Like most of us, I'm sure, I learned good manners, among them always hold the door open for those behind us, especially for women. I wonder if GGs were taught something different sometimes. I admit to observing a small sample, but it seems GGs are less likely to hold a door for someone. Consequently, when I'm out enfemme I'm very conscious of this and will hold the door for the person immediately around me. While in drab I've sometimes held door open for small parades!
Keep your eyes open, and you will start seeing differences - at least in NYC women are as likely to smile and nod as they are to say thank you
particularly at a held door.
Common courtesy and niceness have no gender limits that I'm aware of.
Second star to the right and straight on till morning
The door thing! I thought I was the only one who noticed. I instinctively hold doors for women, yet they think it strange when I do it en femme. GGs don't pick up dropped items for other women either.- Celeste
Maybe it's just here.. but I've noticed
A) Women assume males are going to open doors - and give a disapproving look if not done
B) When walking they assume you will give them the right of way, and really don't alter course till a few inches away if you don't
Well this GG doesn't assume that a male will open/hold the door open or think that they should give me the right of way.
Manners cost nothing and that should go for all genders.
Sandra
Administrator
I always used to rib you about your legs can't anymore. R.I.P Sexy Legs
R.I.P Rianna
I was at the post office (enfemme) and an older man in a wheelchair was having trouble negotiating the door. I held the door for him and was thanked by him and some patrons near him. Manners count no matter the mode of dress.
joank
Southern California
I hold doors for humans, and reasonable approximations thereto. I go out of my way more to hold doors for anyone who looks like they need it -- the infirm, wheelchair users, people with strollers, people with their hands full.
Though when I say "I hold doors", a lot of the time there is someone close behind me, in which case I give the door an extra push so that it will still be mostly open when the person steps up behind me, making it easier for them, rather than my stopping and holding the door while standing out of the path. I do stop and hold if the situation looks to need it.
The general practice seems to be that men hold doors for women by opening the door, stepping aside, and letting the woman pass through the door first. Women usually only hold a door in that manner for someone who might have trouble with the door,an elderly, frail. or handicapped person or a small child. Otherwise, you generally open the door, walk through it first, and then hold it open behind you so that the next woman can take it from you and hold it for herself. You don't wait, if she isn't right behind you then she opens it for herself. And you don't open it for an able bodied man. If he didn't open it for you, then the Hell with him!
Hugs,
Persephone.
"If you are living the life you want to live you've successfully transitioned to being the person you want to be." - Eryn.
"If you truly care about me you should damn well want for me what I want for myself" - Michael Westen (Burn Notice)
-.-. --.-/-.-. --.-/-.-. -../ Persephone™ and Persephone™ are trademarks of Persephone herself, accept no substitutes. The terms "en femme" and "en drab" originated with Marcia Sampson/Staylace (OBM).
While in society, manners are not as prevelent as they once were, expressing them is never a bad or gender issue. While manners have gone by the way side.....the flip is that acceptance is up.
I am a combat related disabled vet and while sometimes I am fully able and do get around just fine if someone doesn't hold the door for me or in some other way "bow" to my needs when I need the assistance it really ticks me off. When i'm able i am always the gentleman. It's how I was raised and took no act of congress to make me so. Since I'm not "out" to the public (at least I don't think so) I always present as a gentleman for ladies regardless of their gender.
SarahLynn
Great leaders are not great because of their words or deeds but because of the greatness they inspire from others."
(Legends of the StarDancer)
Manners or mannerisms? I do hold a door open for others irrespective of how I am dressed.
I am careful to accept the door held open for me by someone and I will not hesitate to accept the offer.
That did take some getting around.
Work on your elegance,
and beauty will follow.
Yes, I think that some of my manners, like holding open the door, do give me away. But, then so does my male face under makeup, wig and surrounded by women's clothes.
well certainly, females manners are different than males, we have to learn a lot by observation and practising in private to make perfect
"I think it was a T something that just held the door for us..but wasn't that so nice of her? Look at that great skirt she has on."
It SURE is my hair ! I have the receipt and the box it came in !
I was rasised to have American manners. By this I mean I hold the dooe open for GGs and let them thru first. I then spent 2 and a half years in Germany and had to learn manners all over again. Old time German manners, the GM opens the door and enters first. I asked why? The answer was to protect the GG. What if there is danger on the other side of the door. Also, the GM, while walking of a street, is supposed to be on the street side of the sidewalk, the GG away from the traffic. Since I am not out in public, it depends on the way the door swings as to wheather I hold it or not. I the door swings in, I wait to get an acknowledgement from the person behind me about the door before I continue. If the door swings out, more times than not I will hold the door for anybody who is behind me.
Oh yes, the door thing.
I think this may be the single biggest cause of being read in the CDing community.
Might be only me, or maybe it's the neighborhood (I live in the NYC metro area); but about 99 times out of a hundred, women will simply go through a door and just let it go behind them without looking as to whether there's anyone there, they just let the door slam in people's faces. At first, I thought it was just me; maybe I'm ugly or something. but then I had the time, and sat outside one of the big office buildings (which is now gone after 9/11), for about an hour during the morning rush. Sure enough, men held the doors for others most of the time, but for women, it was the reverse, they usually just let the door slam shut behind them without even checking to see if anyone was there. So much for being 'the gentler' sex.
Some causes of crossdressing you've probably never even considered: My TG biography at:http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post1490560
There's an addendum at post # 82 on that thread, too. It's about a ten minute read.
Why don't we understand our desire to dress, behave and feel like a girl? Because from childhood, boys are told that the worst possible thing we can be, is a sissy. This feeling is so ingrained into our psyche, that we will suppress any thoughts that connect us to being or wanting to be feminine, even to the point of creating separate personalities to assign those female feelings into.
So as to not display the wrong good manners.... just act like a stuck up B!#ch and no one will suspect a thing! lol
Years ago I held the door open for a "lady" and she turned around and gave me a piece of her mind for seemingly several minutes - something about being perfectly able to open her own doors yadda yadda yadda...
I still open doors for people, say please and thank you, walk on the street side of ladies, and generally try to be as polite as possible to everyone, until they show me that they don't deserve such treatment...
Ambigendrous
Wealth should not be measured by how much you have, but by how little you need - anon
Can manners give us away? Absolutely yes! I was raised to be mannerly in the Southern tradition. All people except your closest friends are addressed as Sir and Ma'am , or Mr. or Ms.... Opening doors for anyone regardless of their gender is standard practice. It's actually a part of the Golden Rule - Treat others as you would you would have them to yourself. Your chair or seat were always offered to the elderly, those with disabilities, pregnant women, or your guests. Men should never wear a hat indoors or at the dinner table. A compliment received is always replied with a thank you. Dinner tables are not meant to prop up your elbows. Ladies sit with their legs together. Religion, sex, and politics are never discussed openly with others. A true act of charity or kindness is never given for personal attention. So yes manners give us away and hopefully as someone who is decent and honorable.
Babette
Someone else's imagination is a terrible thing to waste.
I would like to say manners give me away but the people I hold the door for don't even notice me
The earth is the mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it.
Chief Joseph
Nez Perce
“Love isn't a state of perfect caring. It is an active noun like struggle. To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.” - Fred Rogers,
Funny you should say that when I'm out driving in boy or girl mode and I let someone out from a side road or go past if the road is too narrow 9 times out of 10 if it is a GG I get no wave of the hand or flash of the headlights to say thank you. It is as if some GGs expect to be given right of way.
Maria
My basic approach to door holding has evolved due to non recognition of the person getting the benefit. I will not let the door slam on anyone. However, if it's a woman or an elderly person I will hold the door open for them and then proceed after them. If it is a teenager or adult male I will hold the door open so it does not slam on them, but, they proceed following me. I sort of expect a little acceleration on someone's part if I am going to hold the door.
I my area it seems the people are friendlier than NYC, where I grew up. People of my generation, male or female, and the next younger generation will make eye contact and nod or mouth good day or sometimes stated some pleasantry. The youngest generation just does not know how to communicate with anyone, so it seems.
Interesting question, Donna, and one I've thought about. E.g., how do you greet people? In my drab days, I'd generally say, "How are you?" or "How are things?" But it seems to me that in Ireland women tend to say, "Good morning," or after the morning, simply, "Hello!" (One of my favorites, which I hear in the supermarket all the time, is, "How's Annabelle?")
Since I came out full-time, I've been making a little experiment. I noticed a number of years ago, that if I was walking down the street and found myself on a collision course with another adult, I would always give way. I realized that this wasn't politeness on my part. Rather, it was instinctive obedience to the law of the jungle: the smaller must give way to the bigger, and I'm virtually always the smaller--except with a small number of women, and then I'd give way on the grounds of sex.
But now that I'm out and about as Annabelle, if I find myself on a collision course with a man, I just keep on going, to see if he'll give way to me. And unless it's a very elderly man, he always, always does. And I always enjoy that. (A bit of a devilish grin inside: Ha!)
As for doors, it seems to me that a man will hold a door for a woman differently than he will for another man. If it's another man, he'll hold it just enough to allow the other man to grab it himself. He's handing over the baton, so to speak. But for a woman, he'll do as much of the work as he can in order to leave her as little of it as possible.
One day recently I was leaving the library. Just as I was grabbing at the door from the inside, a young lad grabbed it from the outside. I would have had to pull it, he had to push it. When he saw me, he immediately stopped on the threshold and with his arm fully extended, held the door wide open so that I didn't have to do a thing. I was fairly impressed: this is a heavy door with a taut spring on it, and I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have had the strength myself to hold it open that way. I was a bit embarrassed, but what could I do? I smiled, thanked him and went on through.
So when it comes to doors, I'll let a guy take the lead. But with women I'll hold it in whatever seems a polite manner.
Annabelle
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