There are certain motions that only women do that I study and try to emulate.
Taking off a bra is one. putting on or taking off your ear rings, another. The shake of the head to toss your hair back. Slipping your shoes on behind your calf. Im sure I could come up with more. Does anyone have others that captivate and intrigue.
All I know is this ... I video tape myself walking, and posing, and work hard at trying to get looking naturally female. It is so very hard, and I think a lot of it has to do with how our musculature is so much tighter. My arms, for example, do not have full range of motion at the elbow. I cannot touch my fingers to the tops of my shoulders, and I can't straighten my elbows. Many women can actually hyper extend their elbows beyond straight without even trying. Feet. I have been doing yoga for a year with a big purpose being to get my feet to bend to straight with my shins. Most women can go beyond straight ... I'm almost at straight now.
To add to the list ... standing in heels, viewed from behind, and you bend one ankle inside so that the heel is at a 45 degree angle to vertical ... when I do that correctly, I see ... woman.
Hi,
Can i ask this ? do you see every woman do all of these things & what if you dont or cant does that change how you see a woman , would that woman then not be as much a woman as youd like to see, & how much of this is a this is what you wont to see or a percived what you think should happen . & out of 100 women how many would act in this way, .
...noeleena...
I must admit that I am fascinated by the feminine hand gestures , females have away of moving their hands that I would love to be able to emulate to me it is almost like femininity flows from the hands whenever they move them unlike my ridged digits
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Joanne
Sorry Noeleena but I think you missed my point. Its not about how I perceive woman, its about feminine gestures. What happens if I dont see those things, nothing. Out of 100 women how many act what way?
Without staring, I often watch women in heels just standing in line and wondering how they do it.
Also--how women carry things, how they reach into a purse, how they hug, how they put on lipstick, how they brush their hair...and how they sit or get into a car...it kind of never ends....Love the idea of video taping btw!
Well, for most of us, when we take off our bras, our boobs fall out so we can't really imitate that "move".Originally Posted by Annie M
If you've ever observed "flaming" gay men (usually on the Jerry Springer TV show), they imitate female moves but exagerated.
Not every female makes the same moves, one with short hair won't be shaking her head to move her hair back, for example.
[SIGPIC]http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=82706&dateline=137762 0356[/SIGPIC]Linda
Great athletes are great simply by doing whatever it is they are good at, over and over "zillions" of times. Same with women. The things you describe, they have done for years and years. No wonder they are effortless/elegant/flowing whatever.
Women's elbows ARE different than men's. Which is WHY they can't throw a ball like a man. Many have angled elbows - NEEDED to accomodate the wider hips they have than a man. Wider hips ONLY to allow a baby to be able to pass through. It's no wonder women walk differently. Notice how most women with narrow hips walk more like a man?
They usually have thinner ankles - less weight to carry. Maybe something in the structure of them might enable more flexibility. Don't know. I'm sure given enough practice, a guy can become very good at many female movements but our bodies are just not built for many feminine movements in most men.
Thank goodness.
Once en mode, the moves come naturally if we don't think about it too much.
Second star to the right and straight on till morning
"Women's elbows ARE different than men's. Which is WHY they can't throw a ball like a man."
Neither can I, maybe that's my problem. Just thinking about catching a ball my thumbs jamb as I have small hands not football hands.
Of course we know that a female body is different than a male body but we still watch and try
to emulate, at least I do. Some things work others don't and you have to be subtle with your movement as not
to look more out of place than we do. Crossing your legs for one is not that easy for men but women look fabulous
when the sit or stand gracefully. Most women use there shoulders with expression and men use theirs as battering rams.
Its not wrong it just is, but noting the differences and emulating the grace and flow is a challenge cd's face.
On another track about body movement. I often read that, why is it that women can were men's clothes and get away with it and men can't wear women's with the
same equality? Well women are women even when wearing men's styles. Men on the other hand often are trying to look like women. OK blanket statement, exceptions
all around, but I think the premise stands. Women are women even in men's cloths with some notable exceptions, and today a man in women's cloths often can look out of place with the deportment of a male.
If on the other hand you just like wearing women's things then pick your battles wisely. But I still study admire and take note.
Last edited by Annie M; 12-01-2012 at 11:38 AM.
Crossing my arms when taking a top off and lifting it over my head.
I can't throw a ball either.
Work on your elegance,
and beauty will follow.
Is this feminine? I mean what about men with long hair. Would they do the same?
I think that taking a top off like this is just the easiest way of taking off a tight top. Women are more likely to wear tight tops though, hence this movement.
My mum taught me to cross my arms to take off a top when I was about 5 years old and I've never thought of it being particularly feminine but if it is then great, I've been doing it for over 60 years...........Crossing my arms when taking a top off and lifting it over my head.
I can't throw a ball either.
[SIZE="3"]Lots of love Gina X[/SIZE]
If you sit near the river for long enough eventually the bodies of your enemies will float by......Chinese Proverb
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are still missing !!
People who think they know everything, are especially annoying to those of us who do
I've heard that it's a sign of being TS when a man can't throw a ball. true, false?
I know this has been discussed quite a bit. The way I see it is men that emulate women are viewed as being weak and are in danger of being threatened by more macho types. Women on the other hand appear tougher in men's garb and don't have that weak stigma. Make sense?
Picture a CD in a situation being around a group of men, then picture a FTM CD with a group of men or women. To me, the MTF CD has much higher chance of being harassed.
It's true that women have usually a greater range of motion. If I remember the obstetrics lecture correctly, a lot of it is due to how the joints develop with female hormonal influences. Our joints are meant to be a little different...especially in the pelvic area...and, actually, the pregnant female body goes through pretty crazy musculoskeletal changes (as well as huge changes to literally every other body system). Pregnant women are even more flexible/have a greater range of motion than non-pregnant women (it helps to realign the center of gravity). Of course, it changes again a few weeks post-partum. But, in general, there's a biological reason for the musculoskeletal differences. Even if you just pick up a pelvic girdle on a table...say we are in biology class and you have to distinguish the male and female pelvis...it's pretty obvious with a quick glance. BUT, there are women out there that have pelvic inlets (specifically that part) that are like the male pelvic inlet. It's rare...but, male generally have heart-shaped pelvic inlets...it's bad for a pregnant woman because this pelvis wasn't designed to deliver a baby vaginally. So, just know that even though there's a general "anatomy guide" to the musculoskeletal differences between the sexes, there are always exceptions. And, though exceptions are pretty rare, it would suck for the woman out there that had high androgen levels during joint-development to be told that she moves like an awkward female. It sucks to generalize.
The most "feminine feature" is a beautiful smile. I am just kind of long in stature...I'm so bad that I have fallen while running from getting all tangled up...I'm clumsy...I have absolutely no upper body strength...I fell over last night while dancing and took my friend out with me...but, we just kind of laughed about it. I'm not sure if the people on the dance floor declared me unfeminine, but it DID make me popular for the rest of the night...I had to slap drinks ordered for me away like flies at a picnic. So, I'd say the best bet to look feminine is not to focus on your movements and anatomical differences...the male musculature is tighter?...Yeah, but so are NERVOUS PEOPLE...or, people that are thinking too hard about it. It could be that you are predisposed to be "tighter," but I am almost 100% sure that a person that is nervous or focusing on their movements are going to appear awkward and rigid. Smile...laugh...have fun...get your feet tangled up while dancing and take a few people down with you.
Last edited by Shananigans; 12-01-2012 at 06:48 PM.
"Today a young man [...] realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration...that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively...there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imagination of ourselves. Here's Tom with the Weather.”-Bill Hicks
“What freedom men and women could have, were they not constantly tricked and trapped and enslaved and tortured by their sexuality! The only drawback in that freedom is that without it one would not be a human. One would be a monster.” East of Eden by Steinbeck
When I talk my hands & arms are part of the story. I've been this way this childhood. Lovely thread Anne.
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I have found since I have come out as being transsexual that I have difficulty NOT being feminine in male mode. I'm constantly stopping my arm and hand movements. I have to watch how I sit even.
I also watch women for things they do. Being brought up male and being 52 means I have to squeeze in an awful lot in a short period of time.
Love the thread, wonderful.
Ding ding ding ding. One of the hormones produced by the ovaries and placenta, which especially spikes during pregnancy, is relaxin. One of it's major functions is to relax the ligaments of the pelvic, albeit it works on other ligaments as well. It's also produced in males in the prostate, but it's more for sperm than for systemic effects like in women.
So just hypothetically, if a man took relaxin, would they become more supple and start naturally moving more femininely?
WOO! I'm so ready for my final
But, to AndreaJ, I don't think it really works that way. Feminine movement is highly subjective, even if there are sexual dimorphic differences between the musculoskeletal systems of the sexes. I'm serious when I say just being kind of natural is the best way to go...I think the key is not to hyper-feminize your movements, because it will most likely come off forced and artificial. I'd say do the things women are taught to be socially acceptable if you want to fit in with the girls...we are taught not to be hanging around with our legs open, we can't readjust ourselves, you shouldn't be like messing with your bra or breastforms, don't be really crude in your language... When I see my SO CD, I see that he pays a lot of attention in moving his hips and placement of his hands...but, he'll do things like sit with his legs partially open. It seems obvious not to do that, but he is just used to it. So, instead of adapting new behaviors, I would just make certain that you aren't doing "male" behaviors. Then, if you just kind of "be" without trying to hyper-feminize your movements, you are more likely to "pass" IMO. You also have to know that exaggerated feminine moves are usually picked up easily and get more attention...this could be a good or bad thing. But, if the behaviors are noticed...and, then, it's noticed you're CDing...if you are being way too hypper-feminine in your movement, then you have just become a caricature of female behavior. It seems forced because it IS. But, being polite...doing/not doing things in public that are similar to what girls are taught...acting like yourself...these are more likely to be perceived positively. And, the effects are immediate...hormones by definition work over time...and, hormones aren't going to do crap for subjective feminine movements. So, if it were me, you know what I'd be doing.
"Today a young man [...] realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration...that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively...there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imagination of ourselves. Here's Tom with the Weather.”-Bill Hicks
“What freedom men and women could have, were they not constantly tricked and trapped and enslaved and tortured by their sexuality! The only drawback in that freedom is that without it one would not be a human. One would be a monster.” East of Eden by Steinbeck
Maybe a little bit. However no amount of hormones past puberty is going to change broad shoulder and narrow hips. Bone structure, and as mentioned above, learned behaviors are more important than a little more flexibility.
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