Do you not want to be girly as a guy?

[JenniferYager]

My wife and I were out at the Lush store a few days ago, enjoying the scents and picking out new stuff. One of the store associates was male (making me slightly envious of his job, although probably not his pay) and had on skinny jeans. At the time, it bothered me.

Which is weird, because I have no problems wearing such jeans as a crossdresser. For me it wasn't the jeans, it was that he was a guy and should be wearing guy clothes if he's presenting as a guy.

Has anyone else had this conundrum? That you're bothered by men wearing something effeminate, but wouldn't have a problem if they were to crossdress?

And yes, I realize the irony was that I was in the Lush store with my wife, something most men wouldn't do...

[kimgirl]

I think I used to have a problem with it, but as time goes by less and less.

Over here skinny jeans, tee shirts, hair styles are becoming more and more androgynous in the current fashions. In fact sometimes it is difficult to tell whether they are M or F, but all this is mainly with youngsters. And generally now it is quite the norm for men to wear bracelets and jewellery. I find I am saying to myself or my wife, "I like those jeans" or "I wouldn't wear that" irrespective of what gender they are presenting. Often it's the way it's worn or the mannerisms that make the difference. However, the way some men wear their jeans half way down their butts I think looks ridiculous.

Did you get anything good at Lush?

[JenniferYager]

So White shower gel

http://www.lushusa.com/on/demandware...te%20christmas

[kimgirl]

Ooooo............I bet that smells lovely

[Helen_Highwater]

Jennifer,
I've lost count of the threads were folks here talk about wearing fem jeans and other items but aiming for an androgynous look. Personally I see nothing wrong in blurring the lines between male and female clothing. There's a live thread at the moment about the 3rd gender. Why shouldn't there be a gender spectrum, people sitting somewhere along a line rather than being X or Y. A bit like autism and dyslexia sit on a scale, different but share some common traits. Ending stereotypes is a way to end some forms of bigotry. Apologies if it seems like I'm having "a go", I mean it as a point of view not a criticism.

I have a general test of someone's actions; "Does what they do cause anyone harm?" If the answer is no them who am I to stop them doing it? I don't let it bother me, I just get on with life.

[bimini1]

Interesting observation. If you're gonna present male, be all man. Female, all woman. For me it's like that. But I'm not botherd by someone else mixing it up. Not in the least. Your thang is just your thang, and as long as it doesn't involve violating the civil rights of another person, I'm going to help you be who you are.

[Kate Simmons]

Since I'm in touch with ALL my feelings, the lines are kind of blurred for myself, so it doesn't matter to me.

[Adriana Moretti]

so a guy..presenting as a guy has on skinny jeans...and this bothers you?? You obviously have not been to brooklyn in the past 6 or so years its the normal...well as normal as brooklyn hipsters can be ...please watch the video... and as much as you hate the music the lyrics are pure poetry .....

[Heather_Shirly]

I just don't see why anyone would want to wear skinny jeans to begin with!

[Adriana Moretti]

me either but realize how stupid that sounds while you say it wearing a skirt........

[I Am Paula]

Mix it up all you want. Heels look wonderful with a business suit.

[Marcelle]

Hi Jennifer,

I would be a hypocrite if I said it did not bother me on some level . . . now before anyone goes WTF Isha I will qualify that statement. When I first see a guy who is dressing and acting effeminate my mind goes "Hmmm . . . what's up with that" much in the same manner I figure people do when they see my ugly mug with make-up and me all girly. It doesn't mean I am bothered on a deep "I don't like that guy" level, it is just my mind making sense of contrary information. However, I have found over the past year of exploring Isha, that feeling is less and less and I don't normally bat an eye . . . to their own.

Hugs

Isha

[~Joanne~]

While I keep both sides (for the lack of a better term or phrase) separate, I may have a moment of questioning to myself but in the end, to each their own. I know I wouldn't want anyone questioning my choices if I chose to wear women's jeans mixed with my drab attire.

[Renee Elise]

Hi Jennifer, totally agree...probably due to our own programming and preferences. When I am in guy mode I want to be unambiguously Dude, whether I'm dressed in a suit or sweats. No girly traces anywhere. When I'm dressed as a girl, I go all out feminine. Like in Ghostbusters, I don't like crossing the streams!

[Ressie]

Well there are skinny jeans in the young men's department, so how does wearing them make a guy effeminate? I remember being in shock when baggy jeans were the new style. Seems to go back and forth like women's hemlines. Maybe the discomfort has to do with unconscious homosexual feelings that haven't been dealt with?

[suchacutie]

A few years ago I went on a diet for health reasons and lost 35 pounds in 3 months, and I've lost another 10 pounds since. Nothing fit, and one afternoon I went out to buy new jeans. I came home with what I thought were great-looking guy jeans. My wife took one look and pronounced them terrible, as they just didn't fit well with my new physique. We went looking together and after an afternoon of complete failure decided that the cut of male jeans just didn't work.

We did my measurements and realized that low-rise size8 jeans should fit from Victorias Secret. They did.

I don't at all act effeminate as a male, and don't buy jeans (except for Tina) that would clearly be girl jeans. The last statistic I saw indicated that 10% of women's jeans are bought to be worn by men. I just don't see an issue.

[Alleyne66]

Where I live, skinny jeans are for girls PERIOD. And it's so darn annoying I am practically addicted to those tight trousers but I am too scared to wear them outside. Even my wife agrees that it is a shame because she likes the way they look on me.

Oh edit. I also have a lot of issues with male pants because of my figure. They all look like potato bags on me.

[Bria]

I think that our thinking on this subject is a product of the period of time that we grew up. I'm in my 70s and tend to dress as a guy much the same way guys dressed 40 years ago, if I go to church, out for dinner with my wife, to a board meeting, I wear a shirt, tie and a sport coat (I do wear pants too). Sometime in drab I will wear girl jeans that have modest design on the pocket, but for the most part I'm either full guy or full girl.

Due I care what others do? I suppose that I may raise an eyebrow if someone dresses in a manner that isn't appropriate for the venue, or activity. That said, when I was young nobody wore jeans to church and now it is totally acceptable.

Times change and if we don't we quickly get relegated to the round file.

My 2 cents!

Hugs, Bria

[Krisi]

I wear women's jeans as a guy but not "skinny jeans. They just fit me better than "guy" jeans.

If you go out looking "girly" in guy mode, most people will thing you are gay. If you are gay or don't care, that's fine. Otherwise, it's best to dress as a guy when you are in "guy mode" and dress as a female when in "female mode".

[Lynn Marie]

In my youth I pushed the envelope in clothing, vehicles, and extreme sports. I'm older now, have nothing to prove, nor am I interested in shocking or even surprising others. Nothing's changed with the youth in their rebellion against the rules their parents lived by. The good thing about mixed clothing is their loss of fear about their own sexuality. The fear of being thought of as gay was an incredibly evil thing to have to grow up with.

[Sissy_Michelle]

Jennifer,
So with that said does it bother you that some guys under dress only due to work or other family issues? Or how about when a girl wears her husband's shirt or sweats? My favorite.... A GG is wearing 501 Levis blue jeans ! The horror! I should be upset because she is wearing men's clothes in public !

Most of everyone wishes that everyone wouldn't be so judgmental and they could wear whatever they wish to wear without being chastised or judged.

@--}---
Michelle

[sometimes_miss]

Being girly as a guy isn't seen as a positive thing by the world. Girly guys are referred to as wimps, wussies, puss!es, fags, light in the loafers, etc. etc.. 'He's so sensitive' is usually used as an insult. There are no positive descriptions for men who have feminine attributes.

I'm very careful not to give any clues that there is anything feminine about me; I already work in a predominantly female field, in which any male is automatically considered gay unless proven otherwise. However I was married for quite some time, and date some rather very good looking women, who would acknowledge that I'm 'all man'. Yes, I'm a good actor, too.

[Mia Brankovic]

Hi Jennifer...

I've been wearin' skinny jeans, forever...and nobody has ever mentioned it, called me on it, or questioned it...perhaps, it has something to do with presentation; however, I'm quite effeminate...always formed and trimmed the eyebrows (and the like). And I live in a rural area...things get 'round, round here!

I have broken that barrier...Of things that most men wouldn't do...because I have seem what many men are capable of...I'm not like that, end...

Ciao,
Mia

BTW: Same goes with waist cincher...those things are excellent for defining the Abs!

[CONSUELO]

It strikes me that if we look for tolerance from the people around us as we cross dress, underdress, sport ear studs etc. etc., shouldn't we also practice tolerance and acceptance ourselves.

I come across gay men who dress very flamboyantly in all sorts of clothing. I did find myself once being a little shocked at this but quickly questioned my motives. If I like to turn up to a restaurant presenting as a female, I should be relaxed about a male who presents in some way other than a "conventional" one. Now I actually find the flamboyant dress of many young males to be very interesting.

Human beings are innately conservative. It may be something that harks back to our ancestry. We tend to be distrustful or suspicious of those who look and dress differently. As cross dressers we break those conventions and we seek acceptance from others of our looks and behaviour. Surely the quid pro quo is that we accept, even celebrate, the breaking of dressing conventions by others.

[Beverley Sims]

I think I get the look" from people because I wear skinny jeans and boots.
Those that comment in a positive way, and that is most think they are riding boots and my dres looks stylish.
I am not enthusiastic about the outgoing pedantic gay guy who wants to hit on you all the time.
He is not necessarily dressed effeminate.