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Thread: Reality Check

  1. #1
    Gold Member Sometimes Steffi's Avatar
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    Reality Check

    I hope everyone understands where I'm coming from on this post. If not, my apologies in advance.

    As background, I've become pretty outgoing in my CDing over the past two or three years since I found a group of girls to go out with. But not at home. My wife is not at all accepting, and we have a de facto DADT arrangement. Actually it's "Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil." I think my CDing kind of creeps her out [my words, not hers].

    But the point of this is a reality check for me.

    At the Keystone Conference, there were two girls presenting as, I'm not quite sure how to describe it, baby dolls it the only thing I can come up with. They both came out with the rest of us girls to dinner at a mainstream restaurant. The rest of us girls were dressed for the venue but they weren't. Far be it for me to judge, since I was dressed as a guy in a dress with makeup, forms, wig, etc. But without making a value judgement, their presentation was even more unusual than mine.

    There's also a young adult at church who dresses semi-androgenously. He presents male, but he seems to have shaved his eye brows and re-drawn them in longer and more feminine. He also paints hit nails occasionally and usually wear a "claw" in his hair. Again, it's hard to make any judgements since my nails were painted today also, but not my fingers. My painted toes were hidden under my socks and shoes.

    Anyhow, I have a different perspective now on how my wife may view me.
    Hi, I'm Steffi and I'm a crossdresser... And I accept and celebrate both sides of me. Or, maybe I'm gender fluid.

  2. #2
    Gold Member ~Joanne~'s Avatar
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    I try not to be judgmental, who am I to judge what others do especially since I am a CD myself but I think maybe the whole "baby doll" or "child" thing would have bothered me a bit too. I hate feeling that it would have and I am surly not trying to offend those that do it but as CD's we try our best to pass when out, we fail 99% of the time, but that sort of draws the unwanted attention to us. The young adult wouldn't have bothered me at all.
    Flip Flops were made for Beaches & Bath Houses, We have neither in 2017. Lose the flip flops!

  3. #3
    Silver Member I Am Paula's Avatar
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    There's a middle age man who wanders around a mall were I used to live. He wears Lolita dresses and maryjanes, and carries a huge lollypop. Parents cross the mall when he approaches.
    The right to present as you please is important, but not absolute. One should know when to stay home.

    My perspective may coincide with your wifes in this situation, but differ when we're talking about a well presented CD. Maybe you and your wife can use your new found perspective to open a channel of discussion.

  4. #4
    Full-Time Duality NathalieX66's Avatar
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    Hi Steffie, We were there together that Friday night. I know exactly what you are talking about.

    When we (you, me) were at a restaurant that Friday night, you sat to my right a the table..... and a friend of mine , to the left,who just happens to be transsexual was giving me her vibes of "wtf?" upon the sight, I had to explain the deal. She was kind of alarmed. It can be kind of alarming for fetishists to descend on the transgender community.

    I like fetishes too, but I also like playing with legos. I keep my fetishes to my self.

    When I'm out in public, I'm all girl...because that's just who I am. The two you are referring to are well known, and unfortunately they have rubbed then TG community the wrong way. Anyway, I say live and let live. Like Ringo of the Beatles always says....Peace and Luv.

    I also happen to like spicy Mexican food.
    Last edited by NathalieX66; 04-21-2013 at 11:38 PM.

  5. #5
    Silver Member noeleena's Avatar
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    Hi.

    So what we have is a showoff or two. okay iv seen a few & so has Jos & our grandaughter Dejarn 10 y 5 m, & Dejarn wonted to say hi to this person , i said well you go over & say hi....No way you come with me ...okay so we did, she was lovely & as it was her Mom was there as well so yes we got talking they knew people we did,

    Do you rubbsih a person because they happen to dress differently or say hi any way. think about this they maybe going through some tough time & just the mere fact you said hi to them may just what they need, i know because i try & do that all the time, people are lonely so brighten up thier day .

    As this is about how one dress's they did not say to me oh ...dear you dress funny or are you a male or female ...no... they just accepted i was female no drama there, I v allso taken photos of our group over in Austraila this one dresser was dressed in a maids outfit, very .... well ....out of place look ,
    & it was noted to me after,

    hmmm i took the photos of the person some 5 years ago. same outfit different venue
    i said , ill do the photography, not the comments. i talked to the person concerned , im so used to others who are different ,

    ...noeleena...

  6. #6
    Silver Member Angela Campbell's Avatar
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    It is always difficult to understand someone who is different from yourself, and it is difficult to understand why others do not understand us for being ourselves. I feel the same way sometimes when I see the guy all tatted up and in leather, or the frumpy girl who could be beautiful but doesn't care, or the guy on Jerry Springer who wears diapers. Are they so different from me? Yes and no. I cannot see that point of view because I am not there, but that doesn't mean they are wrong. Just different.
    All I ever wanted was to be a girl. Is that really asking too much?

  7. #7
    Pretty in Pink Amanda Shaft's Avatar
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    I found myself in a similar situation a few weeks ago, and was thinking pretty much the same thing: why are you dressed like that!? At the time I thought the concern with going out dressed ‘inappropriately’ for the situation, is that it reinforces all those preconceptions about what a cross dresser is, and it’s not how I wanted to be thought of. The trouble is that whole line of thought feels kind of snobby but when you think about it is the same thought process that leads TS women to wish to disassociate themselves from the rest of the TG world. To be honest I’m still torn between the two views: I support the rights of anyone to present themselves to the world just as they wish, but I reserve the right to protect my own self-image from being tarnished by association. In the end I guess it’s live and let live.
    So far in the closet, I've got one foot in Narnia!

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  8. #8
    Aspiring Member Stevie's Avatar
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    I can relate to what you are saying.

  9. #9
    Member renaej7's Avatar
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    I think we all can be a little judgmental sometime, which is ok, as long as we are respectful.
    be sweet for me

    -Renae

  10. #10
    Member Kalista Jameson's Avatar
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    My thoughts are that if a FaB dressed as a Lolita, playboy bunny or Supergirl and hung out with me in a non cosplay venue, while I was classily dressed enfemme, I'd still be very uncomfortable because of the environment. I'd love to be around them under the proper circumstances, but If I'm at a family restaurant and Wonder Woman sits at my table for some French fries, I'm gonna be on edge, just because the whole thing feels wrong, regardless of crossdressing style or whatever.

    The Lolita thing is definitely fetishist in my opinion and may have other implications for those wanting to go out dressed that way. I admit not getting that. I personally want to stay off the public radar for my crossdressing as much as possible and just enjoy the experience of being out. Combining the crossdress cosplay thing in a regular environment is for someone with very different goals than me.

    One of my favorite bands from my youth has been KISS, and I thought Gene Simmons was bad ass, but dressing like him to go to Taco Bell prolly wouldn't be the best idea, though I would look cool.

    Cheers,

    Kalista
    Last edited by Kalista Jameson; 04-22-2013 at 06:56 AM.

    I'm a TGirl, yes it's true! I'm a TGirl, through and through.
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  11. #11
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    Hi Steffi, You are trying to blend in and they are throwing it out there go figure, Maybe that's the new normal!!
    Having my ears triple pierced is AWESOME, ~~......

    I can explain it to you, But I can't comprehend it for you !

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  12. #12
    Platinum Member Beverley Sims's Avatar
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    Steffi,
    I am pleased you have had a look at yourself, and given due consideration to your wife.
    I have seen some people dressed extremely, is how I describe it.
    If they believe they are ok so be it but I quite often engage in conversation with these people and get their views on why they dress like they do.
    I am not shy in asking and if they have a militant or political type of stance I leave them be.
    Occasionally it is the pink fog that surrounds them and with a few wardrobe changes they tone it down and look a lot nicer in my view.
    I do believe in be and let be but I do not like to see sorry sights making a fool of themselves.
    The two baby dolls you refer to probably misjudged the situation as do people who sometimes frequent these forums.

    I prefer to give honest but kind advice even if it does hurt a little.
    I have had more thanks than flames when I have given my "sage" advice so I hope I am helping others.
    As you say you have had a reality check and I hope you can work on it and keep your relationship on the improve.
    I wish you all the best for the future.
    Work on your elegance,
    and beauty will follow.

  13. #13
    Senior Member MissTee's Avatar
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    A few years back, my wife and I attended an outdoor concert where we spread out blankets and food, and listened to the bands play. To our right was a large group of gay folks. Very friendly and welcoming, and we had some pleasant conversations them and shared food and wines. They had some amazing cheeses! They were there as a group of friends simply out to have fun. They were in mainstream casual dress and very "normal" acting, representing gay as well as we were hetero. Point here is they made it easy to accept them and respect them. Just ordinary folks you could say.

    About two hours into the concert (late afternoon and still daylight) two young gay men came along and "crashed" the gathering. We could tell all the others were very uncomfortable. These guys were no shirts, pierced everything, and were wearing chaps with no undergarment -- junk near hanging out and rather grossly tattooed rear cheeks shining. They never said or did anything obnoxious, and eventually left.

    There were a lot of negative comments after they left and one comment in particular still sticks with me: a female couple, who are still very good friends with us today, told us they hate it when the exaggerated types come out. It's because it makes it difficult to gain respect as a group, and everyone seem to always point to "that kind" when they talk about gays. Our friends mentioned, too, that for them the true test of acceptance is whether or not someone would accept them enough to let them babysit their kids.

    I suppose then, remembering this conversation, I would have the same concern about acceptance and respect for our community when some of us present in an exaggerated fashion at a major event or gathering. Heck, for that matter, even in public at all. Judgmental, perhaps, but it's simply my opinion of these things. Hugs!

  14. #14
    Aussie girl enjoying life Michelle (Oz)'s Avatar
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    I guess we see that anything further out of the norm will impact on our possible acceptance within society. I'm increasingly coming to a different view - anything out of the norm exposes society to greater diversity and we seem not so unusual.

    My hope is by interacting responsibly within society society will see us (the plain vanilla CDer) increasingly as mainstream. They have every right to present as they see fit - as we do.

  15. #15
    Senior Member UNDERDRESSER's Avatar
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    As long as people are dressed legally, they should be allowed to do that. BUT, there are questions about legality of some of the clothing described. There should also be some degree of respect for others feelings. If you're going to push the boundaries, be ready to accept the consequences when you hit them too fast or hard. i.e. be ready to face being asked to leave if the establishment feels you don't meet their standards, or those of the majority of the clientèle. And if I'm there, be ready for me to tell you to your face that you look ridiculous. I wouldn't do that to someone who was trying to fit in, but displaying your fetish outright in public doesn't meet that standard. If it's an adult establishment with somewhat differing allowable levels of behavior....depends, pick your battles wisely.
    "Normal is what you get when you average out the weirdness that everybody has." Quote from my SO

    Normal is a setting on a washing machine, or another word for average.

    The fact that I wear a skirt as a male should not be taken as a comment on what you do, or do not wear, or how you wear it.

  16. #16
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    This is a difficult but interesting topic. I feel that some cross-dressers who wear ridiculous outfits like Grayson Perry (Claire), the British award-winning artist, enrich all who come in contact with them. I wouldn't wear an outfit like that, but I am glad there are those who do.

    I am uncomfortable being close to a stranger of either gender who has too much sweaty flesh on display - especially in a crowd where you jostle each other. Euch.

    The Lolitas are on the edge, male or female - so short you show the underwear is gross and uncouth but so are a lot of other things we see in the street. I would avoid but not criticise.

    But people of whatever age or gender who push the boundaries - go for it!

  17. #17
    Gold Member Sometimes Steffi's Avatar
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    One of the points I was trying to make is the degree of differences.

    I'm trying hard to accept the differences in a non-judgemental way. I probably should have opened up a conversation with them and asked them why they dressed like that, just as I would want someone who was curious or disgusted with female presentation to ask me why I dressed like that

    Another point I was trying to make is how one perceives those differences.

    If you consider the average male, who is hetero, guy on top, missionary position, so to speak. I think I am more degrees different from the average guy just described than these baby doll girls were from me. So, being somewhat uncomfortable with the baby doll presentation, I can better see how my female presentation looks from my wife's perspective.

    Oh, and a big shout out to Nathalie. We had a great time at our end of the table. And then we walked to a nearby hetero disco bar and danced the night away. There were enough of us girls there that I felt very safe, but I'm not sure if the baby dolls wouls have been safe there.
    Last edited by Sometimes Steffi; 04-22-2013 at 06:47 PM.
    Hi, I'm Steffi and I'm a crossdresser... And I accept and celebrate both sides of me. Or, maybe I'm gender fluid.

  18. #18
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    I have to admit, if I'm out, it's my goal to blend in with other women, not to shock anyone with my appearance. I am sympathetic to those who want to dress in whatever manner meets their needs, but I still think that if we want to be respected, we need to be respectful if others. Outside of a Halloween party, I can't think of a situation where the outfits you describe would be even remotely appropriate.

  19. #19
    Full-Time Duality NathalieX66's Avatar
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    Oh, and a big shout out to Nathalie. We had a great time at our end of the table. And then we walked to a nearby hetero disco bar and danced the night away. There were enough of us girls there that I felt very safe, but I'm not sure if the baby dolls wouls have been safe there.
    Yeah, That was fun! I know I had fun. This year was different from past years where the Friday clubbing night was at Stallions, which is/was a gay bar....does it still exist? I honestly don't know Harrisburg, Pa. , other than the fact that the same Mexican restaurant we went to still as hot spicy as two years ago...my tongue hurts.

    That night was also a first precedent for me, as I was wearing the first black patent high heel pumps I ever owned that were actually comfortable, and fit me perfectly.

  20. #20
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    Steffi, I read through all the masquerade comments concerning what could be loosely termed inappropriate dress. There's a time and place for everything. I'm in a DADT with my wife. She is not accepting of my cross dressing. However, it has been a very long time since she has said anything negative about it. In DADT it's not about wearing the wrong female clothing. It's about wearing female clothing, period. Even if you are age appropriately dressed, and, acting with decorum, poise, and, being totally ladylike, she probably thinks "I didn't sign on for this!" I've always viewed DADT as respecting my wife's desire to not be subjected to something she does not want to be a part of. I view her silence as respecting my desire to not be subject to ridicule and scorn by her. If she were to voice disapproval let alone berate me that would not be DADT.

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