On this forum there are many SO's that don't accept our CDing. But Why? What do you think is the reason that you're SO really doesn't like your crossdressing. After all the fact that we keep dressing means it isn't a fad. It isn't a sexual thing after a while and so on. So what reason can one person who loves you be so prejudicial towards the thing that brings you happiness?
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Briana, because it is weird! You are writing as if cross dressing was like getting a new haircut. It's not. Not only is it weird, but most women have no foundation from which to even grasp the concept.
No SO should simply have to accept anything as ok. Cross dressing is way outside the norm and as such merits significant explanation and discussion to get one's SO to a point of even remote comprehension.
Brianna,
From Jennifer,
"Most women have no foundation from which to even grasp the concept."
And there is the crux of the problem.
Work on your elegance,
and beauty will follow.
Yes it's weird. It's complicated. If wearing women's clothes is a "sexual" happiness is that your preference over her? This is what blows up their minds. Women don't want to be in any competition even if the other woman is you.
Briana, I am going to quote you from another post. "I have never felt attractive as a guy, but as a girl I'm sexy and attractive, or at least I feel that way. And that feels good inside. Something that I rarely feel."
So how can your SO compete with the girl in your head? That girl is your ideal girl, in her life she has competed with other girls and probably knows how to, but she is at a disadvantage competing with the fantasy ideal of the girl in your mind. If she doesn't feel sexy and attractive at times, then what else is she thinking about. We live in a world full of commericals telling women what is hot and sexy, but 90% don't come close to this Holywood fantasy. Now add the competition with what is in your mind and it can get really messy really quickly. Do any of us know what our spouses esteem issues are? Do we know their insecurities? Do we know what the demons they battle with are? I can only guess what some of them are thinking, "but I'm the one who is supposed be the girl, he is supposed to be the guy, I can't take this".
When my closet door opened for my wife to come in she voiced her concerns. The first being she was afraid that I would look better than her. The second one had to do with sex. She wanted her man in the bedroom to lead and take control so she could be submissive, would apparel choices change this. That lead to the next comment which was about masturbation and why she didn't like it. Why, because I knew what I wanted, how to do it, and by how much, she said how can I compete with the ideal in your mind. All valid questions.
To quote Jennifer, "because it is weird!", well at least it is in their minds!
Last edited by Gillian Gigs; 01-21-2014 at 12:09 PM. Reason: spelling
I like myself, regardless of the packaging that I may come in! It's what is on the inside of the package that counts!
It is weird because we think it is. Along time ago we ate horse meat in the USA, but now we don't and people think that eating horse is weird. So weird is just wierd for the sake of being weird. It's very cultural bias and egocentric.Originally Posted by Jenniferathome
As far as hard to grasp??? Why is it hard? women like women clothes, why can't a man. Men like jeans and yet women for great while never wore pants. It was taboo. So why is such a stretch that we would like women's clothing.
"The world works not in reality, but in our perception of reality."- Therefore we should change our perception of reality. We have this saying that "we are set in our ways." which translated means that we are too lazy to try and think in a new way.
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False advertising! She thought she bought a BMW and under the hood there was a Ford engine....... a pink Ford engine.....
The trouble is that crossdressers are in the minority and because of this, men who wear women's clothing will never be the norm.
If as large a chunk of men were to dress as women, as there were women who less than a century ago began to wear pants, there would be no issues. But most men do not want to dress like women.
Reine
Briana I don't know that we are to lazy to think in a new way. I mean think about this how much time we spend getting our makeup on correctly.... A lot more time than most women. We spend a lot of extra time getting dressed to the nines and sometime only for an hour we get to wear what we may have spent two hours doing. Now some have to remove every trace of ever having makeup on and hide every bit of clothing. Even as far as folding a certain item correctly as it was before they touched it. That's not lazy. I think you mean instead of lazy folks don't want to accept in their mind what they feel is too much out of the norm. That is why I love seeing men's clothing getting more silky, more nylon, more comfortable. I would think the makeup companies and the clothing manufacturers would do well to start a uni sexual line of clothing and shoes. We could make this then become the norm after several years. Unfortunate though they probably keep more folks in jobs and more money catering to two sexes than just one unisex clothing and makeup.
Thanks, Gillian for the very clear and obvious (to me, anyhow) explanation. It gives me quite a bit to think about. I am pretty sure that's the challenge I face and the unasked question I must preempively answer.
This might be true if we were all cars that came with standard features, but we are people. Also we buy cars with things we want in them. A person comes with idosincracies that can change.
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The simplest answer is that some women just want a man--period!
Second star to the right and straight on till morning
First of all you have this biological thing going on where the average female will look for a male mate which looks like a male and acts like a male and she will assume that this male will be attracted to her because she looks and acts like a female , then all of a sudden she finds out that her male likes to dress as a female and act as a female , well that is enough to confuse any average female , what is she to think , does my male want to attract males, does he think that he is a female, am I not feminine enough for him , yes there are plenty of exceptions to this which is quite normal as it is quite normal to assume that her male will dress and act like a male so it is not surprising that some have a problem with it and until like ReineD has said about dress's becoming the norm for males to wear it will probably stay this way and all this before you even get to the social side of things , so do not be hard on them as it can be difficult to fight a biological instinct.
Last edited by Joanne f; 01-21-2014 at 03:42 PM.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Joanne
Women had a logical and well thought plan of attack (something men are supposed to be good at). Instead of saying "I want to wear pants because they look nice" they found more reasons (also they didn't put on the pants and then try to get their husbands to play with no more reason than sex).
Comfort and practicality
we can claim that but until women buy it, it is a moot point. You see dresses still have a stigma of not being comfortable ("I can't sit this way or that way. I can't ride a bike or a horse. I can't fix the roof) We need to prove the comfort/practicality level of dressing.
They didn't listen to what others said
Well at the beginning the older women railed against button shirts and slacks. Using the same arguments we hear now. It has been that way forever, some religions say you can't do it, it is immoral, what's next? Smoking and cussing like a man? We can't argue the opposite (except religion...but that is hard no matter what you are discussing) Women stood up and said "Why can't we?" Eventually the argument died. And equality prevailed about all the bad things women picked up from men.
Fashion designers convinced everyone that women co9uld and should wear slacks.
They made them pretty, or sexy, or feminine. Most here have stated that if tomorrow it was OK and someone designed men's skirts (or heels or nylon underwear...OH gee those already exist) for men they would not want them. Yes women wore and still wear men's clothing, but hey do it for a reason. See above.
I agree with Reine on the numbers part but there was so much more to women getting to wear what they wear now. When we can prove logical reasons...PROVE them, then it will be easier to get to where anyone can wear what they like. Not gonna happen in our lives
The earth is the mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it.
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“Love isn't a state of perfect caring. It is an active noun like struggle. To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.” - Fred Rogers,
The reason that "...most women have no foundation from which to even grasp the concept..." is that in their world, the concept of crossdressing simply doesn't even exist. Some would even argue that an element of "female privilege" or "female sense of entitlement" enters the picture here.
For a GG, the idea of wearing men's clothing - or a watered-down, feminized version of same - is somehow empowering. How else to explain the popularity of "boy cut jeans", the "boyfriend jacket", "menswear", and "boy shorts" etc., etc., not to mention the "hotness" and fashion forwardness of wearing men's wristwatches - especially by younger GG's.
I think that there is also a subliminal sexual component to this practice. Despite the successes of the feminist movement and the great strides that women have made for equality, there is still a part embedded in their DNA from prehistoric times that sees the male as the female's primary protector, and wearing men's clothing not only somehow draws them closer to these men, it also provides a sort of symbolic shield against ever-present dangers to their person (real or imagined), and not unlike Ironman's body suit. Ever notice how many GG's love to wear their mate's oversized men's shirts when they are pregnant, even when there are plenty of feminine maternity clothes at their disposal. Makes them feel closer to their man. Coincidence? I think not...
Remember the masculine "Annie Hall" look from the 1970's popularized by Diane Keaton? Well guess what?...she trotted it out yet again after all these years when she accepted the Cecil B. de Mille Award on Woody Allen's behalf at the recent Golden Globes ceremonies.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...accepts-670372
And not to be outdone, Salma Hayek quickly followed "suit" (no pun intended) at a subsequent fashion event:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz...hion-show.html
Would a man coming out on stage in a ball gown have elicited similar favorable "Oooh's and Aaah's"? James Franco tried that a couple of years ago at an Oscars awards ceremony and it was allegedly done for comic effect. Trouble was, he looked just too d#mned good, and the awkward silence and discomfort which that generated on the part of all audience members was palpable:
http://www.sheknows.com/entertainmen...g-is-not-funny
But we're not allowed to call what Diane and Salma did "crossdressing" because that would be sooo wrong, and wait for it... just plain"weird" - unlike, of course how we are perceived when we like to wear clothing with a feminine flair.
A "tomboy" girl is free to be herself and is often praised for showing stereotypical male attributes such as toughness and independence; a more "girly" boy is called a "fag" or a "sissy" and is usually admonished to "man up" lest he have the crap beaten out of him.
I call it a double standard, pure and simple...
Last edited by Leslie Langford; 01-21-2014 at 10:55 PM.
Briana; Gillian gave a great answer to you question but Jennifer nailed it. Men who cross dress are just weird in the view of most women and there is really nothing wrong with that.
It's up to us to convince them that some of our feminine qualities are what they found attractive about us in the first place.
I try not to be weird about my dressing only in that I always fully and completely dress while around my wife so as to give some sense of a normal looking female impersonation to her. One that she can accept. I have never been one to want to sleep in a bra and panties looking my typical male self as even I would consider that weird.
Spouses generally don't like finding out something they didn't know about you, if that something is something they would see in a negative light. Then the whole "I don't know who you are anymore" argument ensues.
I'm no expert on this but I always took it that women wearing pants became more commonplace somewhere around WWII, when scores of women took men's places in the factories to help with the war effort while the men were off fighting. But I don't think there was a plan ... pants were simply more practical. Granted, women looked different in pants than men, due to their waist to hip ratio.
And then came the 1950s when women could ease up and resume their feminine place in society. Their pants were sexy, because they followed the contours of the female waist, hip, and thigh. There's no way that these slacks were considered masculine.
http://www.fiftiesweb.com/fashion/fashion-wp.htm (scroll down)
http://vintagepatterns.wikia.com/wiki/McCall's_3414_A
Totally agree with this. There are skirts for men (kilts, etc), there have been for a long time and in several cultures. But in cultures where kilt or sarong-like clothing is acceptable, I'll bet my last dollar that wearing men's kilts or sarongs does not satisfy a CDer's need to dress like a woman. CDers wear women's clothes because they are women's clothes.
So to the people who look wistfully at women's clothes and wonder why men can't wear them, please don't waste your time and energy. Instead just realize that most men do not want to wear them and instead embrace the fact that you are different. And try to help your wives realize that being different is OK, even if it means developing a thicker skin.
Reine
The only thing I would like to add to other's points is that often it is how the cross dresser approaches the subject. Too often we hide what we do, which would indicate that there is a reason for hiding it, because there is something wrong with it. Thus what are SOs supposed to think when the truth finally comes out?
If we didn't hide ourselves then maybe all of society would be forced to recognize how many of us there are, and thus through sheer numbers alone we would be able to demonstrate our normalcy.
Brianna, your first comments are just apples and oranges arguments. If we put either on the weirdness meter, none rate above a 2. Cross dressing rates an 8. These are not comparable. Now, as for the other point that i captured, I agree completely that perception is reality. Unfortunately, the fanciful notion that "we should change our perception" is just fantasy. Everyone should be nice but they are not. Kids should be raised right, but not all are. Change will come just like evolution...over eons.
@Reine: you comment makes me wonder what would have happened to the Western film genre had men actually done what you suggest! Hard to picture John Wayne in a dress.
Last edited by Jenniferathome; 01-21-2014 at 04:49 PM.
That's my point..practicality. Someone show me where a dress or skirt in more practical in everyday life.
So to the people who look wistfully at women's clothes and wonder why men can't wear them, please don't waste your time and energy. Instead just realize that most men do not want to wear themAnd try to help your wives realize that being different is OK,I am glad both my soul mates liked the difference and celebrated the spontaneity and surprise of being with someone who didn't play by rules
The earth is the mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it.
Chief Joseph
Nez Perce
“Love isn't a state of perfect caring. It is an active noun like struggle. To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.” - Fred Rogers,
I'm not a GG nor do I have a non accepting SO, but I will make a guess.
If a woman [MOST women] could have a MALE brain for a day and experience what a male brain will do with VISUAL input, they would probably/likely be a lot more understanding. Not to say that understanding would necessarily lead to greater acceptance,
It's not going to change anytime soon.
The reason pantyhose and heels are ALWAYS such big hits is obvious. The Pic and Video Forum just adds fuel to the fire.
ReineD quote, "And then came the 1950s when women could ease up and resume their feminine place in society. Their pants were sexy, because they followed the contours of the female waist, hip, and thigh. There's no way that these slacks were considered masculine."
I remember when I was in Grade10 in the winter of 66-67, if a girl came to school in pants, and it was not below -10F, she was sent to the Home Ec class room and given a horrible skirt to wear for the day. If it was below -10F then it had to be a pant suit, or the same thing would happen. By my grade 12 year it had totally changed.
ReineD quote, "There are skirts for men (kilts, etc), there have been for a long time and in several cultures. But in cultures where kilt or sarong-like clothing is acceptable, I'll bet my last dollar that wearing men's kilts or sarongs does not satisfy a CDer's need to dress like a woman. CDers wear women's clothes because they are women's clothes."
Ok, you caught me, guilty as charged, I have tried these other underwear options and they didn't do it for me. I am giving serious consideration to getting a kilt in my family tartan to wear in public. I have a work buddy who is in a drum and pipe band, his joke is that they are all closet Cd'ers who wear their kilts in public because they are too afraid to wear their skirts. Who knows?
I like myself, regardless of the packaging that I may come in! It's what is on the inside of the package that counts!
I can atest to the fact that a light sundress and panties are a lot more partical on a hot day here in Fl. for almost anything that doesn't call for protection of the legs. When it's well over 100 degrees and the index is much higher with humidity in the 90's, believe me it's practical and as much more comfortable as any clothes can be, over nude.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Fran
It's worth something just being around to Fuss!
There are quite a few reasons. If you put yourself in her shoes (not literally!) you will begin to see the reasons.what reason can one person who loves you be so prejudicial towards the thing that brings you happiness?
1) women have a romantic idealization of what real men are, and it ain't a guy in a dress!
2) What will her friends think?
3) It borders on her being bisexual in her mind.
4) It's weird!
5) she thinks you're gay
6) man's role is provider and protector of the family and any fem quality negates that image.
7) what will her family think?
8) she wouldn't be caught dead in that dress you're wearing!
"You're the only one to see the changes you take yourself through", Stevie Wonder
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