It's always entirely our fault

[PaulaQ]

Honestly Lea, at this point I'm just afraid of her, and what could happen if she talks about my visit up there. I just want this to be over. I don't understand why she is so hateful. Well, I guess I do, but I always thought she was a much better person than that. She has always prided herself on being liberal, accepting, open minded, pro-equality.

Apparently not though - at least not in her own back yard.

BTW, if she'd simply divorced me, and been done with it, that would have been hard, but OK. As it is, I have this overwhelming feeling that she isn't so upset about losing her husband, but that she's upset over losing the stuff his money could pay for. She also feels very entitled to a future nobody promised her, that she made up in her own mind.

I don't even know if she really felt anything for me before. It feels kinda like I was just desirable for my income. It's funny - she always worried people would think that. Nobody did really, but maybe she was trying to reassure herself?

[LeaP]

Who knows, Paula? So many themes cris-cross in our lives. Sometimes it's a matter of relative emphasis at different points. It's likely that your ex is all of those good things as well as the bad. Aren't we all? People also change, just as circumstances change. Getting back to your theme, would you hold them responsible, and if so, for what, exactly and why?

[PaulaQ]

@LeaP - the only things I really hold her responsible for are her actions after I came out. She was pretty awful to me. Look - I didn't expect this would be glad tidings and our lives were going to be all rainbows and unicorns after I told her.

But she didn't have to out me, repeatedly, putting us both at risk.

She didn't have to repeatedly lash out at me.

She didn't have to throw me out suddenly with little warning after we'd negotiated a plan for me to leave voluntarily.

She didn't have to get drunk, and call me after we'd separated - many, many times, telling me how miserable she was, and that I'd ruined her life.

She could've continued working in the real estate career that I financed for her, rather than quitting after we'd separated. This made her life more difficult.

She didn't have to deal with me without an ounce of compassion. I never deliberately tried to hurt her, and after the reveal, I tried to make sure she was OK. She didn't care what happened to me.

I blame her for these things. Sure, she couldn't live with another woman. That's fine. Turns out, I couldn't either. I get that. But it didn't need to be so hostile.

So I do hold her accountable for her actions. Those are her responsibility. I've tried me dead level best to be compassionate and fair to her. She didn't treat me the same way.

And Lea - this may be an unusual reason for a divorce, but there is nothing unusual about divorce itself, and a LOT of marriages break up. There is nothing about this situation that is much different from many other divorces -- I didn't do ANYTHING directly to her. I didn't. We just weren't compatible anymore. In fact, most of the bad stuff happened because of her transphobic response to what I told her, and her total emotional breakdown that followed. That's all on her. (I even paid for a counselor for her, but she quit going.)

Sure, I should've owned up to all this years ago and avoided the whole situation. That was really bad. It happens to a lot of us.

I don't think any of that justifies the emotional abuse she's heaped on me, and her total lack of compassion and forgiveness. She knew, in the end, how miserable I was. She didn't care, and still doesn't. So yes, I hold her responsible for those actions - stuff that's gone on for two years now.

Look, I hope she can put all this behind her, restart her life and have everything end up ok for her. I'd really like for her to be happy. I want her to have a good life. I hope she finds someone else. We had a lot of good years together, and I can't hate her. But apparently all of that was just meaningless to her.

I don't know that I hold her responsible for that - although that hurts - but I think it's fair to hold her responsible for her actions.

[Kate T]

I have finally reached the point where I am happy to take the responsibility, even if I am not always thrilled with the consequences.

Best lesson my mother ever taught me. You take responsibility and face the consequences of your actions. It is amazing how that results in a positive reaction from people even when the consequences of your actions are not necessarily that great. If you have done your absolute best and made what you truly believed to be the best decision and actions, then very few fair minded people will fault you for that. Those that do I'm afraid you cannot help and having done your best there is no more you can do for them.

[PaulaQ]

If you have done your absolute best and made what you truly believed to be the best decision and actions, then very few fair minded people will fault you for that. Those that do I'm afraid you cannot help and having done your best there is no more you can do for them.

Not when you are trans. I still stand by the thread title. If what you said was true, I wouldn't be going to have lunch and argue with an "ally" about why it's uncool to censor me and others in the trans community for complaining about a trans-exclusive "lgbt equality ordinance." Because, seriously, sometimes trans women need to use the restroom in a public place. When something this basic and obvious is in dispute, fair-mindedness is just not going to be the common reaction to much of anything else.

[flatlander_48]

Everyone has to remember that we can only do the best that we can at the time. It is entirely possible that a decision or a reaction that came a day later or a day sooner would be very different. Clearly that leaves the door open for a lot of suboptimal decisions and reactions, but that's how it is for humans. Ofttimes doing something in a timely fashion has greater significance than trying to get it exactly right, but unfortunately that doesn't stop us from attempting to do just that.

Secondarily, once we've made that suboptimal decision, it becomes part of the past. We can't fix the past, no matter how much effort we put into it. It's done. Unfortunatly, many times we do get stuck in trying to fix or undo something from the past, but it's just not going to happen. The only thing that is left to do is move forward and carry that piece of information with us with the aim that it may be useful at some future point. But, all that is is a piece of information. It doesn't necessarily mean that if a similar situation occurred, that you should do the opposite of what you did before. It is imperative that each situation be considered on its own merits.

DeeAnn

[donnalee]

Paula, if it was me I'd let her lie in her own bed, but if it is something you feel you must do, then I wish you success. Please follow Nicki's suggestion and take someone with you; you've just described a situation that could turn ugly, perhaps violent. Take precautions and I hope I'm wrong.

[PaulaQ]

Well, I'm back at my old home for the night.

PaulaQ.jpg

She isn't here. So the three of us, me, Pat, & Vanessa are up here to clean the observatory, and to checkout the equipment in it.

I've been really nervous and unhappy about this trip, but I calmed down when we got to Krebs to stop for dinner tonight. We stopped at Pete's Place - Italian food in Oklahoma, nobody ever expects that.

I'm sad being here. So many memories of this place. I miss it here. It just wasn't meant to be I guess. She's kept the place up really nice, I'm happy to see that, mostly because that suggests she's doing OK.

After we do what we can tomorrow, I'm going to try to visit a couple of my neighbors, and maybe go into town for dinner at my friends Rick & Debbie's restaurant. That probably isn't too smart, but I'm just not good at fear anymore, and I miss some of these people. Oh yeah, I'm armed too. Actually all of us are.

I know better than to expect a pleasant visit, although I hope a couple of people will be glad to see me. But whatever happens, I think I'll get something I didn't get 18 months ago, when I left so hurriedly - a chance to say goodbye to a place I loved and called home.

Oh, I've had to out myself to a bunch of folks in the astronomy community I just didn't want to deal with. No loose ends allowed for me, apparently.

It's weird staying in a guest room of what still feels like my house. But, of course, it isn't my house anymore.

I really don't want to come back after this.

[Karen62]

Paula, I know how hard this has been for you, but your commitment to personal integrity is amazing. Take care of yourself and your handsome partner. Just don't shoot at the dark before you are sure your partner did not get up for midnight snack!

BTW, I adore the smiles on both of you. So sweet, so beautiful. God speed in getting this all done and then getting the hell out of Dodge.

Karen

[flatlander_48]

Geez, you guys look like old married folks!! But, I say that humorously and seriously at the same time. Considering how things have gone for both of you with various trials and upheavals, settling into being just regular people probably feels pretty good.

Closure is a good thing. My analogy is that when you leave home to go on a trip, you pack your car and you close and lock the doors to your house. At that point you know that it is time for the new adventure to take place. If you just leave, and don't pack your car and close and lock your doors, it will always feel unfinished. There is no punctuation. There is nothing that you can point to as the end. It's an abstraction because in your mind you left, but there is nothing physical that you can point to that says Finished.

Therefore, it seems reasonable to me that the only way to truly have a New Beginning is to have a Defined End...

DeeAnn

[DebbieL]

I remember when I told my first wife (ex now). We had been dating for about 2 months, moved in together, and I told her about 3 weeks after we moved in together. I had thought when we moved in that because we would be having sex, that I wouldn't need to dress anymore, or have the desire to be a woman any more.

It got to the point where I had to tell her, at least about the dressing part, but she made it pretty clear that if I wanted to go out in public or transition, the relationship would be over. I loved her, she loved me. I lied and told her I didn't want to transition. I found out 12 years later that she had lied about accepting the dressing. I made amends to her, and to my children, by never missing a child support payment and giving her a little extra. I also called the kids once a week, even though they often weren't home.

I finally talked with a therapist who had transgender experience in 1989 and he realized that I was a solid case for transition ASAP. He was surprised that I had survived into my 30s. I probably survived because I had had several courses of therapy, family therapy, and couples therapy as well as being clean and sober since 1977 with my last drink/drug in May 1980. The 12 steps played a major role in my survival.

[flatlander_48]

The 12 steps played a major role in my survival.

I think the concept of Survival is underrated. MANY here have put a lot of time and effort towards ignoring and/or supressing the mismatch between their physical and psychological selves. Sadly, for many this has led to a number of potentially self-destructive behaviors. However, reconciling these disparate parts is not the work of a moment. Survival is the vehicle to allow you to hold station and eventually get you there while ones situation improves.

[CarlaWestin]

"I'd rather live a hard truth, than exist in a comfortable lie."

Paula, I really like your signature line. How true. You are certainly in the vortex of the divorce whirlpool that many of us have endured. In my own situation, I finally realized that X thrived on inflicting pain, manipulation and sorrow on me. That included the gender part a lot. The best thing I did was relinquish all the ridiculous material accumulations, cut all of the poisonous tentacles and move forward. Her anger, without a place to vent, broiled and bubbled inside her. Now, with all that nonsense twenty years in the past, I've progressed far beyond any level of achievement and happiness that I could only imagine back then.

Now, I'm not intimate with your personal situation but, seriously? Just sell everything attached to the infection for pennies and start your new life, virus free. There's a nice future ahead looking people straight in the eyes, knowing what you've already survived.

[PaulaQ]

Here's a photo of us, cleaning the observatory:
image.jpg

One of my friends reverted back to boy mode for the weekend - we were all nervous about her safety on the trip to and from the place. I'm really ashamed she felt the need to do that. Next time - and there will be a next time unfortunately - I'll insist she travel as herself. She doesn't pass well, and feared having problems in rural Oklahoma. I'll never let that happen again.

It was a pretty hard weekend. Cleaning the observatory was pretty quick with the three of us. We had technical problems opening the dome shutter, which you have to do to open the door and get into the place. So cleaning the inside, and equipment testing was cut short. I'll have to return out there at least once, if not twice more to finish selling all of it for my wife.

It was emotionally draining for all of us. We were staying in my old home. It felt like my home. They could see my personality throughout the place. They were kind of shocked at the scale and complexity of my observatory, and that I'd give up such a thing and sell it for a woman who finds me so repellant that she can't even say hello to us. The house, the area around it, the little town a few miles away are wonderful. And they may as well be Mars for all that I could not stay there. So I gave it all up - what can I do with a home and observatory in an area that's so hostile to me?

The guy at the local cheeseburger stand recognized me. He looked shocked. I had a unique order, and he knew who it had to be when I made it. Yeah, there is no place for me out here.

I've loved stargazing and astronomy since I was a little kid. After all this is over with, I expect I'll never look up into the night sky again.

Oh yeah - funny story. My boyfriend's ex texted him over the weekend, and wondered if he'd pay for her tolls on her commute to work. He'd forgotten to close that account after their divorce. But she still expected him to pay for things for her. (She got the house too.) We marveled at the fact that both of us lost relationships because we were trans. It made no difference in the outcome for either of us that one of us told about our transness upfront, and the other (me) hid it. We were both faced with women who won't speak to us, but who feel we owe them everything, and blame us for the woes of their present lives. We kind of marveled at that tonight.

It really didn't matter what we did. It was just always our fault for being trans.

[Nikkilovesdresses]

I'm glad it went as well as it did Paula, even gladder that you took 2 people with you, and very glad indeed that you chose to exercise your 2nd Amendment rights. Good luck- and please be equally well prepared with your further visits.

[Starling]

I'm sorry you have to return again to that place, Paula. Why do so many of us marry women whose capacity for vengeance is greater than for love, or even love's memory? I'm not talking about being divorced per se, but about the awful things she has done since then. I don't think I could bear to set foot in my house again, if my wife reacted that way when I told her I had to transition to save my life. It would be such torture to see it and be reminded of the happy times.

If a wife can't bear to stay with a transsexual husband, wanting to divorce is understandable. But when she seeks to make the rest of your life miserable, that's an emotional crime. I could never find it in myself to be as cruel as your ex, or your boyfriend's, even if I had been deliberately abused.

Lallie

Addendum: On further reflection, I think we often choose women with low self-esteem and serious psychological problems; and then try to fix them, because we're people-pleasing fixers.

[Patty B.]

A divorced sister once said it takes two to make and two to break it, that said I'm kind of in the same boat paula, just older than you and just figured it'd stop once married, grew up in 50's and 60's, but it doesn't. No knowledge back then the internet was a long way off, sure would have been helpful in the 70's, so you do the best you can with what you have and society expects. Also very rural and closed minded, I'm a big deal in this area not many of us are outed, just me. Since my separation and divorce at least my grown children are now ok with me and each other I hope to find some peace with the remaining years. Wish you all the best and good luck.

[flatlander_48]

As is said:

Living Well Is The Best Revenge...

[GinaFox]

"You can't go home again," don't they say? Well, Tom Wolfe did. I've just come home to where my wife and I lived for the past 14 years, she for 30 years. It was hers for a long time before it was ours, but it became mine, too, as I rehabbed it into a gem we could sell our way into semi-retirement. She always said she never thought she'd stay here so long, and was ready to leave the day we met. She made me promise to take her somewhere else, and last fall we did, moving far away. Now we have a new home we're making ours together. She's been there every day but I've been traveling for work a lot, so it's already more hers than ours, but we're aiming to make it ours. But this week, I've been back to our old city, though not the old home, and it feels weird -- not the dark strangeness that Paula mentions, but that "Hey, been here, gone now, it ain't the same place for me anymore" thing. And new home again tomorrow.

[Starling]

That's terrific, Gina. Luckily for you, your wife isn't trying to put you to death by a thousand cuts. That might change your attitude toward the old homestead.

Lallie

[PaulaQ]

@GinaFox - my life as a trans woman, at least when dealing with much of my past has been very much of an unlife. It's as if I am some kind of ghost. I can see people grieve over me, but I am powerless to do anything about it. I can haunt old places where my exwife and I were together, but I never see her or hear her voice. I just get text messages.

People who knew me act as if they are seeing a ghost - the shock on their faces is clear.

Perhaps my suicide attempt two years ago didn't fail, and I simply occupy whatever parallel dimension the departed inhabit, only sometimes visible to those who knew me? Well, it kind of feels like that sometimes. Things that happen to me, and others like me are simply not believed by those around us, as if we were invisible. Occupying some weird purgatory would actually make sense, in a way!

I don't enjoy feeling like a ghost very much. It is a forlorn feeling, because others grieve over the loss of the person they loved, but yet I am still around to watch what I used to have, and people who used to love me.

[Rogina B]

Paula,Your last sentence is exactly why so many transitioning girls run and never look back. You are trying to reinvent yourself in the same space which seems impossible to do for many.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

I remember one time going to my old house (Where my ex lives) when nobody was there and walking around the back yard and just sobbing
In that moment i was experiencing being in "my" backyard, just looking around at the little water feature i always loved ...i was me AND i was home where i belonged...that just destroyed me...
... i think sticking around reminds us of loss over and over. it's a tough thing, and we won't get much sympathy because although its not our fault, we caused the situation that made people feel loss..
There is no way around this.

I have felt this hurt many many times and i use mindfulness and my own internal strength to power through it.
I can't change what others think, but i can role model success.

[flatlander_48]

R B:

Interesting thought. Reinventing anyone or anything is difficult as the process of Living and Being has its own Inertia that works to resist directional changes. In the academic sense, it is a fascinating process but the currency is raw emotion. It is also additive in that we take all of the difficulties and impedences that exist in everyday life and overlay that with the process of working on that which we might become.

It's a difficult proposition and the world at large has no idea as to how difficult it actually is. But, what I've learned from people here and from conversations I've had, turning back or holding station are not viable options. Physicality aside, the journey has to be completed...

DeeAnn

[Cindy J Angel]

Ok gf i though all Texans pack heat last thing u put on lol. You guys look like a great couple envy love the pic. What i dont get is why u keep sayi g u most likey will not keep doing stargazing. Your Observatory looks amazing would love to have one. We have a club here that has open house on the first fri and we go at least 2 or 3 times a year. We are always the last to leave and thats when we get the best looks. By the way did u get my pm i sent for the va documents there from Texas va if not let me know and i will resend love cindy