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Thread: Am I a real woman?

  1. #1
    Paulette-Passion FurPus63's Avatar
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    Am I a real woman?

    I have a new boyfriend who has been cross-dressing for 45 years. He's lived his life in the transgender world all that time. Yet today he said to me after shaving my face, "wow, it's like kissing a real woman." I got so upset. I replied, "real woman, so what am I a fake woman? Have I been faking it for 15 months (the time I've been living 24/7). He said, "yeah." I got so mad I walked out of the house and have been steaming ever since.

    As I was leaving I told him, "I am a real woman. Just because I don't have a vagina, doesn't mean I'm not a real woman. I shouldn't have to educate you. Of all people, you are someone I thought understood."

    I heard him yell at me, "you don't have to educate me."

    Now I ask you. Am I a real woman??? The theory says that we transsexuals are people who were born with genitals of the opposite sex that we feel and believe ourselves to be on the inside. I'm in transition preparing for surgery, living my life full-time as a woman. I take hormones, put make-up on every day, style my hair, etc..., all the things a woman does to present herself to the world. My skin is soft, I've developed breasts, my legs are smooth as a baby's bottom, I'm developing hips and a butt that's shaping my body more and more with each day that passes. The one thing that's missing is a vagina. So does that mean I'm NOT a real woman?

    I felt so insulted and hurt. It's one thing when that kiind of ignorance comes from strangers who don't have a clue about this. It really sucks when it comes from a boyfriend, whom I love so much, and whom is a cross-dresser himself! He has even stated to me that he loves being a female, feels he looks better as a woman, and believes he too was born in the wrong body; but wants to keep his penis. With all that going on with him, and the fact that he attends my support group weekly, where they provide education and information about this whole transgender thing, it blew my mind away that he said something like that to me. It was so insensitive and hurt so bad. I'm almost in tears over it.

    So am I a real woman? Are we (transsexuals)??

    P.S. I hate being trans!!!!! It sucks so bad being a "chic with a dick!" I'm so sick of it all! It's bad enough I have family members reject me, friends reject me, 90% of society doesn't understand, and now someone who claims to love me doesn't understand either!!! Damn it. This sucks!

  2. #2
    Member ruthie801's Avatar
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    I'm not a Transexual just a cd but you are what you feel you are. I think your a real woman!!

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    Senior Member Princess Grandpa's Avatar
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    I'm so sorry for your pain! No clever words. No wise advise.

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    Isn't Life Grand? AllieSF's Avatar
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    As far as I am concerned, yes, you are a real woman. It is better that this happened now because it sounds as if he may have been using you for the last 15 months, which is totally unacceptable. Please try to get over him and this situation as soon as possible. I am sorry it had to happen, but at least it may be an eye opener how some professed "accepters" of who you and we are, really think. Next time you will ask more questions to make sure. Good luck.

  5. #5
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    I think there a lot of CD's who can only see transsexuals as something like CD's themselves. They can't understand how you are a real woman.

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    To your "new" boyfriend, obviously not. How long have you been dating him? And, he HAS been going with you to your support group WEEKLY?

    Unless I misunderstood your post, he wants to keep "his" while you want to get rid of "yours" badly. I think that makes the two of you INcompatible IMO.

    It sounds to me like he [probably] WAS treating you very well?

  7. #7
    . Aprilrain's Avatar
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    Sounds like a bit of foot in mouth syndrome on your BFs part. We all say stupid things from time to time.

    I've been at this (transition) for a couple of years now and I've gone through a lot of changes; physical, emotional and mental. I'm sure there is more to come especially, with SRS around the corner. That being said I still feel "different" than other woman (GGs). I'm sure its the 34 years of male socialization and still not being completely happy with my body etc. etc. I feel like there will always be a "gap" between what I am and what a genetic woman is because of a number of factors. I don't let that stop me from doing what I need to do to live a reasonably happy and fulfilled life. I feel like transition is a bit of a compromise, the question is, is transition worth it to you? Not an easy question to answer.

  8. #8
    Aspiring Member Jana's Avatar
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    That was a totally tactless comment from him. In fact, both tactless and unnecessary. We, more than anyone, know we'll never be GGs, no matter how we feel inside, and however many operations we seek to correct the bodies we were born with. There's no need for anyone to remind us of that. Perhaps, you two can have a conversation about this, so that you can explain to him how you feel. If he loves you the way you love him, he'll come around and make amends.

  9. #9
    Member GG7irish's Avatar
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    If you know who you are on the inside and accept yourself as such then you are what you feel. A woman is considered "whole" so they can have kids etc etc. Well for example I had to have a full hysterectomy years ago, so i no longer can have kids, but that does not make me less a woman. So like I said it is how you feel who you are on the inside.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FurPus63 View Post
    I felt so insulted and hurt. It's one thing when that kiind of ignorance comes from strangers who don't have a clue about this. It really sucks when it comes from a boyfriend, whom I love so much, and whom is a cross-dresser himself! He has even stated to me that he loves being a female, feels he looks better as a woman, and believes he too was born in the wrong body; but wants to keep his penis. With all that going on with him, and the fact that he attends my support group weekly, where they provide education and information about this whole transgender thing, it blew my mind away that he said something like that to me. It was so insensitive and hurt so bad. I'm almost in tears over it.
    This sounds like a real woman too me. You may not have a vagina, but your emotional outburst says.........Total Woman

  11. #11
    Silver Member Kathryn Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FurPus63 View Post
    Now I ask you. Am I a real woman??? The theory says that we transsexuals are people who were born with genitals of the opposite sex that we feel and believe ourselves to be on the inside. I'm in transition preparing for surgery, living my life full-time as a woman. I take hormones, put make-up on every day, style my hair, etc..., all the things a woman does to present herself to the world. My skin is soft, I've developed breasts, my legs are smooth as a baby's bottom, I'm developing hips and a butt that's shaping my body more and more with each day that passes. The one thing that's missing is a vagina. So does that mean I'm NOT a real woman?

    So am I a real woman? Are we (transsexuals)??

    P.S. I hate being trans!!!!! It sucks so bad being a "chic with a dick!" I'm so sick of it all! It's bad enough I have family members reject me, friends reject me, 90% of society doesn't understand, and now someone who claims to love me doesn't understand either!!! Damn it. This sucks!
    Oh my I have so many questions Paulette. Some of them entirely inappropriate. As it stands right now you are born transsexual. Soft skin, breasts and smooth legs don't make a woman and even a vagina doesn't even if you bought it from a surgeon. Neither does living full time "as a woman". His comment is of course really expressing his boy CD nature isn't it. Isn't CD all about pretending to be a woman even if you express variance from the paradigm?

    Tell me what makes you really a woman?
    "Never forget the many ways there are to be human" (The Transsexual Taboo)

  12. #12
    Silver Member Angela Campbell's Avatar
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    The thing is, unless you are living it, you cannot understand it.

    No one............no one understands it unless you are it. Some try to, some say they do, but deep down they do not really understand it at all. Not even the Doctors and Therapists who are cisgendered. Many will accept us, some even will support us but they cannot understand it.

    I know this is a bad attitude to have but it is my experience. Please understand that I do not hate those who do not understand I just accept that they do not and may never understand.

    Now the question...Are WE real women? I am. Maybe I will never be complete but I will get as close as I can to having my mind and body match. I have a birth defect. Does a woman born with three hands not qualify as a "real" woman?

    It would hurt to hear such a thing from someone you love and trust, but I could forgive as I know he probably cannot understand even if he wanted to.
    Last edited by Angela Campbell; 08-09-2013 at 05:02 PM.
    All I ever wanted was to be a girl. Is that really asking too much?

  13. #13
    Senior Member KellyJameson's Avatar
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    The doubly sad thing is he was probably trying to pay you a compliment while leaving you feeling insulted.

    This whole business of being transsexual and what is a transsexual leaves me feeling very tired sometimes.

    Almost from birth we our categorized by gender defined by sex and it is extremely difficult to undo a lifetime of this teaching

    I do think that gender identity is a physical manifestation of the self but this physical manifestation happens on the inside so is hidden from view.

    Unfortunately we live in a world that labels according to what is seen and in a world like this gender and sex are the same thing.

    One of the interesting paradoxes about transitioning is the person changes the body to sexually appear female as the expression of their known gender which further reinforces the cisgender perceptions of the world as gender being created by the body as "sex"

    I have wondered if transitioning is a form of surrender to defining gender based on sex for some.

    This is why HRT is important as a measurement of how your body and brain responds to female hormones as an indicator of your innate gender.

    I have found that I have lost a great deal of my sensitivity to what others think concerning my gender as I have lost my remaining doubts.

    Hopefully this is something all transsexuals eventually experience otherwise you continue to be repeatedly victimized by their labels and attitudes.

  14. #14
    Silver Member I Am Paula's Avatar
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    My wife thinks I'm a man that dresses funny, and male me is coming back sometime.
    Strangers see some kind of cross/trans/mess.
    GG's accept me in their inner circle, but don't think of me as a real woman.
    My sister, and niece only see 100% woman. I'm as real to them as they are.
    My mother has a son who is changing sex, but still her son.
    My Drs. and therapist see me as a transsexual woman.
    My friends think it must be a bundle of laughs to be transsexual, and growing boobs. Then I tell them about the effects of strong anti-androgens. They shut up fast.

    I know that I am a woman... My dick does not make that any less so.

  15. #15
    Aspiring Artist Kelly DeWinter's Avatar
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    Paulette;

    It sounds like your new bf does need an education, at least on when to keep his mouth shut. I equate that kind of a question in the same category of when a woman asks " Do I look fat in this? ", there is ONLY one right answer, any deviation fron the correct answer can only spell trouble.


    From his reply it can mean only one think he disrespects you as a woman and considers you less then what you are as a person.
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    Quote Originally Posted by almostalady View Post
    Now the question...Are WE real women? I am. Maybe I will never be complete but I will get as close as I can to having my mind and body match. I have a birth defect. Does a woman born with three hands not qualify as a "real" woman?
    I believe so. If you feel that you are a woman at heart, then you are a woman.

    Quote Originally Posted by KellyJameson View Post
    Hopefully this is something all transsexuals eventually experience otherwise you continue to be repeatedly victimized by their labels and attitudes.
    Kelly, if we are all women at conception, then we are women. The difference is that there were added features without the added (mentality?) for a lack of a better word. I believe that is why some of us call the added features a deformity.

    Quote Originally Posted by tgirlceleste View Post
    I know that I am a woman... My dick does not make that any less so.
    Exactly. In my case, my dick came with the added (mentality?) for it. But, since I crossdress and enjoy it at times, I suspect that I have both mentalities but the body of a man. if that makes any sense. I call these my essences and I'm fluid between them.

  17. #17
    GerriJerry Gerrijerry's Avatar
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    yes you are a real woman. Only another person who is going thru what you are can understand what you are feeling. Many Trans. go thru the same thing with someone saying something so stupid along the way.
    All your feelings are that of a woman not a male. especially with SRS coming. You are easy to be hurt by people who just don't get it.
    What you need to do is understand this is for you. This is your life you are correcting.
    As for your boy friend being a CD is about the clothes the high they get is from playing dress up. Nothing wrong with that but, It is not that way for you, the clothes has nothing to do with your inner feelings.
    So smile understand and realize he will never get it. Support is needed thru this intense period I hope you are getting it. From your counselor or others. They also don't have to understand just support you in what you are doing and feeling. As my wife told me, it is not a game.
    TO OVER WEIGHT TO POST A PHOTO, MY wife tells me I look like I am pregnant

  18. #18
    GG / SO to a CD MatildaJ.'s Avatar
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    You should understand that GG women go through this too. When someone is a tomboy, or feels ugly or awkward, or has a mastectomy, or a hysterectomy, or a really bad hair day, or if they choose work over kids, or if all their friends are married but they're single, or they just got divorced... women-born-female still go through this kind of insecurity about being judged not enough of a woman.

    The truth is none of us will ever be "woman" enough to please the whole world. But you're woman enough for yourself -- that's all that matters.

    As for your boyfriend, I guess I'm confused. Does he see himself as your "boyfriend," even though you say: "he loves being a female...and believes he too was born in the wrong body." Do you think he'd rather you referred to him with female pronouns, etc? Sounds like it's time for a serious discussion between the two of you, about how you each see yourselves, and each other, and what your future is together. Maybe in front of a counselor, if it's hard for you to speak frankly about these issues without getting into a fight.

  19. #19
    Senior Member Princess Grandpa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by almostalady View Post
    The thing is, unless you are living it, you cannot understand it.
    This is the crux of it. We can empathize we can support and accept but we can't ever truly understand.

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    Last edited by Rianna Humble; 08-10-2013 at 03:34 AM. Reason: Quote trimmed
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  20. #20
    Silver Member Angela Campbell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JessM. View Post
    You should understand that GG women go through this too. When someone is a tomboy, or feels ugly or awkward, or has a mastectomy, or a hysterectomy, or a really bad hair day, or if they choose work over kids, or if all their friends are married but they're single, or they just got divorced... women-born-female still go through this kind of insecurity about being judged not enough of a woman.

    The truth is none of us will ever be "woman" enough to please the whole world. But you're woman enough for yourself -- that's all that matters.
    The difference is what you are talking about is a feeling of insecurity where you feel bad about yourself, not where others do not accept you. Internal as opposed to external. No one tells a woman who had a hysterectomy they are now not a real woman, or if they get divorced or never married. This is not about insecurity but about a SO who has no respect for his partner.

    No....... women-born-females do not go through this. Not even close. This is not a bad hair day.

    As I said, unless you live in it you cannot understand.
    Last edited by Angela Campbell; 08-10-2013 at 01:36 AM.
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  21. #21
    GG / SO to a CD MatildaJ.'s Avatar
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    I don't want to compete about who has it worse, but certainly people say all sorts of thoughtless, unkind things to women-born-female too (and I'm sure women say their share of thoughtless, unkind things as well). It's not all in our heads.

  22. #22
    GG SO of CD ErinSassyPants's Avatar
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    I take hormones, put make-up on every day, style my hair, etc..., all the things a woman does to present herself to the world. My skin is soft, I've developed breasts, my legs are smooth as a baby's bottom, I'm developing hips and a butt that's shaping my body more and more with each day that passes. The one thing that's missing is a vagina. So does that mean I'm NOT a real woman?
    FurPus63, All of that is irrelevant. Soft skin, breasts, smooth legs, genitals they are all irrelevant to being a woman. You are a real women if you are. That's it. You can be a "real woman" with a penis, no breasts, hair everywhere and skin like sand paper. If you love having soft skin etc, then wonderful do it for you and enjoy it. But it does not make you a woman and not doing enough of it doesn't take back your woman card. If you looked inside your heart and soul and found a woman then you are a real woman. You don't have to earn it or live up to it.

    Quote Originally Posted by almostalady View Post
    No one tells a woman who had a hysterectomy they are now not a real woman, or if they get divorced or never married.


    As I said, unless you live in it you cannot understand.
    I absolutely agree that unless you live it you will never understand it the way someone who has lived it does. This also means that I can tell you quite clearly that you are wrong about what people say to GGs about being a women. GGs are absolutely told that they are not "real women" by other people for many reasons.

    Is it the same thing? No, but I think Jess's point was not that its the exact same thing but that society judges us all, that this is a situation that is closer to a GG situation than most people who haven't lived it can know.
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  23. #23
    Member bas1985's Avatar
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    I think that the expression "real woman" is an oxymoron.

    Just like a "real red", which is the real red? Or a real "republican"? Or a real Ferrari? or a real "Italian" pizza (or coffee?).

    they are simple concepts.

    Probably if I came to one of yours "Italian restaurants" I will say: "NO! no way! this is not REAL Italian food"

    Who cares? For you it's Italian enough and that is important.

    I suppose that half of the difficulty of TS arises from the fact that we give too much attention to the outside, either our body, and also of the judgements of others on our bodies. Of course we must give a sort of "suspension of disbelief", strong enough to at least a some degree (so HRT is OK), but... the rest?

    Is the "real woman" a sister of the "fantasy woman"? Maybe... maybe the a thought in our mind can be spelled in this way "I would be a real woman if I looked like that", because X will see me as "real".

    But TS cannot be brought outside. It is an inner state.

  24. #24
    Platinum Member Eryn's Avatar
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    Two questions:

    1. When he said what he did, did he do so to intentionally cause you distress?

    2. Is this slight, whether intended or unintended, worth destroying your relationship over?

    Forgiveness is the glue that holds relationships together. There will always be times when people misspeak or say something without considering all the ramifications. Is this relationship worth gluing back together? The choice is yours.

  25. #25
    Aspiring Artist Kelly DeWinter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JessM. View Post
    I don't want to compete about who has it worse, but certainly people say all sorts of thoughtless, unkind things to women-born-female too (and I'm sure women say their share of thoughtless, unkind things as well). It's not all in our heads.
    spot on, people speak without thinking, I wonder how many arguments can be avoided by just pausing before speaking ?
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