for those who are married

[Jaylyn]

I have to agree with Lorileah on both her post. I concur that we have a very little time in this world and we should just enjoy the time we have. My wife and I agreed from the start that we'd never keep a secret from each other ( exception is presents) that agreement has got us thru many stormy times. Marriage is tough to say the least but with the love we have for each other it can be the greatest thrill we have. Just knowing we have each other's backs in our older ages makes every thing much more comfortable.

[Cheryl Ann Owens]

Let's suppose that crossdressing is not part of the formula. ANY relationship whether a marriage or simple friendship, is based on communication. For any relationship to succeed, there has to be honesty and trust no matter how dark the shared secrets are. Then comes acceptance for what is shared. If a relationship counterpart can accept what the other discloses about themselves, then the relationship becomes a firm bond. Our CDing pales in comparison to what others might share about themselves with another. Yes it becomes more intense where the committment of marriage is involved because each partner has certain expectations of the other. Trust and honesty can easily become the deal breaker if the relationship will succeed.

Cheryl

[DebbieL]

I didn't tell my first wife until after we had moved in together, and she had fallen in love with me. She liked that I was gentle, patient, kind, and a generous lover. As a result, she seemed to accept as long as we kept it at home in the bedroom, as a special treat. Later, I found out that she had never been comfortable with the dressing, but loved who I was as a person, mostly BECAUSE I had such a feminine and submissive personality. She liked the girl inside, but was uncomfortable with the wardrobe. Even after we got divorced, there were a few times when she would say "Why did I divorce you" and I would grin and say "wardrobe problem?".

After that, I was out. I ended up meeting a few women who were bisexual, and they LOVED having a guy who worked and was a geek in the office all day, then came home, put on her pretty clothes, cooked dinner, helped put the kids to sleep, and then gave them the pleasures and sensuality they liked from women. Even their lesbian girlfriends would tell me they loved that I was a lesbian in almost every way. For the lesbians, the issue was the half inch between my legs. However, once they realized that I related to it more as a clit, often keeping it hidden under tight panties, that wasn't a problem.

After a 15 year long distance relationship with a bisexual who was very supportive and loved playing with Debbie, at home or in public, we realized that we both wanted more, and couldn't find it together. The love was still there even to the end.

Then I met Lee on match.com. I had put pictures of Debbie and Rex on my profile, including the front picture of me in a top hat. She saw the pictures of Debbie and sent me an e-mail that said "Dude, you're wearing a dress, what's that about". I wrote here a detailed message explaining that I was transsexual, that I had lied to my first wife and it caused a lot of pain for both of us, so this time I was going to be honest about it up front.

Lee showed my profile to her daughter, who was in College. She said "Well mom, you won't have to worry about hurting his fragile male ego when you start taking charge of it". Lee told me what her daughter said, and I laughed, saying "you're daughter is a very wise and brilliant woman, like her mother". We spent 2 weeks talking on the phone before our first face-to-face meeting. The turning point for Lee was when we went to the beach and she lost her key. Her first husband would have gone ballistic, but I smiled and said 'Let's go find some flashlights!". We didn't find the keys so I said "I can think of three options, we can go back to my house and come back tomorrow, I can book a hotel a few miles away and we can come back tomorrow, or we could sleep in the car, which would YOU like to do?".
That's when she decided "She's a keeper".

She knew that in the ideal world, I wanted to transition, but there were so many logistics issues. She was concerned about what her father and her brother might do or say when they found out (not IF), and she didn't want to start a firestorm at church, but we regularly went out as Debbie and Lee. I struggled with my weight and Lee did insist that I stop "dressing like a ****". She had me watch several episodes of "What Not to Wear" with her, and eventually, when I lost about 80 lbs, we actually did the whole "What not to wear" scene. We went through my wardrobe and ended up thowing about 95% of it out. It was hard to let go of many fond memories, but I had boy clothes I purchased in the early 1970s, and girl clothes I bought in the early 1980s. It was time to let the clothes go.

Then Lee took me shopping, and helped me pick out a wardrobe that was age appropriate, size appropriate, and situation appropriate. We spent about $500 on the first trip and I was a bit of a brat. Then I went on a road trip and went shopping at the mall in one of those outfits. I didn't get read by ANYBODY, even the teenage girls or the little kids. I actually experienced the FREEDOM of being ME in public without fear of exposure and humiliation.

In the bedroom, Lee realized almost immediately that Rex was asexual, not responding much at all, but Debbie was VERY responsive. I won't go into the details, but when she came to my place for our first night together and I was able to please her without using what was between my legs, and was so easy to please as Debbie, she realized that she liked Debbie a lot in the bedroom.

When my father died, I decided I wanted to transition. Lee got a bit freaked about that, but when we went to the therapist together so she could assess my family situation Lee said "I'm not a lesbian". The therapist didn't argue, just asked what we did together, what she LIKED about what we did together, and then asked "have you had similar experiences with men?". Suddenly the lights went on and she said "Oh my god, I've found the perfect girl for me".

When I started growing breasts, Lee found out that I didn't have to be dressed to be Debbie. I was much more responsive, and she found that I really enjoyed it when she was sexually aggressive, when she would "sweep me off my feet". She loves that she can create passion whenever she wants it, but at the same time, I can be very seductive and mischievous in my own ways. At the same time, if she doesn't want to do anything, she knows all she has to do is offer to cuddle and I'll just snuggle right into her, usually with her behind me and holding me.

When her friends ask her how she feels about that, she says "Debbie is so happy now, and she loves to make me happy, and I like her so much more than I liked Rex". As for family and friends at church, they like Debbie much more too. Rex was like a character in a play, intellectual, hiding feelings, and avoiding almost any personal feelings or information. Even when Lee's mother died and my father died, I appeared almost cold. Lee knew that as Debbie, I was crying frequently, even struggling with the loss, and grieving, but Rex was like a suit of armor.

When Debbie came to Thanksgiving, the family liked her so much that Debbie got all the Christmas presents, which thrilled me, I even broke down crying because I was so happy when they mentioned it. At church, friends had seen me grow my hair longer, laser my face, and become more feminine in many subtle ways, and Lee told them about Debbie. When Debbie finally showed up, men and women hugged me and welcomed me like I was a member of their family. The minister even preached sermons on acceptance and diversity, on giving up old traditional beliefs, the good Samaritan, Mathew 25, and so on.

[Lorileah]

Erin, you are fairly new here but this has been discussed many many times before. NOT saying anything and keeping it hidden is a recipe for tears and hurt feelings. Look at it from a spouses point of view. You are keeping a secret. You are 1) not trusting them to make a decision of their own. You are playing with their life and their choices. If they are accepting or willing to try, you have already decided they cannot make that decision. You are treating them with less respect. 2) You are not allowing them to either try and live with you, accept you or you are taking years that they could be working toward a different happiness. I call it equity. When you start a new relationship, you don't have a lot invested in it. You don't own a house or car together, you have separate bank accounts. No children, no in-laws. If at that point you decide you cannot accept something the other has you can walk away rather easily. You have the chance to make a happy life elsewhere. Now if you keep this a secret for whatever reason you rationalize, you start to build things that have substance. A house, money Children whatever and you have a spouse who built that whole relationship on something they didn't have all the facts to. So of course your SO is going to be angry, hurt, vindictive. You have children to consider, the years she gave up to make and keep your marriage. You don't give her the chance to decide so you are treating her as being less than mature.

Now I understand that many here think they can put it away, keep it under wraps. I get that, we have all tried it. Most will fail and then it will arise. She finds a piece of clothing, makeup, smells a perfume, sees the mascara on your face, whatever. First thought, you are cheating. Now you try and explain your being TG. She isn't in the mood to listen and you can be the best salesperson in the world, she will shut you out until the anger is less. Now she can think about how she was in a relationship based on false information for X years. You get this out early, you booth can build a new life easier/ If not..well that's where lawyers get involved.

You talk about her not listening. So you gave up. Thinking what? You won't do it anymore? Did that work? When the rubber meets the road you are going to say "Hey I tried to tell you." and that will go over real well while she throws the vase at you. Now you not only withheld information you have accused her of not listening and being closed minded. You had the talk and she didn't listen you say. You know what she thinks now? You gave it up. She thinks it was a speed bump. But now that speed bump is a pothole.

So you have to get the ground rules set and keep trying to set them OR you need to walk away from dressing and stay away. Which is easier? You decide

[Alice Torn]

I cannot imagine ever being married, whether a CD or not. I was shocked to see that the majority on here, are in fact , married!! All the women i have tried to date, were very turned off, when i came out and told them, and i have never had any chance for marriage. I find it quite remarkable, that many women tolerate it.

[Allison2006]

My wife is very supportive, often encouraging me to dress. And while I don't know if I'd say she's intrigued with any of it, she does enjoy going on shopping trips together and talking clothes, shoes and makeup with me.

[Jocelyn Quivers]

After so much time, it's not so much as likes or finds fascinating in my case. I think it's that my wife accepts this as being who I am, in it's just a normal part of our marriage. Ex when it's a private at home romantic dinner while in girl mode, it's just accepted as normal, same as sharing/borrowing clothes normal, make up, etc. It's the love that me and my wife have for each other that causes the gender issues to kind of moot bordering irrelevant point. As long as girl mode is not 24/7 which is a fair enough compromise.

[sabrinaedwards]

This has been a most interesting post, especially the responses from the GG's. I read all of them and learned from them. I am in a DADT relationship regarding CDing. In defence of my wife, I did not reveal my secret until well into our marriage. I respect my wife's position and have not violated that agreement. I do think she would be shocked at my level of involvement with CDing.

[Kimberly Ann]

Cheryl,
I agree that being married to a CD is a treat. My SO is very sweet and gentle and I attribute a lot of his softer characteristics and mannerisms to his inner girl. I do not tell him when to dress. He can dress as much and as often as he likes, but is hindered somewhat by the fact that we have three children that still live at home and do not know about the CDing. The only time I really say no to the CDing is if we are trying to be intimate and I'm just not feeling it with him dressed. This rarely happens as I usually enjoy it and feel like it adds to my pleasure. My SO shares a lot of posts with me as well (he is on here way more than I am) and some of them are gut wrenching to me. I do not understand how someone could love their SO and not embrace something that is such a huge part of who they are. There are so many positives to being loving and accepting and very few negatives....at least that is my experience. The bond that I feel with my SO is one that I didn't even know was possible. We have complete love, respect and trust in each other. We share our deepest secrets and desires...things that we have never shared with anyone else. I wouldn't change a thing if I could. I just wish everyone else could be as lucky as we are.
Kim

[MissTee]

[QUOTE=mechamoose;3609140] Dismissing it as 'just clothes' is selling it/us short.

[/QUOTE.]

It's not selling anything Moose. It's the way she wraps her head around it. I'm OK with that. As I said, we don't get wrapped up in the whys and whats. We just enjoy each other.

[DanaR]

Most wives who are okay with crossdressing are still not enthusiastic about it.

Some find that their husbands are happier, and so they like that.

My feeling is that it's not my place to judge my husband's choices, as long as they don't hurt anyone. But I'm not enthusiastic or intrigued by it in any way, just as a husband usually is not enthusiastic about his wife hanging out in sweat pants.

JessM basically summed it up on how my wife sees it. My wife goes out with me occasionally. She also borrows some of my things from time to time. One of my favorites was that I went out shopping one night and bought an outfit, when I came home she was in bed asleep. The next morning when I got up the outfit was gone, she wore it to work.

[Ashlyn]

I met my wife on a CD site and she was looking for a special girl like me. We are very happy and she is very supportive and encouraging. One day we will renew our vows and I will be wearing the dress this time!!

[clairebostock]

My Wife is OK with me dressing But not enthusiastic about me dressing

[Eringirl]

Hi LoriLeah:

Thanks for your thoughtful comments. I agree with you. Don't get me wrong. Communication is key. One may have to be prepared that it may not go they way they want....it may cause a fire storm. I am now in pause mode....letting the initial wound heal a bit. If I push too hard too fast, that will just be rubbing salt in it. I haven't given up. I am giving myself a bit of time to heal and her a bit of time to think about it. After 30 years together, ya, I know what she is thinking. I have not "given up". But I got pretty beaten up. I need time to recoup and come at this again from a position of strength, not weakness. I am getting better. So no, this is not over, but every relationship is different and requires a different approach, but to your point, and to most everyone here, yes, communication is always a part of that strategy.

Thanks for caring enough to comment...

Erin

[JudySinNY]

Great board everyone! I'm fairly new to this world and my BF would marry me tomorrow if I said yes lol...so I felt qualified to read and post here! I'm in the processing phase and assimilating. It's going well overall. Stellar to hear him tell it. Mentally I'm good to go. It's just wrapping my brain around the visual that's still a work in progress. Full femme? No problem. Slap a skirt on a guy with a 5:00 shadow? That's taking some getting used to. I'm determined though. I'll keep reading and absorbing the varied viewpoints and it will all fall into place. That's my plan.
Nice to meet you all!

[MatildaJ.]

@JudySinNY, I'm the opposite. I don't mind my husband wearing whatever clothes he wants -- sweats, bathrobe, negligee, kilt, maxi-dress, whatever. But I get emotional some times when he puts on the full outfit, including makeup and wig, because it feels like he disappears and a different person shows up, a person I don't know. But then I've known my husband for decades, and only met his other side last year, so it's not that surprising that I feel more comfortable with him than with "her." Do you feel that you're dating two people (a man and a woman), or can you see the same person inside, regardless of the presentation?

As far as your issue with skirt + stubble, I don't have much advice except to accept that he's an adult who is going to wear what he likes, and his choices don't reflect on you in any way, so you don't have to have an opinion about them.

[JudySinNY]

@jess, I'm trying to figure that out. I watched him transform the whole way from foundation on up. Still him. Once the wig was on? Still him but....not? I was fascinated. He looked good! I expected a glorified reaction to the lesser transformations but that didn't happen. But honestly, I love the person. Just adapting to the presentation I guess.

[Stephanie47]

Alice, I believe one has to realize this forum is representative of a very small segment of the cross dressing community. In my mind that also excludes gender identity/transition issues and gay relationships. I'm strictly addressing those of us who wear women's clothing without those issues. The only cross dressing revelation that I know of in my local circle of friends, acquaintances and neighbors ended up in divorce.

I believe, and, the GG's can correct me if I am wrong, the marriages that do survive the revelation of cross dressing are those where the wife realizes her husband's other qualities far outweigh whatever negative connotations cross dressing may have for them.

I cannot imagine ever being married, whether a CD or not. I was shocked to see that the majority on here, are in fact , married!! All the women i have tried to date, were very turned off, when i came out and told them, and i have never had any chance for marriage. I find it quite remarkable, that many women tolerate it.

[Kris Avery]

I agree that being married to a CD is a treat. I just wish everyone else could be as lucky as we are.
Kim

I have saved my 400th post to celebrate and reveal to those who pay attention....

You are "my treat", my partner on the journey of life, you are my everything.... you are my SO..... you are MY Kimberly Ann ....and you are loved more than you know.

Awe, hugs.... two very lucky, happy, but majorly clueless women

[sometimes_miss]

One thing I have noticed when reading this forum is that some CDers feel like CDing is something they are going to do no matter what and they don't care what their SO thinks. I think if you start off with that attitude, then you are fighting a losing battle. There has to be some compromise on the part of both people involved.

And there lies the problem. I think most women consider crossdressing to be just a hobby that we indulge in from time to time; something we can give up whenever we like, and take up something else like knitting or such, with as much ease as someone changing from eating vanilla ice cream to chocolate. It's not that way at all. Not even remotely. And the above quote would probably be pretty much agreed on by all women, that we have no right to do it, it's just a privilege that a woman allows us to do. And I wonder, how they would feel if we told them what they were and were not allowed to wear? Didn't that cause a whole sexual revolution last century? Yeah, I thought so.

CDers feel like CDing is something they are going to do no matter what and they don't care what their SO thinks

It's not that we don't care what you think. It's that we know that we aren't going to be able to stop crossdressing, no matter what anyone thinks. Here's a thought, GG's who believe that we can quit any time we want: Are you able to stop menstruating on demand? (assuming you are of the age group that does). Think about how you'd go about stopping that for a moment. Should be easy, just change the way your brain works. Because a female brain does influence menstruation, regulating all the other hormones, for example, if you lose too much weight you wind up in amenorrhea. Because, basically you're telling us to change our brains. If only it were so easy.
For a lot of us, it's something deeply ingrained into who and what we are; it's not something we do, it's what we are. I can't directly speak for anyone else; but it's as much burned into my personality as is the tendency to intervene in a fight between a man and a woman even if it's a sure thing that I might get killed doing so.
We're crossdressers. Not female impersonators. There is a distinct difference. One has to; the other wants to.

[JudySinNY]

@sometimes_miss....I don't have any feedback really on this except I appreciate the perspective and would love to hear more like this. Kinda grounds things more in a way? Idk. Anyway thanks!

[suchacutie]

My wife and I spent parts of last week looking for a new wig for Tina. That togetherness pretty much sums up our relationship: together.

We found Tina together, and were completely surprised that she existed. Tina is a mutual adventure; a joint husband/wife project. Why did my wife go down this road? Initially the curiosity we both had led us to investigate who this Tina person is/was. After all, we had been married 33 years at that point. We immediately started conversations about how we grew up, and just expanded from there.

What came out of it: We know each other so much better. She knows I started looking into myself right in front of her, exposing every potentially embarrassing or vulnerable thought. She helped understand that I already had both gender behaviors inside from the start, so it made sense to her to separate and identity them the best we could. Along the way she taught Tina the trappings and emotionality of growing up as a girl.

Tina is her girlfriend, not her husband. She knows how much more I understand about her because of Tina. When she'd like a night with her girlfriend to talk and watch chick flicks, she asks if Tina would like to visit. We constantly talk about makeup, clothes, shoes, etc. We diet together, get facials, shop, and she tells me Tina is so sweet. I'm a classic "fix it" male when it comes to problem issues. The Tina part now understands that there are times my wife wants to talk about a problem and I know enough to invoke Tina at those times so we can just talk (even if I don't transform).

Didn't mean for this to be so long, but, as you can see, Tina has had quite an effect and is very much a part of who we are.

[sometimes_miss]

Tina is her girlfriend, not her husband.

Which makes me wonder, if you preserve the so called two personalities because SHE needs you to, or because you both can't accept that you have female personality traits that neither of you can accept. Not because there are actually two personalities within yourself, because it doesn't come across that way at all; what does, is that you've had this all along, but weren't comfortable allowing it to surface. No surprise, really, considering that virtually all women won't accept it in 'their man' (see the related thread about how many GG's find their mate's crossdressing either acceptable or 'intriguing': Virtually none, considering how many women are supposedly here, and how of many of them actually took the time to chime in to support their crossdressing mates).
Suchacutie, you make it sound like Tina is some spirit that you just conjure up on demand. Which is fine. But at some point, perhaps you and your wife will realize that it's all you, and it's all there, all the time, just waiting around to be set free to be 'all' you, all the time. And there's nothing wrong with that. In fact, it's a terrific thing to be able to see, and feel, all the things that both sexes do. It's just a shame that we're criticized for it. Makes you kind of wonder how this human race will ever advance, when we can't even accept other people who have broader capabilities for feeling and/or thought than we do.

[JayeLefaye]

I'm guess I'm one of the lucky ones. I was up-front about it from the very beginning. She freaked a little because she was afraid that I wanted to transition eventually. Once I convinced her that I had no plans to give up my manhood, then the relationship continued.

But we took the dressing slowly. And I would answer any and every question that she asked. I stopped shaving my legs and dressed around the house in simple loungeware, and would occasionally toss on a skirt. Over the course of four years, she had become very comfortable with me not wearing pants around the house. then one day I looked in the mirror and just couldn't stand all the hair. She found me after work in the tub doing a full-body shave, and her reaction was a smile and a "good for you!"

We then progressed to full dressing and going out now and then, but I was never lost in the pink fog, so it just progressed naturely.

As to "What does she like about it?"

She likes the fact that I am still me, regardless of what I'm wearing. The dressing is just an outward way of expressing the feminine side of my nature, and she likes that side, because it is gentle and caring.

She likes doing my make-up, which I only put on when we're going out, and had a real hoot when she bought me a nice blonde wig for my 59th birthday and I suddenly looked 15 years younger.

She likes my legs, especially after a close shave. Last night, I was relaxing on the back porch after a shower and shave and enjoying the breeze on my legs while she was catching up on some work. She finished up, and I went inside and was going to change form the skirt into some sweatpants, for modesty's sake, because I didn't want to flash her while we watched a little TV...She wouldn't let me change out of the skirt, and after a couple of hours of catching up on one of the few shows that we watch, she just couldn't help herself anymore...She really, really, really likes my shaved legs...

She likes the fact that I will listen, truly listen, to anything she has to say, about anything. I'm not her girlfriend, I'm her spouse, but the fact that I acknowledge the feminine within, allows me to remind myself of the gentle side, and she likes having that gentle side in her life.

Jaye

[MatildaJ.]

See the related thread about how many GG's find their mate's crossdressing either acceptable or 'intriguing': Virtually none

But the thread was about how many wives are enthusiastic or find it intriguing. Many of us posted to say that we accept it, just as our husbands accept us hanging around the house in sweatpants. The fact that we're not excited to see our husband's in dresses & wigs doesn't mean we don't accept it.

Actually, isn't that this thread, where the OP asked what is "intriguing" about CDing for SOs?