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Thread: Sex Change Regret website

  1. #101
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    Kathryn, I know you feel strongly about this, but I don't buy it. First, into the 70's there was no quick assessment and out. People spent months and sometimes years just getting accepted by a gatekeeper, and then went through an extended, and by all reports, excruciating process that few made it through.

    Then the lights went out in most of the gender clinics, thanks to Johns Hopkins and Paul McHugh.

    The first (now) WPATH SOC was published in 1979. It was most definitely not a quick assessment process, either. WPATH was the principal SOC in use, pretty much worldwide for years outside of the few remaining gender clinics. The APA only broke with WPATH with the publication of their own task force document in 2012. WPATH essentially responded to that via the SOC V7, dropping some of its strictures and presenting its recommendations as flexible guidelines (their term) and not a care standard in the usual medical sense.

    The 20th century history of gender practice is one of long, exclusionary, controlled psychotherapy and gatekeeping. Things did loosen, but recently. A lot of the change is hugely positive. Even forgetting the primitive practices and attitudes that prevailed into the 60s and 70s, how many would support RLE before hormones these days? (Not me) Or live with diagnoses of the pre-DSM5 (pre-V4 especially)?

    Fast forward to the present. Things have become quite loose indeed. SRS and FFS surgeons actually compete. Non-specialists (pretend to) treat gender clients everywhere. The WPATH SOC is a shadow. Self help groups have proliferated everywhere. And I agree that the results are not always positive. But where is this gender machine you are talking about, despite it all? Rather than extending therapy and cost - the practice of the past - the abuse today has shifted from inappropriate gatekeeping to insufficient (or lack of, or lack of qualified) assessment. Yet quick assessment-only is what you seem to advocate.

    I think that an assessment should rarely be short and performed only by a trained specialist. I would not only like a reasonable SOC, but one that is properly implemented with oversight. We've swung too far and too loose, to the point where people are being hurt. But I see no indication among therapists of anything but good intent. Some of the surgeons ... not so sure there.
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  2. #102
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    Gender therapist proding transitioners is a little weird for me too. I know they exist and people talk about them on this very forum. The team of the human sexuality clinic to which I went (as mandated by the public health care system in my province) never told me that I was transsexual and never recommended HRT or SRS. Their mandate was, as Kathryn pointed out, to look for co-morbidity and risk factors over a long period time. They did, however, write "letters" for HRT and SRS when I did ask for it after mandatory observation periods (years, not months).

  3. #103
    Silver Member Kathryn Martin's Avatar
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    Lea and Frances consider this: The first inclusion of Gender Dysphoria Syndrome in the DSM took place in 1986 the same year that homosexuality was entirely removed. It is interesting because it was was then used to classify certain types of gay, lesbian and bisexual persons as mentally ill because of the new disorder. [see Disordering Gender Identity: Gender Identity Disorder in the DSM IV-TR, Lev, Hawthorne Press 2005].

    The issues that Benjamin and some of the earlier service providers both in the US and Europe tried to exclude were mental health issues which would mask delusion as self identification. The criteria were very stringent. I have spoken with women who were assessed by Pauli and Benjamin and in England by Randall and Anderson and the process has nothing to do with self discovery and everything to do with assessment.

    The difference between counseling and assessment is that the latter is not designed to engage but rather to stay a step back and assess and report.
    "Never forget the many ways there are to be human" (The Transsexual Taboo)

  4. #104
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    I was assessed, not counselled.

  5. #105
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    And I am most definitely had both. I was assessed (and treated, as appropriate) for a number of co morbid conditions, in their own right as well as to assess the probability that they were responsible for the manifestation of the gender issues with which I presented. This is mainstream differential diagnosis 101. The counseling content covered adjustment and social anxiety issues, working problems, marital issues, problems with children, etc.

    I know that you know that Harry Benjamin suspected transsexuality has a physical etiology - but neither the research knowledge nor the tools to confirm his suspicions. He was right, and he was ahead of his time but he was nonetheless dependent on his own subjective observations (good ones to be sure) and psychological screenings of the time (such as they were) and that was about that. He invented a care protocol. He followed up on his patients. What he did was revolutionary, but it was also rudimentary by the standard of what I have had available to me personally. My assessment was better and founded on better information and experience. The care protocol is more refined. I have care from a multi-multidisciplinary team. Etc. etc. etc.
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  6. #106
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    Eek. A cursory read of these last few posts would have someone thinking that medical practitioners are not providing for the best care for their patients but rather trying to line their own pockets!
    I don't know, maybe that is the case (maybe in the US?? you seem to have a slightly more financially driven health care system than Europe, UK or Australia?). BUT I would suggest a couple of alternative explanations (which may or may not be true, in much the same way as the reasonably unsubstantiated allegations of money leaching may or may not be true):
    1. What is called "Diagnostic reveal". Basically a problem or disorder that had previously been either untestable or testing had been limited due to financial or manufacturing constraints becomes far easier to test and thus there is a marked increase over time of diagnosis made. A reasonable example is Diabetes where much easier access to testing has resulted in markedly increased diagnostic rates (and yes there are other factors in diabetes as well but improvements in testing protocols has been one of the major ones).
    2. Social awareness. Increased social awareness and publicity leads to increased testing and thus diagnosis. Breast cancer is the obvious example here.
    3. Improved treatment protocols. We know that mastectomy combined with radiation and / or chemotherapy has a MICH higher survival rate than mastectomy alone. Is it possible that outcomes following SRS are better now than in decades previously because we have more counselling?
    Also I don't quite get how pushing someone into a diagnosis of TS or GID requiring SRS is going to increase the therapists income? Surely if you want to keep on having them come to session after session of therapy then the best way is to keep the client AWAY from SRS as they then need to keep coming to see you to discuss their gender concerns? Also once the client is diagnosed as requiring SRS then surely all their income is redirected towards HRT and surgery? I know of very few psychiatrists who have touched a scalpel since they became specialists. Correction, I don't know of any.
    I'm in a different medical jurisdiction and maybe I've missed the point of what you are saying but I think we should at least consider the possibility that the medical profession genuinely has our best interests at heart?

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathryn Martin
    This assessment was simply that nothing more. In the early 1970s the "industry" discovered that they could offer services to "guide" people through self discovery process.
    Oh yeah. Nothing says "medical money making machine" like a condition that:
    - affects 0.3% (at most) of the population
    - is mostly uninsured in the US, and highly socially stigmatized
    - affects a population who's often too broke to afford it

    This seems implausible to me. As medical industries go - it's itty-bitty.

  8. #108
    trans punk Badtranny's Avatar
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    In regard to the encouragement I mentioned earlier, I'm seeing a whole lot of missing the point. Some people mentioned cheer-leading, and nobody here who shares my view (most of the transitioners) has said anything at all about cheer-leading or pushing an agenda.

    What we're talking about is an atmosphere of encouragement and strong support in our community for all people who claim to be TG in some way. I have been to an event or two since 2009 and I can tell you for sure that anybody who announces their intent to transition is welcomed with open arms. If you are the kind of person that is looking to 'belong' to something, than the trans community is a pretty good bet.

    This is not necessarily a bad thing, UNLESS you're not really a transsexual. Now there are some here that would say that I'm not a real transsexual since I don't pine for the pussy, but the fact remains that I have completely transitioned socially and my past as a man becomes more distant every day. I assure you that rearranging my genitals would have no effect on my daily life. Whether or not I'm a real anything is unimportant to me, the point is, I now live the life that I imagined as a young kid. My transition was easily the best decision I've ever made and I can't imagine not living this life, BUT it has been very difficult and I can totally imagine someone giving up if they just aren't cut out for it.

    My life has completely changed and for me, it is mostly for the better because I was a seriously unhappy person before. My entire life from the age of 12 had been an endless exercise in proving my manhood. I was the poster child for a dude who was not secure in his masculinity. Transition was a liberation for me, when I decided to finally do it, I didn't give a DAMN what anyone thought. I was finally free. Why in the world would I ever go back to pretending to be a man?

    The short answer is "I wouldn't go back for a million bucks". The long answer has something to do with this is who I am and transition was the right thing for ME to do. It is NOT the right thing for everyone who does it, but there is really no way to determine who will thrive and who will dive. I think the therapists mean well when they are supportive because I'm sure they don't have any better understanding of transsexualism than we do. How could they? The science is still very new. The idea that someone may claim to be TS because of something entirely unrelated is even newer. I cannot even begin to understand why someone who is not TS would pretend to be or even want to be. For me it's been a hell of a thing, mostly because of the world outside of our community, but even with all of the struggles, I still FEEL better about myself than I ever did. It's like the movies where somebody gives up some kind of grand privilege for their true love and live happily ever after. Transition really is a happily ever after IF it's the right thing for you, but if it's not, then look out because it is a ROUGH thing to do.

    So why do a dozen or so bitches on this board get all 'gate keepy' when a new girl starts yammering about transition? Because we care. Because we know what's coming. We have no way of knowing what's in your heart so when we say "think twice" we're just trying to stem the tide of blind support that we know exists in the greater trans community. I will support any person that transitions, but at the same time I will discourage anyone that is "thinking" about it. My feeling is if a bitchy tranny on an internet forum can sway you or confuse you than you are simply NOT ready to transition. If you think I'm a bitch, than you need to know that LIFE is a real bitch when you are coming out. Especially at work.

    Transition regret is a real thing and the people that regret it are the same people who didn't really know what they were in for when they pulled the pin.
    Last edited by Badtranny; 04-02-2014 at 11:50 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by STACY B
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  9. #109
    Member VanTG's Avatar
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    Totally Agree with you on that one. Site is not well put together, some of the links are not connected either.

  10. #110
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    First, I think Kathryn's comment was directed primarily at therapists, most of whom are not physicians or necessarily even PhDs. I have known too many social workers (including my sister) with humanistic impulses to believe it characterizes the profession, though.

    Surgeons? Again, I'm not so sure. To my knowledge, almost ALL FFS surgeons are in the general practice of plastic (and in many cases reconstructive) surgery, even the ones that do "true" FFS bone work. Want a facelift or need a mole removed? Spiegel will do that, too! Except for certain kinds of reconstructive surgery, plastic surgeons' work is never covered by insurance. Trans people might be a relatively small market, but it's big enough to devote a chunk of their practice for a fair number of these doctors. One FFS patient is better than, say, 50 Botox patients.

    Plastic surgery is a profit-driven niche of medicine. Thing is, I'm enough of a capitalist to believe that profit-seeking and humanitarian impulses aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, though they can starve each other out, so to speak, one ethically and the other financially. Bottom line is that there ARE some surgery factories out there and doctors known for their sales skills. I'd still take that doctor - if good - over the one to whom you're the nose job in OR #3, and to whom a bad outcome is just a data point in the development of his research.

    SRS surgeons are no different in some respects from other specialist surgeons. It isn't unusual at all for a surgeon to focus on a limited number of conditions and surgeries.
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  11. #111
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    regarding economical matters you are probably in a different boat than mine. Here, if you pass the gatekeeping, SRS and hormones are free. It is not free laser or FFS, which are a big chunk of transition, but hormones it's a tax for all life and having it free is not a little "gift" from the state.

    I understand than where there is profit more customers mean more profit.

    Nevertheless I would also say that TS is so stigmatized that many TS are Ts without knowing, because of self denial. I was one of those, probably, went to different therapists, told my "feelings" of femininity and NO ONE has ever told me "did you ever thought of sex change?". Luckily they did not fill me with meds, either, they only become some expensive friends.

    So... there are false positives (sex change regretters) but also false negatives (people in self denial). How do you help both? It seems a bit problematic, because helping the second group, encouraging self discovery, passing the internal transphobia, will raise the number of people who enter the "machine"...
    so also people who were not so convinced but, maybe also for weak temperament, are a bit "flipping" in their decisions.

    I think that a "solution" is external to the problem, that is if society accepts a more gender-fluid expressions, we can have a RLE without "passing" much more easily.

    I understand the OP: "I do not want to be a man in dress. I would like my body to be feminized before".

    Her concern are right. Maybe I am a bit gifted genetically and I can 60% pass even without hormones, but not all are so.

    But her concerns are right BECAUSE of the society which is so gender binarized. If society, slowly, can accept a "man in transition" or
    a "man in discovery", she could go out, also totally un passing, but people could understand that she is a man who tries to discover
    if this is a path for her.

    Of course... going out means to "come out".

    But I suppose that the second is matter of "self-acceptance" and no hormones can change that.

    If I know I am a woman I can state this FACT even before electrolysis or counselling... even with a beard and man's muscles.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badtranny
    I think the therapists mean well when they are supportive because I'm sure they don't have any better understanding of transsexualism than we do. How could they? The science is still very new.
    I'm sure that most of them have a much worse understanding of transsexualism than we do. They don't experience gender in the same way we do - to them, transsexualism is a complete abstraction, while to us, it's something we struggle with over our lives.

    Imagine that all but 0.3% of the world was color blind - they saw in monochrome, and some of us saw in color. A physician who specialized in vision might have an amazing technical knowledge of color - but no true understanding of it. It would be an abstraction to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badtranny
    The idea that someone may claim to be TS because of something entirely unrelated is even newer. I cannot even begin to understand why someone who is not TS would pretend to be or even want to be.
    This is the part I'm skeptical of.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badtranny
    My feeling is if a bitchy tranny on an internet forum can sway you or confuse you than you are simply NOT ready to transition.
    Fundamentally, we disagree on this point too. I've dealt with alcoholics for a long, long time. You know what most of us have in common with alcoholics? DENIAL. So many of us start out trying to avoid this. So I think it is a great disservice to tell someone who is on the brink of accepting a terrible truth about themselves "nah, you are fooling yourself, you're not an alcoholic. Here, drink up!" It seems to me that there is a LOT of this on this forum, and it's my opinion that it's really unhelpful.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulaQ View Post
    I've dealt with alcoholics for a long, long time. You know what most of us have in common with alcoholics? DENIAL. So many of us start out trying to avoid this. So I think it is a great disservice to tell someone who is on the brink of accepting a terrible truth about themselves "nah, you are fooling yourself, ..."
    Sure, denial plays in alcoholism, but addiction itself plays more. (I also have a history here, alcoholism run through and through my family.) I think a more pertinent point is incidence, though. The likelihood of someone with a heavy drinking problem being alcoholic is quite high. The likelihood of anyone being transsexual is exceedingly low. In an online forum? Ridiculously low.

    Based on odds alone, more people would be helped by discouraging everyone than actually helping the transsexuals! The situation is exactly the opposite with alcoholism.

    Misty,

    How do I reconcile the statement you were:

    "a seriously unhappy person before. My entire life from the age of 12 had been an endless exercise in proving my manhood. I was the poster child for a dude who was not secure in his masculinity. "
    with:

    Quote Originally Posted by Badtranny View Post
    I didn't hate being a guy at all. I didn't hate wearing men's clothes either.

    I transitioned for one reason and that's so people would treat me more like the way I felt. I don't know what other problems transition might solve but that's the only one I cared about ... I was not a sobbing basket case before I transitioned. ...
    I understand the context is different, but these still seem pretty polarized. I'm not questioning the truth, either, but I am obviously missing something that connects them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badtranny View Post
    In regard to the encouragement I mentioned earlier, I'm seeing a whole lot of missing the point. Some people mentioned cheer-leading, and nobody here who shares my view (most of the transitioners) has said anything at all about cheer-leading or pushing an agenda.

    ...


    Transition regret is a real thing and the people that regret it are the same people who didn't really know what they were in for when they pulled the pin.
    ... and I am among those missing something here, too. It would help me if you gave a few examples of inappropriate encouragement - not the egregious cheerleading, which everyone agrees is wrong-headed, but ... Whatever it is (something more subtle?)
    Last edited by LeaP; 04-03-2014 at 08:47 AM. Reason: Missing paren, missing word
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  14. #114
    Senior Member rachael.davis's Avatar
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    I think the best advice I have gotten from my therapist is Take your time, and get to honestly know yourself.

  15. #115
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    Lots of generalities...lots of assumptions that may or may not be right...

    I never met a transsexual that was a cheerleader. Never. I have never heard of a woman (1st/2nd/3rd hand) that felt goaded into transition by a therapist... now of course there are examples that I haven't seen but my sample size is pretty large...this is not a big issue in our lives.

    TS regret is better named either CD regret(as many of these people are not ts...and see my next point...what to do about these people if they are in our lives ??)... and the rest are suffering life regret... they regret they lost their $$..their wife gave up on them...their kids didn't come around.. maybe the worst being nobody accepts you as a woman...

    all these things are possible, but its not an "issue"... i'll say it again... its a big deal...its brutally difficult and many people are rooting against you...
    it might not work out very well for you... that's pretty much the end of the story..deal with it... seriously, what more is there to say?

    Also, I believe we have to have the courage to stand up to people that feel its out of bounds to say "i don't think you are on the right path"... I don't think its quite right to say "YOU are NOT TS"... but I think its the morally correct thing to do to say "i don't think you should be planning a transition right now"...

    nobody is right all the time.. people get burned but jeepers if you somebody says you are not ts or you shouldn't transition get over it and do what's right for you... It's not personal. If you take it personally, that's on you, not me.

    TS regret?? blecchh

  16. #116
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    Kathryn, that gender pops up in specific terms in the DSM's history doesn't mean it wasn't pathologized by psychiatry prior to that. In the 1800s it would likely have been viewed as an extreme form of "melancholia" ... and the poor patient (or victim) would have sent to an insane asylum. After the publication of the Statistical Manual for the Use of Institutions for the Insane, perhaps a diagnosis of hysterical neurosis or dementia praecox. Again, institutionalized. The DSM-1 characterized homosexuality as a sociopathic disturbance ... and at that point (1952), transsexuality was not recognized as distinct, as it fell under the generalized concept of psychosexual inversion. Again, institutionalized ... And now ever more frequently "treated" with electroshock and insulin shock "therapy" or lobotomized.

    I know you are aware of all of this, so I'm unsure of the point you are making with your DSM-3 comment.
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  17. #117
    Silver Member Kathryn Martin's Avatar
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    Lea,

    Just re-read the context in which I reported about the inclusion in the DSM. The interesting things also is (and this is significant) is that it is not being trans whatever that is the pathology but rather "delusional", "schizophrenic" etc. before 86. After 1986 the pathology was significant distress and impairment.
    "Never forget the many ways there are to be human" (The Transsexual Taboo)

  18. #118
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    I'll give it some thought, as I find the point interesting. At first blush, I'm inclined to say the distinction may not be as great as it appears. Early psychiatric thinking was fixated on the idea of "reactions" causing conditions. So while the condition might be described as, say, a neurosis, the etiology was often the very same things now conceptualized into "clinical impairment."
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  19. #119
    Silver Member Starling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frances View Post
    Gender therapists prodding transitioners is a little weird for me too. I know they exist and people talk about them on this very forum...
    The gender therapist I finally went to, after years of misery and many months of heightened knowledge and self-awareness achieved through both research and participation in this website, is definitely a facilitator rather than gatekeeper. She accepted quite readily my self-assessment and sent me to an informed-consent gender clinic, which in turn put me on HRT and the transition track. In retrospect, I might have benefitted from working with a more challenging therapist, if only to temper my urgency with greater preparation and medical intervention.

    My brief experience with HRT was overwhelmingly positive on an emotional level; but I was so determined to make up for lost time that I got ahead of myself, in terms of both my relationships and my health; and the result was an abruptly aborted transition, and an humiliating retreat from what I knew to be true about myself. I'm still as sure as the day I lovingly applied my first estradiol patch that I would be happier living as a woman.

    So mark me down as a non-transition-regretter. I don't know if I'll ever recover the optimism and joy I felt before my crash, or forget the awful letdown that accompanied it. I make it from day to day now, but I live without true hope or joy.

    Perhaps this is how I must feel, in order once more to be willing to risk everything, including my life--which I feel slipping away, regardless.

    Lallie

    PS: I won't bump myself off, as I'm too "responsible" for that.
    Time for a change.

  20. #120
    trans punk Badtranny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeaP View Post
    Misty,

    How do I reconcile...
    I don't see the problem. I was an unhappy dude, but I wasn't unhappy AS a dude. Or at least I didn't think so. The important part of that quote is referencing the clothes I was wearing. I never had an issue with my clothes or presenting as a man, and I never hated my penis either. My dangling bits NEVER defined me, so that wasn't my issue. I've been pretty open about my dysphoria peaking before puberty and then after that, I spent many years trying to prove I was a man. As it turned out, my genitals weren't the issue, it was how I looked and how people treated me that was the real issue. The big 'reveal' didn't happen until I started doing the work. I thought I was gay, so I came out as gay. It wasn't long before I realized I had some much deeper issues. This is what I refer to as the "hard work" of transition. It's the self discovery and then the honesty with yourself followed by honesty with the world. It is extremely difficult to admit that "they" were right all along. All the bullies that called me a bitch and a fag would really get a laugh if they found out that I was transitioning right? These are the guys that taught me to fight every time I heard the word sissy. I would rather take a beating than let them think I was weak, and now here I am changing my name to Melissa and getting boobs installed.

    I did not want to be this way. My life was a sham because I fought it for so long but at the end of the day, I am what I am, and my transition is not in danger because I know I did everything I could to avoid it. When I came to the 'decision', I didn't come in fear or hysterics, I came with resolve and courage. By the time I came out I honestly didn't give a shit about what anybody thought. Nobody here and nobody out there. I swear to you that if you are even the least bit swayed by anyone here, then you will never be able to come out at work much less transition in real time. Dealing with the likes of me ain't shit compared to dealing with the real world if you've been acting like a macho jerk for 30+ years.

    I'm a construction manager with a nearly 20 year career. I'm still working and still kicking ass AFTER transition. Life is never easy for a tranny, but if you can't deal with the bitches on this forum than you would never make it in my world.
    Quote Originally Posted by STACY B
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  21. #121
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    I'm really sick and tired of all the negativity and doom and gloom. Yes there is such thing as engaging in fantasy. There is also such thing as engaging in worst case scenarios, doom and gloom prophecies. If we pre-occupy ourselves with doom and gloom we will always be miserable. Can we seriously stop all the doom and gloom talk?

    I feel like our motives for transition end up in a catch 22.

    If you hate being a man and transition, then you're just a failure as a man.
    If you don't hate being a man and would feel happier as a woman, then you're just a cross-dresser engaging in fantasy.

    Where's the happy medium? Is there one? Is there even such a thing as a valid reason to transition? Am I supposed to hate being a man and not hate being a man at the same time? Am I supposed to feel neutral about being a man and neither like nor hate it? This is all nonsense. I think it's time we start trusting our own intuitions. This is what my therapist is trying to help me to do, and it's paid off. Hint: I had dreams or premonitions of each of the past several earthquakes we've had recently. We had two big ones, and several smaller ones. I've had some sort of premonition of each one so far.

    There are two sides to every coin. There is so much misinformation and contradictory information out there. It gets confusion when I read two ideas that contradict each other. It makes it difficult to tell which one is the truth. For me, the truth is I knew when I was 5 - my intuition told me at age 5 that I am a girl, and I've tried fighting it all my life, and am still fighting it, and am finding that I feel way better when I am dressed as a female.

    My intuition sensed several earthquakes recently before they all happened. Gees, should I dare make a bold prediction about an upcoming earthquake that I seriously hope does not come true?

    Edit:
    Here's why I really don't think many people who shouldn't transition would actually transition.
    1. Gatekeeping
    2. It's expensive
    3. Most of us doubt ourselves to begin with
    4. Nobody really wants to be TS
    5. Most of us try to bargain for either being a cross-dresser, a failure as a man, or a gay man, or even to be a non-CDing straight alpha male
    6. There are far more people who regret NOT transitioning than those who regret transitioning, probably by a factor of 1000
    7. There are far more people who commit suicide rather than those who regret transition, probably by a factor of 1000
    8. There are far more people who regret NOT transitioning EARLIER than those who regret transitioning, probably by a factor of 1000
    9. Charles Kane was a rich guy who BRIBED the doctors to let HIM transition
    10. A legit site about sex change regrets suggested that two of the fetishists could have still had successful transitions if they focused on social transition and FFS instead of SRS
    11. Christian fundamentalists have an agenda against trans people
    12. There is a FAR better chance of an earthquake happening than someone regretting transition
    Last edited by Michelle789; 04-04-2014 at 01:46 AM. Reason: 12 reasons
    I've finally mastered the art of making salads. My favorite is a delicious Mediterranean salad.

  22. #122
    Resist
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    Regarding gloom and doom:

    Some of it is just that - angry people justifying the weight of their world in a zero-risk arena by going off on rants about how horrible the world has treated them because they are TS. Conversely, some of it is simply unadorned advice freely offered by people who have perspective and clarity from having transitioned well or are actively transitioning as well as they can, and who have learned (not fought against) their experiences in the very unforgiving, real world. If anyone is in this TS forum looking for information to help understand yourself, then ignore the former and listen very closely to the latter. Being TS is a bitch, but it's not nearly as bad as fooling oneself that you are TS and that transitioning will fix you. It won't. If you realize that you are in fact not a woman after proclaiming to everyone that you are it will almost certainly destroy what's left of your tattered social reputation and brand you as a nutcase (which is actually worse than being TS!). Take small steps, but make them meaningful and if you arrive at the point where you must make a leap of faith, then make it from a position of being as informed as you possibly can be, from reputable sources.

    There's something else, that I suspect many others feel also - It's very tiring reading reams of nonsense from people who put forth their opinions of what it means to be TS and/or what they know about transitioning as truth and fact, when they have not taken active steps to become authentic with themselves and the outside world. Living in one's head, hypothesizing and espousing theories of being a woman, and not truly exploring what it feels like to actually live as yourself in this world will keep you in a never-ending cycle of questioning, doubt, and suffering.

    If you are in this place, as almost all transitioned women here have been themselves for a period of time (where do you think this experience comes from :^), then please question away to your heart's content, but FFS listen to the replies from those who know! Be prepared for advice that you might not like very much, but it's likely that advice will enable you to help you help yourself the most.
    Last edited by gonegirl; 04-04-2014 at 03:14 AM. Reason: grammar

  23. #123
    Silver Member Starling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badtranny View Post
    My life was a sham because I fought it for so long but at the end of the day, I am what I am...
    I don't think any way of getting along in life can be called a sham if it represents your best efforts to thrive, despite your conflicts. Even if you are less than forthcoming about the emotional turmoil within, as long as you honor your values and are capable of being a true friend and a sensitive lover, your life has a core of truth and cannot be dismissed as fake.

    That it does not fulfill your own highest desires for yourself does not, I believe, mean your life is counterfeit or worthless, especially to those you have touched.

    Lallie
    Time for a change.

  24. #124
    Silver Member Rogina B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badtranny View Post

    I'm a construction manager with a nearly 20 year career. I'm still working and still kicking ass AFTER transition. Life is never easy for a tranny, but if you can't deal with the bitches on this forum than you would never make it in my world.
    Once the "mean girl" has kicked the "boys" around,and got them "directed"...At least they have something to talk about in the trucks on the way to the jobsites! Love it!
    It SURE is my hair ! I have the receipt and the box it came in !

  25. #125
    Silver Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starling View Post
    I don't think any way of getting along in life can be called a sham ...
    That it does not fulfill your own highest desires for yourself does not, I believe, mean your life is counterfeit or worthless, especially to those you have touched.
    Lallie, this is so much more than that. Misty used the word – hollow – that expresses it very well. This has nothing (or should have nothing) to do with aspirations. There are many ways of expressing this narrow, restricted way of living within yourself. One is the cliché about being trapped in a man's body. Another is imprisonment. Another is hollowness. Yet another a false persona or shell. All of them describe a fundamental, culturally reinforced inability to live openly in the real world. It gradually kills the spirit to the point where, when you die inside, you either give up or choose to literally stop living.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michelle789 View Post
    ... Can we seriously stop all the doom and gloom talk?

    ...
    Here's why I really don't think many people who shouldn't transition would actually transition. ...
    There's another point with the gloom and doom talk, as you put it. And there is a nuance to your comment about transitioning that many miss.

    The "negativity" to which you are reacting is something I prefer to call reality. From my perspective, it's needed, consistently. I struggle with keeping myself there. So it plays a role for the TS members like me.

    On the flipside, the portrayal of the realities of transition serves the purpose of discouraging the non-transsexuals who flock here. (Please don't confuse those at issue here with the non-TS members who are here constructively.) I understand your comment about the natural barriers to transition and agree, certainly enough for the point. Still, the starkness of some of this discussion is needed to cut through the level of noise, confused advice, and irrelevance that the non-TS introduce to many substantive transition discussions. This is a transsexual forum. Uninformed opinions and opinions about things that have not been experienced are almost always unhelpful. I am transsexual yet I tend to speak strongly only on things that I've experienced thus far. I try to limit my contributions on topics further down the path to more academic commentary.

    Sidenote: I was chatting with my wife about regrets the other day. She made an comment along similar lines to yours above – that the regrets rate is low because those who do regret kill themselves! It's an interesting perspective. I've never seen any commentary about it specifically in the terms of SRS regrets. I'd like to see some statistics, including trending on post-SRS suicide incidence versus SRS incidence. Perspective on suicide timing versus SRS would be interesting also.
    I am older than I once was,
    And younger than I'll be. ...
    After changes upon changes
    We are more or less the same;
    After changes we are more or less the same.

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