Is it *really* about passing?

[mechamoose]

I know a lot of our members are on a personal journey. To a number of us, we are trying to physically transition. To others, we are trying to present as our cis-gendered self. Others (like me) are just trying to be ourselves.

So, you my sisters here, those who are on the transition path or on the presentation path.. I want to ask this: Why is someone else seeing the seams and edges a 'failure'? I know you WANT to present flawlessly is the ideal. I get that. But I have to wonder, why are you losing 'good' while seeking 'perfect'?

We were not born in our internally identified gender. Doing a 100% conversion is a 'unicorn' to me. Wonderful to find, but am I going to turn away lesser versions of that? I still dress how I do, wear makeup the way I do, and I don't care. I'm not doing it for THEM, I'm doing it for ME.

I wonder how many of us are being critical of ourselves because we failed to link up with that unicorn.

<3

- MM

[Laura912]

Suspect that the responses will group according to age groups. My path has so many switchbacks and forks that at times soul, body, and mind are going in three different directions. In the past several years, acceptance of what I am and will not ever be have moved in together and are quite happy cohabiting. "Good" is fine. The others can have perfect. But that will not keep me from trying to present as the best possible. Maybe not an unicorn but if I can get a saddle on it, then hang on!

[Sara Jessica]

Passing is a ridiculous concept. I've often pointed out that no one ever really knows if they reach that holy grail because you can never really know exactly what happens in your wake. Sure, you might get by without anyone giving you the obvious "a-ha" look but once you walk on by, all bets are off. You don't know what they are saying and unless you are constantly looking over your shoulder, you won't see them do the requisite double take, or worse.

That is not a pessimistic viewpoint (I'm an eternal optimist), it is simply realistic. And that brings things full circle, that personally I will do my best but settle for a result that is good enough along with an expectation that I will be perceived as trans-whatever by the Muggles and as such, I am much more happy, carefree and relaxed when out & about.

[pamela7]

i'm changing so fast my answer will change over days if not hours or minutes!

right now, having experienced the wonderful CD/TG/TS group in Exeter, UK, on Thursday, I get its not about passing, its about LOOKING AS GOOD AS YOU CAN.
if you think about it, it's what our CO's do for us when going out, too! It's a matter of respect of others and oneself.

xxx Pamela

[cdinmd206]

I would like to be able to blend in in a crowd or at least have people say "not too bad looking"

[Steph_CD_62]

With me passing is NOT an option.

I just really enjoy how I feel when I am dressed. Something about wearing nice lingerie and a nice dress is just so relaxing to me.

[mechamoose]

Passing is a ridiculous concept. I've often pointed out that no one ever really knows if they reach that holy grail because you can never really know exactly what happens in your wake. Sure, you might get by without anyone giving you the obvious "a-ha" look but once you walk on by, all bets are off. You don't know what they are saying and unless you are constantly looking over your shoulder, you won't see them do the requisite double take, or worse.

This idea is super important, thank you.

You/We see the 'polite' responses, the 'non-confrontational' ones. We have NO idea what anyone near us *thinks*, and what they would say if they *could*.

Hence my point. Camouflage, be definition, means that you have successfully blended. The 'enemy' doesn't see it.

Is that enough? If they *saw* you as a boy who happened to look like a pretty girl, is that a failure?

If they accept you in that mode, did you *miss* something?

I just want to be me (as dissonant as I am) and have it be 'bumpless'. I want to do what I do and have *NO* attitude in response.

(poke at the facts, it will eventually reveal the truth)

- MM

[MissTee]

Like you MM, I am just seeking to be myself. Furthermore, I'm out to my supportive wife and don't look to take it further. I pass enough for me in my head and in my heart. That's my journey. I would think, though, that if I was out and about in public I would worry much more about the details. Even then it would not be to pass more, but to stand out less.

[Jocelyn Quivers]

It's just the person I am regardless of male or female sides. Both sides strive for the "unicorn", perfection, to look my best to a certain degree. An example of how my male side looked at the unicorn is going to the beach, swimming pool, etc. Even though I maybe went once or twice a year. I would spend practically every day obsessing over lifting weights, diet, etc. To go gain the perfect "unicorn" physique for those few occasions. It had a lot to do with what my male side idolized or wanted to look like as far being a guy. Going to femme mode it's basically the same thing, lots of diet agonizing, excessive exercise, along with all the additional bells and whistles. It's just how I wish to present, in my quest to look like the “Women’s Health” magazine model. Even though I rarely leave the house in girl mode and the only person who really sees me is my wife, I still present from head to toe trying to pass, wig, tucked, etc. Anything else for my own standards are unacceptable, or when I look in the mirror the absolute last thing I want to see is a guy. Being that unfortunately for the foreseeable future I have to present as one for employment, health insurance etc. In many ways though my male side is and always will be there, and has actually become a greater influence internally. I realize that I will never "pass" but that does not mean it's a goal I'll never stop or quit in trying to accomplish.

[bridget thronton]

I am content to look as good as I can (to please me) and hope the people I run into will be as polite to me as I am to them.

[Nicole Erin]

For anything ones does, there is going to be an "ideal" version which is often pushed by the media.
Like say 20 somethings who are already very successful and rich. Or some 50 year old woman who looks better than her 21 year old daughter. Perfect lives...
Very few people get to live the ideal.

In the case of TG folks, yeah the "ideal" is passing without question with a side dish of being beautiful. It doesn't help when we see Miss Canada or Kim Petras. So naturally being TG, we measure ourselves against that. And we fall short.
Or you get on websites and forums and people like to remind you that you do not pass that well.

I live this full time, 24/7, even at my job. I do not pass that great, and I am pretty at best. For quite some time I obsessed about passing but it just isn't gonna happen on the level I would like. Eventually I quit worrying about it. What was I going to do? NOT be me just cause I wasn't blessed with a huge bank account and genetics?

Some people DO reject social things because the situation is never perfect. People think they are going to have perfect friends, a perfect partner, etc just fall into their lap but it isn't reality.

All you can do in this life is make the most of what you have. You get what you gt in life, take it or leave it.

[Judith96a]

If by "passing" you mean having everyone perceive you as being 100% female when you're attempting to present as female then that's something that I doubt that I'll ever achieve. I may have gotten close to it for a few minutes at a time when I was younger but not now! I know personally 3 girls who DO achieve this - one is a pre-op TS who has had some cosmetic surgery and had worked really hard to achieve her desired body shape, the other two are crossdressers who happen to have quite feminine features to begin with and really do know how to use appropriate padding and dress to achieve the desired effect. In my experience, they are very much in the minority.
For me, the goal is to present sufficiently female to survive casual scrutiny. For example, as I walk towards the bus stop I hope that anyone who happens to notice me will think "tall, redhead woman" and move on to think of something else. Standing at the bus stop, I expect that I may get a few quizzacle looks but that, unless they dare also waiting for a bus, most people will have much better things to do than worry about who or what I am. However, I have absolutely no illusions about fooling the little old lady sitting opposite me on the bus - unless she's forgotten her glasses AND is fast asleep!

[mechamoose]

...they are very much in the minority.
For me, the goal is to present sufficiently female to survive casual scrutiny. For example, as I walk towards the bus stop I hope that anyone who happens to notice me will think "tall, redhead woman" and move on to think of something else. Standing at the bus stop, I expect that I may get a few quizzacle looks but that, unless they dare also waiting for a bus, most people will have much better things to do than worry about who or what I am. However, I have absolutely no illusions about fooling the little old lady sitting opposite me on the bus - unless she's forgotten her glasses AND is fast asleep!

So...(just asking)

Is it about YOUR perception of yourself, or about THEIR perceptions of you?

I gotta ask.

Who are you trying to please, and why?

We have the right to be ourselves. We don't have to justify that, and we sure as hell don't have to apologize for that.

Personally, I want to give our members *all the room in the world* to be comfortable being dissonant. To *not* quite fit in and not feel sorry for that.

You don't have to be tied to that unicorn (Umm..er..sorry. Bondage fantasies intrude...)

I have used this example many times. You could look like Earnest Borgnine in a sundress.. and you should experience *NO* embarrassment. You didn't *fail*. You were being YOU.

Why is that so bad?

<3

- MM

[BillieAnneJean]

There are too many visual cues for most of us to have a chance at "passing". And is it really necessary? When OUT enfemme, how much time do we spend interfacing with a homophobe? Just about anyone else will not care whether or not we look so realistic that we are indistinguishable from a GG. Our contact time is short enough that they just don't care.

And I dress for myself. I don't care if I completely fool anyone. All I need to accomplish is to create enough doubt on their part that they lose interest and go about their business.

What is more important is that I "blend". Sure I tend to dress better than just about every woman within sight. But I am not wearing a neon orange fishnet dress over eight inch platform heels, even to a club. If I am shopping I wear something classy but not a formal gown. If I am at dinner I may wear a dress that for most GGs would be Sunday best. But it isn't sequins, it isn't a party dress or prom dress. So just by the nails, makeup, nice color coordinated outfit, the heels, the jewelry, that alone is going to signal that I am different from the GGs. So just by dressing up, even in an appropriate manner, albeit more dressy than flip flops and sweats, in heels and stockings, I am not "passing".

And I don't CARE. If I put some effort in to it, the people seem to appreciate that I have not just thrown on a dress and expect to fool them. Certainly the women know and appreciate the amount of effort. They acknowledge it when I mention it. But what seems to help the most is a sense of humor. When OUT enfemme I do a comedy routine of sorts when interacting with the general public. I do the feminine hand gestures, the poses, the facial expressions, all a light exaggeration of feminine comedy. I OWN it. People enjoy the comedy, that I am not taking myself too seriously. I draw them in to my comedy. They can smile and chuckle with me. We BOTH have fun. Sometimes they even get in to the act, joining me in my routine.

So I prefer to blend except when interacting. Then I prefer to entertain.

For nearly 2 1/2 years now I have been going OUT enfemme to restaurants, stores, gas stations, bars, clubs, malls, you name it. I have had great experiences to some so memorable that I will never forget them. Like the bachelorette party, Drab to Fab, dancing on stage, bar hopping in a ball gown. And taking new girls OUT enfemme for their first time. But as I mentally calculate the not so good times, I find that somewhere from 3 to 5% of the OUTings, someone is impolite to me. Well maybe those percentages would have been the same if I was in guy. So I will take the odds.

If you are in the Midwest and have not experienced this comedy while blending enfemme, then please see our Group Schedule of Events at:
http://www.crossdressersmichigan.com

Believe me, you CAN go OUT enfemme and have a great time. Come with me and see. If you live too far away, then see our schedule for Drab to Fab. If these are impossible for you, then network and find someone near you who goes OUT and has FUN.

There are no negatives here. I have a great relationship with my beloved SO (she is 99.9% of the world to me) and am having fun CDing.

I am having SUCH FUN!
Billie

[suzanne]

My holy grail is just to feel good in an outfit that looks right on my body. I know that someone of my size would never pass as female, so I don't try. I go out as me in a dress, and it works! I can't say l'm pretty, but my clothes fit properly on my body shape, so my look is as good as it can be. So I feel confident, and that adds to the whole image as well. Women, including wife, often compliment me on my clothes and shoes.

I heard a female celebrity once say that "some men look good in a dress". Well, I'm here to expand on that and say that a lot of men can look good if they choose the right dress, and I'm one of them.

[wanda66]

Total agreement with you Suzanne, I am tall and large no way to pass for a woman. My hair is long and ive had several positive comments about it .what you wear has to complete you personally

[Marcelle]

Hi MM,

Only a minutia percentage of us truly "pass" and by passing I mean close up and personal inspection with conversation and nobody knows the difference. I believe I blend but I never survive first contact of sorts and even blending only means that given 10 people who pass me, only a one or two will give me he WTF look the rest . . . well as Sara said . . . we'll never know. I did a social experiment early in my journey where I investigated the "wake" we leave. My concept of what I thought was completely different from what occurred after I left. If you are interested . . . have a read http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...periment/page2

In the end, the moment I stopped worrying about passing/blending or what not and just got on with the business of being, I was a lot happier. I hold no illusions that people see a guy when I am out and to be honest . . . I am a guy. I may try to present as close as possible to a women but in the end I am a guy and there is no hiding that.

Hugs

Isha

[MsVal]

(Sign in a hot rod shop: "Speed costs money. How fast do you want to go?")

It doesn't matter whether it's a CD/TS wishing to present well, or someone wishing to restore an antique car or build a hotrod. In all of those cases I have realized that there are constraints which limit the outcome. I realize that I am unlikely to ever reach a state where there is nothing left to do, but realistic enough to accept that the best I can do will have to be adequate.

I don't believe it will happen this year, but maybe next. I would like to blend, with a long term goal of passing. My idealized goal is to dress in whatever I choose and go about my day without giving it another thought.

Best wishes
MsVal

[alwayshave]

With heels I'm 6'5", 220 so I am really under no illusion that I pass. Even when I get to my target weight of 190, I don't think I'll pass, just have more clothing options. At this point I am comfortable in my own skin, I just want to feel pretty and look as pretty as I possibly can given my constraints.

[mechamoose]

With heels I'm 6'5"

Hmm,, tall drink of water there.

Not that I'm like, ****ting out or anything....

[Juanita O]

we are talking here about passing, well i have seen genetic females that come in all shapes and sizes, like we do. I look around and sometimes i see females that wouldn't pass as females. I know that i would not pass very well, but i try and blend in as much as i can, but being built like a line backer doesn't help, but again females come in all shapes and sizes.

[Beverley Sims]

I am certain that we are over critical of ourselves.
This is why some do fail to get out.

[AngelaYVR]

I have a certain level that I desire to attain for my own sake. I am under no illusion that I am fooling everybody when I go out and it doesn't bother me at all.

Addendum: I just read Isha's "experiment" thread and found it very interesting. Not having had anything but my own first hand experience, I can say that the gamut ranges from warm to "WTF?" (from a guy smoking a cigarette outside a gay leather bar). I would say that 98% are indifferent or at least don't give it much thought past the initial five seconds.

[Sara Jessica]

So I prefer to blend except when interacting. Then I prefer to entertain.

I like how you conveyed your sense of being. Entertain? I see your point there but I think this is better described as having a bubbly and vivacious personality and you're not afraid to use it. How many times have you heard a woman described based upon her beauty within? That certainly can be another absolutely positive element of our presentation. It beats being nervous and standoffish which at the end of the day can come across as creepy.

I did a social experiment early in my journey where I investigated the "wake" we leave. My concept of what I thought was completely different from what occurred after I left. If you are interested . . . have a read http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...periment/page2...

I remember that well, thanks for posting the link as a reminder! Nice to read it again.

I look around and sometimes i see females that wouldn't pass as females.

Dangerous territory there.

I did my own social experiment recently where I would look at total strangers and upon first glance I would make note of what visual cue led me to conclude one was a male or female. After amusing myself with this over the course of a dozen subjects or so, I was never wrong. The cues rarely, if ever, lie when looking at cisgender Muggles. Even those women who you would accuse as not passing as females, I really doubt that is the case. They exhibit obvious cues of how we as human beings perceive femininity whether it is shape, size, hair, facial features, manner of dress, etc.

At the same time, those cues are often what betray us, whether at first glance or after several. We attempt to hide, mask and/or distract but when all is said and done, there is almost always something that ends up being our achilles heel. That is what this whole thing is all about, best to accept that and move on. Makes life better in my book.

[jsunic_1978]

FOR ME...., im very open about my self, especially in the community where i live. so people know who i am if i want to get all dolled up, full make up form etc..or just a quick shave and shower, throw on my uggs skinny jeans and mt LOVE PINK hoodie by VC i do so if im just running errands, or just checking out good will, i just dress comfortable.

HOWEVER, if i plan on being out ALL DAY, where i may have to use a public restroom, i dress ACCORDINGLY, and ACT accordingly. Ohio just passed a law, that TRANSGENDER PEOPLE CAN USE THE RESTROOM THEY FEEL MOST COMFORTABLE. however, most of us are just CROSS DRESSERS, which is in the transgender spectrum. we use restrooms in whach GENDER WE PRESENT AS...now, if im presenting as A MAN, in women's jeans, shoes i use the MENS RESTROOM....but i usually like the SINGLE STALL restrooms better as either gender or gender bender EVREYBODY JUST HAVE FUN BE YOU AND CONFIDENT AND TRUE TO YOUR SELVES..

and dress ACCORDING TO THE TIME OF YEAR....(SEASONAL) and NO SKINNY JEANS WITH BIKER BOOTS... unless the boots are KNEE HIGH....NO ANKLE BIKER BOOTS WITH SKINNYS here are some boots that go with EVREYTHING I MEAN THESE GO WITH EVREYTHING ill attach a photo in a minite