Just an opinion here, but it sounds like ( to me anyway) that you might be holding back sex as a way of punishing her for not accepting your cross dressing?
Just an opinion here, but it sounds like ( to me anyway) that you might be holding back sex as a way of punishing her for not accepting your cross dressing?
Rebecca I dont know the history of your present relationship - 5 years is quite a time. Did your SO know about your CD'ing when you first met? did you tell her about it before you had intimate relations with her?
you say you're not willing or able to change and those are valid feelingsI love her, and she loves me, but she wants to change me in an area in which I'm not willing to change... and as much as she desires to marry and spend the rest of our lives together, she's not amenable to seeing her way clear to accepting my reality.
but you dont seem to think that your SO's feelings are valid? she finds the idea of CD'ing icky and weird and doesnt want to be a part of it - those are her feelings and she has every right to them, they are also valid - just as yours are valid. You cant change and it sounds like she cant change either.
well clearly a guy in sexy female lingerie and make up doesnt do it for her! and why should it? she's a hetero female, not a lesbianI long to let myself be passionate and uninhibited with an accepting partner... and if I shower and shave, why not some makeup and nice lingerie to heighten my libido? I wanna feel sexy, too... and being a "macho" guy doesn't do it for me
you want her to let you be 'yourself' but you dont want to let her be 'herself'.I'm sure I'm not alone in thinking as I do. Wouldn't it be nice if our SO's would love us enough to allow us the courtesy of dressing as we desire?
I'm gonna keep working at gaining her acceptance, or she can resign herself to a more or less platonic relationship, in which I pay the tab when we go out... that's me being the guy.
If she wants more than that... well, then let me be my femme side!
You will only have sex with her if she will let you be your femme side ? well your SO has voiced her feelings so this isnt going to happen is it -
in my experience, withholding sex as a punishment or a bribe is not conducive to a good relationship - that's just playing games and it normally backfires. Why would you want to back your SO into a corner to do something she is obviously not comfortable with ?
Please correct me if I have misunderstood the situation but from where I stand I cant see any future for you as a couple - you obviously resent the fact that your SO cannot be comfortable with your femme side, and you cant get sexually interested in her unless you are dressed en femme -
Your SO wants a normal relationship with a normal, totally male guy - she's willing to accept your CD'ing as long as she doesnt have to see it or get involved in it and your not happy with that level of acceptance.
No! The problem lies with incompatibility within the relationship. A sex change is NEVER the answer to relationship problems even if they are connected to your crossdressing. EVER.Originally Posted by Julie Gaum
Sorry, this is horrible advise.
E²
JULIE GAUM and you Silentpartner GG SO said it so well, along with many others here.
It's heartbreaking, for all of us.
Thinking when made love to each other, we had something so pure and wonderful...it expressed, enriched, nourished and defined our love.
Then only later...years? decades? we find our lover has only been "pretending" and fantasizing about something we knew nothing about and they just tossed our love-making away so easily, when the truth finally came out.
Last edited by Momarie; 10-09-2012 at 09:46 AM.
[SIZE="4"]Momarie[/SIZE]
If you can't "get it up" without those auxiliary items, then that's the way it is -- but is that even necessary to be affectionate ?
After 20 months on HRT I wouldn't be able to "perform" worth a darn, but if only my wife were to ask for some physical affection, I would be happy to do what I could.
My wife is away for a few days; I sure do miss her hug...
As a part of the discussion in the first 48 hours after my wife and I discovered Tina, we set up some initial "codes of conduct", as it were. Since we knew nothing about how Tina would progress and mature, the easiest interpersonal "code" was, "when I want my man I get him."
No problem!
This comment strikes me as wildly selfish. I mean imagine you rSO saying, "Wouldn't it be nice if our SO's would love us enough to not dress as a woman?" I think you need to reset your expectation as to what acceptance means. Not having to hide is really quite exceptional. Crossdressing is strange, don't kid yourself. While normal to us, it's not "normal."
It sounds to me like you should end this relationship and look for someone who can accept your feminine side. Before starting a new relationship, you need to sort yourself out - if possible, with a therapist experienced in gender counseling. Your posting shows indications that you might be transsexual. If that is the case, you need to see how you want to deal with that.
If you ARE transsexual, and you try to stay in a relationship with a woman who does not accept and even encourage your feminine side, you will start to split. The woman inside will do what it takes to avoid the woman who has rejected her. You'll spend more and more time away, become less and less affectionate, and might even eventually sabotage the relationship completely. Whatever you do, don't make life-long or life-changing commitments until you have sorted these things out. Attempting to force the situation by trying to get married, have children, and have a house and home together - could be nearly impossible.
If you are just a cross-dresser, then you can set boundaries to your expression that both of you would be comfortable with, and it wouldn't be a struggle to honor them, and you wouldn't be threatened if she didn't want more. The problem is that you don't seem to be a basic cross-dresser. At minimum, you are transgender and possibly transsexual. You may be able to live a happy normal life, or you might become a part-timer, not transitioning, but wanting to work as a man and experience love and romance as a woman. Whatever you decide, it needs to be your choice.
My therapist once explained "If you try to kill Debbie, Debbie will try to kill you". I realized today that it's the truth. Debbie can sabotage in hundreds of different ways, and can even create life-threatening situations. I've been clean and sober for 32 years, because I know that when my black-out takes over, Debbie can do things that are very dangerous. I also know that if I even try to suppress Debbie, she can negatively impact my performance at work, cause me to overeat, and even create life threatening conditions that can lead to stroke or heart attacks. I've had two hospitalizations for heart conditions, and one stroke that could have killed me.
When a loved one rejects Debbie, my relationship is not the same with them after. I'll avoid them, avoid direct communication with them, and go into Nerd mode or Clown mode. When I was a kid and couldn't play with girls anymore, and the boys beat me up - I started reading books, hundreds of them every year. Reading books about girls made me sad, because they reminded me that I couldn't be a girl. Books about boys doing boy things made me unhappy, because I knew I couldn't do those.
I ended up reading lots of non-fiction books - that held no emotional charge. When you read 6 to 8 non-fiction books a week, from age six to age 13, and then up it to 20 books a week, most at college level, that tends to make one incredibly smart. But without the social skills of either a man or a woman to go with it, it can be annoying - coming up with factoids and book-knowledge of nearly every subject discussed, can make things very awkward. Even on this forum, I often provide a great deal of factual information - and have to remember to share my real feelings and experiences as well. Otherwise it can be hard and cold.
I also learned to survive by letting others make fun of me, and giving them things to laugh at that were less threatening. I'd act really crazy, like Robin Williams or Jim Carey - but I was doing that in 1968 - years before Williams and Carrie became famous. Robin Williams and I even went to school with some of the same classmates. Many of my classmates in Denver went to University of Colorado as theater students, in classes with Robin. When Mork and Mindy came out kids at my college said "Rex, this guy stole your act!". Often wonder if Mrs Doubtfire was another aspect of my persona that he had turned into a script. Robin and I have never met face-to-face, and he has done a far better job of comedy and making a difference in the world with comedy - than I ever could have. Someday I'd like to meet him and see if he had ever even heard of me, or "Crazy Rex".
The problem with the Clown is that it's very hard for people to take me seriously. It also makes it much harder to have a heart to heart conversation, because if things get too uncomfortable, I can go into clown mode. The only problem is that when Debbie is threatened or rejected, the clowning and jokes can get very mean, even cruel.
Last edited by DebbieL; 10-08-2012 at 10:14 PM. Reason: Format changes.
There's your answer. She thinks you're a guy. You feel you're a woman. She has been honest about her feelings with you, and she's OK with it based on the premise that you're a guy and the CDing is an option. Have you been fully honest with her?
First, that's a passive-agressive approach. She does accept it based on her assumption that you are a guy and the CDing is optional. You're leaving it up to her to figure the rest of it out by herself and until then, you'll "punish" her by not being intimate.
Second, she's not going to be able to figure it out by herself. Tell her who you are and what you want. Then at least you'll both be on the same playing fleld and you can decide whether you will work on the relationship or move on.
But, if you care for her you'll need to give her time to catch up. Don't forget, YOU know who you are and what you want, but she has no clue. After you tell her, not only will she need to redefine her understanding of you, she'll need to redefine her own role as the only feminine energy in your relationship, and this will entail a redefinition of her sexuality. She may not be able to go there, or if her feelings for you are strong enough, it will take time to get there.
PS. If she said the CDing was "icky" when she first found out but she has since softened, please don't continue to resent her. You're coming into this thread painting her in a negative light, and you're not considering that most people don't grow up around CDers and their opinions of the CDing (until they actually begin relationships with TGs) are influenced by a biased media. Gosh, even many TGs take years sometimes to accept themselves.
Reine
Becky, she wants a man, and your not, you sound more TS than CD to me, you don't have to have surgery to be TS, you just have to feel that you are the other gender inside.
I have a very accepting wife, but that stops at the bedroom door, I'm the one that belongs to the LGBT part of society, not her, she is straight, and wants to stay that way.
You've said you have been together for 5 years, but how long has she known about Becky. If she say's and has said for a long time, it's alright that you do it, but not around me, and that has held constant, either you accept it for what it is, or move on. But withholding affection, is not away to move a relationship forward, it will eventually kill it.
Love does not conquer all, and not all relationships have a happy ending. Life comes down to choices, and you have a pretty easy one to make, Pick one either let her go, so you both can find happiness, or accept what she offers, and appreciate it for what it is. But longing for what can never be is not healthy.
Tina B.
Magic is the art of changing consciousness at will.
Thanks to each of you who've expressed your thoughts and opinions. Rather than quote individual replies, I'll try to clarify where our relationship has been, where it's at, and where it may be headed.
A little background...
We met online through a normal, generic dating site. We went out for about six weeks before becoming intimate. I did then, and still do, find her attractive and desireable. I do regret not having been completely open and honest with her from the outset regarding my transgenderism, particularly prior to intimacy.
She asked me one evening, maybe our sixth month together, if something was bothering me, as I seemed distant and introverted. I opened up to her about my crossdressing, transgenderism, and gender identity-related issues.
She has been extremely understanding, especially in that she had never been involved with anyone like me. It was all new to her, and she's been really supportive.
So please realize that I had no intention of painting her in a bad light. She's a really good person, and I appreciate that she has gone to great lengths to indulge my femme side, including lovemaking in lingerie (both of us)!
I see us remaining together for the long term, as I'd like to be able to alleviate her financial concerns in retirement. She's always been looking towards the future, and whether we marry, live together or separately, we'll make it work.
As to "withholding affection"; I don't play that game. My upbringing in an environment which was non-demonstrable of closeness has a lot to do with it. I've learned to be self-reliant, keeping my distance to avoid the possibility of being hurt.
My GF just seems to want more touchy-feely affection than I feel comfortable with. She knows I'm like that, yet I think she's accepted at least that aspect of my admittedly flawed personality.
I told her that I'd be off Halloween and the day after, and she asked if I'd stay home, or come over to her place... I said I'd be coming over to hand out candy with her. She was happy to hear it, as she loves to have me over... however I'm dressed!
Your latest post seems like a bit of a climb down. You did make it quite clear that she would have to either change her views or live in a platonic relationship. And the woman you describe here sounds a lot more accepting and open minded than the one you described earlier. I do think that considering that she didn't know about your transgenderism before you became a couple that you should perhaps learn to be happy with what you have. If you can't, then it's up to you whether you feel the relationship is worth continuing or not, but I honestly don't understand what more you can expect from your girlfriend. I don't know if you were just in a particular mood when you started the thread, but to be honest it made me a bit angry that someone could be that selfish and not be able to see things from anothers perspective.
I don't mean to be mean or nasty, it's just there's a lot of mixed messages coming across.
EDIT: I was in a bit of a mood myself when I types this, so sorry if it does come across as a bit harsh. I hope things work out for you both.
Last edited by Amy A; 10-10-2012 at 01:28 PM.
Over the years my SO and I have had our ups and downs, and I do know what it feels like to see things blacker than they might be and dump it all in here. I've done this in FAB sometimes.So please realize that I had no intention of painting her in a bad light. She's a really good person, and I appreciate that she has gone to great lengths to indulge my femme side, including lovemaking in lingerie (both of us)!
I see us remaining together for the long term, as I'd like to be able to alleviate her financial concerns in retirement. She's always been looking towards the future, and whether we marry, live together or separately, we'll make it work.
I'm glad that you feel more hopeful about your situation today, and I also continue to encourage deeper talks with your SO about the true depth of your feelings. Your long-term relationship may not turn out the way you'd wish, but the alternative is to suffer in silence next time these feelings overtake you and after many years this really can erode a relationship.
Good luck!
Reine
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