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Thread: Compromises to save a mariage

  1. #76
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    Brilliant, Kaitlyn, and yes.
    Lea

  2. #77
    Minority of One Lynnmorgan451's Avatar
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    So we had a fight tonight. A bad one. And now I'm sleeping in my office at work. At a desk. Miserable. I have no idea what to do now. I can't do anything right and if I try to stand up to her about something as trivial as " please don't ignore me I feel like a ghost" all hell breaks loose....she smashed the glass door on the stove and destroyed my computer and the desk it was on. Need a roommate anyone?
    Morgan Lynn Scatterbrain

  3. #78
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    Not wanting to get flamed! but here goes.

    Time and time again on here its stated those who transition do so in the knowledge that they could lose everything in their life, friends, family, job but still they transition because they have no other option. I was lucky, most of my friends remained, my partner a heterosexual woman is now my best friend (she has another man in her life), and my employer has strong gender policies. I was prepared to lose those friends/partner, it may have been more difficult without a job though!

    I see these threads and the phrase "wanting my cake and eating it" springs to mind - I'm sorry but "girl with a penis?" No - as Reine says, girls don't have that appendage. In my opinion, MTF TS's don't get the privilege of calling themselves women or girls until they start living (and I mean living, not just putting on a dress to go shopping etc) in that gender, by all means consider themselves non-op MTF TS but calling themselves women or girls while still living as a man, no sorry, doesn't work for me.
    Last edited by Deborah_UK; 05-10-2013 at 02:11 AM. Reason: poor grammar!!!

  4. #79
    Aspiring Member Ceri Anne's Avatar
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    Lynn, those are very severe conditions, but if I were in your boat, I would look at it as a short term compromise also. The shaving issues are of course to keep you "honest" to your commitment. With luck, and counceling for both of you and time, she may come to understand. Even accept. My wife and family are very important to me, which is the reason I havn't figured out how to come out yet. The risk is very great, but I'm working towards it. Anyway, this is about you, and I hope you see this post. She needs to know she can trust you, that you still love her, and honestly, just to have time where she feels safe to digest this. You have your time every two weeks, maybe by August, things will be better. I wish you well and admire your commitment to her.
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  5. #80
    Minority of One Lynnmorgan451's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deborah_UK View Post

    everything in their life, friends, family, job but still they transition because they have no other option. I was lucky, most of my friends remained, my partner a heterosexual woman is now my best friend (she has another man in her life), and my employer has strong gender policies. I was prepared to lose those friends/partner, it may have been more difficult without a job though!

    I see these threads and the phrase "wanting my cake and eating it" springs to mind - I'm sorry but "girl with a penis?" No - as Reine says, girls don't have that appendage. In my opinion, MTF TS's don't get the privilege of calling themselves women or girls until they start living (and I mean living, not just putting on a dress to go shopping etc) in that gender, by all means consider themselves non-op MTF TS but calling themselves women or girls while still living as a man, no sorry, doesn't work for me.
    Are you F****ing kidding me? Ok ok ok....hahahahahahaha LISTEN.. I don't have to put on a dress or mascara or heels or ANYTHING to justify to YOU or anyone else who I am inside...ok? How many minutes per day you spend in drag earns you girl points? Oh plEEEEEZ spare me...I have serious issues here and I'm not going to split hairs on symmantecs and phraseology. For goodness sake did you even read any of the sh*t I've posted?? Have cake and eat it too? How about at the END OF MY ROPE...F**k the cake. I just want to survive this
    Morgan Lynn Scatterbrain

  6. #81
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    I'm sorry Lynn but that is my impression and I'm sorry you had to react that way, your wife does not want a "girl with a penis" so either you walk away or you live in an unhappy marriage.

    I am not asking anyone to justify themselves to me, I'm not that arrogant, but as someone who was prepared to lose partner and family to be who I really am I find the attitude of those only wanting to transition and expecting everything in the garden to carry on smelling of roses, well those gardens smell of fertilser too.

    I don't wish you hurt and hope you can find a path that suits - but as you've already discovered there probably isn't a compromise that works.

  7. #82
    Silver Member Kathryn Martin's Avatar
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    So let me get this right, you came out to your wife recently that you are "transsexual", then you proceeded to take lots of pictures of your girly self in which you pout, YOU POUT, you proceed to go proceed to go on the internet and have cybersex with another woman, that mentally f*ucking someone else which your wife finds out on top of everything else. You confirm at every turn that you want to live like a girl but your "wang", your "little soldiers" stays. You don't want "to cut it off". You tell us that the "Benjamin thingy" is too vague for you but that you are a "level four".

    Honey, let me give you some advice: you are not transsexual, you are having a fantasy about the girly things, you are ignoring your wife and children, and before long it's going to affect your job. If your wife threw you out last night, "destroyed" your computer maybe it is time to pay attention to her instead of your girlfriend Lynnmorgan. Just get your man clothes on, go back to your family and start mending fences. Otherwise you just might end up being another dude in a dress who lost everything.
    "Never forget the many ways there are to be human" (The Transsexual Taboo)

  8. #83
    Senior Member stefan37's Avatar
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    Well Lynn I cannot say I did not see this coming. Are you in real distress? Hard to say, as I do not know you personally. You claim to be a woman, but want to retain all your male equipment and privileges. You claim to love your wife and remain married, yet you go online and cyber another individual. That speaks volumes where your relationship was before you dropped the I am ts bomb on your wife. You have a never ending list of items that will prevent you from transitioning. You can think and call yourself anything you want, (no skin off my back) but until you take concrete steps to change your gender you will always be a guy in a dress. Seriously slow down, think what you really want out of life. Start a rational dialogue with your wife. Maybe start with asking her what she wants out of life and I know this may be hard LISTEN to what she has to say. then ask yourself without her what you want. Maybe there will be some common ground. Hopefully then you can open a honest candid rational conversation where both your lives can lead. If your goals are different, then the brutal truth is your marriage will not last. I hope you find the path you would like to take. But transition is serious business. It takes tremendous financial resources, commitment, resolve, perseverance and I think most importantly patience to reach your destination. I wish you luck Lynn.
    "When failure is off the table the only thing left is to negotiate levels of success" M Hobbes

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  9. #84
    Silver Member Angela Campbell's Avatar
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    I feel bad for you, because I can see you are confused and having some bad experiences. The truth is you have made some really bad decisions and when things do not go the way you hoped you made more bad decisions. Stop and look around for a bit and try to find a way to calm things down if it isn't too late.
    All I ever wanted was to be a girl. Is that really asking too much?

  10. #85
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    Lynn, what was she specifically angry about? If you want support you will definitely get it here from ALL of us. If you want a bunch of people cheering you on while vicariously applying their personal situation to you and offering opinions may or may not have anything to do with your latest row with your wife I think it's safe to say there will be plenty of that also, I'm just not so sure how helpful that will be to you. I really think that you need help dealing with your gender variance and the anxiety that it can cause. I'm not so sure that your wife's anger is a result of her dealing with the philosophical question of whether or not a girl has a penis, or what the future will look like years from now. A mother with three children under age 5 is MUCH TOO BUSY with making sure everyone is fed, clean, clothed, and healthy to worry about the finer points of what does or does not make a woman.

    I think that it's safe to say that it is "real" right now. Do you understand that one simple call to the police and you can be legally denied entrance to your house or family? Do you understand that the trajectory that you're on includes you being served divorce papers in the near future? I doubt that your employment situation is very safe if you continue sleeping at the office and demonstrate to your employer that your personal life is a mess. If she does file for divorce you will be hammered in family court with a temporary child support order and maintenance that could be staggering. An angry wife with three young children who files for divorce and accuses her husband of having an affair while simultaneously crossdressing and asserting that they are a woman with a penis will find NO SYMPATHY in the legal system. Are you financially prepared to pay a retainer fee for your divorce lawyer, possibly pay for her lawyer also, pay child support for your kids, rent for a second residence for you, and also help pay for your wife and children's residence? How about transition, it's really expensive. Can you afford a gender therapist and all the other necessary expenses that will occur with transition? What is your plan? It seems to me that you're on the path of losing your job and family, being unable to pay your obligations to your family and possibly even as little as 5 or 6 months away from jail time for lack of support. You need to wake up.

    It is imperative that you take immediate steps to try and find a workable day to day solution with your wife that give her peace of mind that you will be an equal partner in your children's welfare. You are so caught up in your pink fog right now that I'm not sure your able to see her perspective here. As long as you use this forum to simply have a bunch of people tell you that anything that you want to do is right and that of course there is no other outcome than your wife's unacceptance and the total nuking of your family then of course that is exactly what will happen. Rest assured that if that time comes then you will still at least have people telling you that it was the only path and that is the plight of the transsexual, just don't expect a lot of the same folks offering you a roof over your head.

    You say that you are a woman, my question to you is what kind of woman are you? I think that at the least you are acting like a man who is self-absorbed and frankly acting in a rather selfish manner right now. I'm not judging you but your choices, take this as advice from a big sister who cares.

    How many women walk away from their kids? How many women with three kids under five would have posted this much on a thread that is four pages long and NOT ONCE show evidence that their welfare is more important than your own, or at least equally important? Being a woman has VERY LITTLE TO DO WITH THE CLOTHES THAT YOU WEAR, it's about how you interact with other people, how you place value on the relationships around you in relation to yourself. If you want your wife to understand that you are a woman inside then you need to act like one, not like a man with a fetish or like a 13 year old girl who just discovered the mall and mascara.

    Honey you might feel like you're at "the end of my rope" but let me tell you that rock bottom is quite a bit farther down from where you are right now and you are speeding there like a bullet.
    Last edited by mary something; 05-10-2013 at 07:32 AM.
    "In our lives, change is unavoidable, loss is unavoidable. In the adaptability and ease with which we experience change, lies our happiness and freedom."

    "My actual gender identity emerged as I healed from the scars of childhood not because of those scars" - Kelly J

  11. #86
    Senior Member Robbin_Sinclair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnmorgan451 View Post
    The love of my life and I have been at each others throats pretty much since she found out I was transsexual. On and off, good days and bad days, then really bad days..........I think about other peoples problems and I even took care of some people in the hospital who have legs and feet amputated from being morbidly obese and diabetic and I think about what issues they deal with. When I compare them to mine it just seems silly. I don't have cancer or any autoimmune diseases. I'm not starving to death in Ethiopia. I'm not in prison or a mental institution. I'm not disabled in any way shape or form except for the notion that my body isn't female, its male. Oh my friggin God why is this such an issue to me?
    Hi -- Your post has been on my mind for about 4 hours. I am newly visiting this site (which used to be my therapy) after couple of months away.

    I love all the people who posted divorce. Generally, this is what I would have said, either doing this kind of work professionally or in a CD site. But you have to remember, this is a CD site. It's not the world. You know what the world thinks of us. At best we are Jamie Farr (Klinger) in MASH. At worst we are the old dead lady-man coming down the stairs in Bates Motel...but who are you?

    Are you really a transexual? Pre or post op? Forgive me father if I am wrong but I think you are as transexual as much as I am. Yes, it would be nice to be female. But no junk? Really, no junk? That's a big step. I've been following that my junk around all my all my life. A lot of people have.

    I like being a woman. Women are my real friends regardless of conventional anatomy. But I don't have to loose the junk to be a woman. That seems superficial.

    Oh, by the way, Lynnmorgan. I have a new post coming. It has to do with marriage compromises and purging.

    It is titled The Body Blue. Posting any moment now. xxrbbn

  12. #87
    Minority of One Lynnmorgan451's Avatar
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    Sorry about my angry post last night. It was a bad night to say the least..I just want to clear some things up. I put my family's welfare before everything. I love my kids and give them TONS of attention. I love my wife and also give her tons of attention. I did NOT have cyber sex with anyone on the Internet. I was turning someone down for cyber sex and my wife saw the message. And because I'm "nice" and also quite "stupid" I told the girl I would give her a rain check.. ..I don't make enough money to pay for all the stuff Mary mentioned and just the thought of it makes me want to .....cry.....I don't care what you call me TS or TG or whatever it doesn't matter. I've been this way my whole life and the whole time in hiding, terrified to come out, terrified of my parents. I came out to my wife, which was hard for both of us, but she was somewhat accepting at first and as time went on, things started to change. We've been through a lot together and I really hope we can survive this. I really love my wife and I will present as man for her. But it's just a matter of time before the sadness takes over. Wow...that's funny...it didn't take long at all. I just want to be happy and I want that for my wife as well. I want a good life for my children and I want to be involved in it every step of the way. Too many bad choices are sealing my fate and I feel them slipping away. I can't live a life where I have to apologize once or twice a day and beg forgiveness. Sometimes I do stupid stuff and NEED to apologize, of course. But recently, it doesn't matter what I do. In her eyes I am wrong about everything...I remember she told me a story once about her ex boyfriend, before we got together. She said he was verbally, physically and mentally abusive to her so she turned the tables on him...every minute of his life she deliberately pushed his buttons to set him off and eventually freak out on her...she did this instead of leaving because she wanted to have a more concrete reason to send him packing.....I think she's doing this to me...I wish she never told me that story because I think about it every time she starts acting ridiculous and accusing me of weird stuff. I don't know...I'm so depressed right now I can't even think. My neck is killing me from sleeping in an office chair and I just want this day to end :-(
    Morgan Lynn Scatterbrain

  13. #88
    Gold Member Kaitlyn Michele's Avatar
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    Personally I think you trying your best. I think you have some ideas in your head that are unlikely to pan out the way you want though... Sometimes when people get into the whole you are not ts thing its not an accusation but a plea to step back...

    i think you are right to bristle every time its said, and that feeling you get is good information about how the entire rest of your life is going to go

    ..think hard about this..
    when someone here says "you are not ts" or "you sure seem more like you are "just" crossdressing", that feeling you get is just another version of what every single moment of your male life has been and will be if you stay the way you are...

    no one in the world reflects back your femaleness..its death by 1000000000000 cuts.... walking out your door, you wave to the mailman..."howdy sir" he says...thats a cut... walking by the ladies clothes to pick up another pair of khakis..thats a cut... your promises that you make to your family...those will all cut..and they'll cut badly because you will find promises harder and harder to keep...

    I hope you can step back from everything for a moment and try for a more day to day life with your family...stop making promises, no negotiations...if you are transsexual events will carry on, thats the way the whole gender dysphoria thing works...its 10000000 cuts..its a grind...nothing happens in an instant

    .....if make your life smaller by living in the moment as best you can, you can create space to make progress, even if only in your mind ...anything you can do to defuse the current situation could help...

  14. #89
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    It sounds like a horrible night Lynn, and I;m sorry that you had to experience that. Perhaps when the time is right you should tell your wife exactly what you told us in your last post? I know my last post was harsh, I wrote it because I am scared for where you might be a week, a month, two months from now. Please take care

    Love,
    Mary

    ps- I know thinking about your wife telling you about how she dealt with her ex is very painful right now because it is concrete evidence of where your relationship is, but truly it is a blessing that you know this info. You have to know the situation in order to change it for the better honey.
    Last edited by mary something; 05-10-2013 at 10:41 AM.
    "In our lives, change is unavoidable, loss is unavoidable. In the adaptability and ease with which we experience change, lies our happiness and freedom."

    "My actual gender identity emerged as I healed from the scars of childhood not because of those scars" - Kelly J

  15. #90
    GG ReineD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnmorgan451 View Post
    I don't WANT to continue living as male, I HAVE to.....and...you said earlier that I'm passable?? :-D
    Yes, you are passable! And believe me, going out as yourself on a regular basis is NOT living as a male when you think of it. How many males do you know who do this?

    You could tell your wife that you have no wish to transition to a woman full time (this is the truth), but you do feel stuck between genders (this is not a lie), and you do need to take the time to go out and be yourself occasionally more than once per month and you can't do this with hairy legs and wearing a moustache. You can also tell her that you DON'T like yourself looking like a bearded fellow and you need to have the freedom to not be hairy if you don't want to be.

    Anyway, I promise you that if you go out at least 100 times (twice per week for a year) to ordinary places and not just TG friendly places even if it is in the next town over (for now), you WILL be much clearer about what you want to do in the long term, and your self description (whatever it will be) will be a heck of a lot more accurate than it might be now, hardly having any experience expressing yourself in public yet. Does this make sense?
    Reine

  16. #91
    Aspiring Member Megan Thomas's Avatar
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    Lynn,

    It takes two to have an argument. This is really starting to sound to me like she's drawing you into some degree of co-dependency. If so, it won't matter what you do you will never satisfy her. One day you'll be her white knight on horseback doing everything right, and then you'll be the most terrible control freak another day. I really think she needs more help than you do to be honest, and probably best done separately than together.

    I really don't envy your situation but I do urge you to step back and don't allow yourself to be drawn into the game she's apparently playing. More than anything, if you behave in ways alien to you in order to appease others you will eventually break, quite possibly in a spectacular or even fatal way. Whatever the pain now don't allow it to build up further down the road.

  17. #92
    Minority of One Lynnmorgan451's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mary something View Post
    I know my last post was harsh, I wrote it because I am scared for where you might be a week, a month, two months from now.
    Your last post scared whatever BeJeezus out of me that I had left! The stomach pains that come from financial distress.....uugggghhhhhh
    Morgan Lynn Scatterbrain

  18. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnmorgan451 View Post
    ....she smashed the glass door on the stove and destroyed my computer and the desk it was on. Need a roommate anyone?
    It's an understatement to say that this isn't good. But, there are always two sides to every story, and at this point I suggest that you invite her to join this forum, join FAB, and talk to other GGs who are in her shoes. Honestly this will be immensely more helpful that what the two of you are doing right now, if only to help the two of you communicate better together.
    Reine

  19. #94
    Minority of One Lynnmorgan451's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    Does this make sense?
    You always make sense but sometimes your pills are hard to swallow....thanks for saying I'm passable that pill was like chocolate truffles!
    Morgan Lynn Scatterbrain

  20. #95
    GG ReineD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnmorgan451 View Post
    You always make sense but sometimes your pills are hard to swallow...
    The bottom line Lynn is that your situation is currently a no-win situation on both sides, yours AND your wife's. I'm basically suggesting a longer term cooling off period in which time hopefully the two of you can learn to breather again, while you also tell her the current truth that you do not want to transition, and hopefully you'll follow my other suggestions.

    And THEN you can focus on defining yourself. It's just too early to do that right now. I'm not saying that you're a guy at all.
    Last edited by ReineD; 05-10-2013 at 10:42 PM. Reason: Added partial quote
    Reine

  21. #96
    Minority of One Lynnmorgan451's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    at this point I suggest that you invite her to join this forum, join FAB, and talk to other GGs who are in her shoes. Honestly this will be immensely more helpful that what the two of you are doing right now
    She's not interested in joining. I've asked her and kinda explained why I think it would help but its a ridiculous idea in her mind and embarrassing. She refuses to spend any time learning about my issues, which I know she's a busy one with the kids and to a point understandable. But still, she wont even really listen when I try to talk about my feelings and such and when she does, she doesn't take me seriously. This whole thing is a big embarrassing joke to her. I think..Honestly I don't even know what she thinks of me anymore. An obstacle between her and happiness is probably accurate enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by Megan Thomas View Post
    This is really starting to sound to me like she's drawing you into some degree of co-dependency. If so, it won't matter what you do you will never satisfy her........ I really think she needs more help than you do to be honest
    I totally agree with both of these statements. I think she's setting me up to whack me out of the court. And as much as I love her and as long as I've known her------> Hell ya she's crazy! <------ but so am I....
    Last edited by Rianna Humble; 05-10-2013 at 04:34 PM. Reason: Multiposting is making a post directly one after another, when you could have edited the additional comments into your first post.
    Morgan Lynn Scatterbrain

  22. #97
    GG ReineD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnmorgan451 View Post
    She's not interested in joining. I've asked her and kinda explained why I think it would help but its a ridiculous idea in her mind and embarrassing. She refuses to spend any time learning about my issues, which I know she's a busy one with the kids and to a point understandable. But still, she wont even really listen when I try to talk about my feelings and such and when she does, she doesn't take me seriously. This whole thing is a big embarrassing joke to her. I think..Honestly I don't even know what she thinks of me anymore. An obstacle between her and happiness is probably accurate enough.
    OK. It's clear that the situation has escalated to the point where there is am impasse. You did say at the beginning of this thread that you agreed to somewhat of a break over the summer. Just be sure to tell her that you do agree it is best to let things cool off for a bit and you will comply with her requests over the summer, tell her that you are doing this for her, but tell her that you will need to express yourself more than what is currently agreed upon (also stress that you DON'T want to transition and you want to continue being her husband and a father to your kids), and that the two of you should revisit this whole thing in the fall ... about the moustache and leg shaving rules. She does need to know that you are not happy with this, but it doesn't mean that she will lose her husband.

    In other words, the color gray does exist as a compromise between black and white.
    Reine

  23. #98
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    Lynn you are probably right that she is getting ready to whack you out of the court with the trajectory your relationship is on. That is why it has to change immediately. She made her ex-boyfriend the bad guy in her last relationship to justify her actions with her loved ones and friends for their emotional support. You need to be above reproach. You know her values and how she thinks, make yourself indispensable to your family.

    Kathryn started an excellent thread about managing transition, you'll find some excellent advice there.

    ps- this is my personal advice here, take it or leave it. Go to your Dr and ask for an ssri like Paxil that will fight the depression and anxiety and tame your sex drive. It will also lower your GD (personal experience) as your sex drive is lower and make it easier to deal with all the stresses in your life. Your wife will see you making a positive step to be a stable partner and give you some breathing room. Tell her you're doing it for your family. This will help stabilize your current situation and clear your head because you need every bit of your capabilities right now.
    Last edited by mary something; 05-10-2013 at 12:23 PM.
    "In our lives, change is unavoidable, loss is unavoidable. In the adaptability and ease with which we experience change, lies our happiness and freedom."

    "My actual gender identity emerged as I healed from the scars of childhood not because of those scars" - Kelly J

  24. #99
    trans punk Badtranny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReineD View Post
    Yes, you are passable!
    Please stop with this "passable" stuff. You have no idea what she looks like other than pics from this site. The CD's can convince each other that they're driving men crazy with their beauty but that's not the kind of thing we need to encourage here.

    Lynn, is taking your compliment very seriously and the fact is you really don't know if she passes. Her avatar clearly looks like a CD, with a wig, beard shadow and bushy eyebrows. There is definitely some potential but let's at least TRY to be honest in the TS forum. Passing takes a LOT of work and Lynn hasn't even begun to do the work yet.

    You know this is a pet peeve of mine, but that doesn't make it any less valid. Pictures do not give an accurate representation of someone's real life presentation. Why is this such a hard concept to grasp?

    I suspect you understand exactly what I'm saying, but your intent is to be sweet and encourage Lynn, yet that still doesn't make it right to give hollow compliments. How does telling her she passes help her situation other than to give her a false sense of security?
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  25. #100
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    I'm not sure it's even possible to pass all the time. Sometimes I pass, and other times, well other times it just sucks lol. I think it almost has more to do with your voice than any single physical feature. But I don't think that "passing" is the solution to her problems right now
    "In our lives, change is unavoidable, loss is unavoidable. In the adaptability and ease with which we experience change, lies our happiness and freedom."

    "My actual gender identity emerged as I healed from the scars of childhood not because of those scars" - Kelly J

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