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Thread: Protective Order

  1. #26
    Gold Member Alice B's Avatar
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    I would do both, with the attorney on top of the list. I would also report her ebhaviour to her school. She should not be counciling anyone.

  2. #27
    Swans have more fun! sandra-leigh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alice B View Post
    I would do both, with the attorney on top of the list. I would also report her ebhaviour to her school. She should not be counciling anyone.
    Taking into account only what has been posted on this thread (because I haven't gone back to read others by the same poster), I would suggest that at present there is too little to go on to report her at this time. I would suggest that the time to report her would not be until after a judge had ruled that there was no credible threat. Until that time, it becomes a matter of "perception", she just has to say she "perceived" a threat, and unless / until such a threat is deemed totally without foundation, she would be considered to be within her rights and right mind, and a professional body would not want to act as if she was not unless the claim was obvious blatant nonsense or paranoia (which, cyclically, she can claim it wasn't, seeing as the judge was willing to grant the temporary order.) Reporting her at this time could be all too easily be turned against you, as "evidence" that you are ill-willed and "out to get revenge". Wait and see what the next hearing has to say about her conduct.

    However, in the meantime, it would probably be a good idea to research what her school teaches about cross-dressing and gender issues. If the school itself teaches that it isn't an illness, then she is going against the school and should have known better than to claim it was illness (provided, that is, that she has taken that unit / class already). If the school itself teaches that it is a form of illness, then reporting her to her school would accomplish nothing immediately productive. Reporting her could, in such a situation, be part of setting up to force the school itself to revoke such a hypothetical teaching as being not in accordance with accepted professional practice.

    I have lost track for the moment of whom is having which difficulty. Stephanie, is your wife studying at a "Christian" university? If so then reporting her on this issue would possibly be of little benefit, as the "illness" perspective might be in line with the university teachings.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephanieJ View Post
    A little background - I have dressed in private since before we were married and her acceptance level waxed and waned. She is a therapist in training who suffers from Borderline Personality Disorder and has been on various psychotropic drugs. Two weeks ago my 76 year old neighbor went senile and murdered his wife with a hammer. The man was a friend who I knew well and in a Facebook post I said that I sympathized with him prayed for him. Apparently my ex took this as a threat.
    ...
    Any other sage advice???
    Yes. Stop using Facebook!!!

    Going through your past posts you seem to be a nice enough person. I must admit I find it extraordinary that the judge would grant that order based just on a Facebook comment and the cross dressing (why on earth you guys don't have nationwide anti discrimination laws is beyond me!). It would seem likely on appeal that the order would be thrown out (certainly in Australia the CD'ing thing wouldn't even be considered relevant by a judge). The only other sage advice I would give is make sure that your house and you are as safe as possible in the eyes of the law, i.e. if you have any weapons, lose them!

    And BTW to anyone out there supporting or proposing the theory that men get a "raw deal" from your justice system, according to your own FBI data in 2011 over 3 times more homicides were committed by males against females than by females against males in 2011
    http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr...e-data-table-6
    So if there is a bias towards women by the legal and judicial system, it is justified!!!
    Last edited by Kate T; 11-16-2012 at 09:13 PM.

  4. #29
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    I am stunned at the overall "conclusion" drawn by the responders. Has no one heard of presumption of innocence? In this case, the wife of the Stephanie. One party in an argument offered no details except that they were railroaded. Is it the majority belief that the judgement came solely due to crossdressing? Is justice that brainless? Here is my immediate reaction to the OP: what are you not telling us? No one removes parents rights so cavalierly.

  5. #30
    Silver Member Angela Campbell's Avatar
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    Actually a presumtion of innocence only is used in criminal procedings. The government against you. In civil cases where it is one person or group against another this does not apply at all. They only need a preponderance of the evidence not even beyond a reasonable doubt. Just a slight tipping of the scales. Yes it happens all the time that parental rights are removed with even less reason. Many times just because a judge just doesn't want to hear it and does what is easiest. Usually in the favor of the mother, as most of the court system views the Mother as the true parent and the father as just a provider.

    Something else you may not know. In some states there is NO APPEAL for this type of judgement. It is usually temporary until the end of the divorce case and this can sometimes last for years. Again ...NO appeal whatsoever. I ran into this. I was ordered a temporary order by a circuit judge that basically gave my soon to be ex my entire paycheck per month except for $200 (about 20 yrs ago) AND gave me 2 kids to live with me to support. At that time a small apartment was around $600 a month and I was earning around $2000 take home. So on a temp order I got to keep 10% of my take home pay and support 2 kids while she kept 1 of our kids. I had a good lawyer and there was nothing that could be done until the divorce was finalized.

    Also know there was no abuse from me towards her whatsoever. Not physical, not verbal nothing. She decided she didn't want to be married anymore, asked me to move out and six months later found out I had a new girlfriend, (she also had a new boyfriend) and she became enraged and started a war. Her behavior eventually caused all of our kids to avoid her for years as she was very abusive to all of us for years. The law not only allowed it but supported it. I will not say this happens to all men, and I will not say many women do not also get the short end of the stick, but sometimes it is just unbelievable what can happen.
    Last edited by Angela Campbell; 11-16-2012 at 09:48 PM.

  6. #31
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    In addition to a good attorney, find a good therapist for yourself. Take care of yourself. Work out. Embrace friends. Go to church. Stay focused at work. Stay close to other family members. Take care of - you. Things with your children will work out. Give it time. Don't get discouraged. Make the most of the time you spend with your children. Do what is best for them and always show them and tell them how much you love them. Make plans. Set goals. Enjoy the moments. Things will get better. Good luck. This is very difficult but so many of us have gone through what you are going through now.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephanieJ View Post
    The law tends to favor women when it comes to these matters.
    This line is so true. Very True.

  8. #33
    Member brandi's Avatar
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    My ex wife was granted a restraining order against me, by lying to the judge,saying I was abusing her and threatening her and my kids with no proof at all. It was all lies, but when I went into court with my attorney, she didn't have to admit to anything. I started recoring our conversations and got her to admit that she lied and she was trying to keep my daughters from me because I wouldn't give her money. I eventually got custody, but it was expensive(worth every penny) and extremely mentally tough. Recordings can't be used in court, but they can be used in negotiations. Good Luck.

    Brandi

  9. #34
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    I thought this site was to provide help and support to our members - not to judge, not to determine the "innocence" of a spouse, not to be critical of a member asking for help, and not to question a member's honesty ("what are you not telling us?"). Stephanie is in need of support, not criticism.

  10. #35
    Just can't help myself! Brenda456's Avatar
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    Unfortunately, in cases of alleged domestic violence, the laws are very one sided. They are written be politicians and it is politically correct to favor victims who more often than not are women. The battle ground will be in the divorce court. Hiring a good lawyer (not necessarily the nastiest) is the way to go.

  11. #36
    Rotten 80's child Nicole Erin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adina View Post
    Yes. Stop using Facebook!!!
    That is right. Anymore, just using facebook is evidence of a crime or something bad. You already know when people try to find "dirt" on anyone that is the first place they look. Someone posts something mundane like, "So tired today" and that is somehow proof that they did something, why else would they be so tired? Well you see the point anyways.

    But your being CD does not automatically mean you will lose the battle. Now that she has brought that out, what more can she use? For some, using that against a CD is like the main weapon. Once that round is spent, they don't have much.
    Plus, I have known men and a TS in real life who won custody. In the TS's case, her ex wife was some party and drug addict.
    If you can somehow prove she is an unfit mother, she could lose.
    These days, the law is still normally on the woman's side but more men are winning.
    It takes a true Erin to be a pain in the assatar.

  12. #37
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    GO and get a Qualified GENDER THERAPIST. Tell them your situation, get a written document stating that you are mentally healthy.

    The whole case could be thrown out on her conjecture, she is not a legal licensed therapist. So what she says in court is JUST HER OPINION.

    A Legal, Licensed Therapist is where you need to start. Then get an attorney with marital and family law experience.

    The pastor route is great but you need LEGAL GROUND to stand on not Holy Ground. Continue to speak with him but understand that once the court is involved all the things you need to move forwrd must be documented by Licensed Proffesionals.

    Best of Luck to you,
    -Donni-

  13. #38
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    You are all brilliant and so kind!!! Thank you so so much for the excellent advice.

    Now let me add an X-Factor.

    My wife's brother has been living with us for nearly a year. He is a disabled veteran who is severely obese and does not work. I've always gotten along with him but he can be a bit "weird" at times and is highly opinionated. I found out that my wife is representing herself with his advice. He's also the one trying to alienate my kids from me. He leaves loaded guns lying around the house and is often left alone with the kids. What do you think my chances are of having him removed from the home?

    On a side note, I'm meeting with three different attorneys next week and will select one to represent me. One is good but over priced so I'm ruling that one out. Other two are reasonable, but not quite as aggressive. One is male and the other is female. I hate to bring gender into it but I think having a female counselor might give me an advantage. Agree of disagree?

  14. #39
    Silver Member DebbieL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephanieJ View Post
    You are all brilliant and so kind!!! Thank you so so much for the excellent advice.
    Now let me add an X-Factor.

    My wife's brother has been living with us for nearly a year. He is a disabled veteran who is severely obese and does not work. I've always gotten along with him but he can be a bit "weird" at times and is highly opinionated. I found out that my wife is representing herself with his advice. He's also the one trying to alienate my kids from me. He leaves loaded guns lying around the house and is often left alone with the kids. What do you think my chances are of having him removed from the home?
    Whose name is on the title? Who's name is on the rent check or house payment? Does he pay rent? Is the amount he pays appropriate to the services he gets? If you pay the rent or the house is in your name, and you sign the house payments, and you are not being compensated for his share of the rent, then you have the right to expel him from the house, but I strongly recommend that you get a lawyer. You have to do it in a legal way. If he has ever pointed a weapon at you or your kids, made a verbal threat, or has acted violent to you, or if he has made statements of violence toward homosexuals or cross-dressers, then you could probably get a restraining order. If possible, get it on record, an audio recording or a video recording would be perfect. That would be enough to document not only that he is a clear and immediate threat to your safety. Don't do anything without a lawyer. She has probably been planning the divorce for several months, even a few years. If you go in half-cocked with do-it-yourself unsubstantiated accusations, you might be the one with the restraining order removing you from the home while you are court ordered to pay half after-tax income as child support.

    On a side note, I'm meeting with three different attorneys next week and will select one to represent me. One is good but over priced so I'm ruling that one out. Other two are reasonable, but not quite as aggressive. One is male and the other is female. I hate to bring gender into it but I think having a female counselor might give me an advantage. Agree of disagree?
    Make sure that each knows that you are transgender. Don't be snowed into thinking that you won't have to pay - make sure you understand your odds of winning, your obligations, and the lawyer's attitude toward your dressing. If the woman is a fundamentalist Christian who says, yes, if you pay me enough I can help you, then run the other way. If they start asking about how much your house is worth and how much you owe, and how much you have in your 401K, IRA, and other accounts - BEFORE deciding to represent you, thank them for their time - there are some lawyers who will litigate even when they know you have no chance of winning.

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by DebbieL View Post



    Make sure that each knows that you are transgender. Don't be snowed into thinking that you won't have to pay - make sure you understand your odds of winning, your obligations, and the lawyer's attitude toward your dressing. If the woman is a fundamentalist Christian who says, yes, if you pay me enough I can help you, then run the other way. If they start asking about how much your house is worth and how much you owe, and how much you have in your 401K, IRA, and other accounts - BEFORE deciding to represent you, thank them for their time - there are some lawyers who will litigate even when they know you have no chance of winning.
    This is so very true DebbieL. These attorneys get you in their office and go over a huge load of paperwork wanting to know how much you make, how much money do you have? They will represent a man with full knowledge that his client doesn't have a chance of getting custody of the children. Everyone says to get a good lawyer. Aren't they all good lawyers? The lawyers go through the motions. They will answer your questions. They want your money, that's why they are lawyers. One of my lawyers got me in trouble when my ex took me back to court for $100.00 more per week on top of what I was already paying her. We left the court, the judge did not rule at that time but said he would later. The judge sent the new order to my attorney. Well I didn't know that. I got a letter to appear in court for failing to follow the new order. I went to my attorney, showed it to him, he said, oh yeah, I think I remember that one. He looked around and found the new order on his desk. He gave it to me and asked, you do have the $2000.00 don't you? I said, yes I do, but what about this hearing?
    He said just go pay the arrearage and I'll call the judge. He did call the judge and sent me another bill for calling the judge in the amount of $500.00 to get me out of the mess that his negligence caused, and that was on top of his regular fee, plus it was oredred to take it straight from my paycheck with a 2% fee to do so, and the courts charged me a 2% fee for doing the whole transaction every week. ok, so maybe he wasn't a good lawyer.
    Last edited by Tara D. Rose; 11-19-2012 at 12:54 AM.

  16. #41
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    Stephanie - Select your attorney first. Select the most competent lawyer. Do not get caught up with a gender issue. Pick the one you think is best. Then let her or him advise you on how to deal with your brother-in-law. Try to keep these issues unemotional for both your sake and your children.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by heatherdress View Post
    Stephanie - Select your attorney first. Select the most competent lawyer. Do not get caught up with a gender issue. Pick the one you think is best. Then let her or him advise you on how to deal with your brother-in-law. Try to keep these issues unemotional for both your sake and your children.
    Best advice yet. I meet with one tomorrow and the other on Tues. Pray for me my sisters.

    UPDATE!!!

    Went to court today with a very successful outcome. The judge dismissed the order with prejudice and best of all he refused to hear any testimony regarding cross dressing. I was VERY impressed with his demeanor and encouraged that things are going well. Now I'm so excited to see my kids that it brings me to tears just thinking about it. Since our first was born, I've never been more than a week without seeing them.

    Group hug to all,
    Steph
    Last edited by Eryn; 12-01-2012 at 04:55 PM. Reason: Merged two consecutive posts. Please use the multiquote button at the bottom right of each post to put all your replys in one post.

  18. #43
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    Honestly -

    1 - Congratulations for not losing your mind. Dealing with someone who is insane is terribly taxing, because they ( and most other people ) do not know they are insane.

    2 - A good lawyer will advise you that if you fight the order, she will probably claim that you sexually abused your children.

    3 - weak people need to "win".

    4 - If you can PROVE that she has be DIAGNOSED with BPD ... you can maybe , after a long fight, realize you lose.

    5 - Get a SENSIBLE lawyer who has good PSYCHIATRIC friends or has dealt with many cases LIKE THIS.
    ( Best Divorce lawyer in the world is no good for the dude on trial for murder ... and vice versa )

    6 - Set a 2 year plan to have her removed from the children's lives completely ... but only if you are willing
    to be the sole parent and can deal with her being institutionalized due her intentional damage to your
    children's development. After all, you dress in women's clothing for recreation and act like a woman
    just as some people do Shakespeare in the park and pretend they are Romeo.

    This is about power and winning for her. There is no "compromise". She will not stop unless you are jailed.
    She WANTS you to react and give her an EXCUSE to call the police.

    SHE WANTS THIS... so she can tell your kids what a nutbar you are.

    Go seek legal remedy for THAT behavior on her part.

    But understand, the best thing you might be able to do is


    Get a JUDGE ( same one who granted the ORDER ) to mediate a session where you send a lawyer to her & her lawyer
    ( you are NOT present )
    where your lawyer ASKS for rights to give Xmas presents
    and ASKS for a counselor to talk to your children ( one YOU hire ) about the mom dad issues and help them cope & understand

    She would be shown as a NUT for denying this.

    The person you hire can tell them their mother is mentally ill ( depending how old they are ) and that you want to see them but she has told lies and you don't want her to take it out on them or whatever.

    Truth is ... for your own safety & fredom, you need to SAVE YOURSELF.
    See, if you get jailed or shot by police and one day mom decides to kill herself or gets killed lipping off to another person


    .... you can't help your kids.

    So ... save yourself first.

    Quote Originally Posted by StephanieJ View Post
    I have lots of evidence to refute her allegations, but what I would love to have is a scientific study of some sort stating that Transgenderism is neither an illness nor is it dangerous. Perhaps I'll have to wait until the new DSM V comes out...

    This isn't the point. It's only a "nitpick" for her. Truly, the CD life probably HUMILIATED her ... and she must now punish you/

    But ... don't make your argument include a legal activity ... don't defend it ... it's not the issue.
    Last edited by Eryn; 12-01-2012 at 04:56 PM. Reason: Merged two consecutive posts. Please use the multiquote button at the bottom right of each post to put all your replys in one post.

  19. #44
    Swans have more fun! sandra-leigh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephanieJ View Post
    The judge dismissed the order with prejudice
    Excellent!

    Does "with prejudice" in this situation mean that she is responsible for your costs, or does it mean that she is prohibited from re-filing for the order?

    Quote Originally Posted by MonctonGirl View Post
    2 - A good lawyer will advise you that if you fight the order, she will probably claim that you sexually abused your children.
    That may yet happen, but Steph won this fight; there is now no restraining order.

    It is within the realm of irrationality that Steph's wife will claim abuse as happening the very first time that Steph gets to see the kids alone, which claim Steph could take steps to defend against, such as (without the wife's knowledge) not actually being alone with the kids, so that bogus claims can be dismissed by witnesses. Or steps such as secretly wearing a "wire" or a mic which is transmitting to a recorder, again to provide evidence of what was said or not said.

    Anyhow, whatever is done, best not to bad-mouth the wife, and if the kids ask why Steph didn't see them, Steph should be careful not to answer with anything that could be considered to blame the wife. Blame "the court" if need be. "The court had some things that had to be checked out; that took a while and now we can see each other again."

  20. #45
    Aspiring Member Amanda_P's Avatar
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    I am really suprised at all the legal advice you can find here. I'm sorry about your situation but damb I'm inpressed. I didn't know there was so many differant fields and people in our circle of forums. I guess what I have been telling my wife jokingly is true. WE ARE EVERWHERE

  21. #46
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    I would like to say what a great outcome. I have had a similar thing happen to me 18years ago. She got a restraining order and I lost out on seeing my child ever again. At that time, when my crossdressing was brought up, my layer bailed and I couldn't afford another retainer.

  22. #47
    Gold Member Alice B's Avatar
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    Great outcome so far. Hope it continues and everything resolves itself in a fair manner. I would make sure the brother-in-law can not have loaded guns that are no locked up.

  23. #48
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    Whatever you do, make sure that you nothing to violate the order, things could get much worse.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adina View Post
    I must admit I find it extraordinary that the judge would grant that order based just on a Facebook comment and the cross dressing (why on earth you guys don't have nationwide anti discrimination laws is beyond me!). It would seem likely on appeal that the order would be thrown out (certainly in Australia the CD'ing thing wouldn't even be considered relevant by a judge).
    There's a lot of resistance against anti-discrimination laws for LGBT people in the US, even from many members of these forums, believe it or not.

    Carol
    My name is Carol.

  24. #49
    Gold Member TxKimberly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephanieJ View Post
    UPDATE!!!

    Went to court today with a very successful outcome. The judge dismissed the order with prejudice and best of all he refused to hear any testimony regarding cross dressing. I was VERY impressed with his demeanor and encouraged that things are going well. Now I'm so excited to see my kids that it brings me to tears just thinking about it. Since our first was born, I've never been more than a week without seeing them.



    Group hug to all,
    Steph

    Good for you! I just cant imagine being told that I couldnt see my babies . ..

  25. #50
    What is normal anyway? Rianna Humble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Purple8229 View Post
    Please remember this very basic rule of thumb. LAWYERS can be fired!
    Why should Stephanie fire the lawyer who just helped her to win the case?
    Check out this link if you are wondering about joining Safe Haven.

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