Depression and isolation in light of recent events

[PattyT]

I don't care at all about the negative legistlation. It is pure nonsense. No government is going to tell me I cannot do something that is not immoral and does not harm the people around me at all. Crossdressing is a completely personal matter as is TG. The government has no right at all to meddle with these factors. My feelings towards crossdressing remain the same. Although I live in Japan where this type of legislation would probably be unheard of, I am an American citizen and follow events in the US.
It is wrong to assume that the US or other democracies will always remain democratic and free. Democracy depends on the attitude of the people and their willingness to protest when necessary.

[Genny B]

This is a great thread! I'm 'just a cd'. I'm older and if the world of today existed 20 years ago, I would of transitioned full time. But also, I adjusted to life without giving up on it and made a life for myself. But I still enjoy that occasional escape where I can be a woman for a few hours. And I am very happy for those few hours. I'm going out this Saturday and have looked forward to it for weeks! But I will not use the bathroom while out. i'm deadly afraid. I will stay out as late as I can and then go home and run to my bathroom. I work in a very strong male ego environment and have to be careful of what I say, but I try to support our world. It's so hard, but I can't just sit there and not try to support us. But I'm sure many would say i am weak and do not really belong to this group. That''s alright. I'm used to it now. Love to all my sisters!

Genny B

[Leighcdmd]

I think that there are a few things that we should keep in mind when considering this recent spate of legislation and, more importantly, how one might react to it. It's an election year, and a truly crazy one at that. By and large, these initiatives are designed to pander to the Christian right, and, for the most part, are restricted to right leaning, largely Southern states. The laws, in and of themselves, will have scant impact on how transgendered people will be treated in those states or within the Nation at large. The trope that is employed by the proponents of these bills is that they are necessary to protect women from the imaginary threat of the sex crazed "guy in a dress" using the ladies room as his hunting grounds. The reality is that these legislative initiatives and indeed even pro TG rights initiatives will have a negligible impact on how people actually think and feel. TG people having been using their preferred public accommodations largely unnoticed for many years.....and they will continue to do so. Why? Because, for the most part, they have done so in a discrete and low key fashion. This flap will fade away.....until the next one. The overwhelming majority of Americans are too absorbed with the challenges of simply living their daily lives to even think about these issues much less even care. Bigots will always be bigots and our community needs to not overreact to them and to simply do what we have always done - go about our lives in a calm and discrete manner.

[JasmeVee]

I'm not to worried about all the fighting in regards to the issue, its just the new thing to hate/like for a bit much like earlier civil rights movements, womans voting rights, black/white weddings etc etc
It all changes, slowly
The bonus being seeing peoples real feelings on it, educate and purge being my motto
I also dont understand the tight grip on discussion about it here, are we better served with "what color are your panties right now?"
No

[barbara gordon]

This thread is so great . So many great ideas . I think These issues are critical for so many crossdressers. I hope this thread stays active for a long while .

[flatlander_48]

a non-hormone, non-op, non-fulltime, trans person

That is essentially my demographic. Fortunately it isn't necessary for me to be DeeAnn or Don all the time. It's basically the same book, but the cover changes from time to time.

My question, for people on the forum, is how do you feel about the current spate of anti-trans (and anti-LGBT) action happening in various places around the US now?

The timing is SO obvious. Transgender folks have probably been around for centuries and the first reassignment surgeries go back to the early 30's. So, the question is why didn't this wave of legislation happen 10 years ago or 25? I think the suggestion that many are pissed because the lesbians and gays got the curve ball past them with Marriage Equality is dead on. In view of that loss, we're the next target and perhaps perceived to be an easy one given the degree of confusion and misinformation, in the population at large, about us.

Similar to how images of drag queens taken during Pride events are put in front of the public for negative shock value, don't be surprised if images of the least pulled together of us start showing up on web sites and other media. It is how scare tactics work.

One point that people often forget about anti-discrimination statutes is that they actually protect everyone, and not just the named group. In the case of protections for LGBT folks, those who are PERCEIVED as LGBT are also protected and that could be anyone. In terms of the current restroom legislation, I t is possible for genetic women who look more towards androgynous and dressed somewhat male-like could be challenged. That could be our wives, sisters or daughters. Note that this has already happened. This can also happen to legitimate trans women. Now all of your documentation may be changed, but is this something you really want to get asked in front of cis-female friends? Being in stealth mode won't necessarily protect you. You can say that your presentation looks completely appropriate, but that's logic and NONE of this is logical. And what of the folks who live in Tennessee (I believe) who cannot change the gender markers on their state-issued documents?

Have recent events started to affect your feelings about your dressing, or about going out in public, or maybe even made coming out seem like maybe not such a good idea at the moment?

So far, no change. The reason I hung out with groups that were 50 and 99 miles from Corning, NY was that I didn't want to run into someone I knew. Further, if there were any restroom hassles, at least I wouldn't be close to home.

In the course of 23 years there, I met a lot of people and news TRAVELS. However, last October was the turning point for me when I came out to over 200 people, including about 130 while dressed. The total included several close friends, my then department manager and my daughter and son. I believe that coming out when I did was good timing and I don't see any difference in the climate as far as timing goes. If there were any negative repercussions, and I'm not aware of any, I also knew that I was retiring at the end of January and moving away.

Since I moved in February, I'm now about 1300 miles from my brother in Dallas and over 2000 to everyone else. Over the last 14 months before I left Corning, I was going out dressed 2 to 4 times a month. Only once did I leave my house to get dressed somewhere else, so I wasn't exactly hiding. And while DeeAnn is not on social media, I have the same username on Crossdressing, LGBT, motorsports and cycling web sites. The only place I am not flatlander_48 (with or without the _ ) is on FetLife, so if one wanted to connect the dots, it wouldn't be too difficult. While being wary of any cretins that may be walking about, this area does have a sizable LGB population and the T population is growing. This was a significant factor in deciding to move here. That is not to say that shit doesn't happen here, but there is a lot of community support. A couple of years ago, the mayor estimated the population of Palm Springs to be about 1/3 gay. So that, plus folks who live in the other 8 or so adjacent towns, makes for a significant population.

Recently I had a conversation with a trans woman who has been very active in the community for some years. She asked about my interests and what kinds of things I had been involved with previously. Among other things, I mentioned that I've been a car guy and a motorsports fan since childhood and she said that there was a car club in the community. Further, if I joined, my presence would counter some stereotypes that folks had. To me that's funny and sad at the same time. We know from various threads here that many are significantly involved with cars, motorcycles and even aircraft. This also serves as a reminder that not all of our issues are without, as some of them are clearly within.

DeeAnn

[PaulaQ]

I want to thank everyone for avoiding, mostly, political discussion. Just keep it about feelings and we'll be ok in this thread.

I do want to tell you that the calls to the trans lifeline have doubled since these issues became part of the national discussions. I can also say anecdotally that I've seen a surge in people who badly need emotional support, as has every other person who supports trans people with whom I've spoken. Depression, anxiety, suicide attempts.

It's like an evil spell has been cast, harming people outside of its direct area of effect. I guess in a sense it is an evil spell, and its name is "dehumanization."

[JasmeVee]

It is encouraging however to see the change as it happens, like espn making a stand against that hatred

[flatlander_48]

It is a powerful thing when businesses join Amicus Briefs, write letters to state governments, etc. What they realize is that when LGBT folks turn down transfers to places that lack protections or have repressive laws, EVERYBODY loses.

DeeAnn

[heatherdress]

No - I do not feel depressed or isolated. Nothing has changed.

[Amanda M]

Paula. Thank you so much for that. I know the "just a CD" feeling. More power to you.

[TinaZ]

Thank you for this thread, Paula. Sincerely, I needed to hear your message.

[Claire Cook]

Yes, Paula, thank you so much for starting this, and for your support and encouragement. Sometimes I think that we who are not transitioning and are not full-time are sort of looked down on by those of you who have, so your comments mean a lot. In terms of your question: yes, it saddens me that there is this anti-LBGT sentiment out there, but I hope this is just a vocal minority. Will it stop me from being me and going out when I want to? Absolutely not. What it does is make me value my friends who accept and encourage me all the more.

And if I am on the interstate in one of those states, I'll still use the rest area restroom appropriate for my presentation....

[erickka]

My therapist works with teens and adults like us . She is a little put off by all of this, and so am I. I don't understand why for every step forward that is taken, then they (our wonderful elected officials ) take three steps back. COME ON people, this is the 21st century, lets get with the program and deal with the real problems in the world and let people be themselves.

[Mayo]

As an occasional in-private-only CD, this sort of thing doesn't affect me directly (though, as a hairy-guy-in-a-dress, I wish I could go out in public without fear and shame), but the amount of vile hatred it demonstrates just disgusts me. As I commented in another thread, the thought of even going into the US these days makes my skin crawl. I'm glad there are voices of reason, and in the end they will win, but that's a generation down the road and more people will be killed as a result of it in the mean time.

[Stephanie47]

I just a plain vanilla in-home cross-dresser who does not feel the necessity of venturing out into the world because that's not my gig. Cross-dressing is a private affair. That being said I have a friend whose grandson is going through turmoil of figuring out his sexual identity. My wife has a cousin whose daughter is transitioning surgically to a man. I do live in a state where the legislation is all positive, although all this bathroom talk locally does appear. It is starting to really bug the shit out of me that people are so ****ing lame as to cast negative comments like confetti on subjects they have absolutely no knowledge.

Last night at dinner my wife said to me she thought my viewpoints were becoming more "liberal" because I am vocalizing more and more about transgender issues. I told her this is not a liberal issue. As someone who is somewhat conservative, especially when it comes to fiscal issues, a conservative really wants the government out of peoples lives. The government really should have no stake in who marries who. I railed out against these folks who are demonstrating their innate hostility towards transgender men and women using "perverts invading" the bathrooms (Ted Cruz) when one could raise the issue of plain old modesty..i.e., not wanting their young daughters seeing anyone's male genitals in a woman's locker room. I told her that may be a legitimate issue to resolve, not equating transgender men/women to perverts.

So, has it affected me or caused me to change something about me.... yes, I'll be in your face if you are going to act espouse hatred toward anyone.

[ChristinaK]

This really is a great thread; many different thoughts about it. We used to be pretty much off the radar for most people and probably still are. In the past, people would look at me, or through me, not even contemplating who I was or my gender. Due to MY perception, now I feel more at odds with the people around me; paranoid about people now paying attention where they didn't in the past. I don't think that's a rational feeling, but I can't help the way I feel now. We have been spotlighted and it has affected the way I feel when I go out. That being said, nobody has seemed to pay more attention than usual.

I have to use the bathroom a lot; can't help it. So, I've used multi-stall bathrooms many times and only once did a woman really eye me critically, not in a hostile manner, but she was my height with broad shoulders, hmmm. However, now that I feel we're being scrutinized, it makes me more nervous to use the Ladies Room. That's a shame. I don't think there will be any issues as most people just mind their own business and won't want to ask us for our "transgender card" to see if we're allowed or not, but just being the topic of discussion makes me nervous.

My sister and wife are totally against TG's using the wrong restroom. We're perverts. Young girls will be molested or worse! Couldn't that happen now? What's to keep a pervert from doing that now? Well, when it's legal, you'll see it all the time! I don't think this issue is going away in the near future and I think the legal arguments are going to the top in some states. If we do have to carry a card, I don't think anyone would ever ask for it, so those of us that don't carry a card don't have to worry about it.

Now, even in a very liberal state they are attempting to get the issue on a ballot so the voters themselves can decide the issue. Given the attitude of most people I've talked to about it, we're in for trouble. If they make it strictly illegal for us to use the Ladies Room, I guess I'm in for a rough time as I will still use the Ladies Room. There's no way Christina is going to use the Men's Room fully dressed. Talk about a safety issue, there's one.

I kind of wish they had left the sleeping dog lye on the issue.

[Sarah Doepner]

I don't feel isolated or depressed but I am angry and frustrated. This current trend in legislation is resulting in a few things that I find troubling.

First, there are already laws on the books addressing the offenses they are highlighting, so the laws are not about behavior, they are targeting a population which I'm sure is going to be found as unconstitutional.

Second, it has given the haters a boost and encouraged them to voice their opinions, and in many circumstances create their own facts. At the same time those who accept and respect the Trans community are growing in number. This is polarizing the issue and making progress toward common sense, fact-based solutions more difficult. I'd just hate to see this become as intransigent as abortion or wilderness where neither side is either willing or able to compromise on anything.

Finally, and this is on us, as we attempt to refute those who are advocating for those bathroom laws we throw up images of trans people who could be icons of the binary world. For every Andreja or Laverne there are scores (maybe hundreds) of us who aren't even close to that level of feminine beauty. For those of us who struggle to create a presentation that allows us to blend, those images create an expectation of perfection. For both the trans and the straight world that creates a level that is difficult to achieve. I'd like to see more examples and images of crossdressers who are really trying their best or of trans people who aren't all the way through with their transition and aren't perfectly passable in their presentation but are perfectly passable as citizens.

Thank you Paula for starting this thread.

[JayeLefaye]

I’ve already posted a couple of short responses. I kept them short because I wanted to take the necessary time to properly express my more in-depth thoughts before posting them. I will add a P.S. at the end to explain where I’m coming from because I want to keep these comments concise.

I trust Paula to correct anything that I’m now about to write:

It seems to me that Paula, a “Group Leader”, was prompted to start this thread due to this quote of hers:

“I just had a person leave my support group because they felt that as a non-hormone, non-op, non-fulltime, trans person, maybe even as "just a CD", that THEY are part of the reason some of these current tactics are being employed against all trans people.”

That breaks my heart. So here is my suspicion of why that poor soul felt that way: They are a CD. A simple CD….And probably read too many on-line “comments”. While it is informative to read the “news accounts”, the “comments” are mostly vile. And to be honest, even some of the “news” can be discouraging, and not always from the sources that we might initially think.

I read one yesterday from an “LGB” source that said it’s time for the LGB’s to separate themselves from the T’s!!!! And this was not the first time I’ve seen/read/heard this opinion….But I’ll let that go for another thread because I don’t want to sidetrack this one.

But I have also read a couple of comments on this, most Safest of Sites, that said, and I’ll paraphrase: Everything was going fine for us plain old CD’s until someone pushed the boundaries too far and prompted all of these new laws and made it uncomfortable for the rest of us “proper” CD’s.

In other words, all of these laws can be blamed on the initial victim, which is akin to saying:
“It’s not my fault I raped that girl. Did you see how short her skirt was?”

In my very, very, humble opinion, the “CD-only” member of Paula’s Group who dropped out did so because her “skirt was too short” and others were paying the price for it…How skewed is that?!?!?!?!????

I hope HE comes back to the Support Group.

I hope I’m expressing myself properly…XOXOX to ALL!!!!!

Jaye

P.S….I am just a CD, with a fair amount of “Gender-Fluid” tendencies, and live in NC. My wife is a therapist with several LGBTQ clients…A lot has been going on lately…Eventually I truly do believe that the end results will be positive…But along the way, it hurts, it just hurts….

P.P.S....As a helpful hint to several of the responders here....Please scroll down and check out the "Media Forum", where "legal" issues are being dealt with in depth. You won't be sorry, I promise!

[Amy Fakley]

I think what's the worst part of it, that some of us listen to these trumped up criticisms from those in power, and take them to heart. As if we, as a community just "pushed our agenda too far and these entirely reasonable people in the world can't condone it"

That is complete horse crap!

We as a community were minding our own damn business in the bathroom, and had been since forever. Cis-folk have been sharing public facilities with us for their whole lives. There was no spike in 'incidents' that prompted this. As a community, we were not "bullying the majority" on this issue as the apologetic talking heads constantly claim, even in the slightest.

THEY came after US. Viscously, and relentlessly. It's plain as day why ... they needed a new boogeyman to scare up votes in an election year, with zero regard for how that rhetoric will effect innocent, law abiding citizens. None whatsoever. They seek to use me as a pawn in their craven little game of politics.

They are in the wrong. Not us.

I know it's hard. I feel isolated, threatened, and depressed too ... but one thing I absoloutely won't do is internalize these bogus criticisms from these thoughtless thugs running for elected office. They are accomplished used car salesmen at best, and pure evil at worst, and I will never respect their opinions about me and how I live my life, even if they do manage to convince others to do so.

[JayeLefaye]

What Amy said:-)!!!!

Jaye

P.S...On my real-life Facebook page, which I don't visit very often, I've focused on these issues a lot lately, without anyone knowing that I'm a CD.....100% approval for "acceptance" and pissed-offedness against the hate-mongerers....I've receive nothing but positive responses from folks who have no "dog in the fight", but understood a partial quote that I mentioned that begins with "First they came for me"....

Bottom line? There are tons of Muggles out there who understand: "First they came for me"....And those Muggles will defend that quote because they understand what it means....Good for them...:-))))), eh???

Jaye

[PaulaQ]

There are a lot of practical reasons I support the rights of the CD community, and consider your identity and expressions as valid as I consider my own:
1. Most of us who undergo medical transition don't pass at first.
2. Many of us who could pass will only do so with extensive facial surgery that is often beyond our means to obtain
3. For a good number of us, even with that, we still don't pass well
4. Some CDs transition, so discrimination against them is discrimination against trans women
5. The black hats don't distinguish between us anyway

So practically speaking, for an outside observer, there is often little to distinguish someone in medical transition from someone who isn't in medical transition. And very few of us pass when we begin, so if CDs aren't safe in public, most of us can't really safely medically transition either. So our interests are aligned.

All of that is well and good, but it isn't why I support your rights, same as I support my own.

The reason I support your rights is this - it is the only right and moral thing to do!

There are a lot of transsexuals who view themselves as being somehow "better" or "more deserving of rights" than a CD. I think those sentiments are absolutely deplorable and hypocrisy of the worst kind. Who am I to demand respect for MY gender, and then turn around and deny that respect to someone else?

I will be discussing this with my support group next week. I've heard talk I don't like, and I am NOT going to tolerate people bringing in horrible attitudes from the cisgender world. And equating CDs with sex predators us every bit as evil and wrong as calling a TS like me a sexual predator.

To the CDs out there who hear this stuff "we're better than them", or "we're not like those CDs!" from TSs, I apologize on behalf of my community. Some of us, suffering from internalized transphobia and a desire to deflect this horrible stuff away from us at any cost. We fear being seen as pretending to be women. Others resent your "privilege" - you can switch back to boy mode when the going gets tough. These ideas are just wrong headed, and based in fear for the most part.

I know CDs though. I've talked with many of you, I've seen the pain in your eyes, most of you do not have easy lives. Leading a double life, as most of you do is not a privilege. Living in fear of discovery is awful - I know because that was my life for so long. I get it. And so I support y'all too.

[mykell]

great now you went and made me weepy, thanks alot, im not even dressed.

so seriously that has had to be the sweetest thing i have read here in a looooong time,
thank you soo much paula !!!!

[JayeLefaye]

You go Paula!!!!

We support, and love ya too!!!!

Thank you, Paula...Seriously...Thank you! Tears are in my eyes as I write this. I hope someone reaches out to your local, individual CD!

Love & Hope

Jaye

Jaye

[SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]

great now you went and made me weepy, thanks alot, im not even dressed.

so seriously that has had to be the sweetest thing i have read here in a looooong time,
thank you soo much paula !!!!

Oh, Mikell...You are such a softy:-)...Glad you weren't dressed...At least you didn't hafta worry about your make-up running:-)

Jaye(insert knucklebump here)Lefaye

[sometimes_miss]

My question, for people on the forum, is how do you feel about the current spate of anti-trans (and anti-LGBT) action happening in various places around the US now?

I think it's great that we're finally getting a good idea of how many people that hate us are actually out there, and get to see which politicians are the horrible people we always suspected they were. Stuff coming up for votes, these hateful 'representitives of the people' now are showing themselves to all the world for the rotten, lying, bigoted jerks that they are. The down side? We're also having to face how many lunatics in the general population support all those people in power that would happily see us dead. It's one thing to read a random nasty post in a web page thread about lgbt rights; it's another, entirely, to see these elected officials making laws that can intentionally expose us to the wrath of people who want us dead.