Gay/TG friendly bars....

[~Joanne~]

So I am out with a couple of GG friend's today, completely drab, and they start talking about their plans for the weekend to celebrate one of their birthday's. The talk is to go to GiGi's or Stiletto's here in Michigan to see a drag show. The conversation kind of caught me off guard as both are married and these are gay bars and not their typical watering holes.

Now, I know quite a few girls here in Michigan go to these bars enfemme and maybe a group here also goes because I know at one point I had thought of going to one of these just for a night out enfemme if I could join up with a few sister's to do that. Now, I don't think I could if I even wanted to, or more so got the courage up to do so, because I could get outed at any time if a bunch of friends go there to see the show or to dance or whatever.

Amazingly, one of them said that I should come with them. I know they were half joking but were half serious too. They said it would be funny to see me there. My thoughts were yeah funny if Joanne showed up instead or if you walked in and I was already there without any plans of joining them on any given night.

I find this troubling because I always thought if I were to join some girls for a night out, without too much care about it, these would be the perfect places but now those thoughts are gone. So i have a few questions that maybe some can answer......

1. I know we go to these places just to be ourselves or to have a dressing adventure out without many hassles but why do GG's want to go to these places?

2. Has any one in Michigan ever been to either of these bars? what was your experience?

3. Did you ever run into anyone you know while there?

4. while they are TG friendly are they CD friendly? because some TG's do look down on us.


Thanks

[Melissa_Rose]

I think gg go to places like this to have a fun night out and not be in a place where they worry about guys trying to pick them up or any other unwanted advances.

And they all seem to enjoy good drag shows..

Cdn

[Adriana Moretti]

1. I know we go to these places just to be ourselves or to have a dressing adventure out without many hassles but why do GG's want to go to these places?

Imo, gals go to gay bars for basicly the same reason, they dont want to be hastled....they dont want men bothering them, and they too can be themselves. In fact quick story one in Atlantic City...the club was a sausage fest, and we all decided forget this there are no gals here and went to the gay club ...there more more straight girls in the gay club LOL !!!!!!



3. Did you ever run into anyone you know while there?.....

yes...I have been to gay bars with my lesbian girlfriends in drab and knew people....i am bi ( most dont know that) but nobody cared i was there anyway....and i had the excuse of my gal pals if i needed it, but it diddnt really matter either way

4. while they are TG friendly are they CD friendly? because some TG's do look down on us......

yes they are cd friendly....the ( im cooler than you) TG's you speak of are out there, but few and far between....thats like saying your afraid to go swiming cause you might get bit by a shark. Go swiming....

[AllieSF]

I have been to Gigi's and it has a few things that also attract the straight crowd, male and female. The first is the drag show that can be fun for anyone. Then after the show you come upstairs to a noisy dance, drink and pool table area with some tables to sit and watch everyone else. A lot of girls like to dance among themselves because their BF's don't dance, or don't dance very well. As was said, there is also that safety factor of being around gay males who have no sexual interest in females. Then you have the good fun of meeting and interacting with a very diverse group of people who are there for the same reason that they are, to have a lot of fun. I have seen TG's, gays, lesbians and a lot of straight people there.

So, I would say that if you can, try to go with your GG friends for a fun night out. Don't be nervous, be part of the fun. They will love that and invite you again. At the same time, you can check out the crowd and venue, have fun, and find out how often each of them go there. My guess is that they only do it once in a great while, thus hopefully leaving you with a lot of free days in between to go by yourself as Joanne.

[Launa]

I don't know what to say because I go to straight bars, gay bars, whatever.... I use the mens washrooms wearing my sequins gowns which creates some tension at times.
LOL

Gay bars are easy because no one cares at all and there is really no threat. That's why GG's love those places plus theres a bit of comedy that goes on too with dancing...

[Beverley Sims]

Interestin where the double standard comes in,,,
Girls like men in dresses but not usually their friends.
I would go with them, it should be a hoot and you never know what they may suggest.

[Katey888]

Joanne - I can't answer specifically for GiGi's (I think you'll get plenty of experienced girls who will do that later...) but I think I can answer your first question and provide a little reassurance...

Yes, we do go to these places to be ourselves - I suspect GGs and straight couples also go because they are fun, happening places to be, but they are also without the regular hassles of 'normal' nightclubs (packs of predatory males steaming drunk...) and for sure have less trouble and better security because of the nature of the club. It was what I wanted on my first outing and I wasn't disappointed - the LGBT community in general is more accepting and if anyone isn't, well, that's normal life really.

I'd encourage you to give it a try - you have a great look and wouldn't have any trouble fitting right in, I'm sure! I do understand what you say about being recognised and accept that this is a valid concern, but the likelihood of that happening is probably really small - people tend to be focused on their own circle of friends... you are far more likely to see anyone you knew first and it would be relatively easy to take avoiding action... I would think...

Go with friends - they'll give you some cover and support - experience it...!

Katey x

[Kate Simmons]

I think it would be a good test. I would go fully en femme just to see if they recognize me.

[Andy66]

I agree with the ladies. GGs can go there without being hassled by men. Alot of GGs love drag queens and gay guys too. Theyre alot of fun, and not threatening.

I run into a guy I used to work with at a local gay bar, but thats just because he dates one of the bartenders. Hes the one who introduced me to the place, and hes really great so I look forward to seeing him. Years ago, my hometown was sort of smallish and I knew alot of people, and there was only one gay bar in town, so yeah, I ran into a few high school acquaintanes there, but it wasnt awkward, it was fun.

[Ressie]

I haven't been to Gigis, but I've met a few CDs that love going there. If you go enfemme you'll have the advantage of recognizing anyone before they come close to recognizing you. You would only be recognized if you came face to face with someone. Of course if you get on the dance floor you could end up face to face with anyone! I understand the fear of being outed. I don't go to gay bars in my town en femme or en drab.

[~Joanne~]

Sorry girls, I forgot I even posted this lol Been busy with work and having them trying to convince me that I should join them tomorrow night but chances are that I am going to pass. I just can't see myself going there with them.

the ( im cooler than you) TG's you speak of are out there, but few and far between....thats like saying your afraid to go swimming cause you might get bit by a shark.

The very reason I don't go swimming lol Jaws did a number on me long ago and you never know what's in the water here in the detroit area lol

Interestin where the double standard comes in,,,
Girls like men in dresses but not usually their friends.
I would go with them, it should be a hoot and you never know what they may suggest.

That's what caught me off guard a bit, the double standard. I have been with one of these girls when she saw a CD and laughed at them. Now this CD wasn't fully dressed and what she was wearing really looked bad but to each their own. Her reaction is what bothered me more than what the sister was wearing then she is going to go watch a drag show? Makes no sense what so ever.

At the same time, you can check out the crowd and venue, have fun, and find out how often each of them go there. My guess is that they only do it once in a great while, thus hopefully leaving you with a lot of free days in between to go by yourself as Joanne.

Certainly a good idea and I have played with that notion quite a bit but these girls? naw, I best to pass. They have mouths on them a mile wide and nothing good would ever come of it.


Thank you everyone for your responses, have a great weekend!

[I Am Paula]

GG's go to gay and drag bars because they are safe, and fun. The clientele is better behaved, better dressed, and doesn't need to get sloppy drunk before hitting on someone. Most women find straight bars revolting. Get dolled up, and go and sit in a straight bar, watching male behavior. It's eye opening. Also, women like dancing with gay men. they can just dance, without him trying to read anything into it. Also, dancing with a straight guy is like putting a hat on a dog- amusing, but he really doesn't like it.

As for running into people you know. If your boss is in a gay bar, neither of you can say anything. He didn't stumble in by accident.

[Judith96a]

Interestin where the double standard comes in,,,
Girls like men in dresses but not usually their friends.
I would go with them, it should be a hoot and you never know what they may suggest.

I understand why you see this as a double standard, and sorta agree - but only sorta. Drag Queens are very clearly and openly "female impersonators". They are clearly playing a role in a 'performance' setting and in that sense there's no difference between a drag queen and a pantomime dame (there are of course also very obvious differences). A CDer's SO might possibly rationalise their SO's CDing by viewing it as "playing a role" (which it really isn't, it's more of a lifestyle thing) but they are never going to perceive it as happening in a 'performance' context. Which possibly explains why a certain CDer's parents were quite content to giggle along with everyone else as their blushing 17yr-old son modelled a LBD in a charity review/concert but would be absolutely horrified to think that he enjoys being Judith from time to time!

[GinaD]

I have had mixed experience at gay bars. In a few I felt totally comfortable, in many others, I felt like most GGs do in a straight bar...a target. I have also felt hostility from patrons who do not CD or are not TGs. I find that I am most comfortable in a "straight" bar if I am in the mood for that kind of atmosphere. Pretty rare these days. I have run into people I knew who didn't know I dressed in the past, before I began dressing full time. Talk about a potentially serious emotional event. Fortunately, I was able to avoid them and didn't get discovered.

[PaulaQ]

I see lots of straight girls attend drag shows here. I see lots of engagement parties, for one thing. Some girls bring their boyfriends to the shows - that's hilarious to watch at times. All kinds of people go - lesbian, gay, straight, bi, trans. Some of the queens are really good performers, and often really funny!

There's no problems with CDs at gay bars, at least not that I've ever seen. The dudes will assume you like men - otherwise why would you be in a gay bar? But you shouldn't have any problems.

[samantha rogers]

Lots of good advice here, Joann. :-)
I head over to GiGis quite often as I have mentioned often in other posts, If you are going on a Saturday, I might be there myself, and it is likely I am friends with many of the regulars you will find there. I cant tell you a darned thing about the drag show downstairs, as Ive never been down there, though later in the evening many of them come up to the dance floor.
Confused by your distinction between CD and TG....do you mean TS instead of TG. To me TG is an umbrella that includes CD, so I am guessing you mean TS. Sigh...I do hate labels. Either way, dressed or in drab, you will not be hassled by anyone at GiGis on a Saturday.
I mention Saturdays specifically because that is when my gfs and I go. I hear the place gets slightly different crowds on different nights.
As to your friends...yes, vanillas do show up, but usually for batchlerette parties. I see a lot of that at gay and especially lesbian bars. Gigis attracts them too.
Here is the thing. If you come dressed you will make friends with other girls. So should you be there and your gg friend shows up you will have several advantages.
You will see her before she recognises you. She wont be expecting to see you and certainly not dressed. She is not going to spot you instantly.
And then, if you are there and spot her it will be simple to have other girls divert her while you retreat. And there are darkcorners to retreat to if you need to.
But really, I think your fears are not justified. Let me know if you want to go sometime and I can introduce you to people. I promise you will have a good time. :-)

[Rhonda Darling]

JoAnne!

This is the chance of a lifetime. Go with them in drab, and after some drinks suggest to them that there's no way that you could ever be dressed and made up well enough to look like a woman. Let that hang in the air and see if they take up the unstated challenge. You might well find yourself being feminized by your friends at one of their homes. I've seen women do it on cruise ships after entering their husband/SO in a cruise contest. Some very impressive results.

If your friends take up the challenge, and end up making you look very femme using their clothes, makeup, etc., you can then tell them you like the way you look and may try it yourself. They won't know whether you're serious, but leaves you open to later "blame" them, playfully, after you come out to them.

IMHO, YMMD

Rhonda

[Jackie F]

I have often thought of going to either place. I have heard GiGi's is the better of the two.
A GG friend of mine posted on Facebook that her and her friends go once a month which killed the idea for me.
If you think you get the nerve drop me a line and maybe we could meet Samantha.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Joanne, It's like the song goes, Girls just want to have fun, go with them.

[Tonya Rose]

I say go for it gurl ,,, a place where like minded people can go have a good time. Has anyone in this like minded forum ever hurt ya? Didn't think so go have a blast GF.

[CindySTJ]

Go and have fun. I have only been to one bar that was hosting a drag show but there where as many men as woman. Straight, gay, lesbian and me in my skirt and heels but everyone was really nice. It is still a show/entertainment for everyone just like going to a bar to see a band. The reason the GG's know about these events is because the bars advertised the event publicly not just to certain types of people.Now you need to ask them if they should help you dress up for the event!

[ReineD]

1. I know we go to these places just to be ourselves or to have a dressing adventure out without many hassles but why do GG's want to go to these places?

Because it's a lark, it's fun to do. And it's a little on the edge for most GGs, somewhat outside the same-old boring places to go to. So there's a little extra excitement in a place that is not likely to be populated with men who might be interested in the GGs, thus interrupting their fun girl's night out.

3. Did you ever run into anyone you know while there?

4. while they are TG friendly are they CD friendly? because some TG's do look down on us.

I don't know if lesbians and gays understand much about the CD/TG/TSs nuances. I wonder if they lump them all together (if the TS is not yet at the point of being stealth). Also, how can people really tell if someone is a CD or a TS, as long as the CD isn't dressed in a fetish manner. And if the TS is fully transitioned and stealth, then few people will notice that she is TS so the ID becomes moot.

We have a GLBT/alt place locally with drag shows that straights and gays go to. I've run into people I know there, who are not CDs or gays. They go there because the music is good and it is one of the few places in town where people dance. I'm always afraid that friends of my adult children might recognize me (without me recognizing them). My SO and I are older than the average people there and so we stand out. Also, we do not run into other CDers there, my SO is almost always the only one … except for the Drag Queens who are performing.

There are a few places in a local city that cater specifically to CDs/TSs. These places don't tend to attract the L-G or DQ crowd, but there are always quite a few Admirers looking for hookups, and of course the CDs/TSs who want to meet them.

I don't think the people who go to the GLBT/alt place look down on us, they pretty much leave us alone. But, I think they do accept my SO because, like them, she is not a part of the non-GLBT world.

People are used to adding the "T" at the end of "GLB" and running it all together as if everyone is part of the same group, but in reality Ts don't have much in common with GLBs. The "G-L-B" tags describe sexual orientation, which is not at all what "T" is about.