DADT effects on crossdressing

[JenniferYager]

Not sure about the Army and Air Force, but I found an interesting direct addressal of crossdressing by the Navy:

http://www.public.navy.mil/bupers-np...s/default.aspx

I copied the words below. Basically, it says the Navy kinda shrugs its shoulders about crossdressing so long as it's not at work or affiliated with the Navy:

CROSS DRESSING: SOCIAL MEDIA FAQs and GENERAL GUIDANCE

ALNAV 057/10 dated 192031Z AUG 10 with SUBJ: Internet-based Capabilities
Guidance - Unofficial Internet Posts provides guidance to all Navy personnel
regarding unofficial posts on the internet, including those pertaining to
DON-related content and discussions. It also provides guidance about the
best practices for use of internet-based capabilities in a personal
capacity. Specifically, paragraph 3 and 3.C. provide intent and general
guidance on appropriate unofficial internet posts.

The following comes from the Navy Command Social Media Handbook that command
PAOs should have a copy of:

"When it comes to your position as command leadership, your conduct online
should be no different than conduct in the rest of your life and you should
hold that same standard to your Sailors and personnel. If evidence of a
violation of command policy, UCMJ, or civil law by one of your Sailors comes
to your attention from social media then you can act on it just as if it was
witnessed in any other public location. This adds an ethical wrinkle to
friending or following your subordinates, but the key is for you to maintain
the same relationship with them at work as you do online and to be clear
about that."

"Communicate expectations about online interactions with your Sailors and
personnel. The Navy encourages Sailors to serve as ambassadors to online
communities. The Navy asks Sailors to live Navy Core Values online."

Social Media and Cross-Dressing Frequently Asked Questions:
1. Q: Is it authorized for a service member to be actively cross dressing in
public?
A: It depends. A member could not depart the ship in cross-dress nor
could they attend military functions in cross-dress. But, a member could
theoretically walk around town (INCONUS) with no Navy/military affiliation
apparent. OCONUS would not be authorized as you are a representative of the
United States and U.S. Navy in a foreign country in an official capacity
even while on liberty.

2. Q: Is it authorized for service members to utilize social media outlets
to post pictures of themselves in drag (cross dress) and utilize tags that
reference the US Navy? IE: HashTags for Twitter, ect.
A: No.

3. Q: Is it authorized for service members to post pictures NOT in drag
(cross dress) and reference hash tags for homosexuality and the US Navy as
one on social media's such as Twitter?
A: This one is harder and I am not sure that you have given us enough
information to answer thoroughly. While we support all of our Sailors no
matter their sexual orientation, we do expect everyone to conduct themselves
professionally on and offline. To answer your question, it really depends
upon what the hashtag is and how he or she is contributing to that
conversation. Professionally and educating the rest of those in that
conversation about the Navy would be something we can support.

4. Q: Is it authorized for service members to utilize social media outlets
to post combined pictures (collage apps) while in drag (cross dress) and
then a picture of the service member in uniform? Not in drag while in
uniform, just two pictures to make one?
A: No. Service members are restricted from cross dressing when their service affiliation is apparent. A social media site where the service member has already
affiliated him or herself with the Navy, such photos inherently link the
Navy with cross dressing and would be prohibited. While the Navy encourages
Sailors to serve as ambassadors to online communities, we also ask Sailors
to live Navy Core Values online.

Navy Policy Guidance on Cross-Dressing:

There is no specific Navy policy on cross-dressing, nor does Navy think that one is necessary. The following are some points a command must consider. The Navy has full confidence in leadership's ability to apply common sense to Navy regulations and make decisions that are in keeping with good order and discipline.

There is no statutory prohibition on cross-dressing. Limitations on servicemembers who engage in cross-dressing are contained in Department of Defense (DOD) and Navy regulations regarding enlistment, appointment, separation, discipline (UCMJ), and uniforms, and dress and appearance.

Navy Uniform regulations, Section 1101: General Information, para. 1, states that "The purpose of the U.S. Navy Uniform Regulations is to: (1) Provide descriptions of all authorized U.S. navy uniforms and components, and (2) Provide guidance for all Navy activities prescribing uniform wear in order to present a uniform image worldwide. It is issued by direction of the Chief of Naval Operations and carries the force of a General Order. Any procedures or components, regarding uniforms or grooming, not discussed in these regulations are prohibited.

Section 7101, para 1 (Civilian Clothing) states that "Commands are authorized to suspend the wear of civilian clothing for individuals who fail to wear civilian clothing as outlined in this section. Civilian clothes privilege may also be suspended for those whose appearance may bring discredit upon the Navy, or who fail to maintain adequate uniforms or seabag requirements properly. Regional commanders and the senior officers present may suspend the privilege of wearing civilian clothing to meet local conditions."

Section 7101, para 2 (Casual Civilian Attire) states that "Naval personnel shall ensure that their dress and personal appearance are appropriate for the occasion and will not discredit the Navy. Current styles and fashions which are conservative and in good taste are authorized."

Looser standards apply to Sailors INCONUS in a pure civilian setting and/or in the privacy of their own home and is governed more by our 1st Amendment rights. If they are attending a command/military function in civilian attire the more conservative dress rules and military regulations apply.

Clarifying civilian dress policy and Navy Standards of Conduct for a command function prior to the event is advised. Counseling noncompliant members would be the recommended first step in the case of any violations to conservative civilian attire/good order and discipline. Disciplinary action may be warranted in cases where members flagrantly violate regulations and or continue the behavior after they have been counseled. Recommend consulting the local SJA in such cases.

[Miriam-J]

Interesting item Jennifer. Thanks for sharing.

It seems to me that this is probably as far as the Navy can go at this point in time, and I think they're being fairly reasonable. Basically they seem to be saying "When you're on your own time and at home you can do as you like, as long as it's not connected to your service identity". It'll be interesting to see if the other services take a similar approach.

Miriam

[Allison Chaynes]

This was pretty much the approach I took as a leader of soldiers when I was in the Army. I had a CD in my first unit who was a great soldier, and a transwoman in the second. They never mixed CDing with work. I only knew about the first because of a surprise barracks inspection. Not a word was said by anyone involved, it was kept professional.

[LaraPeterson]

So they can do it IN the US, but not OUT of the US. What a strange rule.

[JenniferYager]

Lara, in other countries you can be tried and put in jail for crossdressing...hence the rules about out of the US.

[Helen Grandeis]

As the policy states OUTUS you are a representative of the USN at all times and at all places.

Additionally the wearing of civilian clothing is a privilege that may be revoked if you embarrass the Navy.,

[Beverley Sims]

Helen has the correct answer here.
Just use your brains when working this one out.

[Ceri Anne]

Very interesting and workable. As former Navy, Everyone is taught that anytime you represent the US or the Navy, you must adhere to conservative dress. This applies to piercings, tattoos, hair styles and cloths. Many companies require the same from their employees. The fact that the Navy addresses crossdressing in particular is very inspiring. While you are stationed overseas, you are not allowed because you are representing the US and the Navy at all times is understandable. I think you could get away with it if traveling overseas on leave, but that would be pushing it.

[Shari]

Jaw dropping acceptance.
I'm over 40 years removed from the Marine Corps and it just blows me away how much the military had changed.
When I was in, this was certainly a courts martial event and sure to get you discharged less than honorably.
I suppose overall it's a good thing but it does strike at my basic core values even though I am what I am and understand what drives crossdressing.
We were always told while on liberty, "Remember, you're a representative of your country."
Do you see the conflict here, or am I just too old school?

[KimberlyJean]

The Marine Corps have a civilian clothes policy at all times even in the states.

My biggest argument is the fact that I have multiple females walking around dressed like men. Not just in uniform but after hours wearing men's clothing with men's haircuts. If I have a young troop who wants to wear women's clothing I would be enforcing a double standard if I didn't let them. Of course I am biased.

[heatherdress]

Female Service members wear male-style uniforms on duty, as Kimberly points out. Although there are female versions of dress uniforms, most duty uniforms are male-styled shirt/pants, flight suit, coveralls, shoes and boots. The Services require females to crossdress on duty - for good reasons: functionality, safety, cost, tradition, uniformity. In this enlightened day and age, it would then seem to be philosophically at odds with uniform policy to restrict or inhibit off-duty crossdressing policies. None of the Services have crossdressing policies and there don't seem to be a reason to issue them. Maybe that is good, recognition that, with discretion, there is nothing wrong with crossdressing. Maybe the Services recognize that there are many good Service members of all ranks who crossdress off duty and are good soldiers, sailors, marines and airmen.

[KimberlyJean]

I like to think that maybe some high rankiing policy makers might be on our side, J Edger Hoover anyone?

[Jilmac]

I didn't read the entire thread but the info I read gave me the impression that the navy has no problem with a sailor crossdressing on his personal time. As a navy veteran I can say that I never saw this directive while I was serving, but perhaps there was a different mindset in the '60s. I did keep several pair of panties in my ship's locker but it wasn't unusual for sailors to keep articles of women's clothing as trophies.

[daarleane]

I read this with some interest. It is not like anything that transpired while I was in the Navy. The mindset then in the 50's was the same as WWII and in four years I never saw anything about crossdressing. Anything about that would have been related to homosexuality at a time when the nation was homophobic. That would have lead to a Dishonorable Discharge. So yes, times have changed and even the Armed Forces are recognizing it. So there is a light at the end of the tunnel, just keep moving along.