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Thread: Thanks to other treads...I've had to admit something to myself.

  1. #1
    Junior Member Michelle Deere's Avatar
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    Thanks to other treads...I've had to admit something to myself.

    Here is an except from my most recent blog entry, but I though I might get some feedback here as well.

    As recently as last week, I thought I had things straight in my head. Well not so quick there boy-oh.
    As I read new posts on varying threads over the last number of days, I have found myself going back and forth on a number of issues. I found myself agreeing with one writer, and then agreeing with the next writer who had a slightly different take on the subject. Then agreeing with yet another who saw things differently. Why was I being so indecisive? I obviously still possessed some internal strife, and even though I have written twice before that I thought I had found myself in a nice cozy self-understanding, that is obviously not the case.
    What started it all off was the tread “Not trans? Huh? I don’t get it”. Well here now is my latest line of thinking.

    Admission to self

    *(I know there is no such thing as normal, but you know what I mean)

    “I’m just a normal guy who…” Well, after a lot of thinking and talking to myself while on the treadmill, I now have to admit, I am not a normal guy. I have to acknowledge and affirm that I am transgender. When one has thoughts like “that’s a nice dress. Wonder how I would look in it?” that’s not a “normal guy” thought. When I want to rid my body of hair so I can wear a sleeveless dress and enjoy the feel of pantyhose of bare skin…that’s not what a “normal guy” would do. I LOVE beer, chips and chocolate, “normal guy” stuff. But when thoughts like, “I need to pass on that delectable looking chocolate cheese cake because I don’t want to ruin all the work I have done to trim down to look good in that new dress”, that’s not a “normal guy” thought. Would a “normal” guy push his chest muscles/flesh together to see what kind of cleavage could be achieved or when the office is empty, pull out a nail file and take care of a slight chipped nail so that they will look good next time nail polish is applied to them? I don’t think so.
    I have previously stated, there is “no girl trying to get out” or a “second self”, but then, why do I have these “girly” thoughts. And why, when I dress, do I have this need to portray a womanly image? There is obviously a small portion of my brain that is “female”. Any of these thoughts or activities put my firmly in the transgender category. And because I sometimes dress in the clothing commonly associated with the opposite sex, I am indeed a crossdresser.

    Labels. I’m a ______.

    No one should feel pressured to label themselves and nobody should force a label onto those who don’t want one, but labels may not be all bad.

    So I’ve come full circle and have re-applied labels to myself and I now believe that labels are quite useful. They let those with whom you are conversing know from what objective point you are talking. Obviously though, we have many different labels that we apply to ourselves every day, depending on our surroundings. If I’m at work, the label I am tagged with is “Site Manager”. When with a group of aviation personnel, the label is “Pilot”. If I wandered through a mall and came across a display from a local Model Railroad club, I would tag myself as a “model railroader”. So obviously, in this forum, I bear the labels Transgender /Crossdresser.

    I will stick with the attitude that I will not waste energy or time in search of an answer as to why I do what I do.
    Even though for a long time I have identified myself as being a heterosexual crossdresser and as such, belong under the umbrella term of transgender, I have obviously been scared to admit that I am also actually transgender. It still feels a bit strange to type that and re-read it, but it does feel like a weight has been listed off my chest.

    Let’s see how long it takes before I change my mind…again…
    Some of my thoughts on crossdressing at http://themichelleinme.wordpress.com/
    A repository of Michelle photos at http://www.flickr.com/photos/14176339@N04/

  2. #2
    Ice queen Lorileah's Avatar
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    what if what you like is normal? We place a lot of weight on the middle of the bell curve. The statistical p<.01. Nut this is life not a chemical reaction. You do realize that all you listed , the smooth arms the smooth legs were not female "norms" 100 years ago. They are made up normals. The chocolate thing? Why did you make that a guy norm when women eat as much or more? Don't take this whole thing too seriously. The only thing that should matter is are you happy with who you are? (with the subtitle...and your SO is happy with who you are).

    You are normal. Your temp is 98.6 +/- .5, you breathe air. You eat you love your family you are a good person. You can't get anymore normal than that
    The earth is the mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it.
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    “Love isn't a state of perfect caring. It is an active noun like struggle. To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.” - Fred Rogers,

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    Silver Member Annaliese's Avatar
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    As we learn more about are self's, what we once thought, changes, I have gone from in my teens liking pantyhose and even before that wanting to be a girl, even for a young child you learn fast what is expected of you. I know now I am TS, I have always been a TS, it just that we have to fight all those years of being told, what is expected of us as men.

  4. #4
    stone free mykell's Avatar
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    hi michelle,
    i read that thread and thought i had it figured out, also read the thread "thoughts on transition !!" and something else ticked, and there was one about us all(crossdressers) eventually transitioning. throughout my life i have been in different places with my dressing, so i felt that since ive been here i relate to myself as trans-gendered and when i revealed to my wife that was the end term that i used.
    ....Mykell
    i dressed like a girl and i liked it! crossdressing...theirs an app for that those who deny freedom deserve it not for themselves
    NOBODY gets a pass to blow out someone else's candle in order to make theyre's shine brighter

  5. #5
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    As long as you still feel guilt and shame, your mind will continue to try to protect you from YOURself by considering/accepting all kinds of wild ideas just about as quickly as new ones come along.

    Once you accept the fact you have ZERO control over what pushes your various happy buttons, your CDing life will become much easier and simpler and you won't have the NEED to try to categorize yourself. You will also likely lose the need to "fit in" somewhere.

    You also seem to be under the same silly illusion as many here that only a very tiny percentage do this CDing thing.

    Have any idea how many here ride motorcycles? I DID ask how many here participate in ANY motorcycle Forums. Take a wild guess at what the percentage was. Motorcycle riding is not something many can/try to keep from their SOs, friends, relatives, coworkers, etc. Nothing they are "ashamed of"/need to hide.

    The extrapolation here is a simple one.

    NGC's Brain Games will easily clear much of the confusion of how some are "tormented" by this CDing thing.

    It's also very clear to anyone who READS here. Many come to this Forum and succumb to Forum Think, sometimes with disastrous results.

  6. #6
    Aspiring drama queen Isabella Ross's Avatar
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    Michelle, hello from the other side of the country. I came to a similar conclusion a while ago. I have a powerful need to feel pretty, and to look pretty. Therefore, I reasoned, I am transgendered. No misgivings about giving myself that label. But I'd take it a step further...I'm proud of that label. So much so that I would politely challenge your use of the word "normal". What is normal? In a sense, normal means not unique. Well, there are a lot of transgendered people in the world. Therefore, we are not unique. So, as a group, and because we exist in great numbers, wouldn't we be somewhat normal?
    Last edited by Isabella Ross; 10-20-2014 at 02:30 PM.

  7. #7
    Martini Girl Katey888's Avatar
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    Michelle,

    I think it's a really super thing that any of us can get to both a comfortable degree of self-acceptance and self-understanding with respect to this non-normal thing we do... and I can totally respect anyone else's wish not to have labels if that suits them, or to even crank up their own name for a label if they must, but the important thing for all of us is that we gain some benefit from that understanding and acceptance... sounds very much like you have made progress there, even though that might change over time...

    It's the reason I actively want to see what other folk her think and feel and why I continue to think it's a good thing some of us are prepared to debate it - I am one of those who will likely never stop asking, why?: that's just me, I'm afraid - but I've learnt so much from so many different people here I'm sure I won't stop learning as long as I keep asking...

    I will just say that I agree with your perspective of 'the girl inside'. For some of us it may be true, but I don't feel that distinction - I think it's more of a girly (and possibly slightly effeminate) aspect of me that just needs to be felt and expressed from time to time... more of a blended personality, if you like, that has a more femme or male aspect in the same way I can sometimes be more jovial or sad - no apparent reason; it just comes out that way.

    And may I compliment you on a clear and nicely written piece - if any of this helps anybody you can feel comfortable you've done a useful and good thing!

    Katey x
    "Put some lipstick on - Perfume your neck and slip your high heels on
    Rinse and curl your hair - Loosen your hips, and get a dress to wear"
    Stefani Germanotta

  8. #8
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    If you were to swap the word "typical" for the word "normal" does does the vibe of your message change? With that simple word change, did you become less abnormal?

  9. #9
    Gold Member Alice Torn's Avatar
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    MD, You just gave me an idea. If i ever go out again, and someone asks what i am, i may simply say "Abnormal."
    Last edited by Alice Torn; 10-20-2014 at 01:15 PM.
    IT TAKES A REAL DRESS TO WEAR A MAN.

  10. #10
    Junior Member Michelle Deere's Avatar
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    Thanks everybody for the responses so far.
    @Lorileah. maybe chocolate wasn't a good example...or maybe it was that girly bit reaching out? lol.

    @Jennifer and Bridgette. I agree with you both wrt "what is normal?" I had originally used the word "typical" Jennifer, but I though the use of "normal" might hit home the point I was trying to make and stimulate some thought and discussion.

    @Katey. Thank you. I'll try to interact more with other threads. Up until a few weeks ago, I was just one of these 'readers'.
    Some of my thoughts on crossdressing at http://themichelleinme.wordpress.com/
    A repository of Michelle photos at http://www.flickr.com/photos/14176339@N04/

  11. #11
    Gold Member NicoleScott's Avatar
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    Hypothetical: You are called to court, sworn in, and asked "are you trans?"
    I can't answer. Trans is a prefix. Trans-what? And when that question is answered "transgender", I still don't have enough clarity to answer, because I'm not sure that what you mean by transgender is what I mean by transgender.
    No such problem with most labels (we know what an apple is), but we can't seem to get a handle on trans-something. And we ARE trans-something. And we expect the general public to get a handle on it?

  12. #12
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    As my psychotherapy lecturer told, one of the greatest banes of society is the urge to "normalize" everyone what in turn puts intense stress on those that simply fall out of bounds of those norms.

    I'd say that any label has no good nor bad quality per se, but only what we apply to it. So yes, labels aren't that bad. But then again, no one wants to be judged and that's quite the feel when one hears "you're this and that!"

  13. #13
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    Hi Michelle
    You have written a wonderful post that resonated deeply with me ( though I like model cars). I do the nail thing at my desk, I shave, I have a love of becoming my female self and have no compunction to want to live my life as a woman.
    I guess though that normality is defined bythe set of parameters that are shared by common sample group. If we are therefore a subset of the male sample group I would say you are a normal male.
    On the transgender issue I used to be undecided. Now I'm just not so sure.
    Luv
    Amanda

  14. #14
    Platinum Member Teresa's Avatar
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    Michell,
    Some get pretty uptight about labels but we do need them if we're to understand where we are with our CDing ! What most of us hate are the abusive ones banded about in the public domain !
    My thoughts on transition thread helped me get it clearer in my own mind, as you say seeing it written down does make you think where do I fit in all this ! It clears the head and takes the weight off your chest !

    Just to relate to your model railroad comment, I went to an exhibition looking foward to seeing some N gauge layouts, opened my glasses case, no glasses ! 2mm: ft scale is not the easiest to see without perfect eyesight !

    Amanda, The leader of my art group was a very blunt Yorkshireman, and he often used the phrase about being indecisive now I'm not so sure when a painting wasn't progressing !! Then he'd say , " Get some bloody paint splashed on ! "
    Last edited by Teresa; 10-20-2014 at 02:34 PM.

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    "Normal?" By whose standards? I recall seeing hairly legs on young girls in Europe, back in the early fifties. That was normal. French girls hanging on the the strap in the bus or Metro, with hairy armpits. Normal. I am typing these words wearing a top and my favorite mid length skirt.

    I am normal. I think .

    Ineke

  16. #16
    Silver Member Stephanie Julianna's Avatar
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    When I finally realized that I was transgendered and proud of it, a huge load was lifted off of me. On the other hand, I'll keep that realization to myself. If my loved ones heard that admission they would not understand and think that somehow I had 'changed' when in reality I have always been this person that they have always loved (and ocassionally scratched their heads about). Welcome to the club.

  17. #17
    Vino, Vidi, Vici! Renee Elise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephanie Julianna View Post
    When I finally realized that I was transgendered and proud of it, a huge load was lifted off of me. On the other hand, I'll keep that realization to myself. If my loved ones heard that admission they would not understand and think that somehow I had 'changed' when in reality I have always been this person that they have always loved (and ocassionally scratched their heads about). Welcome to the club.
    Wow I feel exactly the same .

  18. #18
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    Don't try to put yourself into one box or the other you are you plain and simple.
    Trying to figure out who or what you are is only going to make any internal strife you have worse.
    When I shed the need to categorize every part of what I was it all became clear.
    I didn't need to fit into any classification according to some so called gender expert that are only into numbers a pie charts.
    Free your mind and your ass will follow.

    I think those that have so many problems with their gender issues is 1. They aren't willing to accept themselves for what they are.
    2.They delve deep into all the whys and hows trying to find out where they fit in.
    3. They research medical and psychological articles only to fall into a maze of information that has no concrete answers.
    Why is it so hard to just admit something to yourself?
    Last edited by Tracii G; 10-20-2014 at 05:50 PM.

  19. #19
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    You have found a moment of clarity. That's great. It really is. Using a particular label was helpful, so there's no need to get off on tangents about personal definitions.

    You are right, too, that labels can be helpful in communicating with others. If someone what's to quibble about a definition, the solution is to offer your definition and let them offer theirs. That way each knows what the other means, without getting bogged down in pointless debates.

    Easy come, easy go;
    Easy left me long ago...

  20. #20
    Silver Member paulaprimo's Avatar
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    change your mind about what?? what changed now that you labeled yourself "transgender"... probably nothing!
    tracii is right. don't put yourself into a box. be you, be happy, do what you do and don't worry what about
    what others need to call or label you.
    paula

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    +1 Paula.

  22. #22
    Member AletaHawk's Avatar
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    Thanks for this thread, Michelle! Since I first read that thread, I've gone through a similar realization. I've been panicking for a few days, trying to figure out what it all meant. Where I used to think I was just a bisexual, (very) casual crossdresser, I've had to start accepting that I'm some "flavor" of transgender. It's high time I own that, and I will thanks to your inspiration!
    I'm a girl when I feel like it

  23. #23
    Junior Member Michelle Deere's Avatar
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    Wow! Thanks again everybody for your feedback and comments.
    Not that I didn't doubt it, (until now I hadn't contributed much) I'd always read that this site was a great spot to find support. I now know and have felt that support first hand.
    I will endeavor to continue to participate, as I continually learn more about myself and this curious activity I enjoy.
    Love to all.
    Michelle.
    Some of my thoughts on crossdressing at http://themichelleinme.wordpress.com/
    A repository of Michelle photos at http://www.flickr.com/photos/14176339@N04/

  24. #24
    Platinum Member Teresa's Avatar
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    Michell, I think youv'e found the best site most members will give you the time, and hopefully help and support you in some way ! Cding does twist and turn, just when you think you have an answer it takes you off in another direction ! As members keep saying try and enjoy the ride, but that is sometimes easier said than done !

  25. #25
    Senior Member UNDERDRESSER's Avatar
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    Normal? See my first signature line.

    Labels?, Yes we need labels, but we should be able to apply modifiers or qualifications as needed. I am a crossdresser, but in my own head, I don't feel that I am, in the way that quite a lot of others on here are. Specifically, I am not trying to pass, I am not trying to be mistaken for a woman, I am not trying to mimic an idealised, (or just average) female form, or face.

    Am I transgender? Again, by technical definition, yes, but from my point of view, I am even further from this than I am from being a crossdresser. I wear the clothes that I do for several reasons. As many men will argue on SkirtCafe, a skirt, kilt, dress, robe, caftan... actually make better sense for a man that pants (trouser/strides) or shorts do. Much more so than for women. You can even make medical claims for such. That is part of why I do, but not the main one. I like looking at people wearing dresses and skirts, even guys in kilts. it attracts attention to the legs, and shows them off. same with hosiery. I want some of that for myself. To certain extent, I actually want to state (visually) that I am comfortable doing that, that I appreciate complementary comments. I am quite happy with a woman doing a bit of the pursuing if she wants. I would even be happy getting a compliment from a gay man, as long as he, or any woman, can take a "thanks, but no thanks" as an answer.

    Another way of putting it is that I want to be able to move (partly) in the world of women, in the same way that I like to see women move in the world of men. It is for the most part, considered quite acceptable for a guy to have a GF who has a traditionally masculine job, and who is considered a bit of a tomboy, but often not considered acceptable for a guy to be, or to pursue jobs and hobbies that are considered "feminine"

    Who defines what is feminine? And if what you are doing, or wearing, does not fall under the heading of "feminine" does that mean you are not a crossdresser and or transgender?
    "Normal is what you get when you average out the weirdness that everybody has." Quote from my SO

    Normal is a setting on a washing machine, or another word for average.

    The fact that I wear a skirt as a male should not be taken as a comment on what you do, or do not wear, or how you wear it.

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