Yelled at from a car while out today.

[Eryn]

There seems to have been an issue with timing...the guy was driving away and a one word reply was all Jason could do....

My point was that lowering oneself to the same level as the drive-by shouter has no upside other than a momentary sense of one-upsmanship. Shouting back has several possible downsides. An dangerous downside might occur if the shouter happened to have one or two equally intolerant friends along. Escalating the situation could easily lead to the car stopping, a face-to-face encounter with the angered occupants, and an unflattering story in tomorrow's news. A lesser downside of responding is that it tells the shouter that you heard what he said and it had the desired effect of hurting you. This encourages him to continue his behavior. Leaving the shouter doubting whether he was understood is better in the long run.

Young GGs have to put up with catcalls from passing autos fairly often and they quickly learn that the best response is no response.

[reb.femme]

Hi Jason,

You can't beat a piece of drive by bravado. How did you know his ass was dumb though?

Rebecca

[sandra-leigh]

I'm sure that calling that person "dumb***" made him stop, reconsider his position on LGBT issues, and develop a whole new attitude toward us.

And if Jason had ignored the person, the driver was going to stop himself and say "Wow, the fag ignored the insult so well, maybe those LGBT people aren't so bad after all; I should reconsider my yells" ?

When I was around grade 5, a kid from another school kept bullying me. He didn't know me other than by sight, but he would insult me, be pushy, call me "fag", and so on. I tried ignoring him, but he just stepped up his bullying. He was a bigger kid and a year ahead of me. His bullying occurred in parks where the only "authority" was the police. He had no respect for me.

Eventually I got tired of the situation. So one day, I went alone to a park area that I knew he would pass through soon, and waited (not long.) I told him that I didn't know why he was bullying me, but since he was obviously not going to stop, that I was challenging him to a fight. He didn't apologize or explain; he said, "Okay". I took my glasses off and put them aside, asked him if he was ready, and he said yes; when then fought (by hand). I didn't have experience fighting; my body was not a "fighter's body", my arm muscles were not well developed; I was smaller and lighter and younger and less experienced than he was. But I wasn't a push-over. In time he tired me and pinned me, and I conceded the fight; he was tired himself and he accepted and helped me up. And invited me over to his house. We became friends.

I could have been hurt, yes. I took that risk. What I did not do was allow him to continue bullying without a challenge, did not accept the idea that if he was going to bully that I should just grit my teeth and take it. I made it clear to him that it was not acceptable, not angrily but still in terms that he could understand and respect. In turn, to him, I stopped being "just someone to push around": I became an equal, someone who was not afraid of him -- brave, even, considering his obvious advantages.

I am not, in relating the above, promoting violence: I am pointing out that some people consider ignoring provocation to be a weakness, an indication that you will not struggle because "you know you deserve it" or because "you know you are powerless". A return insult can thus be a signal that you "have some spirit". There is, yes, a risk, especially in a gang area, that the other person might feed a need to "show you who is boss". Sometimes you need to "earn a little respect"

[Farrah]

Some people are idiots. He probably did that because, he hasn't built up the courage to come out dressed!...I sure you looked amazing!

[tracigirl_tv]

....and let us not forget the positive experience with the gentleman at Rite-Aid. So the tally is one positive, one negative.

Funny how the negative experience always stands out (funny = peculiar).

Thank you for sharing this, Jason.

hugs,

Traci

[Momarie]

Absolutely Erin.
As a woman, it's scary but the best thing to do is to ignore it.
And not give them the power to know it's unsettling to you.
Only a man would invite confrontation in that kind of situation.

[PaulaQ]

@Jason - please be really careful and aware of your surroundings hon. There are men who will assault you because they don't understand you. This has happened to friends of mine. The minute you put on a dress, your normal "I'm a dude - don't F*** with me" aura is just gone. And some insecure and hateful people will do a lot worse things to you than call you names.

If you are going to be out, some self-defense training is not a bad investment of your time and money, in my opinion.

[sandra-leigh]

Only a man would invite confrontation in that kind of situation.

All of the participants of the Women's Liberation marches must have been male, because women would not have invited confrontation??

The topic is sometimes referred to as "street harassment" and it is a big problem. If you search you will find many internet sites in which active reaction by what appear to be women are described, and resistance strategies are discussed. Are we to understand that those are really men in disguise?

[mechamoose]

Small mind is small.

You were just more than he could handle, honey! Offer him a tissue.

- MM

[Eryn]

Only a man would invite confrontation in that kind of situation.

All of the participants of the Women's Liberation marches must have been male, because women would not have invited confrontation??

Sandra-Leigh, I emphasized in bold font the part of Momarie's post that you apparently overlooked.

We must pick our battles, and only a fool picks a battle without being in a position of strength. The marching feminists you mention were in a position of strength.

[Momarie]

Thank you Erin.
That's exactly what I meant ~ being in a position of strength.

[sandra-leigh]

We must pick our battles, and only a fool picks a battle without being in a position of strength. The marching feminists you mention were in a position of strength.

I personally witnessed protests of about 5 women, and of about 10 women. That second one was single-file, signs held up in hands (and so not ready for defense). The only "strength" in their position was that assaulting them was technically illegal, even if not as illegal (then) as assaulting a male. Not that there was any police protection available. For a couple of those 5-women protests, the police where there not to protect the women but to take them into custody as soon as they did something illegal like touching one of the cars driving through the protest group.

You apparently overlooked my reference to street harassment, and the link there to a project to resist it -- including by yelling back. Are all those women "fools" ? You and Momarie are dangerously close to using a "No True Scotsman" argument.

[Ladynlingerie]

There are a-holes everywhere. don't let it get you down. Put on your big girl heels and move on...

[Eryn]

I personally witnessed protests of about 5 women, and of about 10 women....

How does a group of five protesters, each of whom has the others for support and who are within the sight of authorities, compare to a lone woman on the street confronting someone who has already proven that he is hostile toward her?

The worst thing that could happen to the protesters is that they are taken into custody if they violate the law. They each have the others and all the onlookers as witnesses if anything illegal occurs.

The lone woman has no support and no witnesses. She could very well end up dead with her attacker completely unknown.

Are you sure you still want to advocate an aggressive approach from such a weak position? This might encourage someone to make a decision that will end her life.

I read your links about street harassment. The Hollaback website says:

We don’t ever want you to get hurt trying to help someone. Always think about safety and consider possibilities that are unlikely to put you in harm’s way (e.g., calling 911, getting a group together, etc.)

Apparently they also acknowledge that safety comes first.

[Momarie]

A True Scotsman might take such a aggressive approach...
But a lone woman on foot in heels and a dress wouldn't.

[Jason+]

Kind of hard to tell from still pictures, but IMO he passes better than some genetic women Ive seen.

By the way, nice outfit, Jason. I especially like the shoes.

Andy, thank you for the compliment I do like those!

I'm sure that calling that person "dumb***" made him stop, reconsider his position on LGBT issues, and develop a whole new attitude toward us.

Or, perhaps next time he will rise to your challenge with physical assault.

Angering stupid people is seldom wise.

How does he know my voltage regulator isn't one "fag" away from tripping off line?

Instead of responding in kind I could have asked if felt that way all over or just in spots. Lorileah's tongue in cheek solution might actually have worked better. Maybe I could have invited him to the Tilted Kilt which was next to the Payless in the shopping mall and discussed it over a beer. Chances are the kind of person willing to accept such an offer and possibly learn from the encounter isn't the same type who would shout things out of a car in passing.

Absolutely Erin.
As a woman, it's scary but the best thing to do is to ignore it.
And not give them the power to know it's unsettling to you.
Only a man would invite confrontation in that kind of situation.

And as a person, man or woman, sometimes you need to speak up within the boundaries of your personal safety. Would I have responded differently if it was 2:00 am outside a bar in downtown Los Angeles and our vocalist wasn't the only one in his vehicle? Assuming I'd already made the string of mistakes necessary to be there by myself I would like to think I have the presence of mind to adjust my response but after all I am a man.

A True Scotsman might take such a aggressive approach...
But a lone woman on foot in heels and a dress wouldn't.

I'm Irish, English, and Welsh with some Scot thrown in the mix if you listen to my grandmother. What that effectively means is that the only thing 2/3 of me agree on is they hate the other 1/3. I am not 5' 2", 120 lbs or a woman. Without heels I'm 5' 11" and more than I'd like to admit past double 120 lbs. With heels I'm 5' 11" plus the height of two weapons of opportunity. This also could be patently "man" thinking but I have to work with what I am.

I am not implying that the way I handled it was the best I could have or advocating for rising to every challenge issued. I also can't accept the basic tenet that quietly ignoring catcalls and insults is just part of being a woman and should be accepted as almost a right of passage. Women and Men are both worth more than that.

[Vickie_CDTV]

Aggravating a bad situation is always a bad idea, you never know what people are capable of today. This isn't Happy Days and 2 guys who have a disagreement may not just put up their dukes, throw a few punches and call it a day. There are plenty of insane people today, living in a time where human life means very little and you never know what someone is capable of. If you can let it go, why not let it go? Why put yourself in a riskier situation if you don't have to?