Compromises to save a mariage

[Lynnmorgan451]

The love of my life and I have been at each others throats pretty much since she found out I was transsexual. On and off, good days and bad days, then really bad days where I spend way to much time on the internet looking for rooms to rent. Finally, we compromise. Here it is...from now and through the end of August, no leg or arm pit shaving. I get one night every two weeks to shave my face and wear makeup, get as girly as I can with monkey legs, whatever...I can wear pantyhose...ugghh......I have to get therapy, which is fine. I was planning that anyway cuz I need it (I'm crazy) and we are going to marriage counseling. Oh and shes making me have sideburns and a silly mustache for the times between shaving. :-/ Also I am no longer allowed to communicate with people on the internet without supervision.

I think I can do this. I mean, at least for the summer and if I can get through it without getting too depressed, who knows. I feel like I'm free falling through the sky right now. Like I'm in a dream and I just appeared in the sky already falling. I'm not sure if my parachute works and I'm not really even sure if I have one. I just know that at a certain point I'm going to have to pull the cord, pray to God and hope I do it before I splat on the ground.

I think about other peoples problems and I even took care of some people in the hospital who have legs and feet amputated from being morbidly obese and diabetic and I think about what issues they deal with. When I compare them to mine it just seems silly. I don't have cancer or any autoimmune diseases. I'm not starving to death in Ethiopia. I'm not in prison or a mental institution. I'm not disabled in any way shape or form except for the notion that my body isn't female, its male. Oh my friggin God why is this such an issue to me?

I ask myself this question, too...If the "world as we know it" ended and we were survivors hunting, gathering, trying to stay alive. Maybe zombies attacking, maybe just other starving people attacking...whatever the case may be..Where do I fit in? Am I really going to take the time to shave my legs or face?? Would I still even think about doing this with the goal of transition so far out of reach? Will there be any surgeons to fix my body? What about estrogen? OMG where the hell am I going to get hormones!? Will I seek out pregnant horses just to drink their urine and make this a priority over feeding my family? lol.....ok I get carried away...But anyway, its not the end of the world. Its just the end of smooth legs, and only for a while...I can do this...This is retarded....I can do this...other people go through worse every day....these are my mantras...I can do this...Because I love my wife.

xxxooo

[suzy1]

You love your wife and that’s great but…………….

You are no longer allowed to communicate with people on the internet without supervision?
You have to have a moustache?
You get one night every two weeks to dress?

What does that tell you about your marriage!

Sorry but this just seems wrong to me but if it works for you then good.

[Sandra]

I'm sorry but your wife cannot rule your life like this.

I am married to Nigella who is also TS and it is who she is, and your wife needs to understand this about you. All these rules she has put in place are just going to cause a lot of heartache for both of you.

[Michelle.M]

I'm sorry but your wife cannot rule your life like this.

I couldn't have said it better.

I don't know why you used the word "compromise". Irrespective of gender issues, she's making all the rules and you're complying. There's no compromise in that scenario.

And you already know how this will end. Doing what she wants delays that, and it's understandable that you'd want that delay (you're no doubt scared of a likely divorce). But eventually something's gotta give.

[celeste26]

Sorry but this just seems wrong to me but if it works for you then good.

How is it possible to work for anyone? That is not a description of a marriage but a prison camp. All the rules made by one side and nothing on the other (?)

I see divorce soon.

[Linda St. John]

What the hell Lynn.....you call that love ??.....Suzi, Sandra & Celeste all have it right !!! Nothing to add !!
Linda

[suzy1]

Anyone that puts their children’s welfare first is O.K. with me Lynn.
I totally understand that!

Unfortunately the best for your children could ultimately mean divorce.
But only you know your situation.

All the best,

Suzy.

[Stephanie47]

Rather than jumping on the bandwagon and agreeing with the others about being in a prison camp, I went back and read your postings. You and your wife need to terminate your marriage. I see no hope in ever being able to live together and being happy. You listed all the stresses in your marriage. You have three kids under age five. You're dead broke. You inform your wife you're a transsexual wanting to transition. You indicate your wife is/was expecting normalcy. In one post you came home and after being stressed out texting with your wife, you head off with a lesbian friend in semi femme to buy clothing? In another there's an argument about cyber sex? It goes on an on.

I suspect your wife is also totally stressed out. She has the same issues about finance and raising kids. On the flip sides she is sitting there stressed out because her husband wants to transition to a woman. All these restrictions she wants to impose on you are her attempt, however futile, to understand what's going on and save her marriage. Does she understand a person's desire to transition? I would venture to say she is totally confused. She does not know how to proceed. There's always two sides to the story. Your post is only conveying one side of the story. Maybe counseling will help. I suspect it will not. Once she understands who you are and who she is, she'll be better able to make rational choices. Don't stay together for the sake of the children. They will survive better than living in a home full of marital disharmony.

There's always two sides of the story.

[kittypw GG]

I suspect your wife is also totally stressed out. She has the same issues about finance and raising kids. On the flip sides she is sitting there stressed out because her husband wants to transition to a woman. All these restrictions she wants to impose on you are her attempt, however futile, to understand what's going on and save her marriage. Does she understand a person's desire to transition? I would venture to say she is totally confused. She does not know how to proceed. There's always two sides to the story. Your post is only conveying one side of the story. Maybe counseling will help. I suspect it will not. Once she understands who you are and who she is, she'll be better able to make rational choices. Don't stay together for the sake of the children. They will survive better than living in a home full of marital disharmony.

I will guarantee that your wife is probably more stressed out than you. I very much agree with Stephanie. Your wife doesn't have a clue about you because you don't either. This is a very painful situation and your are just prolonging the lie by agreeing to such demands. You need some intense counseling and please for the sake of your family Set them free. Be the hero, be honest. I see a divorce in the near future. The way you handle it now will impact not only the divorce, custody and co-parenting. You need to become a stable person ASAP.

[ReineD]

Suzy brings up an interesting point ... if you were a crossdresser your wife would be cruel indeed to be so severe with her boundaries. But, honestly I don't blame her for not wanting to be in a relationship with another woman if she is not lesbian. At any rate, I'm the SO of someone who is not TS and I suppose she could be classified under the crossdresser label, although s/he does identify dualgender and she goes out as much as she wants to. It's not about the frequency so much, like once per 2 weeks vs. 4 times per week (when he gets busy with work sometimes she'll go several weeks without putting on her feminine clothes. Her choice, obviously. It's more about the feeling that there are no restrictions when it comes to expressing herself. None. Ever. I think that if she felt constrained she would go crazy as well and she may well want to chuck the guy self altogether.

But, this is not about crossdressing, is it. It is about telling your wife that you are a woman, you want to take hormones to change physically and emotionally (don't discount this) to a woman, chemically. And then you'll want to remove all your body hair, grow breasts and have SRS, since you are transsexual. Transsexuals cannot go half way and be happy. If they can, then they are not level 5 or 6 TS (see the Benjamin scale), and they are rather bigender (or dualgender) like my SO. And yes, having sexual reassignment surgery and even growing breasts would surely mean divorce. There is no bandaid over the summer that will fix this.

BTW, I hate the term "crossdressing" for someone like my SO. She is most definitely not crossdressing when she wears her feminine clothes. She is expressing one of several facets of herself. And the term "transgender" means everyone under the umbrella to many people, and so it won't do either. Oh well.

I wish you all the best, Lynn. I sincerely hope it all works out for you, not only to preserve your marriage, but to be happy while doing it.

[Lynnmorgan451]

This doesn't work for me!! Not at all..It is laughable that I have to have sideburns and a mustache!! But I love her and I will do this for her. Hopefully this will be to prove a point. I want her to think I look goofy now if I have facial hair, and I want her to see how sad its going to make me but that I'm willing to be hairy and smell bad all summer to satisfy her. This is my life and I live for my kids and her and I have to be a father no matter what, and I need to be a husband because I said I would when I put the ring on her. I really think that if I go through with this it will strengthen our relationship, or, it wont be good enough, more rules will follow and yes, then divorce is inevitable. But for now, a means to a means??

I see divorce soon.

dooooonnnnnnt say that

[Megan Thomas]

This doesn't work for me!! Not at all..It is laughable that I have to have sideburns and a mustache!! But I love her and I will do this for her.

Hi. You clearly do love her but the question you need to ask yourself is does she love you?

If she did she wouldn't be doing this to you. She'd be supporting you and doing what she can to make you happy. Putting conditions on your life is not how you go about making someone happy. Are you happy? We know the answer to that one...

Being transsexual is one of the hardest things to deal with and it needs not just courage by those afflicted but also a lot of compassion and understanding by those close to us. I hope your wife will come to realise this and change her attitude. In the meantime only you know how best to handle this and I wish you well.

[ReineD]

Hi. You clearly do love her but the question you need to ask yourself is does she love you?

If she did she wouldn't be doing this to you. She'd be supporting you and doing what she can to make you happy. Putting conditions on your life is not how you go about making someone happy.

But, Lynn's wife did not sign up to be in a relationship with someone who is a woman. Can she be blamed for this? If, however, Lynn were to eventually determine that she does not want to alter her body or she is not working towards altering her body, and she is indeed satisfied with expressing her feminine self while also maintaining her male self, then Lynn's wife might be more willing to learn how to work with this? I know that the concept of gender duality is difficult to master since none of us physically see bigendered individuals around us (we either see just men or women) but for many people, coming to terms with this is just the answer rather than telling a wife they are "transsexual". What does "transsexual" mean, really, other than wanting - or more than wanting ... going ahead with electrolysis, hormones, FFS, & SRS?

Can Lynn's wife be blamed for not wanting to be in a relationship with another woman? Not every GG can come to terms with this. If, however, Lynn is prepared to take concrete steps towards transition beginning with telling her parents, her friends, people at work, and living full time as a woman first (RLE), then what does "transsexual" mean, really?

I agree with Kathryn Martin. It's not about what you say, but what you do or fully intend to do and following through with it.

Edit

Good Lord ... I haven't read Lynn's other posts, but I see references in this thread about facebook, other women, cyber sex, etc. Lynn, I hope that you and your wife are doing more than talking summarily about this and I hope that you also will take some time to think deeply about what you want to do. But first you do need to have concrete RLE experience to put it all in perspective. The need to express femininity can become so powerful to someone who is constrained, as to blur the lines between identifying transwoman vs. bigender.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

Reine i think i'd push back on "What does "transsexual" mean, really, other than wanting - or more than wanting ... going ahead with electrolysis, hormones, FFS, & SRS?"
What it means is that if you want to live a life that is true to your nature, that feels authentic to you , you have do just that... a gender fluid person can do this in many ways, a ts person cannot..

Generally speaking you can't EVER get affirmation of who you are unless you become who you are...for many of us this becomes a life threatening situation.. this is an immutable conflict in a marraige... that's why gender queer people can often recommend trying to compromise ...it works fine for them and its just an ongoing negotiation for femme/homme time... ts people can try this too, but it will become less and less satisfactory for you over time...

also, generally speaking, ts husbands underestimate the impact they have on the marriage, even though they are trying to stick it out.. in life it is very difficult to put yourself in the other persons mind..i don't think we can easily internalize just how difficult this can be on your wife, including her feelings of loss, betrayal and confusion...she can never know again with certainty where she stands no matter how much you want her too, and no matter how much you believe you will live up to your promises...in the worst situations, we make promises and over time and can't keep them, sometimes YEARS later...in effect, betraying her again...talk is cheap...promises to not dress/express/pluck/wear/notshave are cheaper

[melissaK]

An elaboration on Kaitlyn's comments . . . indeed saving a marriage is neigh impossible for anyone who didn't start the marriage with full disclosure of B, T or Q inclinations. Changing these sex roles and sexual presentation roles shakes anyone's foundational views of sex, gender, and morals. And even if you view the person's changes in views as enlightening and positive, it makes them a different person in many ways. And so the marriage is tasked with two people growing and evolving in a profound way - together. Any mismatch on theses views will lead to a profound incompatibility. Keeping the relationship is a partnership effort.

And to steal the thread away from Lynn for a minute, I want to use my life to illustrate this. I know my semantics are weak on this, but I knew my marriage as it was, was over. All I could do is work for a new relationship. It's not all about my wife having to learn about me, it's also about me having to learn about her.

She parked herself comfortably in the role of middle class mom, and for her to step away from that, requires she have her own inner strength and courage. Watching her search for it I see she has to deal with her own insecurities that she never dealt with because she used being a busy over scheduled mom as a distraction, much like I used being a workaholic over scheduled dad to avoid dealing with my TS issues. We were both living this over scheduled life, for the much the same reasons. So we talk, as openly and as non-judgmentally as we can. We try to take care of each other in the process.

I'm not optimistic about us, but we haven't quit yet, and anything is possible . . .

[ReineD]

What it means is that if you want to live a life that is true to your nature, that feels authentic to you , you have do just that... a gender fluid person can do this in many ways, a ts person cannot..

That was my point, really. Being true to one's nature means going ahead with it to one's best ability, and not just "saying" one is TS.

A lot of people in this forum think that if they need to express their feminine selves and if they don't CD just for the fun of it or just for fetish, then it "must" mean they are TS. We all know there are many, many different points along the line, between fetish crossdresser and level V or level VI TS according to the Benjamin scale. And these points are the end result for many people (like my SO who is dualgender - or bigender if you prefer), and not on the way to "becoming" TS.

I did go back and read some of Lynn's past posts and just a few weeks ago she made a reference to her wife giving her grief about "her cding". It's true that we cannot hold someone foerever to past statements, but really, doesn't it seem as if often people join here initially wanting acceptance from their spouses for the unfettered expression of their feminine selves, yet within a short period of time after joining, they determine they are TS when they discover that they are under major constraints at home? And then they post in this section a lot and with great conviction only to disappear after a while when it comes down to actually making the decision to take concrete steps towards transition, more than taking hormones to get a bit of boobage?

Just saying that Lynn needs to ask herself some important questions about how far she is really prepared to go, and not make the decision that she is TS and telling this to her wife until she has been out and about in the mainstream A LOT for at least a year and has gotten over the excitement of it all. Lynn is young and can pass easily, so this should not be a problem.

I go back to my original point. If Lynn's wife is hearing "I'm TS" then this does mean full transition including the disappearance of any male physical characteristic. At any rate, it is a lot more than just shaving or not shaving legs, wearing or not wearing clothes, and wearing or not wearing a beard. And to go back to an earlier question I asked here, if Lynn and her wife are close and Lynn is really a woman, wouldn't Lynn's wife already have a clue, like Sandra did (sorry Sandra for bringing you in, but you and Nigella are the perfect example ).

I say this specifically for you Lynn, to help you with obtaining more freedom to dress: two things need to happen. Your wife needs to come to terms with the notion of alternate gender first, and she will not go along with it if within a very short period of time after joining this forum she hears from you that you want to transition (what does this mean, really ... surely it means a lot more than dressing, shaving, and getting breasts). You need to slow down a little with your definitions until you have been out and about in real life a lot and for at least a year. And THEN you can both see where you're at.

And to use Sandra and Nigella's example again, Nigella and Sandra dealt with this for years together before getting where they're at now.

I'm not saying that you are or aren't TS. I'm saying that given your past recent posts and your outlook on the whole thing, you may need to compare your definition of "TS" to Kate's, Kathryn's, Misty's, Rianna's and others who have fully or have completed substantial steps to being on their way to fully transitioning. With a legal name change.

[Lacyfem]

Well what a complex situation. My wife still doesn't know I crossdress and though I like it that way have been chastized by others for not being honest with her. She too is the love of my life and know that the situation you are in is what I'd be in for. That said I"m a crossdresser and not a transgender who wants to be a girl 24/7. Having not gone into the marriage being honest about your wanting to be a woman would be like her marrying you and then confessing to be an ax murderer and wanting her to accept that. You are asking a lot of her to accept what your asking as she wants a man and a husband and not another girl to be married to. It's very nice that you love her so much but you also are selfish to think you can totally change to the woman you want to be and still have the comforts of home, a lovely wife and kids that love you and don't care about this radical change you wish to go through. I fully understand your wifes position and her demands are ones that are telling you I want my man back and if she's over the top, she has that right and hopefully you see that. You've decieved her. I understand your feels as I'd like to dress so much more often than I do but do love my family a lot more than my love of crossdressing so keep it in check. Not easy but it is a choice and the choice you're making is going to cost you your marriage so think you need to get out of the marriage, become the woman you want to be and also still, and most important, be the father you need to be with your children. They will eventually understand and get over it as they will always love you as their father. You need to let your wife go as she's in great pain so she can hopefully put her life together, care for her children and find again hopefully another "man" to love her. If you don't choose to do this it's very selfish of you as what your doing is not a one way street only for you. Your need and pull to become a TG will not go away so it's up to you to make the important decisions.

[Lynnmorgan451]

You need to let your wife go as she's in great pain so she can hopefully put her life together, care for her children and find again hopefully another "man" to love her. If you don't choose to do this it's very selfish of you as what your doing is not a one way street only for you.

I could never and would never turn my back on my wife. I will never decide to leave her because of my issues. If one day she finally decides she's had enough and wants a separation then I won't fight her. I might beg for a while but I want her to be happy and if I can't make her happy then she can decide when it's time to stop trying. I'm not a good giver-upper-er but I'm always willing to compromise...to an extent.

Things are okay tonight. We had a good Mother's Day. I worked all morning and then met up with them at the I laws for a cookout. I was dressed in my nicest button down manshirt that my wife loves. I had jeans and my old school vans with my hair slicked back like a greaser. Lol.....I had a beer and talked business with her old man, putting on my finest Macho performance in some time. She ate it up and it made me happy to make her happy. The painful truth is that I just can't keep putting on shows like this forever. Sooner or later I'm going to say, look.. This is not me! You know this
And hopefully she won't leave!! But I know I won't ever initiate a breakup....and I wouldn't call it weakness or selfishness. I think it's part of my vows, isn't it?

[TeresaCD]

Hi Lynn. I'm sure you can do this, for a time, because she is that important to you.
And hopefully, in time, you will both be able to find a more workable long term solution.
It's good to do everything you can to make things work, 'because you said you would'

[JohnH]

Wow, your wife is really making you tow the line. Hmm - if I read it correctly, your wife does not even allow you to shave your face everyday. If I were in your shoes I think I would shave myself as I see fit - daily shaving of the face and periodic shaving of legs and armpits.

And I also see your wife will not allow you on the internet without supervision.

I would say your marriage is beyond saving - that is just my opinion. I don't see how your marriage is going to endure. Maybe counselling might save the marriage but it appears to me that your wife is not willing to work with you at all. I have seen in on this website before where the wife make unreasonable demands but the separation occurs anyway and the husband transitions to being a woman.

The only conditions my wife wants me to observe is to keep my masculine speaking voice and name, and dress sort of like a man (denim skirts are allowed) when I am with her while having a femme haircut and lipstick. And around the house I frequently wear dresses, even to the point where I take out the trash.

I am on M2F HRT. No, you do not need to take Premarin (derived from mare's urine). There are alternatives.

Take care,

John

[TeresaL]

My situation was very similar when I joined this website. I really did try to keep those rules, thinking that what her experts say may have merit, and maybe this is a dirty, sinful addiction. I was in GD misery. Our condition is complex, and isn't all fun and games -- we can't help it. We also can not change ourselves and our brain wiring because there is nothing wrong with us, and we've done nothing wrong.

Some how, your wife doesn't understand that If it really is love, then you can let the person go free, and they will come back, with no harm done. My freedom only came when I made a stand and declared that my TG life was is here to stay. If my wife wanted to stay, then fine. If she wouldn't let me be who I am, then leave. It took twenty years for me to make that commitment, and it is one of the best things I've ever done. Oh how I wish I would have done it sooner.

Although I never considered divorce was an option, I could no longer live with the mind control and domineering pressure. If you can, then have at it. It not, then make a stand for your life. If you have any dysphoria at all, it will gnaw at you until it eventually eats you up.

[mikiSJ]

Also I am no longer allowed to communicate with people on the internet without supervision.

Are you also becoming 4 years old without telling yourself?

Something more than admitting you are a transsexual is at work here. Your wife may be the love of your life, but you are giving up your life to a dominance, not a love - figure this one out really fast or the boy and the girl in you is going to be lost.

[Dawn cd]

Wait a minute! Give Lynn a break. She said she has agreed to do this just until the end of August. After that the whole thing can be renegotiated. It doesn't seem to me that four months it a big deal if it shows consideration for an SO. Lynn said she LOVES her spouse. Let's give love a chance.

[DaniG]

Lynn, clearly, you love your wife a great deal. I can relate to this. You want to do whatever it takes to make your marriage work.

While I agree with others that her demands are nothing short of draconian, perhaps it does make sense for you to get by for a time. Don't give up yet. You're getting into therapy. The two of you are getting into counseling together. This will give you both a chance to put some perspective on the situation.

I recommend you do some homework on the marriage counselor and make sure it's someone who has some experience with TS. Don't accept an authority in your marriage who's going to condemn you, tell you you're broken, and to get with the program. You need someone who understands TS and what lies ahead of you. This counselor needs to give your wife a realistic view on what's reasonable. Hopefully, at that point you'll be able to negotiate better terms.

As for the long run, I don't believe that you're necessarily doomed. But you shouldn't accept her terms for the long run.

There are plenty of couples who surive transition. Yes, the odds are against you. Yes, your wife's initial reaction is not a great indicator. However, it's still early. More important is the strength of your relationship. Other than the obvious problem, how are the two of you doing? When the stress comes, do you tend to fight or come together? Does she just want to get out?

If there's any give in her terms, I recommend you get back on the forum for the support you need.

Good luck, Lynn! I feel your pain!

[SabrinaDubh]

Also I am no longer allowed...

That right there would have me calling the lawyers.