didn't ask, but she hasn't complained either. So unless she wants to ask for something else, I'm considering it a deal.

If it comes to pass, my wife requires me to deny who I am to the point of never dressing up, it isn't coming cheap dear. Because it is sure not going to be very easy for me and sure not fun for me, and certainly not fair if I get nothing out of the sacrifice. What are you ladies prepared to offer eh? What's it worth to you, to ensure your husband looks the part? And this means no sneaking around enfemme out of her sight guys.

I interpret DADT to be more realistically rethought of as DPDE or Don't pay for it, don't expect to get it.
Marriage is about getting along. You can't make a person change, but you CAN ask. And you can't get in a snit if it was just a request.
Demands of course, usually result in a day in court. Because if the person even needs to demand, well it is clear the person assumes negotiating is not even an option.

I write this as a GM who frankly thinks the only GM here is my other half Leslie. I'm a female time sharing in a bad idea body if you ask me. If I could move out of Leslie's body, I would, and leave him to do with it what he wants. But we all know splitting a mind in 2 and placing one in another body is not even possible in scifi.
I can only hope the GGs here can see that I am trying to see this fairly from both sides.

[Lesley_Roberta]

Good post wrenchette2 didn't quote as you are not far down the thread

[Sara Jessica]

I'm writing first, then I'll read the other replies because it looks like a lot of thought was poured into them.

Leslie, our situations are remarkably similar. My wife has an added burden in that there is a lingering fear on her part that next week, next month, next year, perhaps whenever, perhaps never...I could transition.

A lot of us exist with negotiated boundaries as you have discussed, or in my case, a combination of negotiations and my pushing the envelop well beyond her comfort level. But at the end of the day, like you, there is a solid foundation to our marriage which reminds me why we're still together (as I hate to say it but I would have likely left me long ago).

And remember, you cannot remotely compare the women we meet in our day to day lives with the level of acceptance afforded by a spouse. TG's are way cool, great to have as friends. We're fun, we are unique, and can be such conversation pieces. But those same women who think we're terrific wouldn't be so likely to think so if it were next to them in their own bed, so to speak.

So hang in there and hopefully she will too. May she never forget the qualities she adores that make you the wonderful human being that you are.

[Jenniferathome]

Yes, I "get" the fact that for most women, finding out that the man whom she has a romantic/sexual relationship with is a crossdresser is far harder to accept than if he were just a friend, an acquaintance, or even another family member.

It's not just "harder." I don't think there is really even a remote comparison. Women without an emotional tie have nothing vested in your life. There is no "normal" that has been changed.

Talking will be the only solution. Counseling, if you are talking about your crossdressing there, can get to the source of our wife's concerns. She has to articulate them but clearly needs help to do so. DADT doesn't work, as you know.

[ReineD]

Yes, I "get" the fact that for most women, finding out that the man whom she has a romantic/sexual relationship with is a crossdresser is far harder to accept than if he were just a friend, an acquaintance, or even another family member. Still, it hurts when the person whom you have dedicated your life to and who should be in your corner unconditionally cannot fulfill an emotional need that someone who only knows you in a more superficial manner can...

Input from the GG's here would be especially valuable...

Before I begin please know that my heart goes out to you and I say these things hoping they will help you come to terms with your existing situation so that you will not feel as frustrated or hurt.

The biggest predictor of success in marriages where the husband CDs is telling the wife right at the beginning. I'm not berating you if you didn't do this thirty years ago since I'm sure that you didn't have the knowledge or the strength of desire to CD then. But, it is what it is and when a wife finds out some years into the marriage she feels as if her husband omitted to share an important part of who he is with her, and she feels betrayed. I think this, more than anything, colors her views of the CDing. If your wife knew thirty years ago and chose to ingnore it, there may be a number of other things going on, such as a fear that if she accepts you then you will want to go increasingly further until possibly living full time. Also, unlike the SAs you wife also knows you deeply and fundamentally as your male self (the male that you have willingly been throughout your marriage), and any other presentation might feel like a costume of sorts to her, in other words not your real self or certainly not the person that she knows.

The SAs, nail techs, photographers, etc, accept you because you are a source of income for them. It is to their benefit to provide you with services and also they do not feel threatened by the CDing since it does not impact their personal lives. They also met you as Leslie and they have no other point of reference. If you had been going to a hair stylist for 30 years in male mode and decided to grow your hair and see her on a regular basis as Leslie, how long would it take her to really see you as Leslie, as opposed to your male-self in drag? Would she feel uncomfortable?

Also, if these women's husbands or boyfriends were to come out to them, how accepting would they be in their own relationships? What is the age difference between the women you speak of and your wife? If some are older women, how well would they embrace a son-in-law who crossdresses, if their daughters had difficulty with it?

I'm worried that your frustration and hurt over the status quo in your marriage (especially when you compare your wife to the other GGs you've met) will cause a build-up of resentments that will eventually poison the quality of your marriage.

You did say that marital counseling has only been marginally successful, but would you consider trying someone else, who might be more effective at getting each of you to understand the other's points of view, at least so that neither one of you will be resentful of the other?

[NicoleScott]

Leslie L.
Reading your post several times, I don't get the wife's "total rejection" of who you are. You year-round body shave, go out, have friends and a wardrobe. She just doesn't want to participate and doesn't want you to out yourself. I don't see that as total rejection, unless by that you mean anything short of total acceptance. My first wife, having never seen me dressed, nor pictures of me dressed, nor found my clothes, nor anthing other than having awareness that I crossdressed, deemed that as a deal-breaker and divorced me, being unable to be married to a crossdresser. I've read many other cases like mine here on the forum. Many CD's here wouold like that DADT arrangement, as it sure beats total rejection and divorce. The woman I am now married to accepts but doesn't participate, so I do my thing without her. She also doesn't hunt and fish with me. So I do them without her and don't see it as total rejection of who I am. Leslie, if all you are is a CD, then I can see it as toal rejection. But if you are more than that, she is only rejecting the CD. Consider the glass half-full.

[Sara Jessica]

Leslie L.
Reading your post several times, I don't get the wife's "total rejection" of who you are. You year-round body shave, go out, have friends and a wardrobe. She just doesn't want to participate and doesn't want you to out yourself. I don't see that as total rejection, unless by that you mean anything short of total acceptance. My first wife, having never seen me dressed, nor pictures of me dressed, nor found my clothes, nor anthing other than having awareness that I crossdressed, deemed that as a deal-breaker and divorced me, being unable to be married to a crossdresser. I've read many other cases like mine here on the forum. Many CD's here wouold like that DADT arrangement, as it sure beats total rejection and divorce. The woman I am now married to accepts but doesn't participate, so I do my thing without her. She also doesn't hunt and fish with me. So I do them without her and don't see it as total rejection of who I am. Leslie, if all you are is a CD, then I can see it as toal rejection. But if you are more than that, she is only rejecting the CD. Consider the glass half-full.

Nicole, you make some excellent points.

There are many in these pages who would give their right arm for Leslie's DADT situation, or for mine as well. Yet which is it, a longing to be able to share an integral part of our very being with the one we love most in this world or simply pushing that envelop as far as we can and then wanting still more???

The joys I experience go for the most part unshared. It's separate where we should be shared. It's alone where we should be together, at least in a "how was your day today honey?" instead of utter silence as if the day never happened. It's the absolute exhaustion that comes with the hiding to keep it out of her sight, and the sneaking when it comes to having to conjure stories about where I am...not to her but to everyone else.

Then there is the pure frustration of the separation in general. Yes, I want more than DADT. Do I want my wife to go running around town with me? It happens that I don't. I cannot think of anything more horrifying on a personal level. This is because when out with any natal female friend, I used to put an inordinate amount of pressure on myself to measure up and would get really down if I was perceived as anything less than a female. I've pretty much gotten away from this mentality but I can see it coming back in spades should my wife accompany me. It's not something she desires and I am all good with that. But still, I do wish for more on the home front.

Just as I am certain she wishes for less.

[ReineD]

Then there is the pure frustration of the separation in general. Yes, I want more than DADT. Do I want my wife to go running around town with me? It happens that I don't.

Sara Jessica, please take this in the spirit that I mean it (kindly), but I can tell you this from the POV of having been there that nothing will ever be enough until full and complete acceptance and even then, your wife's full participation still would not be enough. Maybe it has to do with the need to be seen and heard and believed and respected by everyone. It's the wish or the need for a multi-faceted life.

My SO also dressed at home for years. When she found an accepting partner in me, she wanted to go out and she did, alone and with me. Eventually she wanted to make friends who were separate from me. She wanted her own friends, her own experiences in which I was not involved and which were deeper than interactions with the obligatory politeness and niceness of SAs and nail techs. This is when she stopped dressing at home and when I suggested a nice dinner at home just the two of us, she kinda stopped being interested.

A wife's approval is only one step in the process.

[busker]

I'm writing first, then I'll read the other replies because it looks like a lot of thought was poured into them.

Leslie, our situations are remarkably similar. My wife has an added burden in that there is a lingering fear on her part that next week, next month, next year, perhaps whenever, perhaps never...I could transition.

A lot of us exist with negotiated boundaries as you have discussed, or in my case, a combination of negotiations and my pushing the envelop well beyond her comfort level. But at the end of the day, like you, there is a solid foundation to our marriage which reminds me why we're still together (as I hate to say it but I would have likely left me long ago).

And remember, you cannot remotely compare the women we meet in our day to day lives with the level of acceptance afforded by a spouse. TG's are way cool, great to have as friends. We're fun, we are unique, and can be such conversation pieces. But those same women who think we're terrific wouldn't be so likely to think so if it were next to them in their own bed, so to speak.

So hang in there and hopefully she will too. May she never forget the qualities she adores that make you the wonderful human being that you are.

Could is such an important word in so many contexts. for those of us with serious illness--I have lung cancer--I COULD die sooner rather than later. Yes, you COULD transition down the road, or tomorrow but it is such a conditional word that sometimes life just seems to stop for the person whose every waking moment is fixed on the thought.. The trick--for all of us--is to look at the future, plan for things ahead that allows us to keep moving forward (despite the handicaps) and , in the end, "no one gets out alive" (or maybe we all transition). It is a real problem to remain positive , and that, in your case, you won't transition, and your wife will live happily ever after. It is so easy to talk ourselves into the darkness and breaking that pattern is hard as hell. Letting go (of a person or idea) is part of the process to a renewed self.

[NicoleScott]

....I can tell you this from the POV of having been there that nothing will ever be enough until full and complete acceptance and even then, your wife's full participation still would not be enough.

In some cases, sure. But many of us are quite content with occasional dressing in private, and have no need for full acceptance. Maybe you are talking about those with intense internal feminine identities, who want to be recognized as a woman. Part-time dressers, especially pleasure dressers, don't have this need.

A wife's approval is only one step in the process.

Maybe this is my issue with your first quoted statement. What process?

[Jill Devine]

.....
She does not let me shave off my mustache, or my chest hair forest. She says that belongs to her...
Rader

I bet if a man had that same amount of control over his wife he'd be called abusive. Imagine a husband telling his wife that her hair belonged to him and she wasn't allowed to cut it or style it the way she wanted.

Not wanting to stir but I'd tell my where she can get off if she tried that with me. My body is my body and hers is... Hers.

[ReineD]

Maybe this is my issue with your first quoted statement. What process?

I agree, pleasure dressers don't have this need. And judging by many of the posts I read here, although the CDing begins with sexual motives for nearly everyone, it does settle down into a need to express a feminine identity for a lot of people even if this doesn't develop into an abject need to transition and live full time femme. There are many shades of grey.

In the case of an identity dresser, the process is all about self expression and ultimately the resulting acceptance from others, even if this is done in a way as to preserve his male career and his marriage if he wants to, by choosing to express femininity to select groups of people who only know her in femme mode. This is why non fetish CDers wish to leave their closets, and although they believe that a wife's acceptance is the be-all and end-all to their desires, once they achieve this it is rarely enough. They want to go out and be seen, heard, and interact with others.

[Leslie Langford]

Thank you, ladies, for the heartfelt and sincere responses to my original post in this thread.

Much food for thought here, but I think that it was Barbara Ella who really hit the nail on the head for me in her reply, and truly "got" the essence of what was troubling me so much - namely the inability to share something that is so vital and so much a part of who I am with the person whom I love the most, and who theoretically should also be my best friend and confidante in all matters, including this.

My wife can share all of her joys, sorrows, frustrations, successes, failures etc. with me with no strings attached, and I am always there for her. And yet, when it comes to me - not so much; there is always that elephant in the room, so to speak, and certain topics are always taboo. How fair is that? Where is the acknowledgment of the "for worse" part of the marriage vows here in equal measure to the "for better" part as busker pointed out? Loss of intimacy in a marriage is certainly part of the collateral damage here.

And why is this type of stigmatization tacitly sanctioned by a society that can somehow be far more forgiving of known personally destructive behaviors such as smoking, gambling, womanizing, alcoholism, and drug abuse etc. - and for no better reason than they just happen to be more common and therefore better understood, even if morally and ethically they are far less defensible than crossdressing if viewed objectively?

As Barbara Ella alludes to, my wife can come home from a shopping trip and gush all about that cute top, skirt, dress etc. that she just bought and which is to die for, but when I buy something similar that really rocks my world, who do I have to share that with? So when one of my GG friends who know "Leslie" comments favorably on one of my outfits or a pair of "killer" shoes that I might be wearing, is it any wonder that I am especially elated by this type of validation, even if my heart breaks a little bit at the same time? Am I guilty of "emotionally cheating" on my wife when I start to form such a strong bond with my GG friends in this regard because they are fulfilling a need of mine that my wife will/can not?

Speaking of which, some of the other posters here cautioned me not to read too much into this perceived acceptance by my GG friends and acquaintances. They essentially implied that the main driver for this was probably the fact that they were providing a service or a product, and that I represented a "safe" and therefore valued customer to them once they got to know me, even if I wasn't exactly "mainstream". Yes, I am not entirely naive, and yes, that thought has crossed my mind more than once. And yet...

Why would my make up artist have no qualms about me coming to her home studio for my makeovers and not agonize over what the neighbors might think if they ever caught a glimpse of me? Why would she willingly take photos of me in her backyard in broad daylight and in plain view after one of her makeovers to capture the results, some of which I have already posted here? Why would she arrange for one of her neighbors who is starting a home-based manicure business to do my nails after one of her makeovers, offer me a spritz of her perfume just before I headed over, and then come over a few minutes later with a bottle of her own nail polish for me to try out which she felt would go especially well with my lipstick? Why would she ask if I would be interested in contributing to her website by including some of my shopping and/or fashion tips to the blog attached to it - and which she posted openly under my name - and then offer me freebie makeovers in return? Why would she charge me a preferred rate on my regular makeovers on an on-going basis, even though it typically takes her more time to do one than it does for an average GG?

My guess is that it is not just about the money for her, but that maybe she actually likes me as a person, feels a connection with me on some level - and maybe, just maybe - also happens to be one of those rare people who gets great joy simply out of helping others - and especially when they see just how much happiness it brings them.

As for that consignment store owner whom I mentioned - I am always welcome and treated warmly whenever I visit her store, as are other crossdressers who shop there. In fact, it appears that she actually has an affinity for our community, and even schedules special shopping events for members of one of our local crossdresser social clubs from time to time.

And once, when I wrote her a complimentary note regarding my positive shopping experiences in her store, I also thanked her on behalf of our community for openly acknowledging that she has many transgendered clients along with her GG customers, as was mentioned in a newspaper article about her store that appeared around the same time. Not only did she thank me profusely for my endorsement, she asked if she might post it on her website in the "Testimonials" section as well - which she then promptly did. Again, "above and beyond" acceptance by this lady, and nary a worry about how her regular GG clients might react to all this. And it's not as if her CDing customers are vital to the success of her business - it's doing just fine on its own, and her store is always full of people whenever I go there.

Yes, I understand that the dynamic between a wife (or SO) and her crossdressing partner is far different from the one between the same crossdresser and a non-involved GG (even if she is a CD-admirer) - and especially if she has only ever met his female alter ego. And yet, there are so many GG's out there who not only find us intriguing but are also able to get past preconceived notions of what we might be, and recognize that we might have something special to offer that most "real" men don't. Why can't so many of our own wives and SO's come to the same realization, rather than continuously getting hung up on outmoded gender stereotypes?

[ReineD]

Leslie, would you ever consider printing this post and giving it to your wife?

You do feel hurt, this is apparent. I guess there's not much we can say to help you look at the situation differently. So, another tack seems to be in order, and this could be talking to your wife on a level that you maybe haven't before?

[April_Ligeia]

This post really hits home for me. About half of all marriages end in divorce, that's a sad but true fact. It sounds like your wife is getting what she needs out of the marriage, but is it at the expense of you getting what you need? And believe me, after being in the "dadt" situation for about five years in my own marriage (now defunct), I do not take your frustration lightly. I will say that, ironically, now that I am in a situation where I can be myself (again like when I was originally single), much of the compulsion and "urgency" about crossdressing no longer bothers me, because I wear whatever I want at home and out around when I am not working, so nothing is "bottled up" any more. Of course, when things are in "dadt" mode, desires "bottle-up" and overwhelm other parts of our brains, but I think this is true for anything we bottle up, so example if you're dieting and decide you can't eat chocolate, all of a sudden chocolate takes on an enormous significance. Even if you would have gone months without thinking about it or eating it before it was "taboo," all of a sudden you can't live without it.
I hope things work out for you but I will be honest and say that I thought things would work out for me and my ex, but it turned out that the differences were deeper set and irreconcilable. I hope this is not the case for you because it is hard, I really hope your marriage can pull through this, but, more importantly, I hope that you can go through whatever you have to go through and come out on the other end stronger, no matter what that outcome may entail. Be strong.

[kimdl93]

I wish I had an answer for you Leslie. From what you describe, your frustrated with your wife's inability to embrace this part of you. Of course that is frustrating. I'd like to think that with lots of patience and time, that she might incrementally soften her stance, but realistically many people are just not capable of that kind of change. So, you need to constructively deal with the frustration... Perhaps, the best you can do is to muddle through, and enjoy those platonic relationships regardless of whether motivated by money or genuine friendship, and continue to invest yourself in your marriage. It may not be ideal, but its real.

[TGMarla]

Leslie, as you know, I'm in one of thoses DADT situations as well. But everyone is different. My wife, like yours, simply cannot wrap her mind around the whole thing. She watches all these shows on TV, like Dr. Phil and Oprah (when it was on), and is seemingly very accepting of trans people. She just can't handle her own husband being one of them. And over the years, I've done this thing on my own for so long now, I admit I'd feel a little strange crossdressing in front of her. Had things worked out differently, who can say? I might be a lot more "out" than I am now. But we've reached a balance that works for us. The other shoe hasn't dropped yet, and she's not had to confront me face to face about all of it in many years.

I agree with you that it's frustrating. I agree with you that ideally we'd all like to be able to share this most integral part of ourselves with the persons with whom we've chosen to share our lives. But instead, I continue to do my best to keep this out of her life, and concentrate on making every other thing in our marriage as good as I can make it. If that's the very best I can get, then I'm willing to settle for it. Bringing this whole thing out into the open in front of her and forcing her to deal with it is not worth the personal cost to me of losing her and all that comes with her. So I do what I've always done - suck it up and deal with it by myself.

I guess the bottom line for me is that although there's no way I'll ever stop crossdressing, being way out and open about it isn't important enough to me to end my marriage over it.