Guess I need to vent...

[Elisa Lace]

So well... all this halloween thing has really gotten under my skin for some reason. It might just be the pink fog since I've had an almost home alone weekend, but the thing is that I see all these pics on facebook, threads of halloween outings (you all rock some serious outfits and costumes!) and I'm here kinda trapped in my own house, under my body and facial hair (due to prohibitions from my gf). I mean, I was able to dress up, but being unable to get rid of my hair, my feminine side doesn't feel complete at all. How would I loved to just convince my gf to go to a costume party or something without all the negative weight on the subject. I just feel all this to be unfair somehow.

And now, while writing this down I realize I don't have anyone close to me talk about this or my cd'ing freely, can't really let my fem side breathe, so I guess that's why I'm just ranting here. It's kind of a desperation feeling I've got which I can't quite put into words. I just want to be able to walk that guy/girl continuum somehow, but just can't find the way and I also feel selfish at the same time since I know this is putting some distance between me and my gf even if I've talked about it with her.

Anyway.. I'm not even sure I'm making much sense now. Guess I have a couple of bourbon glasses to blame lol

[Tinkerbell-GG]

Elisa, a costume party with you crossdressed is rarely fun for the reluctant partner who knows you're a crossdresser. It's just a public declaration of something she would rather forget. So you're not on the same page at all with that and you'll have to accept this for now.

I also think it's forgotten here that if you start a relationship with a beard and other masculine attributes, things said woman clearly found attractive about you, you're really asking for trouble removing these things, even temporarily. It's a bit like a super buff body builder immediately letting himself turn fat once the relationship is serious. Women rarely enjoy these changes. Remember, if she liked men without beards and body hair and preferred they wear dresses, you'd have been out on Halloween with her! Did she know about all this from the start? Or later on?

The real question is why are you (or anyone else here, for that matter) having relationships with women who dislike crossdressing??

[Persephone]

Halloween can definitely be a bit rough on those who find themselves in your situation, Elisa.

This is the perfect place to vent.

Hugs,
Persephone.

[Beverley Sims]

Elisa,
Tinkerbell has outlined both sides of the story for you and her closing sentence is something you have to consider.
Being controlled by someone else is a recipe for disaster.
Oh! Bourbon does not work well and the solution is not at the bottom of the glass either.

I know and I don't drink.

[Vickie_CDTV]

The real question is why are you (or anyone else here, for that matter) having relationships with women who dislike crossdressing??

Remember, the percentage of women who actually like crossdressing is almost zero. This life can be very lonely without some form of love and companionship (I know this all too well!), so in order to have what they need many have to compromise. I don't think I could compromise like that, but I certainly understand why many do. I wish it wasn't this way, but it is what it is.

[Teresa]

Elisa,
You don't say how long you've been in your relationship and how committed you are to it ? I'm not sure if I agree with Tinkerbell on the point of facial hair ! Really you have the right to alter your presentation as a guy, you could say the beard is giving you a skin problem and need to shave it off !
If you're having problems presenting yourself as a guy with your GF, maybe your relationship will get more onesided as it progresses, as for CDing issues you are probably going to be closeted forever !
At the stage you're at tell your GF staight about your needs, you will be happier in the long run ! Please believe me on that one !!
Reading your OP again, you don't say if your GF knows about your dressing ! So do you know what thoughts she has on CDing at all ?

Vickie' I had two consecutive GFs that were OK with my CDing so in my case the figure was two out of three !!

[Tinkerbell-GG]

Really you have the right to alter your presentation as a guy, you could say the beard is giving you a skin problem and need to shave it off

A non crossdresser can do this and get away with it. (unless the girlfriend has a particular beard fetish or something lol)

Once we know you're a crossdresser you can't fool us with such excuses and in fact it becomes all the more painful and insulting as we know you're feminising yourself. Remember, I'm only speaking for those women, like Elisa's gf, who don't like CDing. Anything that even hints at feminisation, even small things like body hair, are enormous to the unhappy partner.

Hence the reason I asked why crossdressers always seem to end up with non-accepting women like Elisa's gf (and me!) Surely there's a better fit than men who want to feminise themselves dating women who love masculinity. How does this keep happening?!? Do opposites really attract? Because it's the same painful story told here, over and over, yet it could be avoided if crossdressers only dated accepting women. And yes, even if that means narrowing the dating pool to only three prospects. Living an authentic life is surely more important than such enormous compromise. Believe me, the non accepting partner feels as much like a fraud as the repressed crossdresser and both can feel like the relationship is built on a lie. I still look at friends who think my H and I are this super great couple and think: 'if only they knew'.

[Marcelle]

Hi Elisa,

I feel your angst but unfortunately this is something only you can resolve. I see this type of post a lot and while I count myself luck my wife fully accepts this in me and looks past the superficial aspects of a relationship (her words not mine before someone goes all ballistic ) I understand how others will wish to maintain acceptance in a relationship at all costs and all demands. However, I do have to point out . . . it is your body to do with as you please IMHO. Surely your relationship must be built on a more solid foundation than facial and body hair. Oh don't get me wrong, I understand that she may see this as you trying to feminize yourself so a compromise will need to be reached. Perhaps just the beard can go . . . After all beards can be quite uncomfortable (for those who have never had one). So, unless you can live with this angst, I would do some serious talking to your SO and try to strike an accord (body hair stays, beard goes - plenty of guys don't have beards and they don't look girly).

. . . I also think it's forgotten here that if you start a relationship with a beard and other masculine attributes, things said woman clearly found attractive about you, you're really asking for trouble removing these things, even temporarily. It's a bit like a super buff body builder immediately letting himself turn fat once the relationship is serious. Women rarely enjoy these changes.

Tink,

I normally agree in principle with most of the things you write but seriously . . . CDing aside . . . this is as ludicrous as me saying that when a man starts a relationship with a woman who is fit, firm and dresses all girly for her to gain weight, start dressing in sweats and acting less than a supermodel he (the man) has the right to demand she correct these things less he throw her to the curb for a newer more feminine woman. We all start life differently with our respective partners. Yes CDing is a bit of an odd card but if the woman does not want a CDing husband then my advice is move on . . . why try and correct what most likely will not be resolved.

A non crossdresser can do this and get away with it. (unless the girlfriend has a particular beard fetish or something lol) . . . Once we know you're a crossdresser you can't fool us with such excuses and in fact it becomes all the more painful and insulting as we know you're feminising yourself.

Again, you are stating this as if we (CDers) are bad people who are purposely trying to hurt those around us. This is not a choice it is something that has to occur on some level or serious emotional trauma can occur and that will bleed over into any relationship in some form (anger, frustration, depression). Seriously . . . a non cross dresser can do what he wants and a cross dresser has to watch his step? So if you like facial hair and body hair on your man and he (non CDer) tells you he is going to remove it because he wants to get into competitive fitness competitions you are fine with that. But if you know your husband is a CDer and he says the same thing (wants a smooth appearance for competitions) you will demand he doesn't because he is only trying to look girly? This makes no sense to me Tink.

Hugs

Isha

[mykell]

hi elisa,
it is unfair that you cant go out together, all the negativity....society's stigma, what will people think of me being with a CDer, what if i see someone we know, what if....

you do have some one close to talk about this with, your GF...and if she wont listen you have friends here....virtual ones-but friends just the same....
its overwhelming stuff to cope with but it needs to be done......just dont drink and talk.....and get it all worked out before the nuptials.....you'll both be better for doing it....

vent anytime you need....

[sarahcsc]

Hi Elisa,

Of course you can vent. I feel sorry for you especially with the facial hair! Nothing threatens my femininity more than facial hair and I hate them!

Venting manages your feelings for a while (although I doubt the drinking does anything) but you can't expect your feelings to go away if you and your GF don't sort things out. Read the Would You Have Married Your Husband If You Knew He Was A Cross dresser? thread and you will learn that most GGs would NOT have married their current partners if they knew earlier or if they knew what crossdressing entails. So Tinkerbell raised a good question when she asked,

The real question is why are you (or anyone else here, for that matter) having relationships with women who dislike crossdressing??

We can't make all the mistakes in our lifetime so please learn from others who have been through it. Having said that, I know that sometimes we have to make some mistakes ourselves before we know what is right for us. Vent to us if you think it will make you feel better. But you need to be able to speak with your GF too, otherwise, she isn't much of a GF isn't she?

Love,
Sarah

[Tinkerbell-GG]

Elisa, I really hope you can find a way to communicate with your gf so that you're both living a happy balanced life together and not just compromising yourselves into misery. x

[susan54]

I think there are merits on both sides of this discussion. A man should be allowed to change his appearance within a relationship to the extent of removing a beard - a beard can be unpleasant and makes you look older. But if removal really is a relationship disaster - come on, it does not take long to grow back. For anyone over 40 or so removal of body hair is a different thing - it has negative associations - but again - it grows back.

It is one thing to wear skirts and dresses at home. For a partner, seeing her man out in public in a dress can cause real distress and people should not submit someone they love to public distress. Compromise works both ways. I have had partners who don't mind me dressing at home but as soon as they learned of my cross-dressing, sought assurance that I did not go out in public dressed like that. At the time i didn't. Also I would not expect to spend all my home time in skirts and dresses (as I do now) because being in a relationship means doing things for your partner.

I am not currently in a relationship but would not try and hide my cross-dressing from a new partner. As I already have hair-free legs and armpits my naked body will first be encountered like that and it will be explained, and I will insist on spending SOME time wearing what I want, but I will also be happy to spend time being what she wants. If that means not going out then that is OK - compromise, compromise, compromise. Both opinions count, and some things in relationships might not be logical or even fair- it can work if the compromise is equal but not if it is all about you.

[iGenny]

I mean, I was able to dress up, but being unable to get rid of my hair, my feminine side doesn't feel complete at all.

I know that the other replies are more about the relationship side of your post, but I just want to let you know I sympathize about the facial hair.

[Maria 60]

Well one thing is for sure, you came to the right place, this is my favourite place to vent. So go ahead you have great listeners here.

[kimdl93]

It's not selfish to want to express a part of yourself. One might reasonably argue that it's selfish for a GF to place restrictions on you...it's your body hair after all. Relationships are certainly based on compromise, but one would hope they also are based on an appreciation of the whole person and a long term relationship should provide each partner with room for self expression and growth. You and your gf need to discuss this and see if some mutual accommodation can be achieved.

[Tina_gm]

Tink- remember that many of us, definitely me don't really wish to have any type of gender crossdressing issues. So many stories here of the years of denial, repression, trying to make it go away so that we don't have to deal with falling in love with someone who doesn't like our gender issues. And, a vast majority of women will not ever choose it over non cd's. At best, they either have a casual whatever floats for you attitude or works to cope with it. Then there are a good many others who simply will have nothing to do with anything Transgender.

The fact is, there just are not nearly enough women who are out there looking for it, or truly liking it. For me this clearly is the hardest part of being Transgender. It is why so many of us hide lie deny, repress and hate ourselves.

[Nadya]

Elisa,

I've definitely felt like I've needed someone to talk to who've I've developed a close friendship with. It can be especially difficult if you live in a place much more conservative than others. I know many people have already said this but if you ever need someone to chat with on this kind of stuff, you can always message me. It's definitely not fun to feel alone when you are trying to get through a confusing part of your life.

[Diane1950]

Elisa, I'm right there with you, having tried to cajole my wife into letting me dress up on Halloween and having been solidly shot down. She knows Diane exists, but does not care to see or, most of the time, hear about her or my "feminine side".

I'm not here for a long rant, but I'm in the same boat with you, having nowhere else to express myself. I'm glad I found this site.

[Kelley]

Elisa
You have a tough situation for sure. I feel that some wives and SOs use the facial hair as a means to insure their CD will not step over the boundaries when they are not around. I'm not saying this is right or wrong it is what it is. I think you need to evaluate your situation and decide if you can live with your urge to express yourself and not be able to express. You have to look at the relationship and decide if maintaining it is more important than your expression. And most important how does it affect your mental health. I firmly believe that selfe-expression in a very important aspect of humanity, we all need it, not just us CD.

Kelley

[Elisa Lace]

Wow... didn't expect this amount of responses. I thank you all for them too. And forgive me if I don't reply in specific to each one of them...

First of all, context: my gf has been aware of my cd'ing since the second month of our now 3 year and 8 months relationship. For the first 3 years though it was a DADT thing... she knew, she didn't like it and she wanted it to be buried from sight. We broke up on march due to a series of problems, my cd'ing among them. We got back together two months later after having a deep talk about it, mainly the CD'ing subject in which I told her that while I didn't need it to be an "in your face" thing whith me dressing up in front of her or have sex while in femme or whatever since I know it just isn't fair for her. I told her I needed some leeway at least to talk about it more freely. Now almost everytime I get some fem clothing article, I will buy something for her too (recently ordered a bra set for her and she knew and asked about mine with no problems). She made it clear though that she didn't want me to get rid of my body hair. The beard is something she and I like though since it makes me look somewhat my age, instead of giving me a 17 year old face, but which I told her I would like to shave sometimes. That part of the conversation fell to the side somehow and it's now a gray area.

So, moving on with the matter, as Tinkerbell said, no excuse will make her actually believe that I somehow *had* to shave. Unless that is, they make me do it at work (I've survived 3 months now with a beard and no problems now though so it will make her suspicious anyway).

I always think that this all might be different if I was more sure about my CD'ing back in the beginning of the relationship and would have brought up the subject in a more possitive way instead of presenting it as some kind of drug addiction or alcohol dependency lol. Guess I'll never know.

So anyway, compromises must be made if we both care about each other, that's for sure, the thing that hits me though is that not even on halloween, a time for fun in which everyone just pushes it can I opt for anything somewhat feminine since that will sure get her "spidey senses tinkling". To be honest though, I didn't even bring up the possibility of doing it this time (since I had a negative from her on another occasion). Can't say I don't understand her or that I am mad at her, that would be really selfish from my part, it just feels like a struggle.

So I do think a conversation is at hand... not sure when, not sure how. Guess time will tell, but I'm not really thinking on moving on with our relationship to a different level before getting the subject clear as a glass of water. I've already read too many stories about it to make that mistake. ]

Oh, and lastly, I wasn't drowning my problems in bourbon, It's just that I love honey flavoured bourbon and two glasses are enough to get me tipsy lol. Thanks for the worries on that matter though!

Thanks again everybody for your views and opinions

[Tina_gm]

Good for you Elise that you are trying to look at the big picture. That I am sure is what keeps me sane amongst the whole CDing thing. It can be confusing as heck. Life has all kinds of struggles, and we compromise and sacrifice much of what we desire, not just CDing but of all that we desire. We do so for a greater good. I look at CDing in the same context. I strive to balance out everything in life. My gender issues are among all the struggles , sacrifice and compromise I make.

[CarlaWestin]

Yea, so, once again, the classic portrayal of women that lay down the rules of, "These are the rules for me allowing you that coveted privilege of being with me!"
Tink, I agree. Why would any man cower and do the, "Anything you say, Honey. Because I Loooooooove You."
Right. That's not all I'm shaving!

[Katey888]

Well done Elise also... I don't think you're being unreasonable about this at all - relationships are about compromise and while our little passion offers tougher negotiations than most, if you're already out to your GF there should be give and take both ways.

I also don't get the beard thing... so if I met my wife when I had long hair and a beard that has to stay for ever...?

I don't think so...

I do feel sure you would have a lot to gain by having some local support but in not being able to magic that up from nowhere, your best bet is to just come back here and vent... you know you'll always get some friendly and understanding ears.. with people attached...

Katey x

[Andy66]

The real question is why are you (or anyone else here, for that matter) having relationships with women who dislike crossdressing??

Tinkerbell said it way more kindly than I could have. I spent five years of my life with a control freak who would always argue with me about my clothes, so its a sore spot for me. Do you tell your girlfriend what to wear or what to shave? Im guessing she would have some choice words for you if you tried.

[docrobbysherry]

Elisa, I don't choose to comment on your situation with your SO. Other than to say we all walk different paths and dealing with our dressing/gender issues is difficult enuff without it affecting other folks.

However, I CAN tell u this. I attended half a dozen public events in female costumes this Halloween. And, never had to shave off my beard and stash! Including one big event rite in my home town. (Photo)

For those that like their shrubbery AND anonymity? Consider a mask next Halloween!

IMG_3160 (539x640).jpg