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Thread: Tolerance

  1. #26
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    We all speak and post from our own experience. It is not specific to crossdressing or gay people. Join a forum on cars or boats and it's the same thing.

    We also have our individual likes and dislikes. We don't drop those when we strap on a pair of boobs. Some of these likes and dislikes we should probably keep to ourselves but sometimes people push us until we can't keep them inside any more.

    And, as a couple members pointed out, there are some real "bullies" on this forum (see Traci G's post above). People who are going to come back and harass you if you post something they don't agree with. This goes back to my first statement about posting from your own experience without any understanding of the fact that others may have different experiences.

  2. #27
    Platinum Member Beverley Sims's Avatar
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    I find the diversity here invigorating and if I put a view forward others will either correct me or show their own point of view in a caring manner.

    Like Traci has said the TS section is very militant and if you put a foot wrong there you are blown out of the sky.

    Sadly I always drew the wrong conclusions or said the wrong thing.

    An explanation would have been helpful instead......

    Cliques and tribes will always be with us I think..

    That's why we show tolerance and above all..... Interest.
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  3. #28
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    Militant is a good way to describe it Beverley.
    Its found on every forum sadly.
    I was on a site that is more populated by the younger generation say 19 thru 30 most are TG and some are TS and a few have had SRS and fully transitioned.
    I answered a young CD's question and within seconds this militant bunch was on me telling me I didn't know shit and how hard life is even called a dumb **** and told to shut the hell up so yeah there are real ahole activists out there.
    Basically went off on a few of the nastier members and they showed their colors. I got PM after PM from members thanking me for calling those girls out.
    A mod PM'd me and said I was banned for 24 hrs and the 3 post op girls got a permanent ban.
    I never went back.
    Basically we are all different and will probably never agree on all things but lets at least me nice to each other.
    Last edited by Tracii G; 05-13-2016 at 08:18 AM.

  4. #29
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    An example:

    I recently got told by a member here that as a crossdresser, I wasn't "qualified" to use the ladies restroom at Target because I wasn't "transgender". I was told to use the men's room even though I was dressed as and presenting as a woman.

  5. #30
    Silver Member Tina_gm's Avatar
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    Sadly not surprising. Because they are "such a woman" they are almost legitimizing the crap laws that are trying to be written. I have read more than once from someone who has fully transitioned, thanks to the help and acceptance from the medical profession and mental health profession that has given this transitioned person the life they seek, then that transitioned person now feels they don't want to associate themselves with "you people"

    Don't stop taking your hormones there honey....
    Last edited by Tina_gm; 05-13-2016 at 10:22 AM.
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  6. #31
    Silver Member CynthiaD's Avatar
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    The thing I find most disappointing in some of the threads here is the automatic flaming that gets triggered by certain comments. The most blatant is when some well-meaning person encourages others to get out and about instead of remaining closeted. Such remarks, which are obviously aimed only at those who desire to go out but don't, always seem to attract a whole slew of nasty comments.

    There are other things that are even more disappointing. Some threads seem to suggest that there is only one "tolerance mindset." If you don't turn off your brain and march in lock-step with that mindset, you are by definition a narrow-minded bigot.

    But posting nasty comments is self-defeating. It won't make you happy. It won't make you feel good about yourself. It will just make you angry and bitter. We're all flawed. We're all human. We're all stupid about some things. True tolerance of others means accepting the bad along with the good. If you disagree with someone, it's ok to say so, but do it kindly.

  7. #32
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    There's a lot of anger on here
    Where's the tolerance now

    Yeah the TS section can be tough, was the same when I first joined there. Probably too harsh at times but it's a tough life being TS and Transitioning.
    Feels like a hell of a fight to establish your identity so I hope you can understand why we can be over defensive at times.
    Sometimes I'm guilty of being annoyed and speaking my mind, sometimes I'm also wrong. You have to work hard at not feeling bitter and it's just an opinion at the end of the day.

    Doesn't help that text can be read completely different to how you meant it.

    I've been called out before and I'm trying harder not to generalise, because it's true one dumbarse doesn't represent everyone.

    Goes both ways though, TS are constantly attacked for elitism and other stuff.

    What you forget is if I'm responding to a thread it's probably because it's genuinely interesting, with some really great input from CDers and I post on one comment I disagree with or feel isn't right.
    That isn't a comment aimed at every poster.
    However this has made me think. I should make more effort to support the good stuff, only commenting when I disagree is on reflection more negative than positive input.

    Tracii, Gendermutt, Heatherdress I agree with some of what you say but you're also coming across as bitter and opinionated. It's easily done and escalates quickly, face to face we may have a really good convo but on here it seems more of an argument.
    You have to be pretty gifted with language to stand your ground and express your point of view without offending someone using only this format. No one can tell if you're angry, hurt, joking etc etc.

    Mayo I liked your post

    Edit: Well said Cynthia you should proof read my posts lol.
    Last edited by becky77; 05-13-2016 at 11:11 AM.

  8. #33
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    Becky its hard not to be bitter about it when for no reason a post op girl jumps down your throat and calls you names and being very nasty towards you.
    I'm tired of being told I'm not "real" or I'm not "down for the struggle" or the std " you aren't a real TG you are just a guy in a dress" with shitty make up."
    If hormones make some of you that bitchy its not my fault maybe you need anger management training.
    I'll put it this way its not just here on this forum its across the board with post op girls online.
    I still support you girls for doing what is right for you to live your life but it would be nice if some would "remember where they came from" and stopped treating others like crap.
    Last edited by Tracii G; 05-13-2016 at 12:22 PM.

  9. #34
    Senior Member Nikkilovesdresses's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gina shiney View Post
    I have noted that a couple of members (in my short time here) haven't been posting since they were (in my opinion) torn apart.
    I know this to be true- I've spoken to two members with personal experience of it. But this site is just a microcosm of real life, and in real life people aren't always considerate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zooey View Post
    I think some of the conversations that happen here are gross, That's when I show up.
    There's nothing wrong with making a point, but the way we choose to make that point can have a powerful effect. This isn't a shooting gallery, it's a support site. Perhaps rather than 'showing up' you could make the point by starting a thread and inviting comments?
    Last edited by Nikkilovesdresses; 05-13-2016 at 12:55 PM.
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  10. #35
    Little Mrs. Snarky! Nadine Spirit's Avatar
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    This site is not solely a support site.

    It tends to be supportive if:
    - you don't ever say anything that is controversial
    - you conform to the majority
    - you never say anything that anyone ever does is wrong

    For example I have observed many that are not supported because:
    - they take clothes that are not theirs
    - they do not conform to other's sexual thoughts
    - they are not the right type of CD or TS

    But honestly, I don't know if that is a bad thing. Is it wrong to not support someone who steals? I don't think so. But is it wrong to not support someone who does not express their gender variance the same way you do? That I think is wrong. But what am I talking about? Opinions. There are no clear cut rights and wrongs when it comes to opinions. And that is the difficult thing.

  11. #36
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    Fact of the matter is we are all here for the same reason. At some point in our lives we all found out we were different. Whether you are TS, TG, CD, gender fluid what ever you identify with. You are in a small minority of the population and you are looking for like minded understanding poeple. Of course with any large group of poeple there is going to be differences of opinion. What Noone wants is to be made to feel like they are less of a person because they are not like you. We have all gone through that enough in our lives. If I wanted someone to tell me I am a freak of nature and laugh at me I would go into a redneck biker bar and tell them all I am a crossdresser, we are not here for that. Everyone here has a level of comfort and a point where they are happy to say they are wrong because that dosen't match you is not acceptance or tollerance. Truth is I have felt more excepted in general public then I have here at times and it really makes you wonder sometimes. How can we complain about not being accepted then not accept others because they are different it's not how it works. A man wearing a skirt dose not take away the acceptance of a trans girl as it has been said here. If poeple start seeing guys wearing skirts then it is less of a leap for them when they see the trans person. Think about it thenumbers say about 10 percent of men crossdress this includes transgender I belive, most of those hide it from those closest to them and nearly all from everyone. So what like 5 percent of the general non crossdressing population has any interaction with crossdressers don't know if that is accurate but I'm sure it is a small portion. So a guy gose out wearing a skirt is seen by 100 poeple who have never seen a cross dresser. He acts like any other guy dosen't bother anyone dosen't do anything strange. Then a few weeks later they see another guy crossdressed they are less likely to go all crazy because now it is not so strange. Why would the guy trying to look like a girl be any different then the guy in a dress. I have seen this first hand when I worked retail the first guy wearing a skirt the whole store was all going crazy, there is a guy wearing a skirt in here then the cd can in a few weeks later she looked good but didn't pull off fully passing poeple knew but Noone made a big deal out of it. When I was told about the guy wearing a skirt I just looked at the guy telling me said ok was he cute? Do you want me to get his number see if he is interested in you? For me it was a non issue for them it was a big deal we never seen a guy wearing a skirt before what's wrong with him? It you want acceptance and tollerance then you must accept and tolerate others.

  12. #37
    its important mykell's Avatar
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    hi consuela, "comfort" right, i welcome as many as i can here when they take the plunge and decide to hit the join button, big step, i tell them this is a comfortable place to share and learn about our"selves", their is a lot to learn, we may never figure it all out and for the most part we all get along.

    new members that are novices want to start posts to get acclimated are routinely pounced on, those eager to blow out they're candle, generalizations, self professed experts, we have bigots among us, homophobes and transphobes in this very thread....i can prove it so dont temp me. vile remarks made by and to some, stereotypes, misunderstanding posts and what they mean, posting any nonsense that has nothing to do with the topic (to boost post count ?) and in my case the inability to compose my thoughts concisely on occasion, maybe even now.

    or perhaps something like this : Chinese whispers which one person whispers a message to another, which is passed through a line of people until the last player announces the message to the entire group. Errors typically accumulate in the re-tellings, so the statement announced by the last player differs significantly, and often amusingly, from the one uttered by the first. Reasons for changes include anxiousness or impatience, erroneous corrections, the difficult-to-understand mechanism of whispering, and that some players may deliberately alter what is being said to guarantee a changed message by the end of the line. kinda like this thread.

    sound familiar, but were not players, now at this point some are not actually responding to the OP. right. (I’m trying for both, the OP and some comments), its usually not amusing like the game above because we live in reality and ones reality is not anothers reality. its the internet take it from where it is coming from.

    quickish story, irish-fest, good times right, (stereotype), off the parkway in my state next to a vietnam memorial, we veered over to visit the memorial before the fest real quick, this particular day someone the previous night had taken a dead rats, decapitated them and ran around the whole perimeter of the memorial and left a trail of blood around the whole place.....custodial crew was cleaning it and discussing it while doing so.

    we noticed that their were obviously family and service people who had come to touch the names engraved in the walls of those they knew or a loved one they lost, i looked at my wife and told her i would never come back, i exclaimed this was not built for me. i dont feel comfortable here.

    so to a fault right zooey, i can understand why the TS sections were created, i can relate to the TS folk that water there, but for me I dont feel comfortable there, my choice and reasoning.

    many that water in the MtF CD section take an aback feeling when its inferred that they by definition are include it the general transgender umbrella definition and feel insulted by it. some adamantly deny any association to the LGBT, not a good ally. so why should LGBT folks advocate for them. it seems they only want to be part of the group when its convenient for them. guilty, my hands up ive done it, but ive learned here and at my support group….look someone in the eye and tell them theyre not a women just because the had reassignment surgery to become who they knew who they were all along, that goes the other way too, or see theyre joy when they have the name change.

    hey crossdressing is fun, crossdressing in the real world is daunting, being TS in the real world is ?..... hell i cant tell you, its not my reality. but when i go to the TS section and read posts it brings me back to the Vietnam memorial…..i just dont belong there.

    undoubtedly im about to be unfriended again but…..this thread is labeled tolerance….

    tolerance or respect, is not guaranteed, its earned….so reflect about what you have personally done to advance tolerance or respect here or in real life compared to others here who lay it on the line and walk the walk....we owe them our gratitude especially when for reasons we all have or had to not be personally able to advocate for ourselves. not judging anybody, i do what I can and understand why some can't but will give others the props they deserve when they pick up the slack.

    some folks dont take the time to read, trust what others are trying to convey, sometimes pointedly but with sincerity, for our own good. some are really nasty about it and could care less.

    if you look at this from the TS side were a fairly silly lot of twits sometimes babbling on and on how we’re women this and just like a women that and meantime therye out there advocating on our behalf to advance things to better life for us all while most of us hide in plain site like a silly teenage girl, (stereotype) i could see why there is some anger.

    i cant speak of anyones ill treated experience with the TS section or TS folks in that section but i felt wiser steering clear of it. and militant may be a little severe.

    look at the comments about hormones just today and you wonder why their is a comment on misogamy (yea i had to google it the first time she used it.)
    i pulled an example of misogamy thats seen here:
    http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...re-a-girl-when
    sorry to the OP for singling out this thread, like i said crossdressing is fun.
    and another ….
    http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...ou-were-a-girl
    silly stuff. again sorry to the OP.
    has anyone been to the picture forum, look at the posts of those who present sexy to the amount of posts to the plain janes and then to the ones no one posts to, see....we fall all over ourselves to post in the pretty girls threads, how manly. hands up, ive done it too...

    i have been communicating with zo for a few weeks, she is a compassionate, educated, curious, demanding, tolerant, dedicated, and faithful women. id be proud to call her a friend, even prouder to take a seat and pee next to her, (its between us), she has made me see things in myself i was blind to. i think if we want her to advocate on our behalf she deserves our respect, but i also think we deserve hers. so if you read her post she says she doesn't like when folks demean women, now i dont know if heather and zooey have a history in another thread but thats between them, but zo has a right to her opinion. it may be ruff around the edges but she's not the only one here like that and she is an ally for us.

    as far as going through the surgical door and coming thru another person, how would i know ? how many young men went to vietnam or any war for that matter and came back the same person ? how many are on this forum ? are we all gonna live in utopia now and sing kumbaya, nope, but lets just try to respect each other a little better going forward….change is good……we have to change how we perceive each other before we change folks perception of us in the wild....

    oh and just for the record and perspective i was terrified of zooey a few months ago. but now when she makes me think it hurts my brain....
    Last edited by mykell; 05-14-2016 at 06:32 AM.
    ....Mykell
    i dressed like a girl and i liked it! crossdressing...theirs an app for that

  13. #38
    I accept myself as is Gillian Gigs's Avatar
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    The road is long from discrimination to tolerance. It is also long between tolerance and acceptance. All humans are different, the irony is that some of us who are discriminated against do the same thing to others! Some things will never change. If we can't find love and acceptance here, where will we find it?
    I like myself, regardless of the packaging that I may come in! It's what is on the inside of the package that counts!

  14. #39
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    mikell, thank you for that - I appreciate it, and it wasn't necessary for you to say that. There are a couple of things I want to clarify though.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikell View Post
    so if you read her post she says she doesn't like when folks demean women, has anyone been to the picture forum, look at the posts of those who present sexy to the amount of posts to the plain janes and then to the ones no one posts to, see....
    I have no problem whatsoever with whatever folks want to wear, and I don't really care if you take pictures of it. I don't think that's necessarily demeaning to women. If anything, it's appropriation, and the often sexualized aspect of it makes that a bit more challenging but in and of itself I don't care.

    My only issue is when CDs start to conflate their version of femininity with the experiences of actual women, try to explain how we're totally the same, or project their fantasy image on us. That's when it becomes demeaning. When I mention that, it's not the picture posts. It's stuff like...

    • Women never dress sexy (like women, like a woman should, etc.) anymore
    • I'm so much more girly than most women I see
    • Does anybody else get the urge to do girly activities, y'know like vacuuming the house, when you're dressed?
    • I'm such a girl, I own like 200 pairs of panties and 50 bras
    • It's so great how we understand women so much better than other men because we know how to do makeup, walk in heels, etc.
    • Etc.

    Speaking specifically to the CDs...

    Be you. Embrace your brand of femininity. But you don't have to do it by projecting your fantasy onto the lives of actual women and/or judging their experience against your desires. If you want to understand women more deeply, listen to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikell View Post
    oh and just for the record and perspective i was terrified of zooey a few months ago. but now when she makes me think it hurts my brain...
    I'm sorry for any increases in your Advil spending this month.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nikkilovesdresses View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Zooey
    I think some of the conversations that happen here are gross, That's when I show up.
    That is an incredibly misleading edit of what I actually wrote. For the record, the bit preceding that comma actually showed up as...
    Quote Originally Posted by Zooey
    I could care less about men wearing dresses, panties, makeup, or whatever they want. I say you do you, let your freak flag fly, and make it happen. I think some of the conversations that happen here are gross, but I don't go into them to disrupt because it usually doesn't have any bearing on the life of an actual woman (except your SOs). I read a lot; I jump into threads on this side of the forum relatively rarely.


    Quote Originally Posted by gendermutt View Post
    Don't stop taking your hormones there honey....
    Thank you, I won't, because - having dealt with them before - menopausal symptoms are a bitch.

    Quote Originally Posted by heatherdress View Post
    Most crossdressers on this site overwhelmingly admire, love, respect their spouses and SOs. Most crossdressers show total respect and admiration for women in general.
    I never said you didn't admire, love, and respect your spouses. I was trying to say that the version of femininity that is often expressed here through your dressing is frequently glorifying the things that most women either don't have time for in the real world, or alternatively, have worked hard over decades to eliminate the expectation of them doing. My suggestion was that you may find you get more support if you either embrace a version of femininity that feels more relatable and/or respectful to the experiences of actual women, or at the very least, don't try to conflate it with the lives of actual women, or worse, how you think they should be living.
    Last edited by Zooey; 05-13-2016 at 10:02 PM.
    Coming out is like discovering that you've been drowning your whole life after actually breathing air for the first time.

  15. #40
    Silver Member Rogina B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nashmau View Post

    So yes i can understand your frustration, but the fact is still lgb and T have different concerns, needs and unique problems.
    But,we do have common ground. We are not "the norm" and we often disappoint others expectations of us if we are out to them. Most CD's keep it a secret so this doesn't apply to many however I find that alphabet kids can play well together on the same playground.

  16. #41
    Silver Member AmandaM's Avatar
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    I've heard this forum has a "reputation" for being less tolerant than other forums. There are a lot of different people here. We should be free to express our opinions without fear of attack.

  17. #42
    Aspiring Member Genny B's Avatar
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    We as a group, of which I include myself, really need to be more tolerant of each other. Knowing we all are different you would think it would be automatic, but it's not. Is it because everyone wants to be sure they are doing their best at this and find confirmation by finding ways others are not? Again, I include myself in this as I remember over hearing two fellow members talking badly about a third who had 'hairy arms' as their wife didn't want then to remove arm hair. I have since learned we all do our best. What more could anyone ask? We just need to be accepting of what others can do?

    Genny B
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  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by CONSUELO View Post
    Why do we tend to "atomize" like this into narrow cliques and tribes? I have always liked this site because of the wide range of interests in cross dressing that it represents. I like having GG's and transexuals here who share their challenges and journeys. Long may it stay that way.
    It's like that everywhere. There will always be individuals who cannot understand or respect people who are different than them. You see this with race, religion, politics, education (for example a lot of people disrespect intellectual people whom they consider are "uppity"), social class, and yes, gender identity and sexual orientation too.

    Thankfully, not everyone within a social group feels this way.
    Reine

  19. #44
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    Consuelo,
    I'm not going to tar everyone with the same brush but I've found the gay community to be an introvert group, if you don't belong to their exclusive club then don't bother them.
    A good male friend gave me a talking to about my CDing and the gay community, it's something most people don't want to talk about .
    This is why this forum is so useful , we can talk about things that bother us and hopefully things we find amusing. I admit that I may have spoken out of ignorance on some subjects but then many are guilty of that. We should accept being corrected but I'm afraid some members are too venomous with their comments, it is a help forum not a punishment one, there are ways of replying to people without flaming them.

    I'm sure many of us have poured our heart out at some point and hesitated to hit the post button and then hope everyone sees your point of view. I'm afraid the one reply with unnecessarily harsh words is the one that sticks in your mind for days and you don't want to return to the forum for fear of being hurt again.
    Sometimes I do wonder what some members joined for, they hide behind a cartoon avatar and an odd name and then dish out venom only to disappear again without having the decency or good manners to accept a matching reply, maybe they just get off on that !

  20. #45
    its important mykell's Avatar
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    like i said to a fault....
    Quote Originally Posted by Zooey View Post
    mikell, thank you for that - I appreciate it, and it wasn't necessary for you to say that. There are a couple of things I want to clarify though.
    ......................all the other stuff she wrote.....................
    yea i did have to say that, i owe you that much.
    Quote Originally Posted by mikell View Post
    .................................beginning........ .............
    i pulled an example of sillly misogynistic stuff thats seen here:
    http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...re-a-girl-when
    sorry to the OP for singling out this thread, like i said crossdressing is fun.
    and another ….
    http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...ou-were-a-girl
    silly stuff. again sorry to the OP.
    has anyone been to the picture forum, look at the posts of those who present sexy to the amount of posts to the plain janes and then to the ones no one posts to, see....we fall all over ourselves to post in the pretty girls threads, how manly. hands up, ive done it too...
    ....................end.......................
    i pulled the part of this quote and placed it in better context, like i said my brain hurts....better by pfizer stock.....
    ....Mykell
    i dressed like a girl and i liked it! crossdressing...theirs an app for that

  21. #46
    Silver Member Tina_gm's Avatar
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    FTR- my comment "don't stop taking your hormones" was not directed at Zooey, or anyone in particular. Just anyone who is or has transitioned and does not want to be considered part of transgender anymore. I am going to try an analogy. Bare with me, its early and I am dealing with some sinus allergy stuff this am, so this may come off a bit weird ok.


    Let's say we are all just by being born put into the "gender building" Cis gender is on the bottom floor, a huge lobby and that is where a vast majority of people are.
    Then you have those who don't feel right being in the lobby. There is only one elevator that goes up. Anyone who feels the need to go to a higher floor has to take the one elevator.
    On the 1st few floors are the "just a crossdresser" dude in a dress. They like the dressing, maybe some feminine like behaviors associated, maybe they like the sexual feelings, whatever, but they still identify as the gender they were born as.
    Some, most will 1st get off on those 1st few floors. Hey, the closer you are to the lobby, the more "normal" you are, and heights can be scary for most too. We don't want to go higher if we don't have to.
    for some of us, those 1st few floors don't match who we are either, so we get back in the elevator, and go up to the middle floors. Here, still crossdressed, but the gender now is not defined so clearly. It can be confusing in these middle floors. Not really men, not really women either. A little of both, or neither perhaps. In these middle floors there are also a few side rooms, non binary etc etc. Here in these middle floors you will find a lot of people that don't always know if they should go up higher, go back down lower, or stay where they are.
    (you do get some of the people who are on the lower floors who will ride up toward the top or the very top) and "think" because they got on the elevator and that they dress, they are more like the people who are up on the higher or top floors. In reality though, they really aren't.
    So some will find where they need to be on the middle floors, but others will figure out they still need to go to a higher floor still. So back in the elevator they go.... and now it is really getting up there, toward the top. A few floors below the top, close to being a woman, definitely more like a woman than a man, but not all the way there, don't need the surgeries and what not. Probably a very confusing place as well I would imagine. Still there are those that know they need the penthouse suite, the top floor, women only.

    We are in a sense all the same in that we all must get on the elevator to get to a different floor than all of those that are in the lobby. the fact that we are above the lobby makes us connected simply by being higher. We are all different in that we have a floor that is best for who we are. It can be confusing as to which floor we need to be on at times. Sometimes we go higher than we really need to be and then can go back down to a floor that better suits us. Sometimes we need to see the view of the higher floors to see if that is where we need to be, realize it is too high, and go back down a few floors.

    We should recognize we are all different, even those who are on the same floor. Recognize and respect those differences. We should definitely respect the differences of those on higher or lower floors, and not feel we are better because we are on a higher or lower floor, or even the huge crowd of people in the lobby for that matter. None of us as humans are "better" than any other due to which floor we are on. Granted, there are a lot of people in the lobby who will feel they are superior people because they never got on the elevator. But that is their problem not ours, so long as we do not allow them to dictate where we go.

    Occasionally, someone from the penthouse may have to put someone from one of the lower levels back in their place, but hopefully let them know too that hey, if you ever feel you need to be here, I will be here to help you. It is a long way up, and a lot to go through to get here. Just be sure you are ready to be here. Same goes for the confusing middle floors. Same goes for the lower floors.

    To those on the ground floor, anyone who gets in the elevator becomes "one of them" to us, we can also say, "you are one of us", by virtue of being above the ground floor. We can help each other find which floor is best suited for each other. Some will stop at every floor, others will shoot up to the top hardly stopping at any floor. No matter which floor we are on, we can still be friends with anyone on any floor, even those who are ok with us down in the lobby.
    Chickens should be allowed to cross the road without having their motives questioned

  22. #47
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    GM its the ones that shoot up to the top hardly stopping that seem to forget there are other floors or levels in the building.
    If you are not on their level somehow you are not authentic.
    I can safely say the most hateful comments I have gotten on here have come from post ops and I really hate to say it but I wonder if they will ever be happy in their lives.
    If you will notice they even fight among themselves in threads.
    Last edited by Tracii G; 05-14-2016 at 08:59 AM.

  23. #48
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    I love your analogy; it makes perfect sense to me. I'm thinking maybe my husband is just as confused as I am (he's stuck somewhere in the middle). Maybe?

  24. #49
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    Tracii, I think that is just part of what happens to humans in general, sadly. They get to the top of wherever, whatever, and an elitist mentality takes over. I have been a member of a fairly prestigious golf club. For me, it was all about playing the course, and I didn't associate much with most other members. I did notice though, a sense of coldness among many of them. A constant background upsmanship among them.

    When I live in CA some 30 years ago, I lived near my aunt and uncle. None of us had any money at the time. But many saturday nights, we would play these epic games of pitch. we played in teams for nickles. Drank copious amounts of wine out of the box. My uncle has now passed on, but I remember one particular night, the wine was flowing, he was my partner, maxes out the bid... he leads out with a Jack, looks at me and says, I am going to need a lot of help partner. I laugh and cry still thinking of those memories. We had nothing but each other and it was some of the funnest times of my life.

    [SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]

    I certainly cannot guarantee anything Sally, but it is likely. In my analogy, you will find a great many CDers on the lower levels, very fetish oriented, and typically the ones who become the girl for the night or however long. They really transform into this"other" person. They often have different likes or tastes in just about everything. Almost like a split personality, but not always. When you get to the middle area, I think that is when it is most confusing. You feel (at least I do) a sense of both, a connection to both. It is like gender equilibrium, or a lack of at times. I have considered transition. For me, it seemed more terrorizing then staying where I am. But some will end up going up to the top too though. I don't want to put any false hope or expectations on you or him.
    Chickens should be allowed to cross the road without having their motives questioned

  25. #50
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    Tracii you're generalising now.
    I know of TS that have never been through any crossdressing stage, some go through surgery and move on and yet never wear feminine clothing.
    They have zero connection with Crossdressers so why would they feel kinship? I'm not condoning there attitude if it's rude but you are also coming across as strong willed.

    GM the analogy though I get what you are saying doesn't work.
    For example this idea we (as in me TS) live in the Penthouse like some elite level to aspire to is just plain wrong and a frequent ideology here.
    All I want to do is go back down to the lobby with minimum fuss. If I was ever on the middle floors it was because I got lost.
    Feels like I'm now really happy in the lobby but for a few middle floorers who keep coming down telling me I belong with them?
    Yet if I say well I like the people on the middle floors but it's not where I belong I get accused of being elitist or arrogant. Nearly always by the few who are insecure where they belong and are projecting.

    There are so many CDers that state they are only in it for the clothes and don't want any connection with being TS, I don't take offense to that.

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