The "Only transitions if you HAVE too" paradox

[flatlander_48]

As I am not transexual, I can't speak from experience, but I can speak from observation. My observation is that when people transition, it is from a place of standing at edge of the abyss. It isn't "I think I'll transition.". It is "I MUST transition.". Granted, people may delay transitioning due to medical, economic or family reasons, but that doesn't change the MUST.

In that context and given all of the checks and balances in place, how could anyone transition if they didn't have to?

[PretzelGirl]

Lea, I wonder if sometimes the message comes across different depending on which side of transition you are on. I know "don't transition if you don't have to" really made me think hard, which probably isn't a bad thing. But it also felt like a bigger barrier than maybe it needed to be. In the end, I didn't "have to", or I did, depending on how you define it.

For someone in extreme duress, it is hard love when a hug and encouragement are what is probably looked for by the person. For those that transitioned, it sounds helpful and wise. Advice given from someone that has been through it and fully understands having been through the experience. So like most short lines, a long talk/discussion probably fits the bill much better as it adapts to a person's feelings instead of being a quick saying that doesn't account for the target person and where they are at.

[LeaP]

The seekers and the pained will get more out of 15 minutes in person with a trans person than via pages and pages of OPs and responses here. This is an Internet discussion forum. The content ranges from mindless drivel to fantasy to education, various levels of informed opinion, information and resource sharing. Not to mention the occasional fraud, troll, or mole with an agenda. Some of that legitimately flies under the support banner. And people do connect here. The smart ones take that connection outside the forum for personal support. Hugs and love? You stretch the reality too far, I think.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

Wait, you related your experience in the context of what you believed people "meant" vs what they "said".
You criticize us and ignore that people universally counsel others to get professional help here.

It's not your experience, its your point of view is challenged.. Especially by people who may feel their minds are being read, and by people that are sincere and genuine in trying to help others.

You ascribe motive to others that you cannot prove and frankly that's infuriating and counterproductive to all those here.
You denigrate the motives of well meaning and helpful people.

And what's more your visceral reaction to the statement is countered by your comments that were about all the difficulties transitioners face and you cannot coherently respond to why what you said is different than "don't do it unless you have too".

Play victim all you want.
I know for a fact that you got lots of support from me...I recall our pm's.. I recall this very situation and me telling you that people were taking you seriously...
I consistently urge people to consider all alternatives prior to transition.

You can do this all day but its only about you and you do not get the last word because you say you do.

[Eringirl]

I realize that I am on the "outside" here, only in the exploratory phase of Transitioning (e.g. not on HRT, etc). But I have found this to be a valuable discussion. It is helpful to get the perspective of all of you in your various stages of transitioning, and/or your experiences during and after. Everyone's story is different as are their experiences, and that I to be able to glean information for all of them is very valuable. It helps to ensure that I look at as many aspects of this whole thing as possible. I am working with one therapist and about to add a second one (who is a gatekeeper to an Endo and HRT). I feel that this has helped me to explore my motives, emotional state and ability to effectively deal with transitioning. It is not something I am considering lightly and many here have provided information that has been considered in my thoughts and discussions regarding this.

Having said this, I am scared. I am scared of what may happen if I don't transition. I am scared of what may happen if I do transition. But I would be more concerned if I wasn't scared. I am planning for the worst and seeing what that looks like and if able to deal with that and things go better, than that will be a bonus. I do realize that thinking I will be able to be prepared for it and living through it are two different things. This is something of which this discussion, and other threads, have made me acutely aware.

My experiences will be my experiences. They will be the same and different from others here, but will be mine. Valid to me. And when I am able some day to recount them here, some will be able to relate, others will not. That is fine. So thanks to all who have contributed to a robust discussion.

Not withstanding, I would be nice to get a hug from someone every now and again letting me know I am not alone in this.....

[Kimberly Kael]

I wonder if sometimes the message comes across different depending on which side of transition you are on. I know "don't transition if you don't have to" really made me think hard, which probably isn't a bad thing.

I think the phrase in question is generally shorthand for everything that is harder to express, and that the whole point is to get a tentative transition to think long and hard about what they're doing. It's not just possible to do irreparable damage to relationships, families, and careers. It's so common that it is pretty much assumed. So the question has to be whether or not it's worth taking that risk. "Don't do it if you don't have to" is one way of getting that message across.

But it also felt like a bigger barrier than maybe it needed to be. In the end, I didn't "have to", or I did, depending on how you define it.

That's the question that we each answer for ourselves. In practice, I don't think I "had to" in any traditional sense. It wasn't an existential crisis for me. I wasn't miserable. I just knew that I was suppressing an important part of myself and that deep down I'd regret not transitioning. From an entirely analytical point of view, I saw enough signs of social progress that I felt there was more upside than downside for me. I also felt a social responsibility to embrace my identity to improve our visibility in the world, even if just a little. Finally, I was in good enough shape financially that I could have survived losing my career, though I'm glad it didn't come to that.

[Nigella]

Do you value the life that you lead now, the loved ones who share your time and space? Could you accept the loss of all that you hold dear?

During my journey I have seen and heard of many who could find a happy medium to ease their GD and have been able to lead a normal as possible life.

This issue I see is where do you draw the line at "Transition"? There are many areas of transition which will ease the GD, however, there are two areas IMHO that are clearly a defining points, HRT and SRS.

For me the "only transition if you have to" point is when you realise that this is the point of no return, that is when your life can become very complicated. The statement is very broad and each transitioner will interpret it their own way.

As for the paradox of "I wish I had done it earlier", in my case it was when I got on the other side we realised how much happier we were. For some it would be the relief of leaving behind a life that was not theirs and wishing that they had not wasted that time getting to where they are today.

[Cheyenne Skye]

Then instead of "I wish I had done it sooner. " how about "I wish I needed to do it sooner. " ?

[Kaitlyn Michele]

really when you say i wish i had done it sooner you are saying you wish you knew then what you know now... its true of so many things in life and this is no different


This whole thread is about how difficult it is to communicate something so unknowable..

[PretzelGirl]

That's the question that we each answer for ourselves. In practice, I don't think I "had to" in any traditional sense. It wasn't an existential crisis for me. I wasn't miserable. I just knew that I was suppressing an important part of myself and that deep down I'd regret not transitioning. From an entirely analytical point of view, I saw enough signs of social progress that I felt there was more upside than downside for me. I also felt a social responsibility to embrace my identity to improve our visibility in the world, even if just a little. Finally, I was in good enough shape financially that I could have survived losing my career, though I'm glad it didn't come to that.

Kimberly, I relate to this a lot. That is why I think I fell on the "didn't have to". But then that is predicting the future as maybe I just decided before it progressed to "I had to". I never despised Steve's life, but I love Sue's so much more and it is more complete and fulfilling. That is a good thing.

[Kate T]

Thank you everyone for your responses. I think overall a fairly interesting discussion.

[Tina_gm]

Regardless of where anyone is on the spectrum, most wish they had done it sooner. I would be among them. I wish I had married my wife sooner. I wish I would have divorced my 1st wife sooner. I wish I had told my second wife sooner. Are any of these things truly mistakes? some maybe, but I will say that in each case that I was completely ready to take the actions I did. I don't know if it is truly a paradox. I believe that wishing we had sooner is often a case of I wish I was ready sooner. Being ready sooner maybe that can be worked on, as society crawls out of its transphobia. Even then, when such a thing happens, such a life changing step, a person really should have absolutely no doubt about taking that step, and in the process will likely realize they could have done it at least a little sooner than they did. Better safe than sorry.

[Debglam]

A very interesting thread.

I think that Rianna brings up a very good point:

We see some people posting here about transition, but who value their relationship with a non-accepting wife more than they value being congruent. Or who value being seen to be the father of their children more than they feel the need to be whole. Or who value something else more than the need to be seen for who they really are. For those people, transition would be a mistake because it is not a priority for them and they would lose whatever the other thing is that they prize more.

I find myself somewhat in this category and what I would have done if I was say 20 years old but with all of the information that is out there now is a lot different than my current options. I tell people that transition is a "train that left the station without me" but(!!!) the only reason I think I can say that is because I truly believe that dysphoria occurs on a sliding scale. If the intensity was greater I likely wouldn't have the option of following this middle path. So having a choice to "transition only if you have to" seems to me to be a luck-of-the-draw situation where not everyone can make that choice.

Debby

[EvaMarie]

Sorry I never bought into this "wisdom"... I didn't HAVE to transition at 44, I had a very comfortable life as a male though I was getting very tired of fighting "her"... I know I could have soldiered on and tried to be content with keeping it all just a dream and very much a secret... But I also knew time wasn't on my side and it would never go away... It used to really bug me I could never find a wife and have kids and just be "normal", now of course I consider that a blessing No Ive always WANTED to transition and I felt like I was running out of time and energy fighting it... I definitely have ZERO regrets with my decision... YES it was a decision, I didn't HAVE to do it but Im sure glad I did

Of course the only thing holding me back was doubt in my mind that I could ever be successful... If I had known it was gonna be as easy as its been Id have done it sooner for sure .)

[Rianna Humble]

So please tell us, EvaMarie, what it was that you prized more than being whole but gave up to transition and don't regret?

And are you really sure that you didn't need to transition? Your words would suggest the opposite.

[genevie]

Do you value the life that you lead now, the loved ones who share your time and space? Could you accept the loss of all that you hold dear?

I spent some time last week with a couple T's. Those are their words, not mine. We talked about loss. The loss holds me back. I have a meeting this week with my therapist and that certainly will be a major part of the discussion.

As for the I wish I had done it sooner, maturity and decision making that arises from that maturity and perspective tells me that we can only make decisions when we can.

[STACY B]

I heard the same as Rianna in that post ,,lol,,, An for most Trans Girls it is a Have too ! Not a want to ! You would have to be CRAZY or just insane to go through all of this if you didn't HAVE TOO ! I for one like most of the others am in the HALF TOO club ,, An the reason we wait so long is we have to consider all other options .

An after all the other options are crossed off the list we have nothing left but transition . Hell I made a GREAT MAN ,, I made it look easy ,, Had a great life an job an family ,, Only thing that was missing was HER ,, An believe it or not that's a BIG ONE .
Don't get me wrong I tried like hell NOT TOO ,, Being a Taurus you can only imagine the Fight I put up before I let go ? An still find myself wanting to fight from time to time from shear guilt an shame an regret .
Years of Alcohol abuse ,,, Physical abuse ,, Mental Abuse ,, Abusing my Body ,, Weight gain ,, Damage from just general jobs an carriers I chose to prove I wasn't that way or this way .
An the whole aspect of getting educated in a place where there isn't much until the internet came along . An the reality of coming to terms with it an accepting it was pure Hell for me .

Not to mention the struggle with my family issues . Hell how can I explain it to them something I don't even understand ? I have to learn an educate myself before I can even try or think about how an what to say to them . An what if there just like me or like I was at that age or just a Bull headed as I am or was ?

Can I do it ? Do I have the fuel to explain it ,, Or make them believe me ? Or make them understand ? If your not with someone day in or day out explaining an drudging the day to day actions of this whole thing an them seeing an learning from day to day how ever evolving this self discovery this is how would or could they know ? They just know what you tell them ? Not what is fact an has some scientific backing ,, Hell even the experts second guess themselves .

Only thing I can ever say or tell someone doing this or contnplating going threw this is EDUCATE YOURSELF as much as you can . An take it one day at a time an get as much support as you can . You have to relent your male self an build a female self ,, Its not about being weak or sissified or girly or any of those stereo types of the media an what was said in your past life .
We are just PEOPLE FIRST ,,Trans second ,, Just be the best female self you can be ,, Your still gonna be you ,, Just not the male you ,, If your kind an sweet now an live an authentic life now as you are you will do the same after transition .
If you are evil an lie an are mean an distrustful now you will be the same after transition . GIVING UP was the hardest thing for me ,, Giving in ,, Letting go of all I held dear an meaningful an was my shield of armor . My costume ,, My identity might have been a lie ,, But is was the best lie I had . An the more I ran from her the bigger that lie got an the stronger an better was the costume . It took over 40 years to put that costume together . anyone work on a Halloween costume for over 40 years ? AN ,, Letting all those surpressed feelings out ,, Learning all over to show some emotion an not bottling it all up an trying to MAN UP an finding another way to BE STRONG .
There are lots of Strong women out there ,, My SO is one of the STRONGEST female I know ,, Just because I am Bigger than her does not mean I am stronger . MAYBE PHYSICAL ,, But never Mental , I couldn't do it without her . I gave up several times an she is the one that pick me up an put her foot where it don't shine an said DO IT !
As for me its HAVE TOO TIME ,, I didn't start until I had to ,, But I will just live an learn along the way ,, An with the help from this site an all my support systems where ever I can find them along the way I will get through an will survive I guess ,, Different than I expected but what the hell ,, As Bad I as thought it was going to be in my mind how much worse could it be ?

Time was running out on my old life fast an as I look into my future I see lots of thing lsft to do an see an share with my SO ,, The one I love an the one I want to spend the rest of my life with . I get up everyday an the first thing I think of is how Dam Lucky I am to have a wife that loves me for me . An the next thing I think of is how can I make her life Better than it was yesterday . This whole Transition thing has shown me one thing that I was never aware of in my life TRUE LOVE ,, Unconditional LOVE ,,

In my life before transition all I knew in my mind was Love had a cost . Someone had to pay someway ! With Money or time or Emotion ,, But it had a price ,, An now I see that is not always the case . My is no payday for my wife here ,, Just pay her back with the same Love that she gives .

Hard for the Man Me ,, Easy for the Woman me ,, That's what I mean when I say letting go ,, Learn to Love Like a woman an you will learn how to live like a person . Have Too ? YEP ,,

[Inna]

both statements are equally tangible yet the opposing nature arises from the perspective of our times.
"Transition only when all the options have been exhausted" came from dreaded reality of transitioning amongst rigorous and frankly misunderstood subject of TransSexuality within blind societal scrutiny.
"I wish I transitioned when I still had entire life ahead of me" is as obvious as "to live the life fulfilled"

Times are changing as does the consciousness of human kind. Many more kids from 2 y.o. on come forth. Most of the parents are young enough to know or had heard of similar situation within their community. And even though this remains a tough and somewhat uneasy subject, day by day the clout of dread is lifted.

Give it another 20 years and there will not be another 40, 50, 60 y.o. transitioners but most will live their life as they should always had, without the stigma of false pretense

P.S. lets be glad we live in times we are still able to experience truth within. Only 50-60 years back such would not be possible. We are, "the lucky ones!!!"

[EvaMarie]

So please tell us, EvaMarie, what it was that you prized more than being whole but gave up to transition and don't regret?

And are you really sure that you didn't need to transition? Your words would suggest the opposite.

OK Ive given this a lot of thought... Honestly Ive given up NOTHING and I have zero regrets Actually If I could wake up tomorrow and have all of the old "guy stuff" GONE Id be very happy.... It sucks being surrounded by it all and Id Id love to move somewhere else and go 100% stealth and live a much simpler live as a woman .) Im in the process of trying to sell it all and its overwhelming.... Imagine managing your own estate sale

Like I said though I was in the fortunate position to easily do this... The $$$ is there, no wife, no kids... Ive been "retired" since I was 39.... My only fears were being disowned by my family and being seen as a freak and not being able to pass... Neither are a problem now, my family really surprised me but I never depended on them for anything so they didn't have much choice but to accept me... Its genuine love and support though and for the first time in my life me and my mother have a real connection "Passing" hasn't been a problem either thank Goddess!!! Ive been amazed by the ease Ive had just stopping the whole "man act" and living as a woman and to my surprise apparently a very pretty one

So while I can sympathize with my sisters who are less fortunate than me not everyone has to go through hell to be their true self

[Kaitlyn Michele]

lots of strawmen now.
There are of course exceptions to every rule.

Its quite important to note there is context to the statement. Without the context its way too broad of an idea

"Don't transition unless you have to" is said in either the context of suffering/loss or the context of lack of seriousness/planning/critical thought..

If you have nothing to lose, then the concept is totally meaningless.

[Anne2345]

@EvaMarie: Wow. You've got this transition thing licked, I see. Very impressive. By your words, you have no regrets, no loss, you're fully passable, you're accepted by everyone, your family loves and supports you, you're a little more than a year into HRT but have already had "VFS and full FFS," you've been able to completely stop the "man act" at the drop of a hat, you're living fulltime as a "very pretty" woman, and you didn't even HAVE to transition, rather, you made the proactive decision to just go ahead and do it because you had always "wanted" to do it. Oh, and you will be scheduling your SRS here super soon with Dr. Brassard . . . .

I've gotta give you props - very well done, and good for you.

Still, you are only 6 posts into your membership here on the forum. With the streamlined, successful, and ultra-efficient transition you have enjoyed to date, you have GOT to tell us more about yourself. And more importantly, you have got to tell us HOW you have managed to pull off all of these things in the manner in which you have. I mean, since you have such a great handle on yourself and your transition, presumably you are here to share your story and experiences with those less fortunate than you in hopes that we may benefit from it all, right?

But the thing is, neither I nor anybody else here can take anything away or benefit from your amazing story and life experiences unless you offer details and substance.

I thank you in advance, and look forward to reading more about you!! :-)

[EvaMarie]

@EvaMarie: Wow. You've got this transition thing licked, I see. Very impressive. By your words, you have no regrets, no loss, you're fully passable, you're accepted by everyone, your family loves and supports you, you're a little more than a year into HRT but have already had "VFS and full FFS," you've been able to completely stop the "man act" at the drop of a hat, you're living fulltime as a "very pretty" woman, and you didn't even HAVE to transition, rather, you made the proactive decision to just go ahead and do it because you had always "wanted" to do it.

Well thanks (I think) honestly yes its been easier that I ever thought it would be .) Why would I lie Yes ZERO regrets and ZERO loss aside from "male privilege" I dont miss much .... Of course it took a while and I know I didnt pass well at all at first but yes why is it such a stretch to think that a person 5' 7" with smaller hands and feet and an average build and a lot of effort couldn't do this after more than a year full time and after 14 months on HRT and successful VFS and FFS Im sorry I decided to transition so I could be happy and I certainly am, otherwise whats the point???

But the thing is, neither I nor anybody else here can take anything away or benefit from your amazing story and life experiences unless you offer details and substance.

I thank you in advance, and look forward to reading more about you!! :-)

Well I think there is a private forum here Id be much more comfortable going into the details in but it takes a while to join the secret club??? Im itching to see it anyway... Until then your just gonna have to put up with me without having the whole story out there .)

[Kate T]

Thankyou for your input Eva. Please forgive some of the questioning comments, there have been people on these forums before who have been less than truthful about their lives and experiences and this is quite hurtful and disrespectful to those who have had struggles and difficulties. I do hope that you are not one of those people.

Perhaps though we can go a little easier on the sarcasm directed at Eva? it would be a shame if Eva felt excluded before she has a chance to offer her story and experience.

[EvaMarie]

Hey no problem I have very thick skin you know... A sarcastic post post on an internet forum dont bother me, compared to what Ive already dealt with in life .) Transition aint for sissies I like to say

Im not saying its a cake walk for me but just that nearly all of my fears weren't that big of a deal and Im happier than I ever imagined Id be Of course Im far from done yet too and the steps get bigger and harder to do .) Im fortunate to have done very well financially at least as a "man" and that certainly helps....

I in no way meant to offend anyone who's had or having a hard time with losing their job, wife, kids ect... I can say I cant really get that but only because I never married or had kids.... I can see how the advice "dont transition unless you have too" might apply there...

After some thought.... Loss??? Yes I made 350K the last year I worked as a man.... After a couple of years and more than 100K on surgeries Im not looking forward to possibly having a hard time finding a job at Target or as a cashier at the gas station... BUT I have no regrets there... Ive yet to work as a woman but that's my next step, I'll roll with that as it goes along .) Im not bragging either just giving a few truthful details about me... Im certainly not looking to get in a pissing contest with another TS, I can hardly pee standing up without making a mess of myself anyway LOL

[Anne2345]

Well I think there is a private forum here Id be much more comfortable going into the details in but it takes a while to join the secret club??? Im itching to see it anyway... Until then your just gonna have to put up with me without having the whole story out there .)

Hmmm. You're comfortable relating to the open transsexual forum that you made $350k the last year you worked, that you have spent more than $100k on FFS and VFS, that your family loves and supports you, that you are open and out to the world, that you are selling all of your male stuff to whoever will buy it, that you are "very pretty," that you will soon have SRS performed by a well-known and well-respected doc, that you have had "ZERO regrets" and "ZERO loss," and that you are awesomely and amazingly happy, yet you won't share any of the substantive details of HOW this is and HOW you did this???

Please forgive me if I am being somewhat unreasonable here, but jeez!!! This is *really important* stuff to a lot of different folk here, me included. So to come in here just all willy nilly and completely out of the blue as you have - and offer no personal history or explanation of circumstances at all whatsoever - and to write such words and thoughts as you have (which are based upon no established foundation at all) I find to be just a wee bit reckless and a bit over the top.

But maybe that's just me, and maybe I am being completely unfair to you here. If so, I apologize . . . .